Electric Motor Secrets

[Peter Lindemann]

Designs are symbolic...

Mr Lindemann,
in your DVD, you describe a "c" shaped iron keeper for your rotary attraction motor. could the use of an "H" shaped iron keeper work better, utilizing BOTH sides of the coil at the same time? (the coil would go on the cross member of the "H")

Bryan,

A wide variety of designs are possible. The purpose of showing the C shaped core is merely to convey the principle of operation. It is probable that a motor could be designed that utilized an H shaped iron keeper, but I have never designed one.

Once you thoroughly understand the principles, dozens of new designs are possible.

Peter

[clone477]

Tesla's Patent???

Hello Peter and all,
I wanted to thank you for opening my eyes to this whole new world on motor designs, you dvd was very interesting and I learned grasped alot. I wanted to point something out to everyone and yourself. And I dont know if this has been pointed out before or not, or even if my assumptions are correct, but here goes....

I Tesla patent #568,177 Apparatus for Producing Ozone, if you closely look at the diagram it looks as though it is wired to collect the spark from a collapsing magnetic field,which looks to be arranged in a resonant circuit. The first part being simular to what we are doing here. Also, he states in the patent "....which enable me to produce, without difficulty and AT VERY SLIGHT EXPENSE, ozone in any desired quantity." It continues ".....is CAPABLE OF OTHER AND HIGHLY IMPORTANT USES OF A SIMILAR NATURE...."

Was Tesla trying to tell us that design had more than one use????

What do you guys think, does this make sense or am I off??

Thanks for the great forum, and thank Peter for contributing your knowledge.
Fern

[Peter Lindemann]

Pistons are Iron

thank you Mr Lindemann for your explanation, you clarified this error for me.

another thing that i found, towards the end of the video you show the mechanical drawing of Teal's motor.(showing the solenoid)
in that picture, there is component #76, im assuming is supposed to be the actual piston. however, there is a little white space in the center of this, a line at the top, and more white space at the top of piston drawing, which is probably supposed to be empty space.
in the actual photo, with the piston fully exposed, there is no hollow area to the piston head. could component #76 actually be an aluminum sleeve, and the white space is the iron?
earlier in this thread, someone mentioned that an aluminum disc hit with a hard electro-magnet spike will shoot it way up into the air.
i would imagine that as the coil energizes, the iron part of the piston would be drawn up into the coil, and when the armature reaches full extension, a huge spike violently repel the aluminum sleeve back out of the coil. this would give direct force to the piston travel both in AND out, virtually doubling your torque.(or more)

if i am way off, please forgive my ignorance, it has been years(12) since i last studied any of this.

thank you for your previous answer.

-adam ant (bryan)

Bryan,

Thank you for using your real name. I appreciate that. To the best of my knowledge, the "white space" inside component #76 is AIR. The area defined by the cross-hatch pattern is the part #76 which is defined in the Patent body as the "core". Its mounting to the connecting rod (#78) is screwed into the base of the core. The area above this is empty, or in reality, filled with air. The use of Aluminum is never mentioned in Teal's patents.

These drawings are "symbolic" in many ways, and do not reflect the exact design. You can see, for instance, that all of the photographs show that the tops of the electro-magnets are open so the air can escape when the piston travels up, but Figure 5 does not show this feature, instead showing the top of the cylinder closed.

Please feel free to download these patents and study them carefully. Also look at the photographs of the working units. All of these materials can be accessed on my website at:

Free Energy, Bob Teal | Magnipulsion, Dr Peter Lindemann

Peter

[Peter Lindemann]

You've got a Good Eye..

hello all,

this is my first official post and i thought this would be a good place to start. i just finished watching Mr. Lindemann's DVD and i was very impressed. i studied motors and generators back in 1996 with the US Navy, but their courses are so packed together and in such a short time frame, that i only retained about 10% of that knowledge. after watching that DVD, and also reading these posts, i can say that im glad i lost that garbage "science".

Mr. Lindemann, i must ask, in your DVD as you begin to mention Teals' circuits for his patent, and mentioned that their is a battery hooked up. I wondered if you noticed that his schematic drawing of a battery is showing negative (-) facing OUT on both sides. (both + terminals are touching)

is this a typ-o on Mr Teals part, or is he trying to say something here?

thank you

Dear Adam (Ant),

Yes, there is a error in Teal's patent drawing concerning the correct nomenclature for a battery. In Figure 5 and Figure 8 in Patent #4,093,880 the batteries are drawn with only 5 plates. Since there are no transistors or diodes in the circuit, we don't know which is the Positive (+) terminal, but I have always redrawn it with the Positive terminal up. In Figure 6 in Patent #4,024,421 the Negative terminal is clearly shown in the down position and going to the coil first, while the Positive terminal is shown going to the switch. I have always assumed the circuits in the second patent were essentially the same as in the first patent.

The function of the circuit does require a normal battery connection, and not a battery with two Negative terminals. This is definitely an error in the drawing, not a covert secret methodology.

Thanks for asking.

Peter

[nali2001]

Hi Sykavy,
Yes, making the slots and fingers will be quite a bit harder to make than just a flat surface rotor. But I think it has some big advantages since now the two poles are 'virtually' interlocking. So one might think that the need for the super small air gap will be reduced.

Iron filings have a permeability of next to nothing unless (professionally) pressed. So that would not be a real helpful solution in my opinion.

The main problem here is (as always) money... Like I said a factory where they make motor laminations will have no problem stamping out the laminations needed for a No-Back emf motor. But although I have no idea what it will cost to make such a core for you, I doubt that it is in reach of the 'common man'. Maybe having them laser cut is more do able.

Steven

[sykavy]

Hi Sykavy,
Well I don't really know if the solenoid piston design has significant advantages over the 'normal' switched reluctance motor design. On the one hand one might think there is better flux interactions since the coil encapsulates the piston core. But on the other hand you must have some support system to guide the piston, which results in noise, losses and wear.

There are so many different types of Reluctance motor design out there you wont' believe. Here for example is an interesting addition:
http://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/...126/4/385/_pdf

Also another method for reducing the air gap size is having 'slots' in the stator and rotor core elements, so that the rotating parts kind of interlock or 'mix' with each other.
Like this:
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/SlotRotor/1.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/SlotRotor/2.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/SlotRotor/3.jpg

Steven

Hi Steve
You know I was thinking of the slot idea on my own, but I didn't know how to explain it.
What would be the air gap around these slots be?

Plus it looks a lot more complicated to make than just a simple flat air gap. You were saying that one would need a professional die-cast for Peter's air gap but wouldnt slots make it even more complicated?

What if the air gap was filled by a metal/plastic mixed plate. I mean iron filings mix with apoxy and then slowly shaved down till the perfect air gap was reached.

[nali2001]

Tesla Switch

Ok thanks, the Tesla Switch topic is now going on(starting) at:

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/962-use-tesla-switch.html

Steven

[Peter Lindemann]

Let's start a new thread...

Dear Peter,
I apologize for this somewhat off topic post, but since you and Bedini have history you might know a thing or two about the 'Tesla Switch' and alike systems. I think these systems might be a good addition for these No-back emf motor designs especially since they can be driven like dc low ohmic induction loads. Not much input is lost in the form of heat and such.

For those who do not know what I am talking about read:
THE TESLA SWITCH
And
http://www.panaceauniversity.org/D3.pdf
Start at page 25 (to 36)

So this post is kind of a double post. On the one hand I see the Tesla Switch having huge advantages, but on the other hand, except for the Bedini page there is no real info to be found anywhere about this system... Why? well Peter what is your take on the Tesla Switch, and in case Bedini is reading this, please feel free to jump in.

Thanks!
Staven

Steven,

This topic is very important to consider, but is really OFF TOPIC for this forum, since it requires multiple posts to thoroughly discuss it.

Start a new thread and I'll address the answers there.

Peter

[nali2001]

Tesla Switch

Dear Peter,
I apologize for this somewhat off topic post, but since you and Bedini have history you might know a thing or two about the 'Tesla Switch' and alike systems. I think these systems might be a good addition for these No-back emf motor designs especially since they can be driven like dc low ohmic induction loads. Not much input is lost in the form of heat and such.

For those who do not know what I am talking about read:
THE TESLA SWITCH
And
http://www.panaceauniversity.org/D3.pdf
Start at page 25 (to 36)

So this post is kind of a double post. On the one hand I see the Tesla Switch having huge advantages, but on the other hand, except for the Bedini page there is no real info to be found anywhere about this system... Why? well Peter what is your take on the Tesla Switch, and in case Bedini is reading this, please feel free to jump in.

Thanks!
Staven

[nali2001]

Designs

Hi Sykavy,
Well I don't really know if the solenoid piston design has significant advantages over the 'normal' switched reluctance motor design. On the one hand one might think there is better flux interactions since the coil encapsulates the piston core. But on the other hand you must have some support system to guide the piston, which results in noise, losses and wear.

There are so many different types of Reluctance motor design out there you wont' believe. Here for example is an interesting addition:
http://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/...126/4/385/_pdf

Also another method for reducing the air gap size is having 'slots' in the stator and rotor core elements, so that the rotating parts kind of interlock or 'mix' with each other.
Like this:
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/SlotRotor/1.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/SlotRotor/2.jpg
http://home.planet.nl/~sintt000/SlotRotor/3.jpg

Steven

[sykavy]

Well Sykavy,
small air gaps are indeed much desired. But if you go too crazy with them they can in my opinion become problematic. When you want to get in the range of like 0.02mm you really stet the bat pretty high for yourself. Everything must be machined with top notch precision, and also you must start to think about what the eventual bearing wear will be doing, also metal expansion due to to heating will become considerable. Stator vibration and stretching will also now be an issue.

Now there is another way to combat the need for insane small air gaps. And that is to increase the 'contact' or 'pole' surface. The longer the total pole the more interaction surface you have.

Just look at this render and see the small pole surface:


Now compare that with the stator of a real use reluctance motor:
http://www.eti.uni-karlsruhe.de/wolf...res/Laufer.jpg

Steven

Would the solenoid piston set up used by teal be an easier feat?

He had two coils in his drawings and I was thinking that maybe he had a set up like a steam engine piston. A coil that drew the piston up and then a coil to pull the same piston down in the same solenoid ( maybe that is why they were so long). By having a constant magnetic circle around the piston then friction would be low, because it would have equal pull on all sides keeping the piston from scraping the sides during the relax time.

[nali2001]

Air gaps

Well Sykavy,
small air gaps are indeed much desired. But if you go too crazy with them they can in my opinion become problematic. When you want to get in the range of like 0.02mm you really stet the bat pretty high for yourself. Everything must be machined with top notch precision, and also you must start to think about what the eventual bearing wear will be doing, also metal expansion due to to heating will become considerable. Stator vibration and stretching will also now be an issue.

Now there is another way to combat the need for insane small air gaps. And that is to increase the 'contact' or 'pole' surface. The longer the total pole the more interaction surface you have.

Just look at this render and see the small pole surface:


Now compare that with the stator of a real use reluctance motor:
http://www.eti.uni-karlsruhe.de/wolf...res/Laufer.jpg

Steven

[sykavy]

Dear Sykavy,

You asked "Could the gap be wider if we made a stronger electro-magnetic pulse?"

Yes, in the motors I have now, the gap is wider. The motor still runs but is weaker. Making the magnetic field stronger makes the motor run faster and stronger, but also draws more electricity to accomplish this.

The purpose of making the air-gap smaller is to make the motor run faster and stronger WITHOUT drawing more electricity to do it. This makes the production of mechanical energy MORE EFFICIENT.

I hope this helps you understand the relationship between the power of the motor, the air-gap, and the efficiency of mechanical energy production better.

Peter

Yeah thanks.

[future pather]

[Peter Lindemann]

Don't Misunderstand Me

Peter,

No problem. It was obviously a deviation from the thread topic, but I felt your words:

dishonesty will be out of fashion. . . people will want to live together in peace and cooperation.

Caring for others, speaking your truth, and living in integrity is the beginning of this future.

allowed for what I wrote.

I would never want to take away from what you are doing with motors, etc. God knows I can't!

But the clips I posted give what I feel is an excellent overview of a big problem when it comes to world economics and freedom AND it provides a solution. The speaker seems very confident it would work. That positive message seemed worthwhile to me but if you don't feel "attracted" to checking it out, I hold nothing against you

-Jessica

Jessica,

My comments DID allow for what you wrote. The intent of my comments was not to suggest anything inappropriate on your part. I was merely saying that "I don't do politics". In my "IDEAL WORLD" I would outlaw politics as a profession, but I don't think the world is about to be remade in a way that I like. In the meantime, it is necessary for each of us to find our own "path of integrity" and do what is "ours to do".

I honor your path, even as I honor my own.

Please feel free to comment as "the spirit moves you". I'll respond in kind.

Peter