Cap Dump Circuit

[BroMikey]

Volt drop

Hi Mike, I'm not sure if this really applies to your thread , kind of I guess but I don't have a circut for the dump , just manual , eventually mechanical.
The one thing I've noticed when trying to dump into the source battery the voltage will jump but then settle to a lower value?
If I dump to a secondary battery it jumps then settles but never to a lower value and eventually charging. So is that the reason for disconnecting supply before dumping into it?

To Shylo

When a battery has been setting for a long time it may show a surface charge on the meter but when a good health surge of power or spike comes the plates begin to activate.
It's almost like having a full jar of sugar and when you begin to shake it it settles to a lower level but the same amount of sugar is still there.

With a battery other things can happen. I have some sitting around and they show a surface charge and when engaged by pulsing the voltage drops.

tonight I put a 1500 pound battery on the pulse dump for the first time in 4 weeks. The voltage showed 12.6 and after pulsing for 30 minutes the battery showed a charge of 13.5vdc. and after 3 hrs it was 13.0 volts and after 12 hrs was at 13.4. So yes batteries need to be stirred up and much time to fill completely. Many who see the pulse charging information think that the batteries charge faster.

The newbies think that faster means free energy.

Another thing pulse charging does is to grow a finer material crystalline lattice that enables your battery to hold more charges or pockets to fill, either way you want to look at it.

Therefore sometimes as you pulse charge a battery it is changing by getting larger. As the pocket count is increased the charges will show less yet the battery still has more power in it than it did to start with.

I like to look at it like this, the battery sulfates a tiny bit between charge ups so the strong in rushing currents clean these obstacles off the plates and this will show a lower voltage right away as the newly opened pockets that should have been opened to be read by the meter were not accessible.

Once cleared off the pockets show empty as they can be read by the meter , where before no room for energy existed.

A fully sulfated battery that can not give out any power reads 12.5vdc on the meters. I have nice batteries here that no matter how hard I try they will not come back to life yet they read nearly full on the meter.

Don't let your batteries sit for long or you will have to work harder to get them cleaned up first and then charged up and on top of that continue the conditioning process of enlarging.

My ALUM converted batteries all give back over 50 percent more power than they are rated for from the factory when brand new.

Mike

[shylo]

electronics

Hi Mike, I'm not sure if this really applies to your thread , kind of I guess but I don't have a circut for the dump , just manual , eventually mechanical.
The one thing I've noticed when trying to dump into the source battery the voltage will jump but then settle to a lower value?
If I dump to a secondary battery it jumps then settles but never to a lower value and eventually charging. So is that the reason for disconnecting supply before dumping into it?
Hi Matt in that video of the magnet rail, I'm sure you exp. extensively did you ever get anywhere with it? I was thinking it could be used as an assited kicker in a multitude of exp. If I had all the same magnets I would try myself.
Sorry not much to do about electronics, just looking.
artv

[BroMikey]

All grown Up

Hi folks, if we don't try and share freely, we will have the same monkey on our backs and i'm sure most here know the monkey i'm speaking of.
If i had information of value, i would share it without hesitation.
Things related to basic human needs, (energy, etc.) need to be shared freely, or we will never get the slave masters off our backs, in this world that is.
peace love light and lighten up all.

Hi Sky

I see you have come along way since the earlier days huh? Just kidding around, I know YOU can take a punch. I have watched your work from I think 2004? Well somewhere back there I was in my 40's.

You and I were on other yahoo groups and I used the name "ELECTROGASMAN" talking about the hexcontroller and Bob Boyce work.

Thanks for all of the great posts.


@MATT
@SKY
@Group

Now let me explain what happened last night in the newbie's work shop.

I had this dump running for over a week and just couldn't stand it I guess.
So I went searching for the upper limits after having beat the H-E-Double-L out of these 3 tiny devices.

So what I did was increase the supply current and voltage a little at a time till I got results .

Kaboom!!!!! I saw a flash, I was at 3 pulses per second and maybe 700 watts input with little or no resistance for charging time on the cap bank.

I bought 20 more fet right then. I still have 12 left.

I will be doing a video and show what I mean as this is one of the most important things that JOHN BEDINI has point out by the use of his oscillators.

JB has shown the importance of turning off the supply power while the caps dump when he shows his oscillators filling the capacitors up on his discharging units.

Many want to simply turn off the supply momentary with another set of fets when the dump comes and this is a great idea. So I did that. Well first I soldered in 3 more brand new fet's.

I looked at the amp pulse at the normal setting and the supply running at all times with the dump at 1 per second. I also went to a resistance for charging my cap bank to it's longest time. So it took a full second for it to charge up and was ready for dumping.

The current pulses came to 10amps then I charged it back up and removed the input power while the dump came, there was little difference in the current pulses only and extra amp for 11 amp pulses.

So I decided I had better show what I learned to the lesser experienced so when they start burning up fet's they will remember this post.

again I burned up 3 fet's purposely. I run the supply up to 75 volts dumping down to a 12 volt battery with a rapid secession on pulses doing everything wrong. 20 amp pulses and a groaning power supply.

The circuit breaker go off at 20 amps and I had the supply up close to that sometimes just to be rotten. Finally they exploded.

So I rocked back in the chair realizing that at about 3 ohms of resistance to charge the bank was to fast when the dump came and the dump down voltage was never reached sometimes as I adjusted around the pulses and current input.

Now here is what I am stuck with. I can run for days at a 500 watt input with the right resistance (about 6 ohms for my caps) the input amp draw just flickers (Wiggles Thanks JB) at about 1-5 amp fluctuation over 1 second, while the output pulses are 10-15 amps.

The wrong way is a 10amp charging resistance over 1 second and the output pulses are 10 amps, this is wrong.

Then I remembered all of the oscillator work and how the oscillator failed at the instant of the dump plus how the SG force Oscillator filled caps so quick.

So I had to make a choice to turn off the supply between dumps or continue building this oscillator.

I have irfp250's in there now and will build a higher voltage version latter. This one will be good for maybe 60 volts using these 250's.

Mike (Been searching for a higher volt bipolar 400v minimum)

[BroMikey]

Dude Turn Lose of It.

Circuit diagram deleted

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, if we don't try and share freely, we will have the same monkey on our backs and i'm sure most here know the monkey i'm speaking of.
If i had information of value, i would share it without hesitation.
Things related to basic human needs, (energy, etc.) need to be shared freely, or we will never get the slave masters off our backs, in this world that is.
peace love light and lighten up all.

[Matthew Jones]

I'll help you with yours. I might even share some of mine, but you unfortunately you already have a perfected grasp on what your doing and why nothing else will work. I don't see being able to change that.

I have made considerable investment in my work and the tools to understand what I am doing, doubt what I tell you, before I even tell you how or why, if you want, its your loss.

Like I said I am sorry to have bothered you.

Matt

[BroMikey]

Matthew Jones Circuit

Hey Matt

All I can find on youtube that shows your work in this link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dW4jrmSygbM

The bulk of your posts here on this group refer to someone else's work with you telling people many things and correcting everyone.

I see you directing others to a private group all closed source.

Sorry I am not surprised. I told you that.

Show us you working circuits please, thats all.

Mike

[BroMikey]

Show Me your circuit

Circuit diagram Deleted

[Matthew Jones]

Sounds like you got it all covered, sorry to bother.

Matt

[BroMikey]

Measuring?

I have been following the discussion since it seems to relate to stuff I am doing. May I ask what you are looking at as your figure of merit? Your battery (batteries?) are now charging up to 13.2 volts? What else are you measuring, if you don't mind sharing?

Thanks...

Hi Wayne

Who said anything about measuring? I am just trying to build a capacitor discharging device that charges large batteries and doesn't burn out Fet's every week.

I pulse charge and this takes much longer than Direct Current charging but this method does not produce all of the internal heat and drives the voltage up to 15-16vdc.

Some folks feel that large current pulses are the same as large currents that are steady on. This is a misconception.

The purpose of my cap dump circuit discussion is to show a hands on illustration of a working and practical unit. Also an industrial grade.

The pulse charging if done right will charge without heat and you can protect your investment this way. I monitor my batteries all through my pulse charging adjustments and they are stone cold.

I also have a 200amp dc automotive battery charger that can charge these big batteries in a few hours. They will heat up and this is not good.

So the main purpose of pulse charging is to get the full amp hour rating every time it is charged and more.

Now at some point down the road as we use our pulse chargers our batteries will charge themselves a little if we wait enough hour using a tiny amount of current but I am the only one I know who talks like that.

Know one is knowing or proving that they can get more power out than they put in. That is the reason for measuring and measuring all of the time.

This is a tool, that's what it is and a very good one. This tool can give back extra energy from batteries because extra energy was placed there.

All batteries will lose fluid over time and need to be refilled or topped off.

My measurements go like this. I input 200-300 watts and waste 50 watts through a resistor to charge caps. Then a slight bit of heat loss from the fets.

So with this in mind the input is greater than what the battery gets. Yet after a while pulse charging does get easier and this is where the fun begins.

Mike

[BroMikey]

Heat and batteries

You failed to understand what I was telling you so I'll say it again...The amount of power you are putting in is not the deciding factor in the charge, its the ability for the battery to store and maintain the environmental charge that follows the pulse. You would be far better off hitting the battery 2 times a second with 1 amp than you are hitting the battery with 10 -15 amps a second. More power does not speed up the process it hinders it.

Measure what you are taking out of the wall as opposed to what you are putting in. Did you gain? Do you gain from run to run? Is the battery charging getting more efficient or less? Are you keeping track of it?

That may not register with you right away but when you end up cooking the crystals on those plates you'll begin to understand. Your just driving the internal resistance up on the battery and creating heat by using that much power. You can buy those chargers at walmart for 20 dollars all day long no need to build them.

Good luck.

Matt

@Matt

Dear Matt $20 walmart chargers produce heat, my batteries are cold because I relax between pulses.

By the way, I have a 200 amp roll around battery charger and it doesn't cost $20 it try more like $300-400 US.

Bedini style pulse charging is the best way to go. You can't charge a 3000 lb battery with a 1 amp input and top it off a 15.5 vdc in this lifetime.

Practical application.

Yes I have done everything you suggest and the answer is yes it charges with less LATER. Later as I condition. These batteries are giving me hell and I won't back up because I have been here before and know what to expect.

Once it has reached a certain peak charge I will be doing more of the measurement yes. However keep in mind that you don't know what I am up against as you and most people don't use ALUM as an electrolyte.

Your little cart battery using standard ACID would be a joke to my beast dump as I would charge that battery twice as fast as any other charger could.

Acid is a piece-O-cake, try ALUM and watch what kind of a pain staking effort is required to fill those puppies up. This is all I will use, ALUM only.

I have scooters my son uses and some of the older guys here in town who I did work for on their electric motor bikes and we all agree that high density Alum batteries are far different than an ACID battery.

I charge ACID batteries up in one quarter of the time as ALUM.

I am in the beginning phases of cycling ALUM battery plates. First use DC only run it down charge it up again later use a little pulse charging slowly after a FEW cycles of charging and discharging ALUM Batteries with DC you might be able to pulse charge it.

Well you can pulse charge it all you want and it will just laugh at me if I don't follow the instructions by Mr John Bedini.

Now let's clear everything up Matt. I am sorry if you thought I was ignoring you on joules in and joules out. I am not to that stage yet but when I get there you can be sure I will remember your words.

Every every day. Everyday for over a year I have had my head down working on this dump and zapping batteries. You are not going to surprise me.

A 1700ah battery will not charge using a 1 amp input in this lifetime and I for one want to discharge and charge everyday. Not once a month.

I am through trying to do a proof of concept that doesn't pay my electric bill.

Like John Bedini is doing using 100's of amps from solar panels charging batteries with a loud amplifier circuits and huge amounts of heat pouring off his heat sinks.

I started with a 2ah battery. I went to a 20ah battery then a 100ah battery all ALUM converted, so you are not going to surprise me.

I know what this takes.

@Matt a $20 walmart charger is a direct current device that digitally stops at 14vdc while it boils your battery or you could buy the roll around.

The $20 charger is for a car battery size and yes size matters.

Take John Bedini's big battery array, he charges his in 36hrs at a 240 watt input.

Proof of more out than in does not impress me so count me out. I know I am getting that but I will not waste my time trying to prove this.

Like you said Matt I need to spend my time on the cap charging inverter.

If you are charging your golf cart batteries on 1 amp then it must take days to do that unless sulfation is fooling the meters.

Trust me for what I am doing and the size of my batteries it takes more intestinal fortitude if you want usable power.

This dump is not featured as a free energy or free lunch charger, it is plain and simply an effective way to make batteries live as long as the humans. Also getting nearly twice as much energy out of the same package in the long run.

Now It takes nearly twice as much power to charge it and you get it back.

This is the point of my message to you Matt. I am here to do that, CHARGE BATTERIES. Nothing more. I am not looking for a 10X to one.

I have watched batteries I paid big money for, that died in weeks. NO MORE.

No more Matt, no more failed batteries for me and I know what I am doing so the rest of you stay right there and watch my progress as I show those who wish to pulse large batteries to run their homes on.

Even John Bedini is going the practical route and that will use up some power in the form of heat expelled, so what. But not nearly as much as other devices.

Practical application on a larger scale is far different than a proof of something that works.

I will keep you posted as I reach the measuring stage, so far I have only cycled the battery twice on dc and charged it once with pulses.

You didn't know where I was at in my process so now you know Matt.

I hope to share more out than in like I have before this big battery experiment.

We shall see Thanks again Matt and all the group members.

mike

[wayne.ct]

What Efficiency are you measuring?

I have been following the discussion since it seems to relate to stuff I am doing. May I ask what you are looking at as your figure of merit? Your battery (batteries?) are now charging up to 13.2 volts? What else are you measuring, if you don't mind sharing?

Thanks...

[BroMikey]

Small Cap Bank Large Physically

Well if they are all just 90k uf then thats not bad. I would have thought it bigger from looking at it.

Matt

Hi Matt and group members here is another video

BroMikey Cap Dump Part 2 - YouTube


In this video you can see this dump kicking that big batteries backside .

Mike

[Matthew Jones]

Well if they are all just 90k uf then thats not bad. I would have thought it bigger from looking at it.

Matt

[BroMikey]

My cap Bank

Circuit diagram deleted