Use for the Tesla Switch

[SeaMonkey]

Hey Vissie..
There should be no Friendship problems here with anyone, this is not about that,
it is not a pissing match of who is write or anything of that nature.

It is real simple...

If Seamonkey has all this knowledge on how to make this better then spit it out or buzz off.
there has been enough of this crap here already.

I do not need to explain to him the details of my cct for him to give US ALL HIS Super Simple better way to do it.

The info he has given on the proper requirements to turn a fet on and off efficiently is right and he knows how to look up good info.

For one, I don't see how a transformer as a gate driver will give the required parameters for switching the gate on a Fet as he says it will. Fine for a transistor, but this is a different beast.
I would really like to see how this is implemented so I learn and grow. Would be usefull in a lot of other applications as well.

He keeps talking about Floating this and that. etc.

Quit talking about it and SHOW us a realworld schematic of all this that actually applies to the cct we are working with.

There is a lot more to the way this works (as you have found through actually building it) than normal text book stuff.

So this whole group upset is on his shoulders.

I showed mine now he needs to show His (not some one else's) complete design.

THEN maybe we all can discuss it and move on !!

Your diagram may indeed be a workable solution.

Unfortunately, whatever 'genius' is residing within the
diagram and its ability to function is concealed from the
untrained eye.

Your diode array as shown on your diagram is beyond
the ability of many, many readers to comprehend.
The concept of 'steering diodes' and 'diode "OR" circuits
is one that needs to be 'simplified' in order for the
readership to grasp it.

You have made some good choices in your circuit
diagram. If you could somehow devise a way to
're-arrange' the parts in order to facilitate the 'flow'
it would be possible for the masses to appreciate
what you've done.

Have you ever seen a military equipment manual?
The schematics within them are prime examples
of how to 'layout' a diagram for maximum comprehension.
Collins Radio was particularly good at constructing
equipment manuals which idealized the form of
schematic which is most instructive.

You have devoted a great deal of time to figuring a
way to make the Floating MosFets receive sufficient
drive to switch quickly and efficiently. Why not devote
a little more time to making it readily 'visible' to ALL
who may wish to understand?

In the process you may be surprised to discover certain
redundancies. You may get a few "oh ****" moments
where you wonder why it is the way it is...

You have much to offer.

I do not believe you are finished yet...

[nvisser]

Should this test not be the other way round.
Look at the pulse on the battery terminals when we discharge a charged capacitor to the battery through a mosfet for different pulse widths
Or when feeding a coil's flyback pulse to the battery?
I believe you will need a good scope to see battery resonance in the Mhz regions

[SeaMonkey]

I did the battery spike test today.
The scope shot is probed over the battery terminals, switching at 100Hz with 400usec pulses
The load was a 0.6 Ohm resistor (2 x 1.2E 7W in parallel)
The negative spike stays about the same from 5usec to 500usec pulses.
The spike is in the order of -1.7V
There seems to be a huge un measurable spike after switch off that looks bigger at low pulse widths but it is so narrow that you can hardly see it in x10 time mode.
So I am sad to report that I did not learn much out of this experiment

Your willingness to devote time and effort to
the procedure is appreciated. Your feedback,
even though you believe you may not have seen
anything significant, is valuable.


While performing this procedure to evaluate the
battery pulse discharge characteristics there are
some precautions which must be observed:

In order to rule out the development of a 'spike'
due to distributed inductance in the wiring, all
connections should be as short as possible.
Standard RF wiring practices.

Different battery chemistries will produce
different characteristics. Even individual lead
acid batteries can produce different characteristics.

You're looking to verify what Bearden has written
about Bedini's research on battery capabilities;
the response of both electron movement and
ion movement to sharp impulse demands; and
whether you see any evidence of what Bedini
referred to as 'battery popping.'

The very sharp spike which you've observed may
be an inductive response.

You're looking for evidence of a 'signature' that
Bedini found to be useful for adjusting the Tesla
Switch to achieve what appeared to be overunity
performance.

Bedini himself spent many, many hours in search
of the 'signature' which he was looking for; evidence
of the 'negative resistance' phenomenon as a
consequence of the phase differences between the
electron response and the ionic response.

Brandt also stated that modern battery construction
has all but eliminated the tendency of batteries to
'resonate.'

Without this 'resonance' the Tesla Switch may be a
huge disappointment...

[citfta]

Hi Vissie, I don't have a problem with anyone who wants to work with Seamonkey. I just can't seem to do it. I ask a question I get back insults and nothing useful. If you can work with him then go for it and I will just read the posts and not comment.

Good luck, Carroll

[DoubleD]

I really do not want to jeopardize the friendship's I got here because of choices I made.
SeaMonkey. Maybe it will be a good thing if you start a new mosfet Tesla switch forum .
Then those interested can join it and all this fighting can stop.

Hey Vissie..
There should be no Friendship problems here with anyone, this is not about that,
it is not a pissing match of who is write or anything of that nature.

It is real simple...

If Seamonkey has all this knowledge on how to make this better then spit it out or buzz off.
there has been enough of this crap here already.

I do not need to explain to him the details of my cct for him to give US ALL HIS Super Simple better way to do it.

The info he has given on the proper requirements to turn a fet on and off efficiently is right and he knows how to look up good info.

For one, I don't see how a transformer as a gate driver will give the required parameters for switching the gate on a Fet as he says it will. Fine for a transistor, but this is a different beast.
I would really like to see how this is implemented so I learn and grow. Would be usefull in a lot of other applications as well.

He keeps talking about Floating this and that. etc.

Quit talking about it and SHOW us a realworld schematic of all this that actually applies to the cct we are working with.

There is a lot more to the way this works (as you have found through actually building it) than normal text book stuff.

So this whole group upset is on his shoulders.

I showed mine now he needs to show His (not some one else's) complete design.

THEN maybe we all can discuss it and move on !!

[nvisser]

I drew up a diagram as described above and will try and do it in the coming week.
Bedini said:
"one way was the SG machine in constant high voltage pulses. The other is abrupt capacitor discharges in one second pulses, this causes the battery sustained for long periods of time, or time charging.
The Tesla switch is something much different in the way charging is performed. The switch must be set to perform the same function as a capacitor discharge system allowing the differential across the load"
He also mentioned:"The first part of this is how much potential can you move in a micro second before the current builds up in the circuit"

I guess that is what we are looking for.or are we trying to find the batteries resonant frequency?
The picaxe 18x code could be like this:

setfreq m8
Main:
PULSOUT 3,1 ................5usec (10 =50usec,20=100usec ,100=500usec)
pause 20 ................ 100hz - all pause commands are half the length at 8MHz
goto Main

I did the battery spike test today.
The scope shot is probed over the battery terminals, switching at 100Hz with 400usec pulses
The load was a 0.6 Ohm resistor (2 x 1.2E 7W in parallel)
The negative spike stays about the same from 5usec to 500usec pulses.
The spike is in the order of -1.7V
There seems to be a huge un measurable spike after switch off that looks bigger at low pulse widths but it is so narrow that you can hardly see it in x10 time mode.
So I am sad to report that I did not learn much out of this experiment

[nvisser]

I really do not want to jeopardize the friendship's I got here because of choices I made.
SeaMonkey. Maybe it will be a good thing if you start a new mosfet Tesla switch forum .
Then those interested can join it and all this fighting can stop.

[DoubleD]

Vissie ..
If the guy would ACTUALLY SHOW Something instead of reposting a bunch of preschool crap we went through long time ago would be nice.

What new approach, he wont even Draw up his own design to show WTF he is touting as a BETTER way.

Just posts a bunch of ancient crap that if anyone has followed this thread to this point should know well by now.

WE ALL KNOW THE BASIC FREAKIN CIRCUIT

Show us the Improved way to do it that he so proudly claims to KNOW how to do. !!



Sorry man but he is just wasting every bodys time here.

If he has something to input to IMPROVE the cct then spit it out.
If he wants to teach an electronics cource then he needs to start a new thread just for that.

[StevanC]

meantime (sideshow progress report) news flash

The progress of the TS PVAmp with MOSFET and nsec ragne "Que":
I have soldered the power-stage (IRF3205 55V failover, 53A DC, 150A surge) and the Schottky diodes (MBRS2060 60V, 20Amp DC, 150A max surge) and started to layout cables.

The sketch is roughly this (there are errors and inconsistencies yet, but it is "very about it"):

(soon to be continued...)

[StevanC]

@SeaMonkey,
Okay, what would be the preffered devices?
A. IRL2204N?
B. IRF3205?
C. Or IRFP260 (55mOhm) but capable of blocking 200V?


1. This looks like one winding primary (10..30 turns as in the article) and 8-filar secondary?
2. How do we test our (different) cores to the right wire gauges?
3. Shall the Primery to secondary copper masses be in balance?
4. How much of a "umph" should the xfmr drive have V? @ A? for what MOSFET set?
5. This looks like a 3 stage project to me: "Quer-"; "driver-"; "power-" - whit BIG troublle in the middle
6. Do we feed the MOSFETs with coaxial cables or twisted pairs their respective "Que" singnals? Do we match trace lengths and to what exact level?
7. Do we size the driver stage to quad "Que" power devices (four devices in parallel) od we make that in a second (scaled up) attempt? How do we control drive level?
8. this is it at the moment

Stevan C.

[nvisser]

[SeaMonkey]

A Blast From the Past

The circuit which Eric posted some time
ago is conceptually very sound.

Apart from the polarity of the circuit at
the "Load" terminals with respect to the
battery banks, it is so very close to a working
implementation.

The notation regarding the method of supplying
power to the various drivers is pertinent.

Whatever has happened to Eric?

[SeaMonkey]

Hi All,

My goal has been to get the batteries to charge themselves or at least charge other batteries without losing their own charge. So far my best effort has been to get the TS to run for several days while powering itself without losing any charge. The only load was a few LEDs. So I think I have a long way to go to get any decent load to run or to get some charging done without losing charge on my TS batteries. I agree with Leroy if we can get some decent charging from a TS then we could just use it to keep our batteries up and not have to have two large banks of batteries. This seems like the easier way to go if it can be done.

@ Seamonkey, several of us have tried relay switching at one time or another. Matt and some of us have determined from testing that we don't need really high frequency of switching to get pretty good results if we are just running a load. I have used relays controlled by a PIC controller and gotten some ok results. Do you think the Mosfets will switch faster than relay contacts? I am asking because if relays are as fast as Mosfets then we are still missing something to get the results we are looking for. John B has suggested we only need switching speeds of around .5 Hz or so. Relays can easily handle these speeds yet we still don't seem to get any charging and our batteries eventually run down if we load them very much. I think Matt has been the only one to be able to run a reasonable load for an extended time. Thanks for the suggestions you have made and the resources you provided.

Carroll

Yes, MosFets will switch faster and more reliably
than relay contacts. The high current units that
are now available have very little "ON" resistance
and so are as efficient as metal-to-metal switching.

Brandt did say that his circuit, even when adjusted
to attain 'resonance' for best operation, did not run
indefinitely. He was able to get approximately 4 to 6
times normal battery use per charge with his and eventually
the batteries would need re-charging with an external
charger.

The stories about 'instant re-charging' and '36 Volts
across each battery without heat' may be nothing
more than fantasy dis-info. Bedini is the only 'credible'
source of info about his own experiences with the
circuit and he 'mysteriously' chooses not to re-investigate
its 'wonders' after it was strangely 'destroyed.'

Relay switching has merit for first attempts with the
circuit to get a feel for what it does. As you've
discovered, the contacts have limited lifetimes when
switching useful current levels.

The MosFet will 'git 'er done!' Whether any miracles
materialize remains to be seen...

[DoubleD]

For those of us who've spent years poring over
schematics it is not beyond our ability to track
and digest. For those less able and experienced
it is an imposing diagram. '

Well I usually don't do schematics for MY stuff as it is an extra un-necessary step for me most of the time.

Could you possibly think of a way to simplify the
visualization by means of an altered layout to
better emphasize what your strategy is? '

NO
If you can't figure it out with this then Sorry, .... I have lost my crayons.

Since you've mentioned that your circuit is indeed
functional, will you enlighten the readership by
describing its operational parameters:
'

None of it is relevant to the cct construction at this point !!

It will take about anything your Control cct can throw at it within the range of MosFet choice!

My own inclination is assuredly towards transformers. Think
'isolation' and 'point of load.'

GREAT
By all means Post us YOUR cct so we can all learn how to do it easier .

[SeaMonkey]

Here might be a way to amplify a small signal into workable energy. Solar that is!

If you're willing to tolerate the switching losses
of bipolar transistors and the cumulative losses
of the several diodes, your circuit should do
something. There aren't any obvious errors.

It would be helpful for ALL who are interested if
you'd provide a written paragraph or two to
summarize what your circuit is intended to do;
its several different functional regions; with
some idea what typical voltages might be across
the various energy storage capacitors.

Others may desire to know more about your use
of the Micro-Controller for monitor and control
and how you've chosen to interface it to your PC.

Any operational data you may wish to provide
will be very helpful. What sized solar array are
you using; how many batteries are you charging;
etc...

You may yet earn a "Well Done!" Candu?

- - - - -
Yeah, about the sorry state of the World and
especially the good ol' U.S.A.

I spent my time 'in country' and saw more blood,
death, destruction and sorrow than I thought
possible. I've since come to agree with Smedley
Butler: "War is a Racket!"

Dystopia is putting it mildly.