3 Battery Generating System

[Farmhand]

No tricks Dave, I simply made a comment and asked a question in a civilized way
on an open forum.

Where is the tricks ?

I already know I won't get a reasonable answer, but I cannot help but ask the
question.

How can it come out if it does not go in ?

If you want to see tricks maybe i can rustle some tricks up, it's not difficult.

I have done many experiments in this area, very similar to what you are doing
now but years ago. I worked out one thing, Lead acid batteries do weird
stuff. I seen batteries apparently self charge and did "work" runs where none
of the batteries appeared to lose any voltage, but I know they lost energy
because I tested that. I looked for proof of concept and did not find it. What
I found was that lead acid batteries can be used and show a higher voltage
afterwards but contain less potential energy because energy was utilized and
the potential energy of the battery was reduced even though the voltage
remained the same or even more. That can be demonstrated in several ways.

One way is a simple battery voltage bounce back test run, where the draw on
the battery at first lowers the voltage then the chemistry catches up and the
voltage rises under load, if the load is stopped at the right time the battery
voltage can in fact exceed the starting voltage but the battery has in fact
given up some of its energy. In the cases I observed.

But I never could come up with a theory as to how more energy can leave a
device than the energy that entered the device.

Anyone know how much energy it takes to first format and charge a 12 volt
60 amp hour battery after it is built, before it can be used ? I don't, I bet it is
a lot though compared to what can be got back out.

I just thought posting on one thread was enough.

Ok run me out of town now, but I must ask why ?

..

[a.king21]

re old tricks

I've given Farmhand some food for thought on the ou thread.
But then I'm speaking from a position of strength as are some of the participants here. Farmhand has never seen ou, so he needs some encouragement.

[Turion]

Well guys, Farmhand is up to his old tricks! But instead of posting here, where he knows we would run him out of town, he posted on my old thread at Overunity.com. This is what he said;

I was wondering, with all due respect. To those who claim something special is going on and there is a more energy out than energy in situation or effect taking place.

!) Exactly how can it be that more energy can come out of a device than energy that goes into a device, including all the energy contained in the batteries right from the point of construction and including the energy contained within the matter of the device itself, and the initial energy required to first charge the batteries ?

2) In other words how can anyone expect to get more energy out of a device over an extended period than work that was done to create the materials and construct all the parts of the device in the first place and all the energy contained within the materials the device is actually made from ?

The way I see it it is completely impossible for any system to output more energy then is input into said system at all previous stages of construction of the materials and device.

ie. The energy used to initially charge all the batteries and the energy locked up in all of the actual matter the entire device is constructed from.

Logic and common sense says that for it to come out it must first go in, unless something is created from nothing.

In other words actual OU is impossible by definition. Energy cannot be created from nothing, it is not possible to create any actual thing or work from nothing. To me that is pure logic.

Therefore logic tells us that any energy coming out of any device simply has to have gone into the device at some point previously, before it is possible for it to come out.

So I ask can anyone explain exactly how they expect a device to output more energy than is input into the device and it's components previously ?

______________________

I bet you didn't know that if you try to build a free energy device you are responsible for producing as much energy as went into the mining of the ore, the smelting of the copper, the refining of the copper, the extruding it into wire, the wrapping of the wire onto spools (not to mention the resources used to make those spools) the transporting of the wire to the store where you bought it, the wear and tear on the salesman's shoes for stocking the wire on the shelf, the raising of the grain that fed the cow that provided him with the beef in the hamburger he had for lunch that gave him the energy to lift that spool of wire. ....YOu know, I think Farmhand is right...I will probably never be able to build a free energy device that will provide enough energy to make up for all of this...at least not in my lifetime. Guess I better give up!

Dave

[lightend]

luther

hey luther.

if that was the case wouldnt it be more efficient to line up x amount of batterys in a shaker with magnets on ether side and shake the line of batterys (or the magnets) so the batterys are for every changing polarity?

if that worked we would only need to run some wires out the batterys to be able to harness the ambient energy.


(also just registered so i could respond to your post, many people are congratulating you and I also congratulate you but believe you are incorrect as my above statements would work and I dont think it would work) (unless I got the wrong end of the stick)

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Great post Duncan

Great post Duncan, remember the vid I sent you? not sure about bring in energy from the eather! Also I did a vid for this thread showing the back end battery reversing polarity, then reversing back when left to rest, this all happens in my SMD electrolysis, but the cell is made to reverse and causes a big electro chemical complex reaction where you can collect the excess emitted electrons and do work again, that was shown in that vid only you have seen Duncan, which was a replication by another and private. That complex reaction in part is an instant hydrogen fuel cell (one that does not have H and O separation membranes due to the frequency used).

Bottom line for me and only my opinion, is an electro chemical complex reaction in the duff battery becoming an alternating current electrolysis cell and only will work if a load is applied, just like a hydrogen fuel cell, the electrons pass through the load to create the electron path for recombining, and so generate power.

It's all very interesting and my 2 cents says that is what is happening, just trying to help so don't shoot me down please.

Regards to all

Mike

[Duncan]

That's very useful a.king its one of those things we know but then forget (like so much else) having read your post It fetched this neon scalar wave detector to mind .I post for your information


The schematic, NEONDET.GIF, is a derivative of a microwave detector
described in the February, 1980, "Ham Radio" magazine. As
originally created, the circuit's purpose is to detect microwave RF
standing waves, but with minor modification, it can also be used as
an effective scalar wave detector.

The schematic shows a round magnet epoxied to the NE-2 lamp, to help
isolate it from EM signals. Additionally, the circuit should be
enclosed in a metal box, or "Faraday Cage", with shielded I/O
connectors.

The power source consists of eight 9V batteries. Battery life is
very nearly the same as shelf life, because the lamp is operated in
"starvation" mode, drawing approximately 0.1ma.

The 25K and 250K potentiometers are adjusted first to fire the NE-2,
at approximately 60-70 volts, then adjusted until only the tip of
the cathode electrode glows. The 100K pot is adjusted for optimum
output gain.

Notes:

1. The 741 can be replaced with a 1458 cascade amplifier for
better results.
2. The RF loops in the NE-2 leads are mandatory to reduce
interference as well as lamp current noise.
3. Component values are not critical, and can be changed as
required for the type of output device.
4. Removing the magnet and Faraday Cage, and adding a
capacitively coupled loop antenna will permit use as a
microwave EM detector.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
If you have comments or other information relating to such topics
as this paper covers, please upload to KeelyNet or send to the
Vangard Sciences address as listed on the first page.
Thank you for your consideration, interest and support.
Jerry W. Decker.........Ron Barker...........Chuck Henderson
Vangard Sciences/KeelyNet

[a.king21]

Something which may help.

A long time ago I discovered that my meters were not displaying radiant energy. So I have devised a simple radiant energy detector. It is the simple neon bulb, or to be more precise the ne2 bulb which is essentially a neon without the resistor.
Each neon will measure a strike voltage of about 90 to 100 volts, and a decay voltage of about 60 volts -due to arcing of the electrodes.
So stringing more in series gives you a crude radiant energy voltmeter. But there's more. You can tell the polarity also. If both the electrodes are lit, you have ac. If only one electrode is lit you have negative on the lighted side.
So now you have a radiant energy meter that tells you crude voltage, ac or dc positive or negative. That should help to clear up some mysteries.
I can tell you that I am never without my ne2 radiant detectors in any of my experiments. NEVER.

[Turion]

Thoughts and opinions

Very early this morning I sent out an email to a small group of folks with my thoughts about this whole thing. Luther expressed the same idea far more eloquently, but here is what I said at the time:

Let me tell you my theory on all of this, and then you can tell me I am nuts.

I believe that magnetic fields and electrical fields are related. I am not sure whether the Positive pole of a battery is a north magnetic field or a south magnetic field, and I wish I knew for reasons I will get into in a moment. Anyway, I believe the two fields are "coupled" together. If you reverse charge a battery, this change in the ELECTRICAL filed distorts that magnetic field and it works like crazy to switch things back or change the magnetic field somehow by drawing on magnetic fields surrounding it. But we can't see this without putting meters on the battery that measure the magnetic fields. Which most of us DON'T DO.

By the same token, if you reverse the MAGNETIC polarity of a battery, you affect the ELECTRICAL fields, which draw in flux from the ambient to try and resolve the conflict you have created. Now, if you USE this flux (by powering a load) before it can reverse or compensate for the conflict you have created, you are able to draw continuous power.

This is what Don Smith was able to do (with high voltage.) Connect one side of a cap to ground and hit the other side with a spark. Voltage is drawn into the cap through the negative ground leg filling the cap.

Our friend said he reversed the polarity of the battery by the method he showed me. He also said he did it with MAGNETS. He NEVER said he was reversing the ELECTRICAL field of the battery, and the fact that he said to use a quick spike of electricity and the fact that he was also able to use magnets to do it makes me wonder if he wasn't doing exactly as I have described here. Does this make sense???

SO THOSE WERE my thought, and then I got this email...

I intended to tell you what i am going to say and after you agree too, if you like to share it on the forum.
Here it comes then. It happened to me three times but since then no more. First time, I had the load balanced and at some movement i made, I accidentally disconnected the primaries. I harried up quickly to put the wire back on again, but just before I do, I checked at the voltometer on the buffer. It stayed steady like nothing wrong had happened. I let it for few more seconds, then few more minutes, then one hour! The motor on the buffer was running with a medium load on it, no primaries where connected, and of course not even the main motor was running(from the primaries to the transducers).
The buffer battery which was connected to the transducers, run the motor, and the voltage didn't drop a bit. Not only that it was also unmovable. I checked with other voltometers as i have 4 already because i thought that the voltometer was stack, or broken or something. I was looking and looking and looking and could not believe my eyes! Needless to tell you that I had so much energy in my body after that, that i could easily run from my house to Athens and come back many times!
Next morning, I did the same. I started the system, balanced the load and when it was fairly balanced, I disconnected the primaries and the motor. This time I had lights on the buffer, not a motor like the night before. I run it again for a whole hour, like 110 watts totally from the buffer and the voltage didn't move. Like the buffer didn't care if it had any load on her.
I did that once more the day after and since then I didn't manage to do it. Of course I changed my setup, I put other batteries to see if it a general thing, I tried so many, but didn't succeed again. I was first on paradise and then in hell. But I am happy because i tested for a little while.
I know one of my transducers has changed polarity because I checked it. I actually had put four transducers. Someone on the forum said the more dead batteries the better. So since then I put 4 transducers, tight together on paralell. Seperate wires tight together on the negatives, and going to the poles of the buffer with separate wires. But changing polarity I thought was a normal thing as many others, even you, had already mentioned that on the forum.
Actually all my transducers are about one volt. Each one of them was about 8AH and the buffer was 12AH. My primaries were 7.2 or 5 AH. But the primaries and the motor were shut almost immediately after starting the system, before one or two minutes passed.
So all this happened one month ago, and now I almost believe that what happened was not true. Even myself I started to doubt that. I am trying to replicate it and I was thinking after I succeed one more time, I would tell you and share it on the forum.
It's very nice to know that someone else knows about that and I am not completely mad!
Now, how to get battery switch polarity, in my case could be that i was using 4 transducers? Who knows? I am using the same transducers now, but it's not happening.
I will try some more setups with some ideas i have.
I also must tell you that I have tried with very good results the following setup. Two batteries in series, motor, transducer+transducer, buffer1 in parallel with buffer2. Like the standart setup only two buffers in parallel. Then I switched, I make the buffers to be in series and go the other way back through the motor transducers and the original primaries in series, but now I have switched them too, and made them parallel. I used a DPDT to make connections to the motor so it will be moving the same way. That was little difficult to find out, but I managed it. All in all, reminds me of tesla switch but with transducers. I switched manually 5 switches, every 3 minutes, but voltage remained the same more or less. I think that with electronic very fast switching nothing will be lost.
love
Panos

Let's just keep stirring the pot and see what we get.
Dave

[Cornboy 555]

Jeeeezz, Luther, i am in danger of almost understanding, what you have written here.

You have a knack, for speaking in an easy to understand method.

Thanks very Much,

Warm Regards Cornboy.

[Duncan]

Just to ginger up the thoughts along those lines Luther this sentence.....
When you hear the sulphate crystals buzzing and crackling inside the battery, you know something amazing (and kind of scary) is happening.
From this short article,,
Capacitive Battery Charger - John Saves Energy

[tachyoncatcher]

The ambient itself raises the voltage on the output sde plate of the capacitor to raise it to match the input side of the capacitor thus raising the voltage across the diode and negating the voltage drop across the diode. You did not supply this energy - the ambient did so for you. This is the kinetic ambient background aether that Tesla talks about. Because it is kinetic, you can get it to do work for you by leading it about via electrostatic charges.

Bravo Luther!!!

[Beamgate]

Wonder if a SuperCap could be used in a similar way?

[Mario]

Hey Luther, how are you man? It's been a while... great post. So basically you suggest pulsing an almost discharged battery in reverse. Let's say a cap pulser circuit, but with the battery connected backwards, so that only during the negative pulse the battery flips negative. When the pulse shuts off we connect that battery to the load to collect the balancing back pulse, then we pulse again with the next negative cap pulse and so on...

Mario

[Duncan]

The two best posts I've read in a long time

[erfinder]

The only way to do that right now that we know of, is to hit the magnetic field of the battery with a larger opposite polarity flux field to drive it to flip over - the same as John Bedini does with his Ferris Wheel Generator.

My 2 cents for what they're worth...

Best regards to all,

Luther

I love you man!