Water Sparkplug

[Ursine]

I may end up drilling the center out and epoxying in another electrode.

Dave

[mxt]

Chris,

These are the specs for the plug:

Champion RDZ19H
10mm
3/8" reach
5/8 socket

I called Champion to find a non-resistor plug. When I told him I wasn't too concerned with the reach (determines if it's a hot/cold plug), he asked me what I was burning. I told him I was trying to ignite water vapor. 'CLICK'. He hung up on me.

Dave

Hello Dave,

Here is what I found. The difference is that your plug is with tapered seat but Non-resistor plugs are with gasket seats. Check this link: Spark plugs

Miks

[Chris31]

Chris,

These are the specs for the plug:

Champion RDZ19H
10mm
3/8" reach
5/8 socket

I called Champion to find a non-resistor plug. When I told him I wasn't too concerned with the reach (determines if it's a hot/cold plug), he asked me what I was burning. I told him I was trying to ignite water vapor. 'CLICK'. He hung up on me.

Dave

LOL what did you expect?

Anyway as for the plugs, unfortunately this plugs seems a rare one. I cant find NGK or bosch making an equivalent, champion does not list a non resistor version either.

[Chris31]

Hi everyone,

This oscillator Phil (aka pmonk) posted is great. The power consumption, load values, scope data all match. I don't understand the heat on the 3055's but it went down and the output power went up when I went from 220 Ohms to 110 Ohms on the Base of the 3055's (thanks for suggestion Kinetix). Even if I need to cool the xistors that's fine because it consumes far less power than the other oscillator.

Greg

Many post ago I have suggested the transistor should be driven hard else you will never use its full switching potential, as a result you are going to get drop in efficiency.

For some reason no one understood what I meant.

Well its sorted now, thats all that matters

[Jetijs]

I agree with that.
Greg, did I understand correct and your oscillator is running at 57Hz?
also, what transformer are you using?

[gmeast]

Oscillator

Hi everyone,

This oscillator Phil (aka pmonk) posted is great. The power consumption, load values, scope data all match. I don't understand the heat on the 3055's but it went down and the output power went up when I went from 220 Ohms to 110 Ohms on the Base of the 3055's (thanks for suggestion Kinetix). Even if I need to cool the xistors that's fine because it consumes far less power than the other oscillator.

Greg

[sa14785528]

hi magneto

thanks for the help, i used jetijs' method and got the system running! that plasma spark is a beautiful sight and sound!

cheers

graham

[Jetijs]

I am using 0,05uF caps and the oscillation frequency is 2,23KHz.
This is a waveform of the input at 75W load on the output. The base resistance is 220 Ohms. Input power 12.6V 3.4A. The bulb fillament just starts to glow dimmly.



And this is when I lowered the base resistance to 50Ohms. Now the 75w bulb turned on at moderate brightness. The amp draw increased to 5.3A.

[sa14785528]

hi Jetijs

thanks for the speedy reply! thats a great way of testing, should have thought of it myself, damn!

cool, so im almost there! wana see that big plasma ball!

thanks

graham

[magnetO]

HV Polarity? Depends on Ignition System.

hi,

but both of them lit up.

graham

Hi Graham,

it would be good to know what kind of ignition your engine is driven from.

A modern transistor ignition does multi spark per engine stroke. The 1., 3.,.. goes up(or down); 2.,4.,.. goes down (or up).

The standard CDI (capacitve discharge ignition), CAN make multi spark (down and up) per engine stroke.

Kettering Ignition
Kettering Ignition
does normally make only one direction.

So, what igniton is in your engine?


@insane4evr,
@kinetix,

I did grasp deep at the trash can, and get the thrown away diodes again. Made a string out of some half-lethal diodes, but all at about 20MOhm (no real bad ones, no good ones), and (again) only 25 diodes. The string blocks. It works!

Havent drive much km, but it works.

Not sure what kind of diodes (NTE517 ??) next order will be.

magnetO

[gmeast]

3055

Hi, everyone.
Guys, as I recall, the 2N3055 can drive much more power that it does in this circuit that you experiment with right now.
It seems that they do not open totally. So, maybe you should lower the value of the 220R/0.5W resistors. Put 100R/5W instead and compare the results. That will probably modify the oscilating frequency. Of course it will draw a little more power when unloaded, but will give more power at full load.
The bigger the current injected in base (gate), the bigger the current through the transformer, so the bigger the power transferred through it.
2N3055 can drive up to 15Amps (C-E junction) if fed with 7Amps in base.
Best wishes.

Hi everyone,

Looking at the trace I see it is a little 'roundy' under load and that makes me think also we need more base current (ain't turning full 'on' - in a linear mode). The 3055's are warm, but the numbers are better than with the other oscillator. I get 22 - 25 watts with a 1K Ohm R load and around 150 VDC on the scope. Also my Amp meter reads around 1.8 - 2.5 Amps and 12.5 VDC at the battery so the numbers agree. I agree, lets open it up to 100 Ohms on the base and square it off. I'm running a 1 uF electrolytic along with the 12kR and am at 57 Hz ... That RC agrees w/theoretical too.

Thanks for everyone's input,

Greg

[Jetijs]

Ok, will try that out,
thanks.
Graham, You can not blow everything up in wiring the diodes in wrong direction, because if the diodes are in wrong direction, you just wont get a spark at all.
Try this:


Put a diode string in series of the spark plug on the HV output. If you wire it like in the first drawing and you don't get a spark on the plug, that means that your ignition coil HV output is of negative polarity. If you now reverse the diode dtring direction, you should see a spark. This way you will determinate the HV output polarity. So If your HV polarity is Positive, then you need to connect the diode string so that the cathode is connected to the spark plug HV lead (NOT ground). Otherwise, if your HV output is negative, you need to connect the diode string with the anode to the HV lead of the spark plug.
Hope this helps.

[Kinetix]

Hi, everyone.
Guys, as I recall, the 2N3055 can drive much more power that it does in this circuit that you experiment with right now.
It seems that they do not open totally. So, maybe you should lower the value of the 220R/0.5W resistors. Put 100R/5W instead and compare the results. That will probably modify the oscilating frequency. Of course it will draw a little more power when unloaded, but will give more power at full load.
The bigger the current injected in base (gate), the bigger the current through the transformer, so the bigger the power transferred through it.
2N3055 can drive up to 15Amps (C-E junction) if fed with 7Amps in base.
Best wishes.

[sa14785528]

HV polarity?

hi,

im just about to connect up my diode strings, but dont know which way to wire them around. i did the test with wrapping a wire around the spark cables and connecting it to to LEDs, but both of them lit up. then i put a diode in line with the wire and the LEDs lit up no matter what way round the diode was!
im stuck!

i really dont want to put the strings in the wrong way round and blow up the circuit!

thanks

graham

[Jetijs]

A little about pmonk's circuit.
Today I soldered everything properly, but this did not work very well, I guess that I messed something up. Anyway, I made a new circuit using solderless connections and alligator clips. Everything works well again. I could light up a 25w light bulb and the AC voltage stays at 230V. I tried to light up a 75W bulb, but it lights up very dimmly and the AC voltage across the bulb is 40VAC max. I guess that in order to get more power through, we need to use two additional 3055 transistors in parallel with the ones that we are using already. Or maybe the UPS transformer is just not suited for frequencies this high? What do you think?

The only components that heat up are the 2n3055 transistors, all the other components stay cool.

Thanks,
Jetijs