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  • Turion
    replied
    You cannot see the effects with one coil. It takes a real rotor with multiple coils, and then you realize that every coil added causes an EXPONENTIAL increase in amp draw OR an exponential DECREASE in motor RPM. One or the other. Choose your poison.
    1. INCREASED AMP DRAW AFFECTS THE TOTAL INPUT TO THE SYSTEM.
    2. DECREASED RPM AFFECTS THE TOTAL OUTPUT OF THE GENERATOR COILS

    But bi has declared that I don't know what I am talking about and magnetic neutralization has NO effect on the performance of the system. He is just WRONG. And always will be. He says he did the experiment. Where is the video to prove it? I have SHOWN my videos because he never takes my word for anything. Where is his? Let's see the 7th grade science experiment you did bi. We can't wait! I did a series of THREE videos with the old clunker machine. One showing it running with NO coils (and their cores) in it. One with about 7 coils (and their cores) and no magnetic adjustment, drawing MASSIVE AMPS. And one where it was all adjusted with all 12 coils (and their cores) in it drawing 12 amps, and we eventually got it down to 7 amps.

    I ran across major problems as I was putting the generator together today that I can overcome, but as usual, it takes time.

    1. I need twelve 1/4 20 stainless (non-magnetic if possible) machine screws 6" long to use to adjust the opposition magnets on the stator. I assumed I could get them at Lowes. They have nothing over 4" and neither does anyone else in our small town. So they are on order from Amazon and won't be here until Tuesday. This was a change in the way the magnets are adjusted from Black Beauty that won't allow the adjustment magnets to come in contact with the rotor NO MATTER WHAT, which makes me a happy camper. But I didn't realize that getting the required length machine screws would be such a problem.

    2. I wasn't really thinking about my test board until I mounted it back on the cart I build the motor on today. I needed a BREAK from winding coils. I noticed that my gauges only go up to 150 volts AC, because my previous coils (with cores) only put out 120-130 volts and that's all I needed. But these new coils (with cores) put out 270 volts, so the meters won't give accurate information. That means I need all new meters. They are on the way.

    3. I was using one 300 watt bulb per coil (with cores) pair as my test load, and they were getting a bit over rated input, but they did fine. Now the new coils (with cores) will be outputting 400+ watts, so I need to find some 400 watt bulbs, or put a couple 200 watt bulbs in series. As you can see from the picture, my board is not set up for that. So I will be dealing with that tonight and tomorrow, either ordering some larger bulbs if I can find them on Amazon, or ordering the holders to wire two 200 watt bulbs in series. One way or another.

    This machine will be TESTED when I have it back together. Not before. I never said that Monday was a "do or die testing date." I was hoping to have everything back together then, but I will have it all together when it is all together, and then it will be tested. Or maybe NOT. I am trying to figure out how to use two coil outputs to make it self run. If I can do that, no reason to have it tested is there? Oh, except bi will never believe it. But I don't really CARE about that anyway. I know what I know, and that's good enough for me. And if I can do a self runner demo for the folks I am working with, that will be good enough. And it will save me $700.00.

    Oh, and by the way. I NEVER said adding a coil (or a core) to the generator turning at speed causes cogging now did I? Show me where I said that. You can't. Just another example of you attempting to put words in my mouth.

    Bad gauge.jpeg Light Board.jpeg
    Last edited by Turion; 10-14-2021, 06:50 AM.

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Originally posted by bistander View Post

    what I say is true and your impressions are erroneous.

    I built a test fixture and confirmed it.

    You weren't interested.

    Now you lie about it. Just forget about it and use your rebuilt black ugly and prove your case.

    Your lab test date of Monday is missed two days ago.

    And BTW, adding a core to the machine while the magnet rotor is spinning causes core loss (not cogging) just like I have always claimed

    Cogging is not a loss mechanism. Core loss obviously is.

    You still can't relate Sir Newton's to the physical apparatus, can you?

    yes BYE we understand the conventional arguments with the 200 year old pinup Professors, much like today is the same. If so and so says it you must be wrong.

    Because the test data has not been released to you then you think it does not exist? You would not understand what lab documents say, if you can not follow the 7th grade stuff.

    The fact remains that "AT SPEED" core cogging does not exist is a lie, it does drag down the drive motor as you have been shown. You have claimed we are liars and frauds for 6 years and no mater what test is released you quickly reword demanding yet another test proof.

    You have no desire to help, you do not care about the guys here, you hate us all. Your entire goal is to poison every conversation. This is why you are here.

    Your rotor sucks, wood with hot glue, here is a rotor costing big dollars. Where is you test rig BYE? You don't have a comparable rotor and you know it.

    Last edited by BroMikey; 10-14-2021, 04:56 AM.

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Originally posted by Turion View Post
    I got the two coils I dropped off the other day to have the new core material put in. I traded the six coils I wound yesterday for them. They should have the cores in those six coils in the next couple days, while I wind the last four coils. They also brought me the new rotor, and I got it mounted to the shaft and all the magnets put in.

    And bi, I won’t waste another second arguing with you. You’re not worth my time.
    I told you that Bye would quickly demand another proof while he sets BYE and does nothing but play the Menace.

    I think BYE should be proud of you and your efforts, instead he hates everything you do.

    What a beauty this rotor is.

    Last edited by BroMikey; 10-15-2021, 04:12 AM.

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  • Turion
    replied
    I got the two coils I dropped off the other day to have the new core material put in. I traded the six coils I wound yesterday for them. They should have the cores in those six coils in the next couple days, while I wind the last four coils. They also brought me the new rotor, and I got it mounted to the shaft and all the magnets put in.

    And bi, I won’t waste another second arguing with you. You’re not worth my time.
    Last edited by Turion; 10-14-2021, 04:59 AM.

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  • bistander
    replied
    Originally posted by Turion View Post
    As I recall, adding the magnet WAS the 7th grade science experiment, and I asked YOU to do it. I have done it a million times. It is the basis for HALF my claims. So I know EXACTLY what happens. The motor is BARELY affected in any way no matter how many coils and their cores are added as long as they are neutralized. And I can spin a rotor with 24 magnets on it in a machine with 12 coils, and it only takes one finger to do it. Simple.
    The record of what I said (claimed) is there. I've been through it multiple times with you and you purposely conflate and confuse what I say and refuse to do the simple procedure which demonstrated explicitly what I say is true and your impressions are erroneous. I built a test fixture and confirmed it. You weren't interested. Now you lie about it. Just forget about it and use your rebuilt black ugly and prove your case. Your lab test date of Monday is missed two days ago. Perhaps you can get an actual test yet this week and show everyone instead of making up lies about me.

    And BTW, adding a core to the machine while the magnet rotor is spinning causes core loss (not cogging) just like I have always claimed beginning back when you called me Mr. Potato Head, remember that? I explained then, using Eddy current brake as an example. Your neutralization schemes reduce cogging, not core loss. Cogging is not a loss mechanism. Core loss obviously is. You still can't relate Sir Newton's to the physical apparatus, can you?

    Please don't argue with me now, just show us the test.
    bi

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  • Turion
    replied
    As I recall, adding the magnet WAS the 7th grade science experiment, and I asked YOU to do it. I have done it a million times. It is the basis for HALF my claims. So I know EXACTLY what happens. The motor is BARELY affected in any way no matter how many coils and their cores are added as long as they are neutralized. And I can spin a rotor with 24 magnets on it in a machine with 12 coils, and it only takes one finger to do it. Simple.

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  • bistander
    replied
    Originally posted by BroMikey View Post
    Did ByeSlammer say sorry? Did Bye thank Dave for showing him where he was wrong or thank Dave for the thousands of dollars it takes to test ideas? No, Bye is hiding in shadows embarrassed. years now Dave has been called everything except a white boy. Where is Bye now? Is Bye going to vindicate Dave? Is Bye going to admit Dave was right all these years and that he was wrong? Of course not. So what else is news?

    I replied to Turion's video post. See below.

    I was not wrong about anything. You just post lies about me. You make a claim; show my quote where I claimed something wrong. Can't, can you?
    bi
    Originally posted by bistander View Post

    I'm kinda busy at this time but did a quick read and view of the video. Still couldn't do the 7th grade science experiment, could you. You're afraid of that. And I see you inserting a core, not a coil. Still having trouble telling those apart, aren't you. The behavior shown in the video of the speed reduction when the core is inserted while the motor supply is current limited is entirely consistent with an increase in core loss due to the added core. Just like I've said. If you had added your anti cogging magnet like I asked, you'd seen that it did not reduce the core loss (or the additional load caused by that core loss). Too bad you didn't try that. You could have learned something.

    ...
    ​​​​​​​bi

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Originally posted by Turion View Post
    It's kind of like saying "Did you see my new shoes (with feet in them)?

    Maybe it will be Son of Black Beauty. or SOBB. Perfect name. Because it will make bistander cry.
    Yup the shoe just dropped and all Bye can do is make chicken tracks, son of - a- ......? black beauty
    Last edited by BroMikey; 10-13-2021, 10:15 AM.

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  • alexelectric
    replied
    Originally posted by BroMikey View Post
    thank you, BroMikey, there is much to document and continue learning

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  • Turion
    replied
    Tomorrow (late) I get my rotor with the four holes drilled in it to match the mounting flange, and can start assembly. I am also picking up two coils (with cores) from my friends in Sacramento. I won't know all the parameters of this machine until I get it completely put together and have all 12 coils (with cores) in it. So I really have NO IDEA exactly what the amp draw of the motor will be or the voltage to get it to the required RPM. Right now I am going by what PRIOR versions showed. This is a much more precise machine, so it may take less. I strongly doubt that it will take MORE. These new cores (with coils on them) are not pure steel, but an alloy mix, so they may NOT have as much magnetic attraction (DRAG), or they may have MORE, since they put out more power than previous cores (with wire wrapped on them). Hard for me to know until I see it on the bench. I wound six coils (without cores) today, so a total of 8 are wound, and I will probably wind six more tomorrow and that will be all the wire I have. It will give me two extra coils (without cores) for when the NEW core material to be tested comes in the next couple weeks. My friends have a ways to go to finish cutting wire for the cores. Maybe five or six more days.

    BUT, I will have two coils (with cores) tomorrow, so I can look at trying to loop the system and see what RPM I can get from the combination of the two coils (with cores). Whether that will be enough to run it with all the coils (with cores) in the machine remains to be seen, but I have to start somewhere. I have seen the input as low as 4 amps at 26 volts, so I have something to shoot for, but never that low with ALL the coils (with cores) in place. SO how stupid it sounds to always have to add "with cores" or "with coils" to everything because bistander can't figure out that the two kind of go together and when you are talking about coils in the machine they have cores in them. It's kind of like saying "Did you see my new shoes (with feet in them)?

    Anyway, tomorrow I will start a new video series on the assembly of THIS machine, since some effective changes have been made that make the machine even safer than Black Beauty. Maybe it will be Son of Black Beauty. or SOBB. Perfect name. Because it will make bistander cry.
    Last edited by Turion; 10-13-2021, 04:17 AM.

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Did ByeSlammer say sorry? Did Bye thank Dave for showing him where he was wrong or thank Dave for the thousands of dollars it takes to test ideas? No, Bye is hiding in shadows embarrassed. years now Dave has been called everything except a white boy. Where is Bye now? Is Bye going to vindicate Dave? Is Bye going to admit Dave was right all these years and that he was wrong? Of course not. So what else is news?

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Dear Turion I have been looking over the stats on your awesome TDK-Lambda supply. That company is the best of the best. However upon reviewing the output values I find that a 24-26 volt X 8 amp max only comes to 200 watts. You need to double that. This is a great supply for a target of 120-150 watts maximum.

    I was under the impression that your running amps might need to reach 350w- 400w with a startup of slightly more. Correct me if I am wrong but looks like you need a 13-15amp 26v supply.

    13A X 26V = 338W it seems to me even with a unit you can freely spin up with one finger that during starting the amp load might be as high as 500w but only for a few seconds.

    See the TDK-Lambda model number is LS200-24 this is a max 200watt supply but you would want to run lower to get in on the higher efficiencies.

    If you are only running 2 coils then maybe it will work but with no generated output.





    Last edited by BroMikey; 10-13-2021, 03:06 AM.

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Hey Alex

    http://www.energeticforum.com/forum/...system/page326

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  • BroMikey
    replied
    Originally posted by Turion View Post
    I have this with a voltage adjustment. It might get me there. We will see.
    shucks that is a nice one. Pay no atten to the closet clones

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  • Turion
    replied
    I have this with a voltage adjustment. It might get me there. We will see.
    Attached Files

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