Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[Slider2732]

Good question. No it wasn't...the core ferrite sits about 2mm forward of the magnet and ends just at the end of the coil. It's thought that the small distance away from ever touching the core assists flux within the core. Unproven though, but would further explain Romero's washers.

Here's a quick vid taken just now. I was experimenting with the FanGen and noted something highly unusual - AC carries on with a large skin effect past a FWBR.
Tesla tower experiments will see the wireless field extend right back through any circuit and up to the wall if a wall adapter is used. But, how about AC when it should be rectified ?
The demo shows that effect and points to more AC being available than 1 FWBR extracts...it's not a clean job that they do.
Large caps (such as the 40000uF in the Muller) dampen the HV and the effect isn't seen, but without caps, it seems clear that all is not becoming DC.
(In the vid I say that you were wondering about the solar circuit, but I intended to say you were wondering about the coils and the picture showed the solar circuit).

YouTube - ‪HV carries on through a FWBR !‬‏

[penno64]

Thanks Slider,

Was the bias magnet on the original coil/core, glued directly to the ferrite?

Penno

[Slider2732]

Yep sure. Struggling for anything camera wise here though and had to solder a USB lead back on this crappy image one. I have another that was salvaged for a part or two and will see about fixing that. My other isn't seen by Cheese program in Lubuntu Linux.
I'm not opposed to being bought off for a couple of million by the Government before I discover something monumental, then buy lots of proper gear and post via proxy under a different username



What you might be able to see:
Bottom left is the original coil, with messed up winds to create capacitance and how Romero had his. It had the magnet superglued, due to that flying off or reseating problem under power.
Bottom right is the second coil, with a washer on the back to give better surface area ability for the location of the (2 in this case) bias magnet.
Above those we have the monitor loony coil, note the neat winding difference. It's now sitting on one of Lidmotor/sMartCreations solar pulse motor circuits...running from 1V and while doing the flashing LED pulse thing is also powerful enough like this to run a Joule Thief circuit off the coil connections !

[penno64]

Hi Slider,

Thanks for all the detail.

Of most importance is the biasing magnet. If I understand correctly, for the
first coil used (the one that lit the neon while stationary), you used one or
more of the cdrom drive magnets. Mention of an aluminium washer - where
was that placed ?

For the big coil, you used hdd magnets snapped in half with pliers.

I hate to ask again but, would a picture be possible. It is so hard to truly
see anything from the videos.

Kindest Regards, Penno

[Slider2732]

Thanks all for getting really into these motors again...something needed to happen it seems and all i've done is demonstrate what ole Nik showed us to do. Romero posted the coil, so we know he used it, Bruce has done work with multi-strand design that is well worth the read...all of us now have a heck of a system potential. Doubters need only build and test one...it's not like the materials are tough to find.
I'm indebted to Rod for replicating the coil so quickly and showing his phenomenal output figures and lit bulb.
I'm upset with me lol, for not realising how important the setting up actually is and that if one swaps stuff around it's difficult to get right back to what worked !
It is also noted that learned and time respected folks like Minoly may wonder what's the difference to a Bedini SSG for some effects and to those ends, I can't say.

@Penno -
The neon is placed simply across the coil outputs, no cap stage or anything fancy.
The magnet ring remains in the rotor. It's both sufficiently weak enough a fridge magnet stuff to not affect the magnetic fields produced by neodymiums, but strong enough to hold those outer magnets to the rotor. When optimal positions are found on the rotor I then superglue them to it. The weight also allows a flywheel effect (being from micro R/C aircraft build background, having something do many things all at once is a natural thing).
The neo's themselves are from old CD-Rom drives, the laser assembly. 2 in each. Drives carry all sorts of shapes and sizes of neo's, so matching 4 or more can be a chore, unless of course someone had a dozen 52X Sony's or something. I'm out of drives now and have enough magnets for 3 pulse motors. Other magnets are coming from HDD's, where I snap them to size with pliers. Works well, bit rough.
Biasing magnets for any coil are those left over that aren't of a 4 set. The huge thing on the big monitor coil is half a HDD magnet, but that thing is just a loony coil
Whether the flux changes by using an aluminium washer on the back is unknown, what I do know is that small magnets can be stupidly heavily stuck to the coil core and difficult to move if they are in the wrong place or the wrong strength. They want to sit in a certain place and when power is applied will remove all yer hard work and sit somewhere else LOL. The washers make that much easier to deal with.

0.32uF AC caps work on my FanGen unit, other values didn't work for speed up. The FanGen is a Muller tester, removing the powering section of a Muller by having the original PC fan circuit do the work. Any speed differences are therefore unrelated to the actual driving circuit.
BUT - caps aren't essential for the speed effect. If they boost, then wahay
Here's the FanGen speeding up with load and no caps: YouTube - ‪Motor speed rise with load‬‏
Here's it is with the 0.32uF caps and showing neon BEMF collapse at rotor rest: YouTube - ‪FanGen - HV cap addition‬‏
Finally, one of the best effects noticed yet. This shows the BEMF build up charging external caps through a FWBR made of 1N4148's. The BEMF charges and charges with each time the external PC fan load doesn't move. To a point when finally there's enough energy to run the 12V fan. However...the fan keeps on running !
YouTube - ‪FanGen - cap charge start up of external fan‬‏

What is the FanGen going to do with one of these multi-strand coils ?
And how about Rod's cap placement and Mr. Nunnerley's idea ?

[toranarod]

The question is how best to apply this to the muller ? Michaels suggestion sounds good, a bit beyond me but i'm sure Rod and others know what he means, simple is best in my case, with this effect and Rods cascading voltage stages, that would be a fun video to watch.

Have read all suggestions and ideas. will try more globes and increase power requirement.

lots of work to do very hard to sleep tonight my head is full of circuit configuration.

Thanks Michael john for your input.

Good work Slider

[penno64]

Hey Slider,

Would it be possible to get some finer detail on your neon lighting system.

I feel this has great importance with what we are trying to achieve.

A couple of pics with maybe a ruler in the photo.

Any more detail on the rotor mags, and had you removed the ring magnet
from the inside of the fan blade casing.

Most important, the biasing magnet type - I think you said it came from a HDD.

A pic of the bobbin would be priceless also.

Sorry for all the questions and requests but, Slide, I think you hold the key !

Penno

[Joit]

It's a Tesla concept. Look at the way he has the cap and coils arranged in this patent and a few of his high frequency apparatus patents as well.
NIKOLA TESL-A - Google Patents

He didn't miss much. Left very little new to discover.

Cheers

Yes. Not really new, when you look on his Work from over 100 Years before.
I wish we would have adjustable Capacitors, because i think the one he had been something like it.
The Jars do look like, when you move the Top Rod out.
And he has even a Patent on such Capacitors.

[Farmhand]

The question is how best to apply this to the muller ? Michaels suggestion sounds good, a bit beyond me but i'm sure Rod and others know what he means, simple is best in my case, with this effect and Rods cascading voltage stages, that would be a fun video to watch.

[Steve220]

How true

P.S. "The capacitance of Slider and the CFL tube and it's onboard caps too probably, were likely in play to produce the effect. The CFL tube could go resonant too maybe. Anythings possible the rules are out the window"

I agree, when inductance and capacitance is involved, anything can happen.

And in this case, all seven strands are on the same core and shorted back through the coil in two unequal groups that are in series.
A capacitor is placed across one of the unequal groups.
It is really different.

Steve

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Hello Slider

Have you tried this?

I added a capacitor to one half of the coil. The value is critical.
My cap 0.47 uf it will need to be tuned to suit your coil.
This gives a major speed increase while providing more out put.

I love seeing increase in speed when a load is added.

Hope you don't mind me giving a bit of input, motors are not really my bag, solid state is.

Replace the cap with a varactor or two diodes in series with the cathodes together. What you have is a parallel and series LC and with just a small current input from the passing magnet you will create a parametric oscillator/amplifier.

This I use a lot in my work, it forms a variable cap, and in this case the voltage varies the capacitance of your LC and you have a pump.

I don't think I need to explain any more, just a little thought will show you what is happening, and what can be done in OU terms.

Mike

[Farmhand]

Maybe a de-q-ing diode might be advantagous too like in the attachment or similar. I think it should be reletively easy to duplicate, Rod seems to have done it and found the right size cap, it's a similar size cap to what I use in a similar way. The cap can be placed from ground to between the coils too for the same effect or similar.

It's a Tesla concept. Look at the way he has the cap and coils arranged in this patent and a few of his high frequency apparatus patents as well.
NIKOLA TESL-A - Google Patents

He didn't miss much. Left very little new to discover.

Cheers

P.S. The capacitance of Slider and the CFL tube and it's onboard caps too probably, were likely in play to produce the effect. The CFL tube could go resonant too maybe. Anythings possible the rules are out the window

[Steve220]

Interesting

Thanks for the update. It looks like a nice LC type circuit.
The increase in speed is really good to hear.

I could see where it would take a while to tune since it is kind of a odd coil arrangement and the other strands, even though not across the capacitor are "sort of" involved due to being in series with the other strands that are in parallel and all on the same core.
Plus the strands are shorted back through the coil in two unequal sets.

Wow! That is a lot of things going on all at the same time.
But if it works.......

This may be why slider could not get his coil to do the rotor boost thing again, maybe a change of capacitance in the wires.
Just off a little bit could cause a problem.
Could be hard to duplicate again.
I hope to see a video.

Steve

[toranarod]

It shouts transformer to me. Is this where the DC/DC comes into the picture ?
I'm largely ignorant on the subtleties and calculations. but if you need at least 7 watts and you have an excess of that magnitude of voltage, would such a conversion with the correct windings leave you really so short on looper requirement ?
I'd like to know, just for knowledge and apologize for lack of prior knowledge.

Hello Slider

Have you tried this?

I added a capacitor to one half of the coil. The value is critical.
My cap 0.47 uf it will need to be tuned to suit your coil.
This gives a major speed increase while providing more out put.

I love seeing increase in speed when a load is added.

[Bruce_TPU]

Bruce,

You began to make bogus and outragous overunity claims useing your super advanced two wire Ohm's Law math, and you never retracted any of those hyper delusional claims. All you've continued to do is maintain that I lack the comprehension to fully understand your futuristic physics. I deeply resent that.

Lidmotor recently observed that he found no advantage to useing multi strand Litz over single strand in his Romero coils, a position I took from the outset.

Who are you to try and bully me off this thread with those wild and preposterous over unity claims of yours? I want you to admit you've been wrong, and stop persecuting and demeaning me for taking the time to correct you.

I NEVER claimed overunity, with anything, but you, of course, have little comprehension.

And I respect lidmotor's work, but just because ONE MAN doesn't find any advantage to something, I guess we should all pack up our experiments, forget ALL THOSE WHO HAVE and go home.

Get over yourself, and wind a coil. Just say NO to PC hero syndrome!