Gray Tube Replication

[Reiyuki]

I'm on travel now, so I may not be able to work on the gray system for a bit, but I'll offer what I can.

We're trying to optimally reproduce 'radiant events' using coils and capacitors in with disruptive discharge. Through our various replications, we should be able to come up with a rough theory that may help improve and perfect replications, or at least create a set of minimum requirements.

NRGFromTheVacuum
This replicator CSET replication as well as a simple 2-capacitor discharge concept he has promoted. There are a couple points to be made on this one:
YouTube - NRGFromTheVacuum's Channel
- The HV setup uses a tesla coil secondary (usually 40-120ohm).
- Capacitor is high voltage low capacity. Possibly a ferroelectric capacitor, known for a unique charge/discharge curve.
- Operating on at least 6kv.

Aaron
YouTube - aaronmurakami's Channel
- 4uf/4000v cap 'worked fine'
- 330uf at 400v 'worked the best'
- Caps in videos are electrolytic in series, likely a high ESR in this configuration, so cap type doesn't matter much.

Ghst
YouTube - 1Ghsty14U's Channel
Ghst seems to be getting good flashes using only 1 capacitor and a coil.
- 1.6uf @ 1750AC cap (microwave cap)
- #22 1-200 turn coil, 5ohm or less, for sure.
- Ignition coil driver. Arcs look way higher than 1750, over 5kv is possible without arcing over a microwave gap.

Reiyuki
Unsuccessful replication so far, but I'll share my differences.
- .75-1joule capacitor energy @2-4kv
- Low and high energy coils tested (5 ohm bifilar to 70ohm from a tesla coil secondary)

Summary
- Voltages are highly variable, but energy needs have minimums. 2.5 joules seems to be a minimum discharge energy (ghst). My highest was about 1 joule and unsuccessful. So any replicator should try for at least 2 joules total energy in their tests.
- Diodes are picky creatures and should be used for improving recovery and not for initial triggering.
- Only one capacitor seems to be necessary. A coil seems to have enough stored energy to be the other potential source.


There's plenty more variables to try. Sure, Grey may have converged on an 'optimal' design, but knowing what factors were key will get this thing off the ground faster.

[energetic for um]

ghst

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/3182-cset-conversion-switching-element-tube.html

"The CSET patent states that the purpose of the one way energy
component, or diode, was to protect the arc switch contacts from
erosion caused by back EMF from the arc. However, the diode also
performs a different function as well. T. H. Moray showed that this
kind of energy can be picked up from the earth's environment using an
L shaped antenna. It can be seen that Moray was using the same kind
of energy, since a wire in his circuit could be cut, with the ends of
the wires placed on either side of a sheet of glass, and the circuit
would continue operating. So, as you say, the energy in Tesla's spark
gap was not an arc. This same type of perpendicular energy effect can
be produced with a spark, by T-tapping a High Voltage arc circuit
between the diode and a preceding cap, and positioning the end of this
jumper wire close to the arc. The CSET circuit has this T-tap,
running backwards through the motor to the grids. The T-tap spark
effect generates an oscillation having an extremely high frequency,
somewhere between 10 MHz and one GHz, depending on the size of the
capacitor. The high frequency environment within the CSET may be
tapping into the "Sea of Energy In Which the Earth Floats" that Moray
was using. For some reason, NASA stopped monitoring these four bands
of energy frequencies, back in the 1990's."

Don't you have an L shaped antenna in you tube?

[Ghst]

Ghst, are you still using the same schematic on your recent tests?

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/1778/ghstschema1.jpg

Yes I'm using this basic setup, except I am not using switch on LV. I am connected the diode. I then have a jumper connected also at the diode that connects to the ground of battery or the positive for the LV potential. Inductor doesn't have to be wound around the tube.

[Aaron]

caps

Hi Rei,

I think if you put enough of those caps in series to get more voltage than you'll need, they should be fine.

The smallest capacitance I used and got the effect was 4uf/4000v cap charged as low as several hundred volts up to 1000v and it worked fine.

The largest capacitance I used was 330uf at 400v and that worked the best and that isn't too much current because it is so time compressed.

It is just my opinion that the collision forcing to common ground is the effect we want...there are a lot of ideas here and my opinion is based on experiments and my own perceptions of what is happening.

As far as the energy projects go, I'm putting them on hold until I'm done with spring cleaning and get my garden going.

[Reiyuki]

Ghst, are you still using the same schematic on your recent tests?

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/1778/ghstschema1.jpg

[Ghst]

Pre Burst of the Massive Discharge

These pre-burst frames (frame before the green flash plasma) are what is intriguing to me. They are like a ghost appearing anywhere inside the tube outside the tube and are generally away from the area of the discharge.If you watch the video closely, you can see the pre-discharge. These appear white with a red outer ring to my eyes, but look like this on film.

http://img164.imageshack.us/img164/1/prebursttomassive2.jpg

http://img164.imageshack.us/img164/6015/prebursttomassive1.jpg

This is the video of the massive Bursts.
YouTube - Nailed 5

[energetic for um]

ghst

awesome work ghst, i really think your on to something here, i don't know why everybody isn't really impressed with your thingy. plasma outside the tube is definatly something

[Reiyuki]

Hey Aaron,
-Sorry, by asymmetric discharge I mean the 2 high-voltage potentials colliding with each other on their way to ground (I assume that's what we're going for?).
-The 2nd picture does not have a coil. I suppose that would explain the subtle difference in effects.
-The -load- coil I have with the best response is bifilar series wound (tesla patent version) with a steel core. Even at 12v it launches a magnet.
- Funny you should mention disposable cameras; I worked at a camera counter years back and salvaged caps and boards from several cameras in my spare time. There's a box of at least 60 disposable camera caps I should be able to hook in series. As long as they don't explode from strain..

Just out of curiosity, what have you been working on lately? The last CSET vid is from a month ago, made any improvements or are you working on something else?

[Aaron]

Rei's circuit

Hi Rei,

What do you mean by asymmetric discharge?

On the 2nd one, is there a coil in that one?

It is possible to get the effect but have it so weak that it won't get much power but if you can see that it actually does charge the coil by putting a magnet by it or something else magnetic - and if you can see some movement, you know it is charging - when normally, the HV passes through and does not charge it.

I think the capacitance at 0.1uf is too small.

I'm not sure where you're at, but if you go to a place that processes photos, you can probably get a bunch of disposable cameras for free...wire a bunch of the caps in series to get lower capacitance and hundreds of volts...that would probably work better than your cap bank and would also be free.

[Reiyuki]

Aaron,

I tried the experiment again using the 'colliding potentials' concept. One diode to rectify the ignition coil HV, charging one capacitor from the HV and the other through a gap. The LV side is through a chunk of carbon, triggered manually.
Here's some still shots from the tests. The first is with one bank of capacitors and no coil, the second is assymetric. The asymmetric discharge is 'bluer' and the sound is a bit more like a puff than a crack.



I didn't however get any noticable pulse in the coil (~5ohm). Is this what we're looking for? If so, what would you suggest as a next stage? Perhaps trying to get some useful power out?

thanks,
-Reiyuki

[Ghst]

Massive Effect

I just had to post this. Look at what I can do!

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/6582/massiveeffect2.jpg

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/500/massiveeffect.jpg

These are so intense that they are blinding. I still see huge spots in my vision. You can go here to view all of my saved photos and see how this effect has grown. ImageShack® - ghst's Profile Page

[Ghst]

I have here a few photos of my "nailed" setup.

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/9169/nailedsetup1.jpg

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/7...ledtopview.jpg This is Top View HV connected Black on right. Blue is the grid connection. The nail spacing is 1/8 inch staggered two rows, maybe 1 1/2" between HV and Grid connection Blue. Red is to connect neutral tube Grid to Nails.
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/1...drightside.jpg right side view
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/9...edleftside.jpg left side view

These pictures show the frame right before each burst. This will give you a idea how bright these effects are. The last picture shows the green plasma outside the tube. Also I am using no inductor coil. But the multiple spark gaps created by the nails seems to boost the caps charging and the size of the effect. The tube is 3' diameter.

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/2443/preburst1.jpg

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/2199/burst1.jpg

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/3069/preburst2.jpg

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/167/burst2.jpg

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/4034/preburst3.jpg

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/6844/burst3thewopper.jpg

This is the video the stills came from.
YouTube - nailed 3

This effect will happen inside a tube or without a tube, but its not so loud inside the tube. Outside the tube connect the black (HV) as shown and connect the Grid wire (blue as shown) you don't need the red wire. Discharge LV by bringing LV side of cap in over the top of nails between the HV and the Grid connections. Preferable closer to the grid wire (Blue). Be careful and safe the discharge is loud and deadly.

Reiyuki,

Well, that's what I have so far. I was hoping for a green flash or something concrete, but I figure so far so good.

These effects happen so fast that I have to Video the discharges, then do a frame by frame to see the extent and color of the discharge. Even then some of the effects are missed by the camera, if they happen between frames of the video.

@ Aaron,

The coils will be virtually unaffected by the HV pulses going through the coils as it is mostly potential moving through the coil and the coil offers little in the way of resistance to a HV and super low current pulse and will not heat up or burn up...it just passes through to charge the caps and will produce no real magnetic charge in the coils themselves.

I must express that I've had different experiences with the HV through the inductor coil, then cap. I have a pile of coils that have burned out. when placed in between the grid and the charging capacitor. Really every one has eventually failed. Including the coil wrapped around my original Tube replication. When the HV jumps to grid I am getting a lot more than potential to the cap. You are sending the full HV discharge from the ignition coil through the inductor to the cap. This has been my experience so far and I'm only trying to help.

[Aaron]

Rei's circuit

Rei,

The tube isn't necessary to make it work; it just makes it stronger.

If you make the "grid" point closer to the HV source than it is to the LV point, when caps are charged, the HV will be forced to hit that first before going to the LV point. For example, it may even work if you have the grid point directly in between the HV and LV point...then the HV point can't not hit the grid (capacitors) before going to LV point.

I would keep the LV rod totally disconnected....leave the HV source running and charge the cap to the "grid" point....and when the caps are up in voltage, use a wooden stick or whatever to connect the LV side to the ground...like a single shot event. I'd remove the diodes and battery as well and just make a straight switch connection from LV point to the ground.

[Reiyuki]

Thanks for the help Aaron and Ghst. I made quite a bit of progress over the last day or so.



Ignition coil is back, being powered by a 'sacrificial' 555 timer in case of a surge. The entire system is ~3-4kv and discharges around 2kv. I have tried a few variations from the notes on pg1-10 of this thread. There are a couple interesting things to report so far..

- When the capacitor bank is charged and power is removed, I get little trickles of very tiny static-like sparks going from the capacitor bank through the blocked diode to ground. These happen around 1hz and appear to occur indefinitely (at least 2hr without noticable capacitor discharge). I thought at first it was due to RF from a nearby server rack, so I disconnected everything but the capacitors and diode, but the very tiny snaps keep happening until I discharge the caps. I haven't tried to get usable power from this, but it certainly qualifies as a 'weird' effect.

- With the proper spacing, I can get the 'grid' and the 'LV diode' path to arc simultaneously. No green flash, but then again there is no 'tube' to speak of yet either.

- When I get the 2-way arcs, I measured a sizable surge going between gnd and the LV diode. It could be bemf from the ignition coil, I'm not sure yet.

YouTube - EV Gray Tube Test 1


Well, that's what I have so far. I was hoping for a green flash or something concrete, but I figure so far so good.

-Rei

[Aaron]

Rei's circuit

The HV going through the inductor coil, before the caps will eventually burn out the coils, and produce minimum if any repulsion.

The coils will be virtually unaffected by the HV pulses going through the coils as it is mostly potential moving through the coil and the coil offers little in the way of resistance to a HV and super low current pulse and will not heat up or burn up...it just passes through to charge the caps and will produce no real magnetic charge in the coils themselves.

@Rei - the coil(s) are just fine in the location you have them.

When the caps are charged and you switch the LV side on, the HV spark from the transformer can collide with the + potential from the caps and move to common ground and that is when the coils can and will charge if you have the caps and gaps correct for your setup.