Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[elias]

all this means is its possible to make the gen coil invisible to the rotor magnets.
acceleration may not be possible. still to early to tell to be sure but I have never seen anybody say there generator runs on just a load.

Your results show otherwise? when shorting, you get more speed than no coil config? Even your speed is more when you computer switch the coil. How is that? Is this config the Adams/Bedini Style rotor?

[toranarod]

@Rod

Do you mean that your Adams/Bedini Style rotor performs much better and acceleration is present in that style? Does this mean that you have achieved lower input current to your out runner while inserting a shorted coil to your system? Couldn't you achieve the same result using your Muller type generator?

Thanks,

all this means is its possible to make the gen coil invisible to the rotor magnets.
acceleration may not be possible. still to early to tell to be sure but I have never seen anybody say there generator runs on just a load.

all the things Romero hinted at that where critical seem to be coming true.

I would like to build a hole new motor based on what we have learned so far.
just want to test iron powder cores. like Muller used.

[toranarod]

Hi Rod:

With "No coil installed" you mean:
a) Core still in place but copper wire removed
b) Core and wire removed

Thank you.

No coil installed. rotor free spinning. only the drive motor. no coil or core
I will do some Photo's
I have some more data on magnets and speed and so on. Just writing that up now.

This is the Muller Motor results.

My problems are core materials. I was told by a transformer manufacture today to piss off. Because they would not share the core materiel with me. Its a secret
they said.

[elias]

@Rod

Do you mean that your Adams/Bedini Style rotor performs much better and acceleration is present in that style? Does this mean that you have achieved lower input current to your out runner while inserting a shorted coil to your system? Couldn't you achieve the same result using your Muller type generator?

Thanks,

[mariuscivic]

Hey Guys below is some more info from romeros website hopefully it will help you with what you are doing all the best ron


comment from romero below

Hi all,
I can see that in the last few days more people are comming with good ideas and are more open minded.
When everyone can understand and can replicate the effect then you MUST start to do more testing with more than one generator coil in the system. Arrangement of the coils and positioning the coils are critical to get to the next stage.

Success all,
Romero

Hi ron48!
Can you please post the link from where you copied this comment?
Thanks!

[ron48]

Hey Guys below is some more info from romeros website hopefully it will help you with what you are doing all the best ron


comment from romero below

Hi all,
I can see that in the last few days more people are comming with good ideas and are more open minded.
When everyone can understand and can replicate the effect then you MUST start to do more testing with more than one generator coil in the system. Arrangement of the coils and positioning the coils are critical to get to the next stage.

Success all,
Romero

[frenky]

Hi Rod:

With "No coil installed" you mean:
a) Core still in place but copper wire removed
b) Core and wire removed

Thank you.

[toranarod]

Hi

I was reading the Romerouk pdf At some point he has said:


At another point:


I don't know what to deduce from these comments?! Maybe he meant the magnet spacing is important, not the rotor diameter, and larger diameter leads to better results if you place your magnets in correct proportions.

HE is RIGHT I moved the magnets today as he said here.

[toranarod]

I have replicated my bedini setup

Today's data results.
I made the appropriate changes in accordance with the data collected.
and the results would suggest this is the direction to pursue.

every body on this thread has added something to this result Thank you.
A lot to this result

I think this is a very good result.

[MonsieurM]

Hi

I was reading the Romerouk pdf At some point he has said:


At another point:


I don't know what to deduce from these comments?! Maybe he meant the magnet spacing is important, not the rotor diameter, and larger diameter leads to better results if you place your magnets in correct proportions.

there maybe a direct mathematic relations between the magnets used (size/diameter/gauss)

and the rotor dimension....

all i can tell you is that:

The golden ratio spotted in a magnetic compound.

Access : Solid-state physics: Golden ratio seen in a magnet : Nature

[elias]

Some inconsistencies in Romero's explanations

Hi

I was reading the Romerouk pdf At some point he has said:

I will show you how many rotors I have made before this one
worked, all others looked perfect but small diferences.

At another point:

I have measured the rotor and it is 20cm, sorry. I had so many changes and I also had a 25cm and a
35 cm rotor in another setup.
Diameter has nothing to do with the results if u space the magnets equally.
Based on previous tests larger diameter = better results.
All other dimensions are 100% correct.

I don't know what to deduce from these comments?! Maybe he meant the magnet spacing is important, not the rotor diameter, and larger diameter leads to better results if you place your magnets in correct proportions.

[elias]

What if each diode of the FWBR was two diodes. Not like Romero made each two diodes in parallel, but by making each two diodes in series. I made a diagram below to explain it better.

I tested shorting with Schottky diodes in parallel, the drag was reduced.

[elias]

Some tests

Thanks Rod for the remarks then that was related to the problem when pulse driving the rotor. Thanks for clarifying that out. For those interested I am using an 80W 300 RPM Buhler Driver motor at 24V.
Well, I managed to do some tests yesterday, for charging caps.

I used a 500 turn, laminated core coil for this purpose. The core is about 16mmx16mm
RPM: about 2700
Output: a voltage doubler with two 22000uF caps.
My rotor is 16 alternating N-S 15mm dia Nd magnets.

Result: The result is interesting, Each cap was charged upto 20V, resulting in a 40V output, and the noticeable drag is only at the middle. That is if you short the output, the drag is minimal and as the cap charges up the drag increases then decreases, the drag is non-existent in both ends: When the caps are discharged, and when the caps are charged. Minimal drag is introduced to the system only in the middle 10v part.

Unlike conventional systems, we have no drag when the current is zero, and when the current is at maximum, the drag occurs in the middle parts. We need to find a way around this drag too. Then we will be able to charge the caps without any drag to the system. I think that coil shorting is one of the best methods. Or tuning the cap to the coil, so that the cap charges up when only one magnet passes by the coil, to create a type of resonant condition. Or keeping the cap voltage at minimum by drawing current from it by using a DC-DC converter.

Just some thoughts.

[marxist]

transforming the generator coil into a transformer

mariuscivic's video with the acceleration happening due to the use of a transformer - in series with the generator coil - was interesting to me.
See his wiring schematic here: http://www.energeticforum.com/156212-post1605.html

I was wondering why the use of the transformer leads to acceleration.
So I remembered that any transformer produces a phase-shift between input and output, that is between primary and secondary. This is standard physics.

What does this mean for us?
I think the phase-shift of the signal in the output-winding of the transformer reflects back into the primary and as a result the signal in the primary is also shifted and consequently the Lenz-force is delayed. This is not a proper explanation of the actual interactions in a transformer, but it lead me to the following:

Maybe the transformer can be directly incorporated into the generator coil to create this effect.
One would have to wind a generator coil and short it (permanently). Then use this first winding as a primary by winding another winding over it. That second winding would then be the secondary and be connected to the load.

In case someone is inclined to try this:
mind the winding direction of the secondary. Depending on the load (or rather its impedance), the secondary will have to be wound in "in the other direction".

In other words: For the secondary both winding directions need to be tried.
Best would be to use an existing generator coil, short it and slide a secondary winding over it. One would have to have two such slidable secondaries to compare. One wound clockwise and the other counter-clockwise.

[qvision]

@ Wattsup and Rod,

Really interesting points, i will try the pure-pole wind when my wire arrives, i hadn't realised, in multi-layer coils, that winding back along the core reversed the polarity, i thought it was the direction the wire went around the core, not along it, that affected the poles ?

Is anyone apart from Rod using an outrunner ?


QV.