Water Sparkplug

[grizli]

All, I have been following this thread and have successfully duplicated the effect using two nails. I have also attempted a gray tube replication (without much luck ).

In any case, I started to think about differences between this setup and the gray tube. In the gray tube the diode blocks the HV after it jumps the spark gap. This is also what tesla refers to when he says to create a "short" unidirectional HV spark.

It occurred to me that we are wasting a lot of energy by simply "shorting out" the cap across the gap. So I decided to try the following circuit.

I placed another HV diode between ground and the negative side of the spark gap (like the Gray tube). This caused the effect to disappear though I still got a "spark". (I did not try collector plates like the gray tube). I figured I needed to provide an alternate route for the HV to go AFTER it jumps the gap. So I added a 3rd point to my gap that was closer to the LV side than the HV side and tied that point to a capacitor and back to ground.

I charged a 30uF cap to 240V discharged it, created the plasma effect, and my second (identical) 30uF cap ended with a voltage of 140V. The plasma spark jumped from the HV to the LV and finally to the 3rd point with the cap and then to ground. Subsequent sparks caused the voltage of that cap to climb higher than my initial cap though this effect seemed to slow after the second cap reached 240V, probably because only the HV spark from the coil could cross the gap (I still got plasma sparks though).

I was unable to measure a difference in the power of the plasma spark. Attempts to observe the color of the spark were difficult through my sun glasses.

Has anyone come up with a standard way of measuring the "power" released by a spark? It seems to me that we should attempt to measure the work that can be accomplished for a given amount of input power.

Other ideas include placing a coil between the 3rd point and the cap and then capturing the BEMF to a 3rd cap (like a gray motor). I intend to place a cap AFTER the LV diode to "capture leaked current" like the battery in the Gray tube.

what about putting another coil in series with 240V capacitor... so that way we will have SWING similar to tesla coil primary : spark will for sure be "on" longer time ...
spark may behave different this way ..

[little_old_lady]

Recovering Energy while maintaining the effect.

All, I have been following this thread and have successfully duplicated the effect using two nails. I have also attempted a gray tube replication (without much luck ).

In any case, I started to think about differences between this setup and the gray tube. In the gray tube the diode blocks the HV after it jumps the spark gap. This is also what tesla refers to when he says to create a "short" unidirectional HV spark.

It occurred to me that we are wasting a lot of energy by simply "shorting out" the cap across the gap. So I decided to try the following circuit.

I placed another HV diode between ground and the negative side of the spark gap (like the Gray tube). This caused the effect to disappear though I still got a "spark". (I did not try collector plates like the gray tube). I figured I needed to provide an alternate route for the HV to go AFTER it jumps the gap. So I added a 3rd point to my gap that was closer to the LV side than the HV side and tied that point to a capacitor and back to ground.

I charged a 30uF cap to 240V discharged it, created the plasma effect, and my second (identical) 30uF cap ended with a voltage of 140V. The plasma spark jumped from the HV to the LV and finally to the 3rd point with the cap and then to ground. Subsequent sparks caused the voltage of that cap to climb higher than my initial cap though this effect seemed to slow after the second cap reached 240V, probably because only the HV spark from the coil could cross the gap (I still got plasma sparks though).

I was unable to measure a difference in the power of the plasma spark. Attempts to observe the color of the spark were difficult through my sun glasses.

Has anyone come up with a standard way of measuring the "power" released by a spark? It seems to me that we should attempt to measure the work that can be accomplished for a given amount of input power.

Other ideas include placing a coil between the 3rd point and the cap and then capturing the BEMF to a 3rd cap (like a gray motor). I intend to place a cap AFTER the LV diode to "capture leaked current" like the battery in the Gray tube.

[ashtweth]

Thanks Greg, just gotta put our one way valve in this weekend for our hydroxy booster, and we will install Robins plugs and give the report after a week

[gmeast]

Firestorm Replicas

Hi all,

There has been some concern about how the beryllium-copper plugs are wearing. Many saw the data table I posted showing seven distinct measurement points for each plug. After about 250 miles of 'running around town' miles I pulled my #2 plug and checked it against the data table. I detected no more than about .0015" variation from the recorded data ... well within measurement error ... enough to say "0" wear.

Of more concern to me was the uniformity of the spark's excursion across the anode / electrode surfaces. So I enriched the idle mixture to get some carbon on the plug so I could "take a picture" of the spark's excursion.

All I can say is that the wear from the spark must certainly be spread out evenly. The picture I've included looks just like an inverted shadow cast from a bright light.

Below is the pic:

Peace,

Greg

Photo showing sparking pattern keeping carbon burned off - clean

[grizli]

First : Hello ALL
This topic is big and I am new to water spark plug...

Please answer one short question:

Has anyone so far tried to put this plasma modified spark plug into small gas engine and in the air intake put only WATER FUMES...

Would it work: will that plug make electrolysis while plasma is emited into water fumes directily in cylinder.. that why HHO burn could even enhance plasma and explosion


Another thig that came to my mind: TWO plasma pulses in TIME very close to each other : FIRST one makes water to HHO strong plasma burst, and immediately after that smaller arc that ingites if unignited fumes were left: OR you think first plasma make HHO and burns it immeidately

[boostedbb]

So those plugs weren't quite equidistant I take it. That was one of the key features of the firestorm plugs and I believe the one which ensured that no "hot spots" showed up. Perhaps now that the plugs on there own have acquired equidistance between the electrodes the equal spark distribution will take care of the hot spots on these units and the wear will cease. I sure hope so.

[ashtweth]

Hi,Guys, back after 3 days on a farm converting to hydroxy/GEET/RV. We showed them the plug research too.

Here is what Ravzz sent me regarding Robins plugs

"Another thing you need to notice is that in the same pic the insides outer electrode have taken the shape of the semi-sphere due to spark erosion / metal electrode vaporization. The temperatures on electrode surfaces go well beyond 2,500 deg C when the plasma occurs for a fraction of a second and this vaporizes some of the surface and this is where the rare earths can arrest this erosion."

[Aaron]

youtube login

Youtube is working good for me.

[gmeast]

you tube

Has anyone had trouble logging in to their you tube accounts?

Greg

[Kinetix]

Thank you very much, guys.

[gmeast]

Hi Kinetix

Hello, everybody.
I have asked this simple question at least three times, I think, and nobody answerred. Never mind...
I will ask it another time, as it could prove beneficial for many of us:
HAS ANYBODY TRIED TO ADD A CAPACITOR (e.g C2) BETWEEN THE CENTER TAP OF TRANSFORMER AND GROUND TO CHECK IF IT IMPROVES THE EFICIENCY?
Thanks.
I have attached a schematic of the oscilator. I have added a few parts:
- a voltage limiter
- a small inductor for limiting the "noise"
- a capacitor (C2) to improve the shape of the oscilating signal.

Best wishes.

I do know that with the oscillator I have built, and that has been posted here, A capacitor placed from center tap to ground acts to stabilize the DC supply if your leads from the DC (battery) source are long. The center tap is usually the Plus from the battery. It gives the transistors something to draw from ... like in a DC power supply. I use 2000 uF and it does make a more crisp looking scope trace ... and I think that translates into efficiency as well.

Peace,

Greg

[Jetijs]

Kinetix,
yes, I tried to put a cap where you said, it did not change anything. But I was using a variable power supply for this and not a battery, so the power supply might already have enough capacitance built in. Have not tried this on a battery.

[Kinetix]

Hello, everybody.
I have asked this simple question at least three times, I think, and nobody answerred. Never mind...
I will ask it another time, as it could prove beneficial for many of us:
HAS ANYBODY TRIED TO ADD A CAPACITOR (e.g C2) BETWEEN THE CENTER TAP OF TRANSFORMER AND GROUND TO CHECK IF IT IMPROVES THE EFICIENCY?
Thanks.
I have attached a schematic of the oscilator. I have added a few parts:
- a voltage limiter
- a small inductor for limiting the "noise"
- a capacitor (C2) to improve the shape of the oscilating signal.

Best wishes.

[gmeast]

leaning

Theoretically it should, because you can override the oxygen sensor with a variable pot, and make it think it's running rich. Doing this on a petrol engine, with no steam/hho/geet mods, would cause it to run very hot, and eventually burn the valves, thus reducing compression, power and fuel economy.

But, it would be probably, easier (since you have carburetor) to tighten the IDLE and MAIN jet a little bit (make it run leaner) and introduce the steam to compensate for the higher operating temperature when running lean.

If you add up a small HHO cell (1 lpm is enough, I think, for the beginning) you can really improve the combustion process. People reported that engine runs cooler with HHO.

Here's a link to a genuine HHO experience:

http://www.takeaction.com.au/hoh/Studies/datsun120y.asp

The guys reduced the consumption by 50% !!! So, this is definitely a way to go.

Adding a OXY sensor to your bug would cost you, I guess, quite a bit. So, try to find the simplest computer+OXY and monopoint injection you can. This way you can take out the carb, remove the float bowl cooling system you installed and, maybe, gain more control over the system.

On the other hand, you can simply do this:

1. Simply measure the exhaust temperature with an on board temp gauge to establish a baseline temperature.

2. Then start leaning it out with and observe the temperature change. Since your motor is air cooled, you should maybe, drive it around in circles to avoid overheating, but not far from the garage and observe the temp change each time you lean it out.

3. When your exhaust temp rises some 100*C, add the steam and drive it to see the differences in temperature and loss of power (if any).

4. When you're satisfied with results add VexUS and observe the temp and power again.

5. If you have money and time add a small HHO cell. The preferable design is identical to JoeCell. In other words, 5 concentric SS tubes in destilled water with a drop of lye. Maybe you should make a small circuit for the cell. The one that will reduce the amperage as the rpm falls, and increase ti when rpm rises.

If you have any thoughts on these suggestions please tell. As soon as the winter passes, I'll do the fore mentioned things on my car We're gonna have soo much fun

God bless!

Hi Demios,

You spent much time and thought on this. Good suggestions. Thanks.

Peace,

Greg

[demios]

Theoretically it should, because you can override the oxygen sensor with a variable pot, and make it think it's running rich. Doing this on a petrol engine, with no steam/hho/geet mods, would cause it to run very hot, and eventually burn the valves, thus reducing compression, power and fuel economy.

But, it would be probably, easier (since you have carburetor) to tighten the IDLE and MAIN jet a little bit (make it run leaner) and introduce the steam to compensate for the higher operating temperature when running lean.

If you add up a small HHO cell (1 lpm is enough, I think, for the beginning) you can really improve the combustion process. People reported that engine runs cooler with HHO.

Here's a link to a genuine HHO experience:

http://www.takeaction.com.au/hoh/Studies/datsun120y.asp

The guys reduced the consumption by 50% !!! So, this is definitely a way to go.

Adding a OXY sensor to your bug would cost you, I guess, quite a bit. So, try to find the simplest computer+OXY and monopoint injection you can. This way you can take out the carb, remove the float bowl cooling system you installed and, maybe, gain more control over the system.

On the other hand, you can simply do this:

1. Simply measure the exhaust temperature with an on board temp gauge to establish a baseline temperature.

2. Then start leaning it out with and observe the temperature change. Since your motor is air cooled, you should maybe, drive it around in circles to avoid overheating, but not far from the garage and observe the temp change each time you lean it out.

3. When your exhaust temp rises some 100*C, add the steam and drive it to see the differences in temperature and loss of power (if any).

4. When you're satisfied with results add VexUS and observe the temp and power again.

5. If you have money and time add a small HHO cell. The preferable design is identical to JoeCell. In other words, 5 concentric SS tubes in destilled water with a drop of lye. Maybe you should make a small circuit for the cell. The one that will reduce the amperage as the rpm falls, and increase ti when rpm rises.

If you have any thoughts on these suggestions please tell. As soon as the winter passes, I'll do the fore mentioned things on my car We're gonna have soo much fun

God bless!