Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[Steve220]

Good point

In the latest R UK video it seems to be as you said.
The CD rotor with magnets, while simple in construction, indicates the drive coil and generator coil placement is critical.
A combination of rotor magnet, drive coil, generator coil placement and rotor speed is all there showing a gain in output.

As Lid Motor talked about in his videos, It all works together, as a package.
I wonder just how long it really takes for magnetic fields to shift gears.
The coil placement in relation the rotor speed, seems to be the key.
To be a drive magnet, then switch to being a generator magnet in a fraction of a second might be confusing to the magnets magnetic fields.

A little delay, might be all it takes to make a difference.
May be Lenz could think it is Faraday for a split second.
A gain is a gain, even for just a split second.
It all starts to add up over time.

Just thinking here.

[Zooty]

Zooty, I agree. In my other post, I was thinking that there is a connection between the drive coil and the generator coil. I think LID said that they are both related from what he has seen in his work. And in the latest R UK video, this still seems to be the case.
As you say, Lenz law, in special situations as in these devices, might be a good thing, if it can be put to good use. I was thinking, instead of trying to get rid of Lenz law, turn it around and make use of it.

I was thinking that may be the controlled pulse on drive coil "conditioned" the rotor magnet to be ready for the generator coil in such a way as to confuse Lenz law, long enough to help, not hinder.
The magnet in the rotor has a very short time to switch over from being a drive magnet to being a generator magnet.
May be during the very short switch over time, at the proper speed and distance, Lenz law just don't have enough time to "get it all together".

I think of the text books I have read in the past discussing Faradays and Lenzs Law. They were always shown operating in calm, controlled situations. This may not be a controlled situation, actually, it may be very un controlled, at least long enough to "upset the apple cart" so to speak.
By the time the apple cart is set back upright, it is too late for Lenz Law to kick in.
Then the whole thing starts all over again. So there is a small net gain with every event. The Lenz part, kind of starts to pile up, on both sides, on the rotor rotation side and the generator output side. Kind of a two for one thing.
A win win deal.

Just thinking here.

Someone here mentioned a core magnetization delay at high rpm's. If that is the case, maybe lenz kicks in tdc or just after instead of before and has the opposite effect?

[Steve220]

Interesting

Zooty, I agree. In my other post, I was thinking that there is a connection between the drive coil and the generator coil. I think LID said that they are both related from what he has seen in his work. And in the latest R UK video, this still seems to be the case.
As you say, Lenz law, in special situations as in these devices, might be a good thing, if it can be put to good use. I was thinking, instead of trying to get rid of Lenz law, turn it around and make use of it.

I was thinking that may be the controlled pulse on drive coil "conditioned" the rotor magnet to be ready for the generator coil in such a way as to confuse Lenz law, long enough to help, not hinder.
The magnet in the rotor has a very short time to switch over from being a drive magnet to being a generator magnet.
May be during the very short switch over time, at the proper speed and distance, Lenz law just don't have enough time to "get it all together".

I think of the text books I have read in the past discussing Faradays and Lenzs Law. They were always shown operating in calm, controlled situations. This may not be a controlled situation, actually, it may be very un controlled, at least long enough to "upset the apple cart" so to speak.
By the time the apple cart is set back upright, it is too late for Lenz Law to kick in.
Then the whole thing starts all over again. So there is a small net gain with every event. The Lenz part, kind of starts to pile up, on both sides, on the rotor rotation side and the generator output side. Kind of a two for one thing.
A win win deal.

Just thinking here.

[Farmhand]

Hi all, Most of this stuff is covered by Nikola in some way, phase lag, coil shorting and all sort's of goodies are explained in the PDF book below.

PDF Book.
The inventions : researches and writing of Nikola Tesla, with special reference to his work in polyphase currents and high potential lighting : Martin, Thomas Commerford, 1856-1924 : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive

Motor with capacitor in one winding.

http://public.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pXitbbkgRfDQRAoVq_V-5V-p315wqAoWJGbFO8SG8oPXd9GMID6BpKlBHptUPJixIQdk4anj1OLKt7P2P1YTCQg/Motor%20with%20capacitor%20in%20one%20winding.jpg?psid=1

Seems to me that the Romero/Muller dynamo is over COP 1 but not necessarily overunity. Romero is still experimenting but not with the Muller Dynamo ? DId he have the light bulb in series with the FWBR's and the DC to DC converter in the positive line ? I can't remember how he connected it.
Good recycling and directing of power in any system containing coils can show very good results. There is the immediate possibility of almost cop two with coils and even better with coils and capacitors, in my opinion. Add a flywheel and it get's better again. So there may be more there than what romero actually got or showed. I don't know of course, just my opinion.

If it is OU it is only in a very small window of operating parameters (like was said by other's) including load and after startup time, in which case the startup energy would need to be negated first aswell. Which is probably why Romero is still experimenting elswhere and encouraging others to do the same.

Anyway a gain is a gain and all experimenting is good, I wish i could build things like dynamo's, but i lack the resources.

Good work again guy's and I hope the statement about about the window is wrong.

[Zooty]

I have a theory on what RomeroUK might be doing in his latest vid but i don't have the setup to do it. He specifically states that he is using two coils and they are shorted in a special configuration. It got me thinking that maybe he is not actually trying to get rid of lenz law but making work for us rather than against us. The idea is simple. Imagine you have a separate coil away from the drive coil, when you short it out, current flows through it and causes drag on the wheel. What if the load was a second separate coil positioned the correct way to push another magnet. In theory the drag caused by the first coil should be cancelled by the push of the second coil. To get useful energy, we just connect another load in series on one side of the connected coils. What do you think? Sounds too simple?

*edit*

Just had another thought. The winds on the second coil would have to be connected in the same direction as the first coil but placed back to front against the wheel and against the same pole magnet so that the current flows in the same direction in both coils but the second coil has a reverse effect on its magnet to the first coil. All theory of course

[silverspider]

there is a PDF file MULLER DYNAMO / Главная / FreeEnergyLT

Hello to every one!This is my first post here.
I am happy to see people trying to do something for the benefit of all.

Toranarod - you concentrated too much on the motor part. That is not important as long as the inventor claims that the generator is not cousing drag when loaded as it happens with normal generators. I am documenting about free energy devices for 3 years now and i've seen a lot of unbelievable things (movies,articles,books etc.) but never something concrete, just bits of information, ambiguous descriptions and lots of times erroneous data just as if someone is trying to discourage people like us.
I don't know how some "inventors" claim that they are smart and wise and what they do is patent their invention. For me that is the most foolish thing a scientist, an inventor, an wise man can do in this dark ages. They do that for fame,recognition,money??? Why do that??? Patenting means certain censor and sometimes death.What if the person who invents something who could change the way we live spreads his invention by any means to the whole world remaining anonymous? I am sure then no one will be able to stop the spread of the invention once the people realize that its working and its not a lie, a fantasy.Why would you need fame and money when you can see the world benefit from your work, when you know you made a better world, why?
For me those are the real heroes even if i don't know their names!
The monetary system is taking us in one direction and that is self-destruction.
Thanks to all conscious beings out there who are working for the good of all!
thanks to ZEITGEIST movement for opening my eyes!

[elias]

Acceleration under load

This is completely possible.
My confirmed experiments do verify this:
Using an Iron core, the rotor starts to speed up after getting past a certain RPM.
Using a ferrite core, I could not achieve acceleration, but this effect was present:
When you go past a certain speed limit, shorting the coil drags the rotor less than loading it with a bulb, but before that speed limit it is the reverse, shorting certainly does drag more.

You can test this by using a normal DC motor and use it as a generator, when you short the output it will instantly break, but loading it by a lamp for exampe, would cause much less drag, because of less current. This effect reverses in a muller type generator when your rotor is turning fast enough, because of the time delay as I have theorized to be. The time constant is much higher when shorting the coils, because of the smaller resistance, This is what causes the drag become non-existent!

That is what Romero tried to show in his last experiment.
if you maintain your speed of rotation when you are loading it, it would "take" much less energy from the input to do so, because Lenz is left behind! The reaction is slow to catch up actually, especially when using the energy when the magnet approaches the coil, as repulsion is much less drag than attraction.

Edit: As you can see by connecting the coils in series as Romero did, inductance is increased, thus the time delay is increased too, that is why it drags less.

Elias

[Slider2732]

Oh, speaking of diodes, I can recommend the doubling up idea. Not a Muller, but on a pulse motor, I doubled from 2x 1N4148 on a HWBR/Avramenko setup and paralleled to make 4. Usual runs from a 1F supercap at 4V had been 7min 40sec or similar and basically doubled to 13min 51sec !
Weird stuff, but definitely something to look at...another thing that doesn't make sense at first.

[penno64]

Guys,

Don't get too distracted by the drive circuit.

Over at OU, we are thinking the key is the Diode.

@slider,

great work.
once I am pooped out on romero/mueller, I am going to have a go at your Fangen

Penno

[blackchisel97]

I just watched Romerouk video and it looks like a bipolar or modified bipolar switch sitting beside. I had this idea while ago to try two rotors on the same shaft, one with gen coils only and upper rotor driven by two separate coils and bipolar switch. It would take only few mA to get it spin. Just a thought, don't mean to distract anybody from original setup.
Still struggling to get mechanical part done. Electronics are easier to handle.

V

[Slider2732]

He seems to be driven by forwarding for all of us and yet psychologically bombed out by what may happen with too much clear leading.

If it helps, my FanGen system does the speed up thing and the theory is hopefully along the right lines.
Here's a demo video - YouTube - ‪Motor speed rise with load‬‏
My theory of the effect goes like this:
While both the fan and pickup coil with Hall sensor share the same power supply, they are independent from each other. The fan runs using the stock standard circuit of the PC fan.
The neo's form a drag on the coil, even though it has some magnet biasing on the back. Without the biasing HV is difficult to observe, except when under acceleration. Without 2x HV caps that give 0.32uF from coil to Positive supply line the HV lights only 1 side of a neon bulb. With the caps, both sides light, so giving true AC (I believe). As soon as a FWBR or any other load is placed on the coil, the neon illumination quits.
With the load in the video, which was the really busted up and puffed out 12V UPS type lead acid battery, the pull of all energy into the load results in most interaction with the neo's...in turn slowing the rotor. When a load is applied that allows the energy to dissipate more freely, it regauges the coil to magnet interaction, lessens the stressing and creates less drag on the neo's. So the rotor speeds up.
The fan used to be rated at 130mA with blades on at 12V. With no load, but neo's interacting with the coil, it now draws 90mA at 12V.
Here's where I get a bit fuzzy, because i'm new at this and my meter is an analog - With the 12V battery almost as a shorting load and 12V automotive bulb connected conventionally, i.e. the Positive rail also connects to one side of the coil and also through a forward diode, the draw is 110mA. but, if connected similar to a Bedini circuit, reversing the polarities to the charge battery, but using the diode to only allow Positive through to the Positive of the battery, the draw is lessened to 100mA. The same brightness of the bulb is observed, yet whether anything changes at the battery is an unknown, due to its condition.
I hope those with more experience of Bedini circuit types understand what i'm trying to say.
Upshot being, that by lightening the drawn load, by using a more readily escaping use for the energy, it lightens the coil drag. All works together, no matter where in the system the constituting parts are and how they are powered.
That battery never does get above 6V btw, but does work great for what probably amounts to a near coil short.

[Stephen Brown]

Defeating Lenz?

I would try this first:
YouTube - ‪RomeroUK1's Channel‬‏

Patrick

So Patrick,
This video was posted about 15 hours ago. Apparenty, Romero is being true to his word and and showing his latest experiments at defeating lenz using other setups.

Quote:
Originally Posted by romerouk
My advice to all of you is to stop working on the Muller device and just play with a simple rotor and 2 coils, one driving and one for collecting. When you will make that to speed under load or shorted then you can apply that to different even more simpler setups.
Romero

Have you experienced this particular phenomenon?
Do you understand what he is doing from your experiments?
It looks as though Romero has two coils, one large and one small and has them in tandem and asymetrical somehow.
Do you think he has them in series with the drive coil as well?
It also looks as though he has is being much more circumspect as far as open-sourcing and tranparency. Just a hint and that's it!
None the less, the demonstration is impressive.
Stephen

[minoly]

I would try this first:
YouTube - ‪RomeroUK1's Channel‬‏

Patrick

[Rubberband]

Thankyou

Appreciate it and good luck with your replication...

[toranarod]

I've read this thread from front to back, their are some things I could use some help on before I start to replicate it. Perhaps I've missed some things, getting old. does anyone know the actual size of romeroUK's rotor, I've seen 250mm at the start then 200mm. will someone help with all the specs on coils, magnets, and size and actual thickness of rotor, I ask the latter because the pic in post#51 does not look right for 12mm as claimed in another post. The end of most adult pointing finger is almost 3/4" to an inch long, the rotor is almost as thick as the end of his finger in that pic. and it looks to me that his rotor is 20mm thick or a little better. Also, this recent change with reversing to top coil leads, Could this rotor actually be a monopole, I ask because in that pic his magnets are sticking above the rotor, does he have two 10mm thick magnets stuck together with a steel spacer between them...same poles on both sides of the rotor? I think there is a good chance that the timing of the motors being offset to the gen coils is a step I want to use as well, there is the point of torque generation that might lie in that offset as well as firing the motors after TDC of the coil and magnet..... any help to clarify on these would be appreciated....Wally

there is a PDF file MULLER DYNAMO / Главная / FreeEnergyLT