Bedini SG

[Jetijs]

ray,
your setup looks beautiful
I always enjoy watching such pictures. Thank you!

[peper10]

HI Ray!!!!

I seen you're pics and you're vid and it's pretty nice!!!
I was wondering if you intend to try the EARTH ROD after finish you're
testing??
Due to you're setup,i think you can try to hook each of you're negative side
to an earth rod to see the difference between normal setup and with the earth rod???
BTW nice work again!!

peper10

[Aaron]

choke on trigger details

Hi Sephiroth,

I was just thinking of all my experiments with diodes and chokes on the Meyer WFC circuits.

The concept of the choke on those circuits is that you can really get very high voltage out the end going to the cell, while the magnetic field of the choke coil restricts current. The more winds on the coil, the higher the voltage and more restricted current. Those chokes are 10k ohms + so very high resistance but it is NOT the resistance that limits the current, it is the stronger magnetic field that limits the current.

Transformer secondary + -------> DIODE |> ----------CHOKE -----> Annode on WFC ---------> WATER ------> Cathode -----> CHOKE ------> Transformer secondary -

The chokes on both sides of the cell are wound on the same core.

Anyway, when the pulse is ON, the positive potential goes thru diode, through positive side choke and forward. When the pulse is OFF, the diode prevents reversal of polarity there and the charged field of the choke is discharged in the forward direction keeping the polarity the same as the terminals of the WFC (water fuel cell). When the pulse is off, the circuit is essentially OPEN so the charged choke's built up potential will discharge towards ground....moving toward negative.

The diode is what is letting your choke discharge forward to trigger the coil again and that is why it helped kick into self resonance I believe. I didn't think of this before but that is what I think is happening. A scope could show more detail what is really happening. Anyway, the diode to choke concept is also a frequency doubler in the Meyer circuit...two pulses FORWARD for the price of one.

I'll play with this concept on my oscillators because because it might be beneficial, I'll find out.

What was supposed to happen? I was just thinking of general benefit of being able to trigger the trigger while limiting what is leaving the input battery (current limiting)...but I guess without the diode is best.

If we can have some way of the SG triggering with little to no current, wouldn't that be best? How much current does the trigger take anyway? These transistors can switch with virtually no current. I had a rca 2n3055 oscillate while the input was 0.004 ma or 0.0004 ma's, literally and that was only a couple volts I believe. I have the details somewhere.

I think you could get it to work with no resistor...fix or variable...if the choke was big enough, which would be a matter of just tuning the choke to your application.

I suppose without the choke, if you know how much current the trigger takes at your max speet sweet spot, then just wind a choke to limit that much current...the voltage will still get through. [maybe a way to send the rest that isn't needed from the induction to the charging batt?]

Just an idea...you really got me wondering about this! lol

[Aaron]

trigger power?

If the trigger is only supposed to be powered by magnetic induction of the rotor's magnet turning over it...coil charges, then releases and turns on transistor, what is reducing the current draw?

Is your choke on trigger setup causing a faster off/on time to reduce duty cycle?

[Sephiroth]

I've had a look at the wfc circuit and the arrangement of the choke is very interesting...

chokes are still new to me but lets see if I have got this right...

if a current is pulsed into a choke the current is blocked by the choke by converting it into a magnetic field. The voltage is still free to pass through.

after a short time, and if the current supply remains constant, current will then pass through the choke only impeded by the resistance of the wire.

then when the current is cut off from the choke. The magnetic field degrades forming a current in the circuit (in the same direction as the original current flow?). Very similar to what happens in the SSG's coils... which is interesting...

however, if the choke is continuously pulsed something else occurs....

once the pulse hits the choke the current is cut off but voltage passes through just as before. But then when the pulse stops voltage is still coming from the choke as it's field degrades. Then the next pulse comes in (before the chokes field has fully degraded) and re-establishes the field and the process starts all over again...

so if you supply pulse DC through an appropriate choke you will end up with steady DC?

Now if we look at the SSG, a funny thing happens with the trigger. IF it is only the voltage generated by the magnet that triggers the transistor, then we should only see ONE pulse per magnet... multiple pulses should not occur. I think we get multiple pulses only if the trigger is part of an N-Filar coil. When the power coil turns on, its magnetic field generates a current in the opposite direction to the current flowing in the trigger coil. This turns off the transistor, and thus turns off the magnetic field from the power coil and current induced by the rotor magnet is free to flow again, and so the transistor turns on again etc etc etc etc......

That is what I believe causes resonance.

So the trigger signal isn't steady DC... it is pulse DC (actually most the time it is AC but the trigger signal is pulse DC)

But with the choke in the circuit, it is no longer pulse dc and is now steady DC. So what now happens is that when I adjust the pot, it adjusts the length of a SINGLE pulse, instead of the length of the "pulse train" as it would normally.

So the reason why i think I have achieved lower amp draw is becuase originally my coils were firing multiple times on some magnets on the rotor, but only once on other magnets due to minor misalignments.

The choke has made it so that it can only ever pulse once per magnet so every pulse is fairly equal. So I think it's main benifit has been in tuning the circuit...

but chokes have suddenly become really interesting! I think I'm beginning to understand this circuit.... I suspect that chokes/coils pulsed with DC are radiant converters. Hot goes in, Cold comes out... if done with the right timing... and now that I understand how coils can behave like capacitors I see that Bedini's Radiant Charger (where two 12volt caps are charged off a single battery and then the 24v charge is pulsed back into the battery) is almost EXACTLY the same thing as what happens in the SSG.... exept it is using coils instead of capacitors and it is self timed....

This has opened up a whole new area for me!

I'd like to hear your thoughts on this...

[Aaron]

choke

With the choke, it seems like it would be steady DC but it is actually a double pulse in the same direction if you have the diode, which seems to be undesirable in the SG.

In the WFC for example, that helps to keep the voltage potential at the tubes not only during the on pulse, but during the off pulse as well.

I agree the chokes are radiant converters...it allows clean voltage potential to come out the other end with little to no current. In the WFC, you want only the potential but in the SG if charging batts, you want at least a small bit of current.

[dzambi]

Bedini SG, Dave's WFC, Radiant Energy and all the stuff

Let me introduce myself.

I am 18 years old Electronic Engineering student from Serbia and i was(still am) into this overunity stuff, i was reading forums on them lately, it seemed logical to me, although it required from me to BELIVE that radiant energy really exists. And i kinda did, but one post made me rethink this.

I know it is long, but please read it, i would appreciate your opinion about it.

That post was the following:

Freedomfuel
Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 1:51 pm Post subject:
I think that I may have figured out the function of the torroidal coil in Daves cell and which first appeared in the
Xogen patent. I never believed that it had anything to do with changing the proportion of Ortho to
Parahydrogen. My hypothesis is that the coil acts as an antenna to focus energy from the environment and
improve the efficiency of the electrolysis. I reached this conclusion after reading about two 'free energy' scams
on the internet which use torroidal coils as antennas for the wireless transmission of electrical energy. These are
the links:
»»PHiladelphia Area of Critial Thinking

http://zpenergy.com/modules.php?name...rticle&sid=987

It was Tesla who first demonstrated the wireless transmisson of energy using longitudinal/scalar waves from a
spherical antenna. Later in the 1930s a Tesla fan demonstrated an electric car powered from a remote transmitter
using the same techniques. T
Any type of coil can be used as antenna if it does not produced an induced emf from a changing magnetic field.
This is because these longitudinal/scalar electric waves do not contain a magnetic field vector. Other types of
coil you could use are caduseus coils and bifalar wound coils shorted at one end.
It is possible that this arrangement was intended to be a hoax where a 'water-powered' car was really powered by
a remote transmitter. As a single cell could never produce enough gas to run a car it is more likely that it is
intended to recieve a ubiquitous longitudianal/scalar radiation in the environment which could either be of man
made or natural origin. Here is an interesting article in which the author suggests that many if not all 'free
energy' devices which have no discernable source of energy could be recieving energy from high voltage
transmission lines, 80% of which is wasted before it reaches the end users:

http://www.pureenergysystems.com/new...s_transformer/

The author points out that many of these devices have reduced output at night and cease to function when they
are relocated. He also suggestst that the batteries used in these devices act as capacitors in the farad range which
together with their coils act as tuned circuits for very low frequency EM waves.
This hypothesis is supported by an article in the INE website about a man in Germany sellin 'free energy'
devices who was imprisoned after a Cologn utilities company brought a private prosecution against him. It
seems that governments and corporations regard 'free energy' as theft. If I am right about this then when the grid
eventually dies 'free energy' will die too.

And this part of his other post:

Let us take the Dingel car for
instance. It also has a torroidal coil in the electrolyzer according to the wasserauto site and it is said to be
drawing energy from the aether. If ,as I suspect, Dingel is really taking some of the energy that is leaking from
the grid I cannot really see anything wrong with that. After all, it only going to be radiated into space. However,
if everyone did the same the whole power distribution system would collapse and we would have no electricity.
That is why I also believe the US government has made such strenuous efforts to prevent Dennis Lee selling his
so called generators.

So, this looks like a rational explanation. But is it only rationalization of truth or the truth itself?
Could it be that that "Radiant Energy" is really some EM wave emitted from our own powergrid?

Cause if it is, than this overunity you(we) achive is not that much of a breakthrough, because, if it is true, then these generators wouldn't work in remote places, or in Space.

I would like to hear your opinion about this, cause i think your opinion will actually make me decide if i am going to try and spend my time and money on making the WFC and experimentig with it and exploring it.
(Not the WFC, but circuits that drive it, like Bedini SG and Dave's circut).

Thanks in advance.

[theinventor]

Where to find the right Coils

Hey guys i was wondering if ya could help me find #27,30,31,32,36 copper coated wire.

Also, for the bedini project, i need to know where to buy the coils #22 for the power coil and 26 for the trigger coil. I think they are suppose to be bifilar or trifilar, which is best? Excuse the spelling.

please help me with a phone number or website.

Thank you for yas help!

[gmeat]

Wire

Hi Theinventor,

Here is a link I use for magnet wire.as far as bifilar or trifilar goes the more the merry .Hope that helps you out.Good luck building.

magnets, wire, shrink tubing, solenoids, electromagnets and driver electronics at PlanetEngineers.com


-gmeat

[elias]

Let me introduce myself.

I am 18 years old Electronic Engineering student from Serbia and i was(still am) into this overunity stuff, i was reading forums on them lately, it seemed logical to me, although it required from me to BELIVE that radiant energy really exists. And i kinda did, but one post made me rethink this.

I know it is long, but please read it, i would appreciate your opinion about it.

That post was the following:


And this part of his other post:



So, this looks like a rational explanation. But is it only rationalization of truth or the truth itself?
Could it be that that "Radiant Energy" is really some EM wave emitted from our own powergrid?

Cause if it is, than this overunity you(we) achive is not that much of a breakthrough, because, if it is true, then these generators wouldn't work in remote places, or in Space.

I would like to hear your opinion about this, cause i think your opinion will actually make me decide if i am going to try and spend my time and money on making the WFC and experimentig with it and exploring it.
(Not the WFC, but circuits that drive it, like Bedini SG and Dave's circut).

Thanks in advance.

Dear Friend
This is my opinion:
Radiant energy is the vacuum itself, not the waves traveling inside it. So Tesla was able to gain more energy back by utilizing the longitudinal waves in the vacuum or more correctly the aether.

You must just consider this: If vacuum exists then it is something and not a vacuum or nothingness, so it can be used as an energy source. The problem is how to tap it? We have designed our devices to work with the electricity we know, which is the effect of the aether on charged particles, But we haven't got any devices which can operate with the aether itself.

We have to find a way to convert it to usable electric current. And all of those devices (which do work, excluding the scams) somehow accomplish this.

You can either use the energy of a magnet (which is some form of aether which can act on matter) for mechanical energy production or use some material which can convert it to electricity like radioactive material for example or like Tom Bearden's MEG which requires some expensive core material to convert magnetism into electricity or just use batteries for this converting purpose, which Bedini claims batteries can convert this energy into normal power.

Hope this helps, don't get discouraged! The world needs this energy.

Elias

[theinventor]

the right coils

I need yas feed back on the comparison of these two websites that sell magnetic wire. Which do ya think offer more for less and at good cuality or better cuality?

first website:
McMaster-Carr (once there type in the search button magnetic wire). I found there prices awsome but I'am nervouse about buying from them, I'am thinking maybe they sell them that cheap beacause the cuality is not that good.

Second website:magnets, wire, shrink tubing, solenoids, electromagnets and driver electronics at PlanetEngineers.com

I'll waite for yas response before i buy, so please help me out ,I want to buy today.

can somebody explain to me what bifilar or trifilar mean in reference to wire I'm hearing builders of the bedinis work are using. I mean do I buy the magnetic copper wire and make them into bifilar or trifilar or do i go to one of the above websites and type in there seach box bifilar or trifilar wire?

Once again thank you for yas response. O and i want to say thank you to gmeat. Thanks for your response. God Bless you!

[CaptainScat]

Let us take the Dingel car for
instance. It also has a torroidal coil in the electrolyzer according to the wasserauto site and it is said to be
drawing energy from the aether. If ,as I suspect, Dingel is really taking some of the energy that is leaking from
the grid I cannot really see anything wrong with that. After all, it only going to be radiated into space. However,
if everyone did the same the whole power distribution system would collapse and we would have no electricity.
That is why I also believe the US government has made such strenuous efforts to prevent Dennis Lee selling his
so called generators.

this logic, while reasonable at first glance, doesn't seem to hold up with a closer look. perhaps i misunderstood but when he said 80% of the grid power is "wasted" before it gets to the end user... if this is what is "supposedly" being captured by "free-energy" devices i don't quite understand how one could come to the conclusion that if everyone did it, there would be a collapse of the whole power distribution system. it would seem to me that there would be no collapse as the 80% being "wasted" would be being used. the grid works now with this 80% waste... it needs to waste 80% to run with out collapse? this doesn't make sense. maybe he was saying if everyone did "it", it meaning stop using the grid well then i could see its collapse but even then i doubt that. someone will ALWAYS pay for it, you know, the guy who pays $2 for for itemA at storeA even when you can get itemA for $1 at storeB
because it cost more, therefore it is superior. my grandfather was this way, im sure you all know or have known someone like that.

all that being said, i think that this freedomfuel person that dzambi quoted could have answered himself quite simply by taking a bedini SG out into the wilds, or rent a boat and go a few miles offshore, get somewhere that there is no "grid radiation" and find out. does it run on a boat in the middle of a lake? or miles out to sea? does it run in remote areas? simple questions usually have simple answers.

[Sephiroth]

all that being said, i think that this freedomfuel person that dzambi quoted could have answered himself quite simply by taking a bedini SG out into the wilds, or rent a boat and go a few miles offshore, get somewhere that there is no "grid radiation" and find out. does it run on a boat in the middle of a lake? or miles out to sea? does it run in remote areas? simple questions usually have simple answers.

I'm pretty sure kevin took his ssg out to the wilderness and it still achieved higher then cop 1. Can't find the post now but it's somewhere around here! Havent seen much from him recently... he was talking about making a REALLY big ssg a while ago.

theinventor - Had a look at both those sites and the wire appears to be different... the first website is enamel coated wire (which I think is pretty much standard) but the other one says it is "Heavy Amidister"??? I assume that must be the insulation on the wires but I haven't heard of it before... I would have thought either would be fine.

bifilar and trifilar refer to the number of wires on the coil... for example if you wrap two wire around your core it is a bifilar... if you wrap 3 wires around your core it is a trifilar... and any multi-wire coil can be refered to as an n-filar coil... to start off most people just use a bifilar coil for their ssg; 1 trigger wire and a power wire.

[dzambi]

Thanks

Thank you all for those encouraging answers, they really seam to be reasonable. So i really am going to continue educating and try making those devices.

Now i have some other questions.

I don't really like mechanical stuff, like that wheel in the Bedini SG, it makes horrible sounds and is kinda not practical. So the question is, can the same effect be made with just some electronics.

For example, what do you think about Dave Lawton's circuit?
Did anyone try it? Did it work?

Please forgive me if i am asking already answered question, i am still new to this stuff, and haven't read all the threads about this. Many other obligations, i don't have much time for this project.

Thanks in advance.

[Aaron]

solid state

Please visit this thread for solid state versions of these circuits.

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/366-bedini-solid-state-oscillators.html

Kevin was running his SSG in a remote area of Maui where he was lucky if the grid was even reliable.