Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect

[Farmhand]

I don't know if this was discussed on this thread anywhere or not yet, but I thought I should post it for matter of record.

People have discussed whether or not Thane knew about the capacitative nature of bifilar coils. The answer is Yes, he knew. There is a transcription of correspondance between him and other people floating around. I'm copying the critical email from Thane:

--------------------------------------------------------------
From: Thane C. Heins <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Russian Academy of Science - Part 2 To: "Евстигнеев Николай" <[email protected]> Received: Friday, January 29, 2010, 2:17 PM
Dear Nick,
The R (DC resistance) should be low (50 ohms) but the Z (frequency dependent impedance) should be high. You have to create a scenario where the inductor acts like a capacitor (storing energy in electrostatic field NOT the electromagnetic field).

The accelerating coils in this video: ThaneCHeins's Channel - YouTube

employ bifilar windings because the bifilar coil in this configuration has increased self-capacitance, which is a key component for acceleration. The frequency is about 400 Hz.

See Bifilar coil here:
Bifilar coil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cheers
Thane
----------------------------------------------------

I studied Thane's videos quite a bit and I never saw him mention bifilar motor coils, which makes me think he was intentionally keeping it secret that he knew about this. There was even one video called "God's April Fools Joke on Science and the Secret" where he said the secret is nothing more than having plenty of winds on the coil. He didn't mention bifilar in that video.

It is true that you don't have to have a bifilar coil, but the frequency (rotor speed) required to reach zero self-inductance on straight-wound coil is CRAZY high. Tesla clearly states that using a bifilar coil removes the need for capacitors to counter self-inductance in his patent "Coil for Electro-Magnets" provided that all the proper conditions are met (i.e. the frequency and voltage are high enough). It is plainly written in the language by Tesla himself.

Zero self-inductance equals zero back-emf. That is a violation of Lenz Law. The use of a moving magnet to excite the coil is only one particular method of excitation. You can also overcome unity by using the bifilar coil as a secondary on a transformer where you pulse the primary at the correct frequency for the secondary to have no self-induction. The secondary acts a receiver of energy with no countering magnetic transmission. This is not a means to OU by itself. However its a critical part. Its called a one-way energy transfer or an "assymetric" transformation or non-reflective transfer. The Vladimir Utkin document floating around on the net explains assymetrical transformers very well.

See here for the basic electrical engineer's explanation that self-inductance and CEMF are the same thing:
Self-Inductance

Self-inductance IS Counter EMF. They're the same thing. Notice the educational page completely fails to mention frequency and impedance. Pretty convenient how that critical piece is left out in the entry-level material isn't it? By the time you get to higher level electricity courses, you're so puzzled that you have forgotten all the basics and you don't realize Back EMF can be removed at the correct frequency and you could have gotten free energy four courses ago and $20,000 less.

I hate institutional science. Its not science. Its contradiction-filled dogma that no one can make any sense of except for the math wizards who can jump through all the little equation hoops and look like they know what they're talking about -- completely ignorant to the fact that the joke is on them. It just goes to show you can take a brilliant person and reduce them to complete foolishness if you spin the right web for their mind. Deception for the win. Thank you, money-lovers.

I hope Jesus comes back soon.

Hi pha3z, I think you must have an OU device to say these things. Where is it ?

Self-inductance IS Counter EMF.

I disagree with this statement above, self inductance has the result of building a magnetic field, there is self inductance to a straight piece of wire, in a coil the magnetic field is more because the inductance is more, when the magnetic field is building energy is stored in it, then when it collapses the energy stored in it is released as regular emf the forward kind, as the field is building there is Counter emf just like there is in a straight piece of wire. Then when the magnetic field collapses the emf it produces is opposed by more counter emf.

Counter emf is present whenever there is current flow in a conductor.

IF self inductance is counter emf as you say then are you saying that counter emf is stored in the coil ?

The current delay from self inductance is merely the building of the magnetic field around the coil before current can flow through the closed loop circuit.

Whenever there is emf producing current flow in a conductor there is counter emf there to oppose it. Lenz's law holds.

To give an analogy using a tennis ball, a person and the air, if the wire is like air (the conductor), the movement of the ball is the current and the emf is the person.

When the person throws the ball in air he uses emf to produce current (moving ball) when the ball is moving (current) there is air resistance (counter emf). If you are throwing the ball in air, air resistance cannot be avoided, self inductance would be like instead of throwing the ball the ball is placed at the end of a spring and the spring is compressed by the emf as the spring is compressing there is counter emf produced because of the moving ball (air resistance) and when the spring decompresses it produces emf to make the ball move (current) the moving ball is opposed by counter emf (air resistance), whenever the ball moves in air there is air resistance.

Self-Inductance

That link says that the self inductance and current causes the magnetic field size/intensity and the magnetic field in turn causes "more" counter emf, the self inductance is not the counter emf it just causes the magnetic field that causes "more" counter emf because of the magnetic field building. The key thing is that it causes more counter emf not all of it.

The way I see it the value of self induction will determine the size/intensity of the magnetic field built, even if the self inductance is cancelled by capacitance there is still counter emf when the current flows.

If you have broken Lenz's law and can put current through a wire with no counter emf then please show us.

Cheers

[Allen Burgess]

Critical comment.

@MOrgO,

Who's Gotoluc?

[M0rg0]

My last tests produced the same results as my former ones. Shorting the output coils in the Rodin style multifilar slows the spinner down, but running the output back to source charges the run battery!

Balanceing the load seams to produce the effect. I uploaded alot of boring videos showing nothing happening, because it's running too close to unity.

The circuit stopped working while I tried to wire a 1 Farad capacitor in to try to get a self runner off the capacitor. The capacitor alone slows the spinner down untill it charges up, then it begins to reaccelerate.

The BEMF in the power coil from the 26k rpm 1" Neo sphere is so great, there's no room for any input.

Looping back to source creates a resonace between the input and output windings that I believe manufactures a "Lenz Delay Effect" inside the coil that I can't reproduce with an unbalanced load. The output coil is technically just shorted to the battey through a FWBR, but THE OUTPUT COIL must recieve some kind of Feedback charge from the battery between pulses, perhaps at a level equal to the voltage in the power coil, Voila some kind of "Tank Resonance"! Who knows?

Why are you using rodin coils at all? What on earth has this to do with what gotoluc has demonstrated?
Why don't you stick with the program rather than introduce ambiguity constantly?
Just my observation.
With all due respect.

[M0rg0]

I don't think so

Hi QV,
Truth is, he is not doing the measurements correctly.

The apparent power isn't zero at all.
He needs to work out the rms values for the TOTAL voltage and current supplied to the transformer.

For a symetrical sine wave as shown in his scope shots he has to multiply the max peak to peak current by the max peak to peak volts.

Then bring this answer to rms value multiply his answer by ......one half of the square root of 0.5, (approximately 0.3535 times the peak to peak values).

This is the total apparent or reactive power including any I squared R losses etc. to the circuit.

You can see from the scope shot it is far far from zero.

There has to be a certain amount of energy sloshing back and forth between the inductor an capacitor to keep the reactances charged over their own part of the cycle. If it were zero power there'd be no deflection on at least one of the channels of the scope. (E times I, so anything times zero is zero)

His first scope shot shows there's a phase lag of over 90 degrees, I think.
If it were precisely 90 degrees then the Cosine of the phase difference would be exactly zero giving true FREE energy as output. From apparent power times Cos phi.

BUT because the indicated phase difference is slightly over the 90 degree mark. It means there is indeed some REAL power supplied to his circuit.

This REAL power may well account for the 10.6 Volts seen across his 10 Ohm resistor, giving a dissipation of about 11 watts.

Gerry

Well, with all due respect this is not correct at all.
If you are out of phase 90% half the induction is negative, loss of power, and half is positive, gain in power. Seeing that it is 45% degrees for each, you end up with 0. Regardless of what math you try to present, this is how it is. A delay, or gain, of 90% means you pay for copper losses and nothing more. Are you suggesting that the power meter is wrong? If so, you need to elaborate in terms that the majority of the forum can understand...
With all due respect.

[qvision]

gentelmen dont let THEM to brainwash you

xl=(omega)*L = 2(pi)f*L

where
f- frequency
L- inductance

so when you have bifilar coil your L goes down so you have to get frequency high to have delay

but when you will get normal coil with many windings (high L) you will need smaller frequency to get the same delay

so if someone tells you that bifilar coil which has small L (inductance) will delay current with small frequency THEY JUST BRAINWASH YOU!!

FOR THE RECORD ITS A LENZ'S LAW MAGNETIC FIELD IN COIL THAT OPOSES THE CURRENT IN COIL MAKING THE DELAY, JUST LIKE INDUCTOR DOES, BUT IN THIS CASE GENERATOR COIL ACTS LIKE IT HAVE AN INDUCTOR BUILD IN!!!

cheers from poland
wojsciech

Yes, all true. In order to raise my L i used laminated core strips, with spacing in between which increased L to 20 Henries, over the scale of my meter !

This was with bifilar-wound 0.25mm around 400 ohms. So as well as increasing frequency by adding amgnets or increasing rotor speed we can be exploring maximising other properties in a creative way.

I found the spacing between the laminations effect upon L by accident, and it's a huge difference.

I also recently wound a 1Kg (2.2Lb) coil (bifilar) around a coil-former which had a much fatter barrel than my 0.5Kg coils, so this 1Kg coil had roughly the same number of turns, and yet the AUL effect was huge, so perhaps it's worth investigating the size of the magnetic field as well as it's strength, possibly it's shape has an effect ?

It's a very interesting field of endeavour.

[wojwrobel]

gentelmen dont let THEM to brainwash you

xl=(omega)*L = 2(pi)f*L

where
f- frequency
L- inductance

so when you have bifilar coil your L goes down so you have to get frequency high to have delay

but when you will get normal coil with many windings (high L) you will need smaller frequency to get the same delay

so if someone tells you that bifilar coil which has small L (inductance) will delay current with small frequency THEY JUST BRAINWASH YOU!!

FOR THE RECORD ITS A LENZ'S LAW MAGNETIC FIELD IN COIL THAT OPOSES THE CURRENT IN COIL MAKING THE DELAY, JUST LIKE INDUCTOR DOES, BUT IN THIS CASE GENERATOR COIL ACTS LIKE IT HAVE AN INDUCTOR BUILD IN!!!

cheers from poland
wojsciech

[qvision]

I can confirm the bifilar info, we message each other fairly regularly on utube and talk on his thread at OU.com and the coils are bifilar-wound.

Thane is called CrankyPants on OU.com, here is a post confirming bifilar wind :

Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect

Good info Phazz but one thing i would disagree with, the need for 'crazy' frequencies to get the effect with straight-wound coils.

I found that i didn't need crazy frequencies with straight-wound coils, but that bifilar-wound coils gave me a nearly 400% performance increase of the AUL effect using the same amount of wire. So it's definitely worth winding them that way, here's my vid of first bifilar test :

The Heins Effect - Bifilar-wound, series-connected coil. - YouTube

So an increase of nearly 400% from a straight wind is a no-brainer, just make sure you keep the pair of wires as close as possible when winding it.

[garrypm]

Bravo, Pha3z

[pha3z]

Thane DID use Bifilar Coils

I don't know if this was discussed on this thread anywhere or not yet, but I thought I should post it for matter of record.

People have discussed whether or not Thane knew about the capacitative nature of bifilar coils. The answer is Yes, he knew. There is a transcription of correspondance between him and other people floating around. I'm copying the critical email from Thane:

--------------------------------------------------------------
From: Thane C. Heins <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Russian Academy of Science - Part 2 To: "Евстигнеев Николай" <[email protected]> Received: Friday, January 29, 2010, 2:17 PM
Dear Nick,
The R (DC resistance) should be low (50 ohms) but the Z (frequency dependent impedance) should be high. You have to create a scenario where the inductor acts like a capacitor (storing energy in electrostatic field NOT the electromagnetic field).

The accelerating coils in this video: ThaneCHeins's Channel - YouTube

employ bifilar windings because the bifilar coil in this configuration has increased self-capacitance, which is a key component for acceleration. The frequency is about 400 Hz.

See Bifilar coil here:
Bifilar coil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cheers
Thane
----------------------------------------------------

I studied Thane's videos quite a bit and I never saw him mention bifilar motor coils, which makes me think he was intentionally keeping it secret that he knew about this. There was even one video called "God's April Fools Joke on Science and the Secret" where he said the secret is nothing more than having plenty of winds on the coil. He didn't mention bifilar in that video.

It is true that you don't have to have a bifilar coil, but the frequency (rotor speed) required to reach zero self-inductance on straight-wound coil is CRAZY high. Tesla clearly states that using a bifilar coil removes the need for capacitors to counter self-inductance in his patent "Coil for Electro-Magnets" provided that all the proper conditions are met (i.e. the frequency and voltage are high enough). It is plainly written in the language by Tesla himself.

Zero self-inductance equals zero back-emf. That is a violation of Lenz Law. The use of a moving magnet to excite the coil is only one particular method of excitation. You can also overcome unity by using the bifilar coil as a secondary on a transformer where you pulse the primary at the correct frequency for the secondary to have no self-induction. The secondary acts a receiver of energy with no countering magnetic transmission. This is not a means to OU by itself. However its a critical part. Its called a one-way energy transfer or an "assymetric" transformation or non-reflective transfer. The Vladimir Utkin document floating around on the net explains assymetrical transformers very well.

See here for the basic electrical engineer's explanation that self-inductance and CEMF are the same thing:
Self-Inductance

Self-inductance IS Counter EMF. They're the same thing. Notice the educational page completely fails to mention frequency and impedance. Pretty convenient how that critical piece is left out in the entry-level material isn't it? By the time you get to higher level electricity courses, you're so puzzled that you have forgotten all the basics and you don't realize Back EMF can be removed at the correct frequency and you could have gotten free energy four courses ago and $20,000 less.

I hate institutional science. Its not science. Its contradiction-filled dogma that no one can make any sense of except for the math wizards who can jump through all the little equation hoops and look like they know what they're talking about -- completely ignorant to the fact that the joke is on them. It just goes to show you can take a brilliant person and reduce them to complete foolishness if you spin the right web for their mind. Deception for the win. Thank you, money-lovers.

I hope Jesus comes back soon.

[wojwrobel]

ok since noone wants to share this "secret" i will give it a try ;-)

ok imagine you have a wire that heve little positive and negative charges in it!

thouse charges like each other plus likes nimus so they stand still in plus-minus-plus-minus order ok

when magnetic field aproches thouse charges beginning to move! pluses in one direction and minuses in other , direction it depands from pole (north or soth) and direction from which the pole is comming

so as the magnet aproches PERPENDICULAR to wire thouse charges move in oposite directions due to changing magnetic field so we have to sinus wave

so magnet gets to middle of wire and magnetic field stops changing (we have stable field over the wire for a second) then charges comes back together because of uniform field - only changing magnetic field pushes charges apart thats why we dont have any current flow when magnet is not moving vs wire

and last step the magnetic field leaves the wire so again we have change in magnetic field so again charges starts move but this time in oposite direction when magnet was aproching wire so we have bottom part of sinus wave

i hope reading this you will have better view of how this works!

some guys might say that we have only negative charges that moves? well we dont have 100% sure on that so lets leave this !



Anyway back to subject

From my own expirience i can tell that if you want the best delay you have to wing as many turns as posible and the tinnest wire you can!

All to make as much inductance L as posible so your results would be best at low frequencie

i have L=50H coil and just 250 hz makes almost 90 degrees phase delay to magnet passing

I also tried bifilar wound coil but whats intresting inductance is smaller by factor of 8 times so its not good

well even if you study tesla patent on electromagnet coil he states that bifilar coil are made to REDUCE INDUCTANCE!!! by increasing coil capacitance which is something oposite to inductance.

cheers from poland
wojsciech

RON PAUL 2012!! go vote

[aladinlamp]

all in one graph

Hi

i want to better understand what exactly happens in alternator regarding magnetic flux, lenz law, current, etc



assume you have 1 stationary coil, just 1 magnet on the rotor and you make just 1 revolution

best way show all the action is single graph, where you show magnetic flux, induced emf and current on the same time line

can somebody show me such graph, where all units start at zero value and end up at zero value, with respect to time

just 1 magnet, 1 revolution, 1 complet cycle on single graph


thanx

[qvision]

I've just realised that it won't speed up under load in this config

Thane Heins says i should wire them in parallel which i will try later today and post results.

[Allen Burgess]

Self runner.

Why not try looping back to source. Two transformers, microwave 500 to 120 ac connected to 120 to 12 Radio Shack, then the rectifier to run battery. See if it charges.

[qvision]

I've been testing the new setup, with occasional pauses for sleep and food ;+}

It seems that it generates more power than it uses but i will have to wait until i get a scope (new year).

Here's a vid :

New setup to explore acceleration-under-load. - YouTube


Thanks for reading,

QV.

[Allen Burgess]

New acceleration under load video.

Here's what appears to be yet again another "Fossil" Lenz Delay effect video. Interesting! His r.p.m.'s are very slow, below 1K, but he has hIs rotor magnets spinning along as well like
Tops. I think now, after having taken a skeptical look at his videos before, that there actually might be some advantage to twirling the magnets on the rotor after all!

The New And Improved Generator ( speed ) - YouTube