Electric Motor Secrets

[vzon17]

Double power stroke

On a post that shows the Bourke engine on this page.
Electric Motor Secrets - Page 2

Look at the diagram where the ports come into th cylinder at approximately the middle of the cylinder, notice the piston moves almost equally past the ports on both the top the and bottom of stroke. this would be the location of the coil/s and then you can easily have a power pulse going both directions and the advantage of having the power stroke there is that the crank is then at the most advatageous part of its rotation furthest away from top dead center so there is most efficient transfer of the force to the rotation of the crank, now imagine there are three coils there in the middle and the piston has 4 section to it so you could stretch out the power application over most of the stroke on both sides of top dead center.

[vzon17]

Incoming stroke

Well there being only one incoming stroke depends on how you have it setup. If one would trigger the attraction stroke with the rod coming in and then have the rod go past the center and then trigger the coil again when its coming back towards the center then you could double up on the strokes, another alternative is to have two or three coils seperated by a flux barrier and a three part piston then as each piston section comes into its coil the coil gets fired. In fact I did a small jig with a piece of pipe and a couple coils. If one had a three section piston with gaps between them and two coils you could get a single coil power stroke followed by two double coil power strokes on the incoming stroke, and one double coil power stroke on the return stroke, so you could have 3 double power pulses and 2 single ones each time it goes in and out. you can make a mockup with some paper pieces and a pen.
the top piston wolud extend past the top coil one position and that gives you one more double power pulse and one more single pulse on the return.

you could get quite a few degrees of rotation under power that way. times that by 2 or 4 pistons and you may have a powerful machine. Also use the scotch yoke instead of the connecting rod setup. you can put three piston pairs on one crank throw with the scotch yoke. Could be a powerful engine. Now if one could just get the nice control circuit to operate it along with recapturing the collapse it wolud be a beautiful thing.
You would get 10 power pulses per revolution. And depending on your stroke length you could add more coils and pistons. for more power pulses per revolution.

[Aaron]

parallel windings

they were jsut hooked in parallel.

The other possibliity is that he wound the second coil the opposite direction to the first. I dont hear anybody talking about that ever.

So other possibilites are that if one could open the circuit of just one of the coils and then switch it to a different circuit it would hook the two coils in series and the collapse of the field would then be going through double the length of wire. kind of like switching the setup from parallel to series suddenly.

Anywway thats enough of the speculation on my part.

The Teal patent does show them hooked in parallel.

With reversing a winding, I think I'm the only one who has done that on Bedini trifilars...the recover winding I had reversed on 2 different coils.

Anyway, on the double stroke idea, no matter how the coils are wound together or in relation to each other, it can only be an incoming stroke since no matter the polarity of the field in the coil(s), it will simply attract an iron rotor or rod.

What we know as far as the schematics are shown, assuming it is as the motor was really built, the 2 windings are in parallel. What is the chronology of each and every step from those 2 windings being charged then having the power turned off?

I would really like to see this exact concept thoroughly evaluated

[Jetijs]

Hello all.
It has been a while since my last post in this thread. I just want to say that I have not abandoned the work on my motor, it is just that I am working on a different project that is not related to free energy and that kills almost all my free time. It will be over at the end of june (I hope). This is why I might not answer your PM's in time. Meanwhile, since I have not received the spring scales yet, I am working on a housing for my speed reducer that I got from ebay. It will reduce the motor speed 15 times and in the same time increase the torque 15 times. This is because I want to hook my permanent magnet alternator to the motor eventually. At 5000 RPM my permanent magnet alternator would produce an unnecessary high voltage that would not be practical to use. My alternator produces 12v already at just 120 or so RPMs, so the speed reducer will take care of that
Thanks,
Jetijs

[vzon17]

Some technical data for attraction motors

I found this nice PDF file that has lots of data on reluctance motors which are what the peter lindeman attraction motor is. lots of ideas and formulas and they even have a section on recovering some of the energy.

http://photoman.bizland.com/SwitchedReluctanceMotor.pdf

[vzon17]

One more modification possibility of two coils, teal

There could also be two coils back to back so that you get a power stroke going in and one going out. After all this as not a combustion engine so no reason you cant power stroke the piston twice, coming and going. And if you wanted to add a third thing put a pancake coil in top of the piston to repel of an aluminum disk.
YouTube - 8 Capacitor washer launcher

[vzon17]

Possibilites of two windings in teal motor.

Well there are some possibilities with modifications to two windings. the way it showed on the schematic though was they were jsut hooked in parallel. I just tried hooking two solenoids end to end and connected a diode between them and energized the front one in hopes that when I turned the front one off the collapsing field would go through the diode to energize the second coil and pull the rod into the second coil. didnt seem to work that way.

The other possibliity is that he wound the second coil the opposite direction to the first. I dont hear anybody talking about that ever. There is a left handed coil and a right handed coil so I wonder what happens when you wind them both on the same core and hook them in parallel. the polarity of the magnetic field does not change its still goes the same direction. but I wonder if it affects the magnetic flux any.

But when you wind a coil going back and forth from end to end you are creating both left and right handed coils. I wonder if this is where back EMF comes from. maybe if one winds a coil so it is only right hand or left hand something would change. It wolud be hard to do however as it wolud end up being a series of pancake coils stacked together and hooked in series. but might be worth a try. pancake coils are intresting becaues they are not left hatd or right hand becaues you can just flip them over to reverse them. with a long coil you cant do that as they are mirror images of each other. You can prove that by winding a couple of coil from a few inches of wire.

So other possibilites are that if one could open the circuit of just one of the coils and then switch it to a different circuit it would hook the two coils in series and the collapse of the field would then be going through double the length of wire. kind of like switching the setup from parallel to series suddenly.

Anywway thats enough of the speculation on my part.

[Aaron]

2 wires

...Bob Teal motor schematic, it showed there being two windings on each solenoid, no mention was made why this was.
I figure it was maybe Teal doubled up on the windings to reduce resistance.

It gave me another idea in my motor obsessed mind though and that what if one would put two solenoid coils right one behind the other to increase length of power stroke. then wire them up so the collapse of the first coil dumps into the second one for additional pull.

Hi V,

You're maybe the 3rd or 4th one to touch on this concept. What are some other possibilities for the 2 windings?

[vzon17]

New guy here. Watched the Motor secrets DVD a few times

So its nice to be in contact with others of silmilar interest.

There are a couple of things in the video I would like to address. In the section where Peter analyses the Bob Teal motor schematic, it showed there being two windings on each solenoid, no mention was made why this was.
I figure it was maybe Teal doubled up on the windings to reduce resistance.

It gave me another idea in my motor obsessed mind though and that what if one would put two solenoid coils right one behind the other to increase length of power stroke. then wire them up so the collapse of the first coil dumps into the second one for additional pull.

What about the thought of having two winding on one coil and one winding has many more turns on it than the other. then collect the collapse of the part that has the higher turns. I wonder if this would give more voltage so that one could in part compensate for some resistance that way. Then dump the higher voltage to another coil or use it to charge or power something.

I found a diagram that showed a different way to build the attraction motor which may be more effiecient also. I cant get the webpage from overunity to load but I did save the graphic.

http://photoman.bizland.com/index.gif

Thats all for now.
V

[Eric]

Hi everyone, I am new to this forum, and I am old thinker of free energy
I think the one problem is in the diode nte125, I think it should be reversed like in original Peter's schematic.
In your schematic 12v battery is constantly running the coil and when photo transistor opens, 2n3055 also opens, so the PSU is running the current through the coil and through the battery. The battery could never be charged this way. It's like when you are charging the car battery with reversed polarity it is more like quick DIScharge rather than charge.

lol sorry about that. i lost some of my files and i think this might be an older version of my schematic, and am have trouble with how to orient the symbols properly but trust me, physically the diode is in the right direction, ive tried both ways and the results are pretty obvious when you run the motor. i went ahead and replaced the sensor... again..... this time i have a diode coming off the collector of the sensor to the base of the P transistor. it seems to be working fine now. i will post some videos soon, i just need a little more time to iron things out.

thanks!
Eric

[kokerich]

Hi everyone, I am new to this forum, and I am old thinker of free energy
I think the one problem is in the diode nte125, I think it should be reversed like in original Peter's schematic.
In your schematic 12v battery is constantly running the coil and when photo transistor opens, 2n3055 also opens, so the PSU is running the current through the coil and through the battery. The battery could never be charged this way. It's like when you are charging the car battery with reversed polarity it is more like quick DIScharge rather than charge.

[Eric]

question about transistor temporarily failing

HI guys!
i got a new video camera that i am playing with so i can upload some video shots soon. still waiting for my machine shop parts again, seems i found anouther shop that likes to put me on the back burner. in the meantime i found that i have several old weedwacker motors so i went ahead and chopped up the old rotor in one of those and got it up and running on the basic circuit. i even used the old copper brushes modified with a little fingernail polish to dial in the ontime windows but my oscope shot on that switch looked pretty "noisy" so now i have a reed switch on it, this gives me a much cleaner shot. also playing with my first motor with the optical switch, for curiosity, i added a reed switch in series with the recieving phototransistor and got some pretty amazing results..... but... now it appears that maybe one of my transistors is failing partially. because my motor spontaniously shuts down for 3 to 5 seconds almost like something is overheating, tuning down the voltage on the led in the opto switch seems to improve the problem, so i am curious if anybody knows what might be causing the damage? to the phototransistor? here is the original circuit. it doesnt have the reed switch added on to it. r2-r5 are 100ohm and r6 and r7 are 300ohm the PSU is actually only running around 25v not the 60v listed thats just a max voltage



thanks!
Eric

[aladinlamp]

for starters stick with the basic circuit until you fully understand it, and just dump the discharge into a battery, capacitor, lightbulb, or a high watt low ohm block resistor. (ive done them all, its a lot of fun to see how different the motor performs with the different output types!!) currently i am working on another output type, a separate winding, this is a little more difficult, we know from the movie that we dont want 2 different magnetic fields acting against each other in the "same winding" at the same time. but..... if we had another winding electrically isolated from the first but physically part of the same motor we could discharge the output voltage through it, driving electrons through it, building a magnetic field in the "second winding", wiring the circuit so the polarity of both the collapsing field in the first winding and the growing field in the second winding are in "attraction with each other" not in "opposition against each other". i am hoping this will build a stronger or more constant pull on the rotor. giving me more work out the shaft and possibly less needed amperage going in to the motor.

hope that helps!
Eric

hi

this is exactly what i had in mind, separate recovery coil like in Bedini systems, arranged in a way, which will keep N/S orientation all the time


Thanx

[Eric]

Hi

i just want to make sure i understand this properly, correct me if i am wrong

in this schematics Rotary Attraction Motor Update


1.Electrical energy applied, I-in, creates magnetic field with certain N-S orientation

2.Electrical energy returned,I-out, creates magnetic field with opposite orientation than in step 1.

3.Iron rotor is beeing attracted in both steps 1 and 2.


Is this correct ?

Thanx

almost correct, the "I-out" or electrical discharge doesn't create a magnetic field. what happens is first your power is turned on and you create a field. the properties of this fields speed and strength are governed by v=IR, the voltage you put in, the resistance of your winding based on the wires gauge and length, and the amps that that level of resistance allows. but now your field is built, your rotor has been pulled in roughly halfway in, you cut the power off, sharply, (careful here, i hope i am discribing it right) at the very instant you shut the power off, the field wants to flip the polarity and disappear instantly, like less than nanoseconds, but it cant, the copper winding has a level of impedance. this impedance slows down the rate of change or speed at which the field can collapse. this impedance also gives us our voltage out "your I-out" as the field collapses. the level of voltage you get is governed by the impedance of the coil, not V=IR when the field is built. going back to the rotor, first it allready got pulled in part of the way when we built the field, and since iron doesnt care about N/S polarity it continues to get pulled in "as the field is collapsing" you see, your not creating a field when you get the electrical discharge your collapsing it. at least not yet.....

for starters stick with the basic circuit until you fully understand it, and just dump the discharge into a battery, capacitor, lightbulb, or a high watt low ohm block resistor. (ive done them all, its a lot of fun to see how different the motor performs with the different output types!!) currently i am working on another output type, a separate winding, this is a little more difficult, we know from the movie that we dont want 2 different magnetic fields acting against each other in the "same winding" at the same time. but..... if we had another winding electrically isolated from the first but physically part of the same motor we could discharge the output voltage through it, driving electrons through it, building a magnetic field in the "second winding", wiring the circuit so the polarity of both the collapsing field in the first winding and the growing field in the second winding are in "attraction with each other" not in "opposition against each other". i am hoping this will build a stronger or more constant pull on the rotor. giving me more work out the shaft and possibly less needed amperage going in to the motor.

hope that helps!
Eric

[aladinlamp]

Hi

i just want to make sure i understand this properly, correct me if i am wrong

in this schematics Rotary Attraction Motor Update


1.Electrical energy applied, I-in, creates magnetic field with certain N-S orientation

2.Electrical energy returned,I-out, creates magnetic field with opposite orientation than in step 1.

3.Iron rotor is beeing attracted in both steps 1 and 2.


Is this correct ?

Thanx