Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[elias]

I think the 'conical' coil (core) face on a Muller is akin to a flat coil (core) face on the Adams. I believe it has to do with the rotor magnets line/angle of approach and retreat.

I wonder why square magnets are better than round? They are using square on the new muller design too.

That is good info thanks for sharing.
Coincidentally that was one of my thoughts too about a couple of weeks ago. Conical coil, like Tesla Coil, now how does he recommend placing the core towards the magnets, the base of it or the head of it? I thought about facing the base of the cone towards the magnets. Or maybe the sharp head of it be the answer?!

Square magnets do make sense too but with a square core I suppose. Also if we use square magnets we need to build a pyramid type core for our coils.
Pyramids are great channelers of energy and that is why it might work better. Pyramid means fire in the middle, because it seems that they accumulate energy in their middle.

[MonsieurM]

Unfortunately the video is in spanish...which i don't speak

SFCM 10/11:5 Diseño de materiales magnéticos a la carta - YouTube

The possibility of tailoring the properties of a magnetic material to obtain the best performance in a given application has been traditionally an unreachable dream. Until recently the main research effort was dedicated to obtain specific materials for a wide range of applications i.e. soft magnetic materials, hard magnetic material, recording media, etc.. These materials were used in different devices with small modifications because their magnetic behavior was implicit to its composition or crystalline structure
Amorphous and nano crystalline materials were a very important change because they were like an unwritten book and its anisotropy and its soft or hard magnetic behavior was easily controlled by using different thermal treatments.
Nowadays the magnetic material seems more like an additional component of an integrated device. It is just an additional process, similar to the inclusion of a conductive path or the inclusion of transistors...Actually the magnetic anisotropy is almost perfectly controlled and the use of high vacuum and clean room techniques allows the growing of multilayer materials with excellent interfaces and the exchange interaction is a new element of design.[email protected]

[quantumuppercut]

Data
Recorded RPM 4557
Magnets site on rotor diameter of 170 millimeters.
We have a Magnet speed of 128 Kmh.
35790 mm a second.
coil had a Diameter of 14 mm.
L= 9.2mH / .92 Ohm
T=L/R
This took the magnet 391 micro Seconds to pass the coils.

This coil L/R = .0092/.92 = .01
The new coil L/R = .0038/.56 = .0068

4457 RPM / rpm = .0068/.01
rpm = 6573

I think this sounds about right.

[MonsieurM]

Magnetic anisotropy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Magnetic anisotropy is the direction dependence of a material's magnetic properties. In the absence of an applied magnetic field, a magnetically isotropic material has no preferential direction for its magnetic moment while a magnetically anisotropic material will align its moment with one of the easy axes. An easy axis is an energetically favorable direction of spontaneous magnetization that is determined by the sources of magnetic anisotropy listed below. The two opposite directions along an easy axis are usually equivalent, and the actual direction of magnetization can be either of them (see spontaneous symmetry breaking).

Magnetic anisotropy is a prerequisite for hysteresis in ferromagnets: without it, a ferromagnet is superparamagnetic.

--------


Superparamagnetism is a form of magnetism

[toranarod]

Thanks Elias

So is Rod
here is the coil. looks nice and was my best wind. 49 strands of wire
what a night mare.
210 turns 3.8 mH and R= 0.56 Ohm with Iron Laminate core
It work. But only at 6000 RPM. I need to do a lot more test before a draw any
conclusions. test today, wiring all strands in parallel. I will separate them tomorrow.

conclusion and this is only my thoughts, from what i have tried.
Litz wire is great for a drive coils but not so good as a generator coil

[mariuscivic]

mariuscivic
I have recorded the same affect many times the 1.4 volts drop across the bridge
is to high for the time constant the coil charges up to long and Lenz is on the job.
My answer was.
Faster RPM or use schottky diodes
they do work very well.

Thank you Toranarod! I will try to find this schottky diodes

[toranarod]

I couldn't help but post this here... It is from Romero. The bold is as I suspected. It makes sense to me.



I think the 'conical' coil (core) face on a Muller is akin to a flat coil (core) face on the Adams. I believe it has to do with the rotor magnets line/angle of approach and retreat.

I wonder why square magnets are better than round? They are using square on the new muller design too.

You maybe right. This s a great observation. I hope somebody is writing this down.

[toranarod]

Hi guys!

I have 6 coils speeding under short. But if i put the bridge rectifier they are not speeding.
Any sugestions? (i can make a video)

mariuscivic
I have recorded the same affect many times the 1.4 volts drop across the bridge
is to high for the time constant the coil charges up to long and Lenz is on the job.
My answer was.
Faster RPM or use schottky diodes
they do work very well.

[pmazz850]

Did you make that rotor or is it salvaged from something?

[mex]

[mariuscivic]

Hi guys!

I have 6 coils speeding under short. But if i put the bridge rectifier they are not speeding.
Any sugestions? (i can make a video)

[qvision]

The only advantage i can see in cube magnets is the evenness of the approaching field as it cuts the coil.

[Shadesz]

Rod,

Do you mind posting a closeup picture of your generator coil mounting assembly on both the Muller and the Adams? I feel there is some important information there.

Good work on that coil! I hope you can find some good from it!

Thanks,
David

[Shadesz]

I couldn't help but post this here... It is from Romero. The bold is as I suspected. It makes sense to me.

Hi,
I would like not to reffer to that muller device I had. What I am talking is about speed under load or short. I read on the forums people saying that we cannot have any benefit from this effect and we will never have higher speed than without the generator coil in place. I don't wanna start another conflict with some of the clever brains and because of that I am not insisting to prove they are wrong.
It will be easy for the people who managed to have acceleration under load/short to measure the rpm before adding the generator coil and again after the generator coil is in place.The only important thing is to use the right sequence, as I said before, the effect will take place at more than one place and the right core material is of a great importance.
Lately i discovered that the shape of the magnets and the shape of the core are very important too. Cube is better than round for the magnets. If the core has the end facing the rotor in a conical shape it is better too.
Just having the edge of the core polished a bit will make a difference, more sharp that cone will be even better.
Unfortunately I discovered some of this recently and I built my new generator with round magnets but the cores I managed to improve. It will not make a huge difference but sometimes little things counts.

Regards,
Romero

I think the 'conical' coil (core) face on a Muller is akin to a flat coil (core) face on the Adams. I believe it has to do with the rotor magnets line/angle of approach and retreat.

I wonder why square magnets are better than round? They are using square on the new muller design too.

[toranarod]

Hi

I think that the light will diminish, and the rotor will speed up, This will cause the Voltage over the other strands disappear, as I have tested before. I am at a vacation and not near my motor to verify again. I think that this shows something really interesting, how can we draw more current and increase the brightness of the lamp while speeding up according to the established laws? Unless the phase delay of the current is causing it work for us instead of against us. What we have been thought is that the phase delay causes the real power to diminish, but as we see, this was not the case in that experiment.

When current gets delayed, the voltage gets delayed too. Because the current is flowing through the lamp and the coil, and they must be at the same phase, but current starts flowing with a lag in accordance to our rotor magnets, decreasing the overall drag. This also shows that smaller the R of the load the more acceleration we can achieve.

One test needs to be done, measuring the voltage and current on the load by an oscilloscope.

I am looking forward to see some test of Rod with his new coil, that will show us many things!

Elias

Thanks Elias

So is Rod
here is the coil. looks nice and was my best wind. 49 strands of wire
what a night mare.
210 turns 3.8 mH and R= 0.56 Ohm with Iron Laminate core
It work. But only at 6000 RPM. I need to do a lot more test before a draw any
conclusions. test today, wiring all strands in parallel. I will separate them tomorrow.