Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[toranarod]

I have been following the thread with high hopes for you guys since it started and I have been hesitant to make any input as I am not building this device, nor will I anytime soon. But the current project I am working on has some faint similarities and I decided that maybe it would be helpful to share some of what I am doing with ya'll. So pardon me if this is an intrusion.

The circuit I am working on is solid state and has to do with core saturation of an iron transformer. In the past I have read many times saturation is not a good position to be in when using a transformer or core if iron. In turn Inrush and surge currents cause problems from initial start up and create saturation.

But I have found in limited amount or in a pulse situation a significant flow of negative type energy emits itself on the output windings of the transformer. This energy is obviously negative as its growth through a bridge rectifier is in the ballpark of 5-6 times more voltage on the DC side of the bridge than the AC while maintaining the same value of current on either side.

The transformer has 2 winding slots in it. The top is where I drive it and the bottom where I extract the power.
On the top part of the spool I use bifiliar, 90 turns of 30 awg and 90 turns of 24 awg.
The bottom part of the spool is quadfiliar 120 turn of 30 awg. Each winding is rectified at the end.

The driving circuit for the top part of the spool is a simple oscillator. The schematic is from Slayer0007 I do not use the C winding. I also do not use the 1n4005 that outputs the BEMF. I just ride the spikes out.

The 4 winding on the second spool all lead to a rectifier that consist of MUR4100e's. They dump into a bank of super caps.


Now this why I wanted to post an example of what I am doing and try to show the relationship between what I have and what you are trying to do.

Most of you have missed the fact, eloquently stated by Dr Stifler, "For anything to be overunity, you must change the state of energy at least once". Most people relate that Electrical to Mechanical or vice versa. But you can change the state of your electricity as well and this becomes possible if the conversion doesn't cost to much. Forward time energy and reverse time energy are very real entities and allow one to follow the above rule with a near ease.

So if you were to wind your coils so that drive coil closest to the rotor was driven with the positive energy from the say the battery and then wind a secondary coil away from the rotor for collection purposes through bridge. All the while not collecting or protecting the transistor from the spike, you would harvest a significant voltage that can then be crunch down in to a super cap to regauge the power.
Then you also can grab power from the separate gen coil and dump it into a capacitor. Then serialize the 2 capacitors to fire back through the drive coil.

This may sound like complex operation but I picture it being pretty easy as everything needed is isolated to itself until you fire.
Collect It Schematic.

Look it over and give it try. I may have missed something posted along the way and this might have already been done. It may or may not work I don't know I just figure since no one has talked about the conversion to negative and actually looked at using it I might as well post my 2 cents.

I'll be outa town till Friday so if I do not post till then you understand why.

Best of luck to all of you.

Matt

Hello Matt
I am still digesting the information . I think I get it.
thanks.

hope to see more of your work when soon.

[Matthew Jones]

Somthing to look at...

I have been following the thread with high hopes for you guys since it started and I have been hesitant to make any input as I am not building this device, nor will I anytime soon. But the current project I am working on has some faint similarities and I decided that maybe it would be helpful to share some of what I am doing with ya'll. So pardon me if this is an intrusion.

The circuit I am working on is solid state and has to do with core saturation of an iron transformer. In the past I have read many times saturation is not a good position to be in when using a transformer or core if iron. In turn Inrush and surge currents cause problems from initial start up and create saturation.

But I have found in limited amount or in a pulse situation a significant flow of negative type energy emits itself on the output windings of the transformer. This energy is obviously negative as its growth through a bridge rectifier is in the ballpark of 5-6 times more voltage on the DC side of the bridge than the AC while maintaining the same value of current on either side.

The transformer has 2 winding slots in it. The top is where I drive it and the bottom where I extract the power.
On the top part of the spool I use bifiliar, 90 turns of 30 awg and 90 turns of 24 awg.
The bottom part of the spool is quadfiliar 120 turn of 30 awg. Each winding is rectified at the end.

The driving circuit for the top part of the spool is a simple oscillator. The schematic is from Slayer0007 I do not use the C winding. I also do not use the 1n4005 that outputs the BEMF. I just ride the spikes out.

The 4 winding on the second spool all lead to a rectifier that consist of MUR4100e's. They dump into a bank of super caps.


Now this why I wanted to post an example of what I am doing and try to show the relationship between what I have and what you are trying to do.

Most of you have missed the fact, eloquently stated by Dr Stifler, "For anything to be overunity, you must change the state of energy at least once". Most people relate that Electrical to Mechanical or vice versa. But you can change the state of your electricity as well and this becomes possible if the conversion doesn't cost to much. Forward time energy and reverse time energy are very real entities and allow one to follow the above rule with a near ease.

So if you were to wind your coils so that drive coil closest to the rotor was driven with the positive energy from the say the battery and then wind a secondary coil away from the rotor for collection purposes through bridge. All the while not collecting or protecting the transistor from the spike, you would harvest a significant voltage that can then be crunch down in to a super cap to regauge the power.
Then you also can grab power from the separate gen coil and dump it into a capacitor. Then serialize the 2 capacitors to fire back through the drive coil.

This may sound like complex operation but I picture it being pretty easy as everything needed is isolated to itself until you fire.
Collect It Schematic.

Look it over and give it try. I may have missed something posted along the way and this might have already been done. It may or may not work I don't know I just figure since no one has talked about the conversion to negative and actually looked at using it I might as well post my 2 cents.

I'll be outa town till Friday so if I do not post till then you understand why.

Best of luck to all of you.

Matt

[yx630514]

Hi toranarod
You get out 15.96 watts?
Is drive coil BEMF output? Or generation coil output?
If is the generation coil output, it is really great!

[toranarod]

[Redisnoc]

no flaming from this source

redisnoc, maybe you should "consider" the statement by 142857. NO ONE, not even Toranarod, Skycollection, Lidmotor, Bolt, or anyone else I forgot to mention has replicated this device. And they are some of the best guys around. I am not saying it is impossible by any means. And I think Rod is on to something real here. He has taken a real scientific approach to the device and his own instincts, and shown data. But no one has replicated the Romero device and Romero said no one would. He said it was a hoax. Do I believe that? I dont want to. But the facts are the facts. He wont speak on the device, for whatever excuses he has stated. Whatever they are I dont care, Its his business. Its his machine. and it will be his conscious if it is a hoax. Most here are dedicated to the science and someone will succeed. despite what that jaded, jaded 142857 has to say. I feel people are so close to success that it wont be long.
Dont doubt 142857 hasnt built anything. He has a few really fantastic machines. A small Bedini that has a nearly 1 to 1 charging, that I feel is unity when you factor in the mechanical work being done. But even right in front of him he dont belive. Some never will. He also has a Bedini pendulum that runs on 1 AA batt for weeks. SUPER!!.
ROD, keep it up my friend, sooo close. "Consider", dont start the flaming here. 142857, when we're old we can sit back and have a drink and watch my fantastic selfrunning device powering all the lights in my house and have a good laugh at the journey and debates we had to get there. And for once I may win an argument. Even if its because your older than me and will be bald and senile.

My comment was to a series of negatives pouring out in one source--so we can suffice it as past...
Here is my take--"Where are all the Tesla replications that ran his car?"
it isn't easy. Romero, if (IF is used here bluntly) he really achieved what he said, would, if he got a visit call it a hoax and run--anyone blame him?
Building something from a picture or movie isn't the same as sitting down at the bench with the inventor while he "fills one in". I believe it is doable.

My appologies back at 142857--Ricks kits are for "learning about this energy"-clearly stated. What I have seen in my efforts is there is an understanding that comes with radiant, and until one gets that, that person cannot understand (a generalization here, no finger pointin...none). That is what JB told me himself. "Build it, because until you do, you won't understand." Most everyone on this thread/forum is close--I described to a friend the other day it is like a Mexican hat dance (us) and because our minds have been mired in the "dumbthink" by the system, we can't even see the hat, much less what is under it.

Romero, IMHO, left out the keys (plural). Then he got scared. He intended (again, imho) to have fun and slowly point them out. Didn't work out that way. Resonance--that is a big thing with all of this--has anyone matched their coils with frequency generator--all of them (I haven't)? Is anyone really sure of his core material? I'm not. Most of you guys are WAAAAyyy ahead of me on this and I am learning from you. But, I have drive and hope.

All of you have made this "hopeful", the Victorian guys talked of
'soft magnetics'--Leedskalnin, whom I have visited (Coral Castle)as a child and again, a few months back, where I was allowed to measure EVERYTHING for 3 hours--and then told "Ok, you have to leave" abruptly.....SOFT magnetics, very low Guass, monopoles too--16 superpole sets with 1/2 being "null north" wouldn't turn the pole detector on--but was magnetic as the other pole. What was missing? I can tell you this--I don't know, but from what I saw, it was probably VERY simply--AND, no one has replicated it either--and there it sits--Folks, we are missing the "hat", and it sits right there on the floor. His device was low voltage (it gave him his 'primary current'--his work (that means castle) was high voltage--and that, is a fact--but it is MY fact, not meaning to start something.

So--In response to your direct (and probably appropriate) response, I will say--I believe it is do-able--It so closely resembles the Watson machine as to be scary.

R.

[Farmhand]

I just read something about a mysterious so-called solar panel.
If you attach a load across it, it is supposed to power a load !!!
What a fake, that device can't impossibly create the energy to power a load !

A solar panel is a perfect example of what is possible in many different ways. The solar panel just sits there with environmental input "not operator input" or "stored energy input" and yet it pours out electricity to power a load.

Why is it so difficult to accept that a device can receive input from both the "operator input" like a battery and the "environment". A solar panel is not the only way to collect environmental energy and they are expensive and beyond most to build from raw materials.

I don't think we need to argue with people who cant see the forest for the tree's.

The objective is to gather energy from the environment into the coils or circuit to add to the energy input by the operator. Simple no hocus pokus required.

Keep up the good work guys.

In my opinion if the generator is run from a Simple Tesla switch to collect unused energy through the primary coils, and the BEMF is collected and the output of the generator coils is also collected then the generator would probably show Excess energy even without lenzless operation.

Rod has got very close to Unity already and he wasn't even collecting the unused energy through the primary coils "Tesla Switch" style. He is still wasting energy through the primary coils, with near unity, which is very impressive . In my experience about half of the energy through the primary coils is wasted directly to ground and it need not be wasted. It is a bit of trouble to collect it but not too difficult for a demonstration.

Giving up gets one nowhere, persistance.

Cheers

[MonsieurM]

Experience is made before the law is formulated, both are related like cause an effect.

Nicholas Tesla

[Joit]

Uh huh, I dont see anyway, that there is anywhere Energy created or destroyed, but anywhere moved, blocked or transformed, but nowhere really created nor destroyed.
Therefor it is even simple to set up such a stupid law, and let it refer to anything, when it dont really match to the whole Physic.

[Xenomorph]

I just read something about a mysterious so-called solar panel.
If you attach a load across it, it is supposed to power a load !!!
What a fake, that device can't impossibly create the energy to power a load !

[Joit]

All I'm really saying is that no matter how you push a magnet past a coil(s), the resulting energy will never be enough to repeate the process.

the most efficient generator imagineable coupled with the most efficent and most compatable motor will not be able to "MAKE" any extra energy.

Nothing in the known universe works like that.

everything requires a fule source...energy input.

Meh, look at your Body, you feed it daily with ~10 000 Calories, and how much work you can do with it the whole Day, Day by Day?
And dont blame the Sun for growing the Food, what would rotten anyway, when it noone eats.

Or the Wind, what moves Water when it blows, and thats a lot of Water what it moves, beside the Hurricans, what are created and even grow bigger for no reason.

But nature is for that anyway a bad Example, because it stabilize itself way faster as mechanical Devices, so you would have to look very close.

That Science is quite not right with her statement you see that very simple,
because there is no real Proof for it, only her comparisons when it match to them.
Even like nothing is for free, so where do you get it from, do you buy it from the Earth?
Or only from the Peoples, what wanna convince you, that there is nothing for free.
And Earth comes where from? The Big Bang? And Who did buy this Big Bang?
Even i dont really believe in this Theorie in a whole, but at transforming Galaxies.

But with this Coilsetup it is something else. There are used the negative and the postive Forces together, Drag and created Attraction/Repulsion.
It is right, you will not get more Energy out when you try it at the standard way with the losses and, let me say, unefficient Buildings, when they try to use a standard Coil to generate Electricity. And even more, it seems that it is the common teaching and intention, to build unefficient Coils what are bad balanced, just to be right.
But seriously, there is anyway no intention from the most manufactors, to build very efficient Things. They wanna sell, and anything, what works a bit better, get a way better Price to buy. Science today is only Manufactoring and Lobbying only or developing high tech stuff, because the Energy is allready created from Power Plants.

And still 2 more Examples.
A good Farmer should be able, to support his whole Family selfsustainable with the Work he archive and Food he grows the whole Year.
Only the Africaans cant do that, because her Family grows mostly after a short while to above 30 Peoples with her Relations, what comes by, and where only the one Farmer works at last.
But actually it is the same by us, a few Peoples still do real Work, and the Rest just comes by, to eat from the Cake.
Human kind grows and grows, and noone helps them to do so.
They do it by her own, not with the Help from someone else or exchange Peoples for something else.

[Turion]

142857

A couple things.
First, have you taken into consideration that there is inherent energy in the magnets that we do not pay for? The energy to attract, and the energy to repel. We may have to pay for ONE, but not BOTH, so in the 1/8 of a revolution you're talking about, don't discount the portion of that revolution that we get for free just because we are using magnets that interact with our coils whether those coils are supplied with energy or not.

Second, if we ARE able to tap into some previously unusable source of energy from the vacuum, all the rules we have had to abide by fly out the window. I personally have seen that happen, and have seen things on the bench I just cannot explain. Energy that could not be accounted for. This is what we all search for, and logic won't kill our dreams. Once you have seen it happen, you can never again deny the possibility.

[142857]

All I'm really saying is that no matter how you push a magnet past a coil(s), the resulting energy will never be enough to repeate the process.

the most efficient generator imagineable coupled with the most efficent and most compatable motor will not be able to "MAKE" any extra energy.

Nothing in the known universe works like that.

everything requires a fule source...energy input.

For a magnet wheel to be self running in the traditional sense of the term is basically just not possible.

couple this idea with a dependable input configuration and you could get a real self running device in the truer sense of the term. ie a solar powered bedini...I believe someone here already has one of those ....or simpler yet a mendomotor. Or wait, even better a radiometer.
These devices use the same principals only conceeding to the fact that they do actually require input....like everything.

I think gravity is a pretty good angle too, as it's dependable, but of course gravity has it's own obstacles...ask the bessler guys.

combine it with gravity? solar power it, put it on a hampster wheel or somthing. that's how you make it " self run"

If JB could actually access the vibrations in the aether we could use that energy, just like solar/wind/tide, unfortunately it's kinda ghostly and it doesn't work unless you believe(like jesus)

I'm not saying it's not there or inaccessable. I'm saying that to collect it will require somthing special indeed.

I think all this learning how to make a better generator is great....we should figure out a way to put them in big bouys and generate real free energy from crashing surf. Seems like this lenzless thing should apply well in wind applications?

It's just not going to power the motor that powers it.
to do so would require it to MAKE more energy in one "spoke" of any rotor to magnet to coil config than it took to push it through that same distance....don't matter how fast it goes or if it cogs/drags or it doesn't.....say you have one coil and 8 magnets on your wheel....you would have to make the energy needed to turn that wheel one eighth of a turn in, you guessed it, one eighth of a turn.

Nothing works without input . where is the energy source of romeros device?

is it the same as JB, is it accessing the ghost in space?

[Neight]

@Toranarod
I just wanted to express how incredibly impressed I am with your work on all of this. the results you are obtaining are truly amazing! and you are doing it all open source as you work, reporting on what works and what doesn't, eliminating another romero situation (is it a hoax or isn't it )
don't let the ignorant naysayers get you down, keep it up!
I have the distinct feeling that your work here will have a major impact on how OU projects are handled moving forward!
I have been following this thread very closely, and while some of it is still over my head, I have learned a ton from your posts on here, and hope to someday soon be able to start a build like yours myself!
just wanted to say a big thanks, you are making a difference, and can't be overlooked like other projects have been in the past, this one is all out in the open

N8

[elias]

Hi elias,

When you shorted each coil, were they shorted separately as in where there 5 separate shorts on one spool? Also, did you twist the strands?

Thanks

Yes there were 5 separate shorts on one spool, and I shorted one after another observing the speed increase.

No I did not twist them intentionally, but they are partially twisted.

[elias]

One thing to keep in mind is, man wrote the laws regarding the conservation of energy, not nature.
Nature writes it's own laws regardless of what man thinks or does.

Of course ... and ... you made the post at 4:44.