Bi-toroid Transformer of Thane C. Heins

[seaad]

Between 100 -200 turns I guess

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivm8aaQu00w&t=409s

[TanTric]

can you say how many winding on each coil of this schematic? king regards

[BroMikey]

Hello BroMikey

Have you abandoned the Bitt-project totally for the benefit of "Splitting The Positive" ? I just wanted to hear your arguments why, if you have stopped that, especially when you had so good results (post #38). But I also know it's maybe bad to have too many eggs in the same basket (shack).
I have now read the most of the essence in your thread "BiTT OverUnity Transformer Bi-Toroid Thane H. Bill A." and I found much goodies there. That thread of yours was unknown to me when I made my first Bitt post here.
I also want to hear your thoughts about the input phase angle and "real power". I think I'm today tuned in the same direction as you anyhow where then. I saw you had a discussion with Sprocket among others.
I'm going on with he Bitt a while now to see if I can solve the input signal problems for instance.

One more question; What kind of transformer cores did you use in this pic. http://flyer.thenetteam.net/1BiTT3.jpg ? Ferrite "Fly back" cores I presume??

And to You and All have a Good New Year!

Arne

This video shows one aspect of using a BITT with the splitting the positive
Tesla coil work I am doing. With Bill A. we see HF 3500hz straight off an
audio amplifier then fancy looping circuits.

This video (if you can understand it) shows a BITT running at 400 hz off
of the series wound Tesla coils, further speeding up under a load and
delivering real power with no cost to the rotor action.

The BITT is just another example of a set of coils being wound in such
a way that does not link the input power to the output power.

It is very simple. Yes i did tests using an oscilloscope and my AC unit
was supplied by a variac at 10vac. The delay showed up on the scope,
the input amps and volts were measured over a 2 month period of time
I tested. By adjusting the load using resistors (and I used car tail light bulbs)
and connecting both bucking and series the best results were 50%
more output than I put in. The meters showed 10v to 18v going in and
so many hundred ma. On the other end it consistently offered a small
amount more according to my AC amp clamps.

Ferite is what I use to think I needed but the ferite I used was to HF.

Go with the lower frequency cores

In the video the toroid slows down the generator and delivers comparable
amounts of power as the BITT does at 40 some volts each

Scope shot included along with the RPM meter. It is patented and clear
as a bell.






https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YClQL5g6dDQ

[RAMSET]

Arne
there is a method I was taught for quick and effective bench testing of Devices like this

it is called fixed loss to ambient [thanks to member Vortex 1 at ou.com]

you need a cardboard box a cold room an input meter and a thermometer

your device will hit a wall where it cannot raise the temp in the box any higher [due to losses to ambirnt]

note the input and the temp it reaches
remove everything from the box

now place the appropriate resistor in the box [sized to your input load

same test
if the DUT [your Bit transformer] made the box hotter than the resistor
at same input power

do the happy dance

if not?

I am running out on family business if you need more info I will be back later

happy holiday to all

I think this year will be a good one....

respectfully
Chet K

[seaad]

Hello BroMikey

Have you abandoned the Bitt-project totally for the benefit of "Splitting The Positive" ? I just wanted to hear your arguments why, if you have stopped that, especially when you had so good results (post #38). But I also know it's maybe bad to have too many eggs in the same basket (shack).
I have now read the most of the essence in your thread "BiTT OverUnity Transformer Bi-Toroid Thane H. Bill A." and I found much goodies there. That thread of yours was unknown to me when I made my first Bitt post here.
I also want to hear your thoughts about the input phase angle and "real power". I think I'm today tuned in the same direction as you anyhow where then. I saw you had a discussion with Sprocket among others.
I'm going on with he Bitt a while now to see if I can solve the input signal problems for instance.

One more question; What kind of transformer cores did you use in this pic. http://flyer.thenetteam.net/1BiTT3.jpg ? Ferrite "Fly back" cores I presume??

And to You and All have a Good New Year!

Arne

[Ufopolitics]

@Seaad

Look Seaad,

I am really not interested in arguing about your results...

Maybe someone else could do it for you, who understand what you are doing there...

I am not the person to help you in your test results.

When I am to prove OU, I go based on the Power Known Parameters, which are simply Voltage and Amperage from Input versus Voltage and Amperage at Output, which could easily obtain Wattage on both I/O levels, just by simply multiplying VXI=W.

And in my simple understanding, we need to load our Output for a reasonable time while reading all parameters...which means it is not just about a "flash reading" and hoping it would prove OU.

Sincerely wish you good luck finding out who will be able to help you.


Regards



Ufopolitics

[seaad]

Clarification

Seaad,

0) If it is about proving OU, the way you did at the Bi-Toroid Thread...then I can do it ANY TIME as well.

1) In your test, you are not showing Voltage and Amperage IN, VERSUS, Voltage and Amperage OUT.

2) But instead, you are relying on a simulator based on angles of magnetic interactions which then concludes on a "Power Factor"...this is -IMO- NOT a very convincing method to demonstrate OU.

0) Yes Please do that. But not exactly in my way beceause I was measuring a "special Bi-TRANSFORMER" (my transformer uses sinus waves). I suppose your apparatus do not have exactly the same config (square waves?). Please show a schematic!

2) No simulator involved at all! , , Phase, mA and V measured as in my first principle pic. See below. The phase differece between the input voltage and the input current in degree. A Normal transformer test.

1) Referring to my post: http://www.energeticforum.com/306841-post622.html

I have TWO input coils in parallell and the output coils in series , right now.

Load resistor = 4249 Ohm (sertainly not optimum, quick test) and phase & current resistor at input = 2 Ohm.

Results: Input; 5 kHz, 1.7545 Volt, 1.785 mA, phase 87.85 degrees cos=0.02966. . .Input power: V x A x cos
Output ; 0.7523 Volt over 4249 Ohm . . . Output power: V sqr/R

This gives: Input =1 Output =1.134 i.e 113.4 %

Edit: Due to oscilloscope/ probe failure New figures (in blue) adjusted with a 0.45 degree lower value.

Regards
Arne

Input calc. : V x A x cos ==> V x A x (cosinus of the measured degee value) (=0.02966) . . Gives Input power in Watts.

Output calc. : V sqr/R ==> V x V/R. . Gives Output power in Watts. . . . You have V and R. . . . Ohms law says I = V / R . . . See pic 3 and only change V to U

Power factor (%) : Output power in Watts. / Input power in Watts. x 100


Regards / Arne

[seaad]

Hello all

I have conducted a comparing/ double test (as in post #638) at 6kHz but now with DIFFERENT I-core materials on top of my primary core. The output voltage is adjusted to the same value in both tests by sliding the I-cores a tiny bit.

Ferrite: Input 1.99V, 2.6mA, 89.55 degrees
. . . . . . Output 0.4073V . . . . . . . . . Power factor = 148.8%

Silicon alloy Fe: Input 1.95V, 3mA, 73.1 degrees
. . . . . . . . . . . . Output 0.4078V . . . Power factor = 3.55% (Edit old value: 35.5%)


Regards / Arne

[seaad]

But my puzzle right now is; Why is the input phase angle above 90 degrees when running on idle (no load) or at output shorted??? Thats next test.

I think my dilemma is solved. In post #638 I had/ used a phase angle of 89.9 degrees. But after I just changed the two oscilloscope probes position with each other in the same test set up (#638) a new reading of 89.0 degrees was present.

So I have edited all my earlier posts with a lower phase angle value (mean) 0.9 / 2 = 0.45 degree.

Of course does these new calulations affect the performance of the units and you find my winner in post #633. My "Bitt" with two input coils on separate cores. See pic.
6 kHz 1.6 mA, 89.4 degree, 237%

Regards / Arne

[seaad]

I would like to see it power a real load. Maybe a light bulb or something.
Thanks

Hi Bro

Exactly I want that too. I have run it with 25 V to the input. Not much changes.

But a BULB? Not. These fellows are nonlinear. Temperature dependent, extremly nonlinear at low Hz. See pic. And don't TALK about LED:s Huh! Oh Diodes. . .

I agree that something can be different with a higher voltage input say above 100 Volts. See the pic with the BH curves.

But my puzzle right now is; Why is the input phase angle above 90 degrees when running on idle (no load) or at output shorted??? Thats next test.

But now it's time to go and fetch a Christmas tree.


Regards / Arne

[BroMikey]

Hey Arne

I would like to see it power a real load. Maybe a light bulb or something.
When I did some of this stuff once the load was connect the scope shot
changed dramatically. or is it powering that laptop? maybe a string of
10 neon's.

Thanks

[seaad]

New variant

This my latest variant, see pics, gave 140% (on foto) measured with the DMM at input and output.
Observe that I have slided the upper core (acting as an"I") off center a bit producing a higher phase angle at the expense of some percent higher input current.

. Small adjustments of the different cores mutual positions affects the power factor a lot. It's something more ,weird, into it also affecting the power factor when adjusting.
Perhaps short circuits?

Edit: Due to oscilloscope/ probe failure New figures (in blue) adjusted with a 0.45 degree lower value.

Regards / Arne

[Iamnuts]

After all this time Thane can't make a decent video, he just ends up
shouting over unnecessary background noise.
Obviously his poorly constructed transformers are very lossy, both
copper and core.
His claim must therefore be for the nett figure, which doesn't mean much!
For normal transformers the power factor varies with temperature and
load. Just look at what happens when his zero power factor just wanders
into the realm of becoming positive. Just do the figures for say a 3kw.
transformer and a. 05 power factor.
John.

[seaad]

Doable? Maybe Hardly!

Bro, all

Bro thanks for your encouraging words.


Referring to post #622 and #633 (my version of the T.H transformer).

If incomming frequensys goes higher, but input voltage remains the same, the OU-part (% value) rises, but the OUTPUT VOLTAGE with corresponding POWER falls however.
If we want to deliver the same output power with a higher incomming frequensy we have to step up the connected input voltage as well!

First; lets scale up my version of the T.H:s transformer to deliver say 500 Watts.
Second; Calculate the needed Input Voltage. "Transformer" Ratio unchanged.

At 6kHz, ~240% ( 200W input power): we have to connect about 5,000 Volt sinus to the input poles to deliver about 1,200 Volts. Load resistor 2744 Ohm unchanged.

So the transformer itself has to withstand Very High Voltages.
Then we come to the task to deliver the Sinus shaped High Voltage. 5,000Volt, 250W, 6kHz.
And maybe behind the delivered 1200 Volts a step down transformer.

And even more! With this type of special transformer the output voltage fluctuates widely if the load resistanse suddenly changes (jumps). Therefore a good stabilizing input circuit is a must. Or some storage/ battery system between the T.H transformer and the consumer.

Edit: Due to oscilloscope/ probe failure New figures have been calculated above. Se also other edits.

Regards / Arne

[BroMikey]

BroM Sorry I am not the man to see the similarities with "Self Assisted Oscillation in a Shorted Coil"
Regards / Arne

Yes it is only one of a series of tests using 4 coils. HF can also be used
with 4 coils, this is not a new design.

Glad you are getting some good results at 6K The lower the freq
the longer the wire needs to be.