Edison battery

[eastcoastwilly]

Hi all,


This place has fairly good price for new nickel iron batteries.
Nickel Iron Batteries - A Lifetime Battery For Your Off-Grid System (or On-Grid Backup)!

@eastcoastwilly


Yes they can be charged with a monopole, the big battery bank that Bedini uses with the monopole and that you see in the video series "Energy from vacuum" are nickel iron.

These batteries need to be charge with a higher voltage than non iron nickel batteries, if I recall well, you need to feed them 18 Volts instead of 13.5V-14V for lead acid batteries.

Take care,

Michel

Hi Michael,

Thanks for the info !!

Will

[Matthew Jones]

All the better reason to start manufacturing them! You would corner the market and put all the other out of business.

Have you priced nickel plate lately. 1'x1'x1/2" thick $400+ from a good supplier where you are assured the grade of the metal. American suppliers go even higher. Of course if you search you'll find the occasional piece cheaper but not with any quantity or guarantee.

You looking at a high Start Up cost for sure. Then you have to charge them.

I looked into for while but it is just not feasible to build them unless you start out buying several tons of Raw nickel and have forged into plate, locally.

Lead is way cheaper, and your performance can hold up for along time with the right type of treatment. Especially in a stationary type use.

Cheers
Matt

[FRC]

Price

I find it strange that nickel would be that high when the world price currently
is around $11.00 USD a pound. Another surprise is that led has been higher in
price than aluminum lately. When I first checked that youtube video about
making your own Edison Battery, I thought, why not make the nickel plate
with Canadian quarters. From 1968 - 1999 they were made out of 99 % pure nickel. So if you can find the earlier ones, they should work one would think.
Even if you have to pay more for them at a coin shop, still might be worth it.

FRC

[IndianaBoys]

I find it strange that nickel would be that high when the world price currently
is around $11.00 USD a pound. Another surprise is that led has been higher in
price than aluminum lately. When I first checked that youtube video about
making your own Edison Battery, I thought, why not make the nickel plate
with Canadian quarters. From 1968 - 1999 they were made out of 99 % pure nickel. So if you can find the earlier ones, they should work one would think.
Even if you have to pay more for them at a coin shop, still might be worth it.

FRC

Does show that at one time, nickel would have been very affordable to use for electrodes:

1 lb = 454 grams divided by 4.54 g = 100 Canadian nickels/lb
= $5 Canadian dollars in nickels per lb. Today's price for $5 Canadian = $4.96 in US dollars.

You would have to find Canadian Nickels minted from 1981 and back to get 99.9% nickel:

Nickel (Canadian coin) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


1963–1981 4.54 g 21.21 mm, round 99.9% nickel
1955–1962 4.54 g 21.21 mm, 12-sided 99.9% nickel


2000–present 3.95 g 21.2 mm, round 94.5% steel,
3.5% copper, 2% nickel plating

1982–1999 (some production until 2006) 4.6 g 21.2 mm, round
75% copper, 25% nickel

IndianaBoys

[FRC]

You may be right

You are correct about Canadian nickels. However, Canadian quarters and dimes
were still 99.9 % made of nickel from 1968-1999 according to the The pdf I saw, after a google search. https://www.bcscta.ca/resources/hebd...mpositions.pdf I was suggesting you would use the appropriate quarters for the plates.

FRC

[Snapper]

Supply of Nickel Iron Batteries

I believe a supply of Nickel Iron Batteries can be ordered from BeUtilityFree.com.

Try Nickel Iron Batteries - A Lifetime Battery For Your Off-Grid System (or On-Grid Backup)!

Although they look expensive at first, they can last for many years and can take full discharge without any ill effect. That means that you can repeatedly use the full 100% battery capacity.

They start to look quite good in comparison for home energy use.

Snapper

[Matthew Jones]

I find it strange that nickel would be that high when the world price currently
is around $11.00 USD a pound. Another surprise is that led has been higher in
price than aluminum lately. When I first checked that youtube video about
making your own Edison Battery, I thought, why not make the nickel plate
with Canadian quarters. From 1968 - 1999 they were made out of 99 % pure nickel. So if you can find the earlier ones, they should work one would think.
Even if you have to pay more for them at a coin shop, still might be worth it.
FRC

Feel free to price it yourself.
Chinese supplier High Purity Nickel - China Nickel, High Purity Nickel, High Purity Metal in Non-ferrous Metal & Products

This is one of about 6 American suppliers that will offer small quantities
Metal Associates | Ferrous and Non-Ferrous Metals Waveguide Tubing and Components.

If you find it cheaper at guaranteed 99% percent pure let me know. I'd appreciate it.

Matt

[FRC]

Try

I guess the only thing to do is to experiment with the quarters on a small
scale and see what kind of results one gets. I am in Canada, and there still
are some of the pre 2000 quarters in circulation.

FRC

[Jbignes5]

New Designs...

What would happen if we took this technology a step further? Would it be possible to make smaller multiple cells instead of one big unit? With nano technology, I am starting to see the perfect source of batteries that last a lifetime. In making the cells more modular it would be easier to manufacture and use less materials to get the same effect.

What do you think guys?

[Matthew Jones]

You could probably try Nickel Plated Flat washers and Black Steel flat washers.
If you get a thick (.05") coated washer for decorative purposes it may work for some time.
That would at least give a cheap means to see how feasible a small battery would be.

But you can buy small Nickel Iron Batteries already. Double "A" size up to dual "D" cells. I am not sure how abundant they are but they were using them in the early to mid 80's in rechargeable application like Elec. Razors and different stuff.
There still might be some out there.

Matt

[IndianaBoys]

You are correct about Canadian nickels. However, Canadian quarters and dimes
were still 99.9 % made of nickel from 1968-1999 according to the The pdf I saw, after a google search. https://www.bcscta.ca/resources/hebd...mpositions.pdf I was suggesting you would use the appropriate quarters for the plates.

FRC

FRC,

You provide useful info.

Using the Canadian Quarter is 5 times the cost of using a Canadian Nickel in comparing the amount of nickel.

Posting info about the price of a pound of nickel and how affordable it was before the 1980's was the purpose of the post.

Now you see a transition of the Canadian Quarter metal content changing from:

silver/copper 1908-1968
nickel 1968-1999
steel 2000-present

Shows a transition from money being backed by a metal that had value to one that has a much lesser value.

Before 1965 the American Quarter was 90% silver and 10% copper.
After 1965 it was 91.67% copper and 8.33% nickel.

Today it would take 960 American Quarters to make 1 pound of nickel at the cost of $240 and you would also have 11 pounds of copper.

Similar comparison for today it would take 4,628 Canadian Quarters to make 1 pound of nickel at the cost of $1,157 and you would also have 1.7 pounds of copper and 42.7 pounds of steel


99% pure nickel sheet 200

This is from online metals:

Order Nickel 200 Sheet in Small Quantities at OnlineMetals.com

The market price for nickel has become very volatile in recent months. As a result, we cannot provide online pricing for these items.

Called Travis at OnlineMetals.com for a quote of 1 square foot of 99% nickel 200 sheet:

.062" thick = $500 2.86 pounds = $174.82/pound
.125" thick = $600 at 5.778 pounds = $108.84/pound
.25" thick = $800 at 11.556 pounds = $69.23


MetalPrices.com
US Dollar
Nickel = $10.82/pound
Copper = $4.26/pound

Steel about $1.25pound

Interesting link to
U.S.Geological Survey (USGS): Nickel
London Metal Exchange (LME) Nickel Prices, charts, historical prices. live feeds, and news, Nickel Cathode Prices.

IndianaBoys

[FRC]

Thankyou

Thanks for the posts from Jbignes5, Mathew Jones, And IndianaBoys, That was
a possible direction that Jbignes5 mentioned, and it would be nice to find these smaller batteries (if some are still out there), that Mathew Jones wrote about. As for IndianaBoys. You seem to have investigated this more than I have. All I was thinking was, that you would have a pound of 99.9% nickel for about $20.00 face value ( each quarter about 6 grams) if you were using the 1968-1999 ones. There must be a high premium for refined grade nickel as compared to the $11.00 world price per pound. Or what else would account for the wide discrepancy?

FRC

[Matthew Jones]

The biggest in Nickel is NiCad batteries. There is only so much available and although its mined regularly like alot of things it is primarily sold to the highest bidder. Right now thats the Chinese and there NiCad industry. They have lots of Cadmium and Mercury in their coal.
Second would be the Chrome and Plating industry. Thats mostly done with nickel.

I have not looked into the world price of $11.00 but I would suspect that is Ore, and Not refined Nickel. The energy cost alone for refining nickel is probably pretty high and adds to the overall cost. Not to add Shipping Storage and labor.

You could strip out the nickel from Nicads but then you have to do something with the Cadmium as well. Its highly toxic.

You could do like the Chinese do and sell it as pot metal for children's jewelry in the States. Thats whole'nother rant though.

Cheers
Matt

[FRC]

Nicads were another option I had considered. But you are right cadmium is very toxic. Also, what is the purity of nickel in nickel cadmiums? Sounds like they first came out with the small iron nickel batteries as rechargables, then realized that there would not be much of a market for them if they lasted forever. So
they came up with the nickel cadmium that would not last. So you have to keep replacing them. Hence, more sales!

FRC

[Jbignes5]

Yeah thats sounds right.

That what normally happens. They are only interested in increasing sales and not about us throwing tons of toxic materials away in our landfills.

I guess at this point we should be looking for a way to recycle whats out there already, even if that means getting it from old coinage stock.

My point is that these batteries would be perfect for the electric vehicles that I am interested in making. It brings to the table a toughness of the battery that can withstand the abuse that a car would generate from it's users. Running the battery out flat would not shorten it's lifespan and thats the ticket to a robust electric vehicle.

Also I would be very interested in what effect a Bedini type charger would have on the batteries. Since the system of Bedini chargers change the batteries operation I would highly suspect that a Bedini type charger would only benefit this type of battery. Especially in the charging and running modes of the batteries.