Cap Dump Circuit

[BroMikey]

Bedini dump circuit

Here is another example of a voltage divider found on the John Bedini's wheels.

It uses a slow Opto for rise times AND a 10k ohm resistor to pull the Mosfet back shut. I know beyond a doubt that this resistor only permits a sawtooth wave form. Fall times for this resistor is 250-500 micro-seconds.

here is a partial circuit.



So why do these waveforms produce sawtooth when they are supposed to be square wave. Square wave is not sawtooth and sawtooth is not square wave.

This is the way all Bedini pulses are formed.

Anyone?

Again this is a very detailed question only for people who understand these circuits BY building them. No speculation please.

Thank you in advance for from input.

Mike

[BroMikey]

Pulse Circuits

Okay I need to have someone tell me what has changed, but first

@Dupe
Thanks for the driver part number sharing whats up at your place keep it up, let us all know for time to time. You have us thinking.

Now let me address the pulse timing of John Bedini's energy pumps and dumps.

John B uses 100MS timing for pulses. Here is one example and I need someone to tell me why I am now asked to shut for a timing in the nano seconds or a 1ms pulse??


What has changed in 11 years, please someone explain.



Also everyone should note the red circles in the picture. I am enraged. Why?

Simple, because I didn't notice JB mosfet numbers for a 24vdc max system, instead I have been looking at diagrams on these group lists produced by people who mean well but really haven't found which end is up on this stuff.

IRFP260 mosfet is the one I just picked up as I looked for the right voltage parts after blowing many 250's.

So john B uses H11DX opto's producing a 100MS yes milisecond pulses.

See the patent photo above. This diagram is not out dated, trust me.

My question is what did this wave form probably look like? And why should we be changing the timing to nanosecond pulses when John uses 100MS yes miliseconds.

Hello? Any takers or are we just building our own new design? That is okay if that what the nanosecond pulse topology is all about.

From what I understand experimenters want a variable range of pulse timing using the slow rise times and long "ON TIMES" to start the charging sequence and as the batteries fill the rates can be altered to any desired pulse train for finishing and maintaining battery charge.

With this in mind we can then look at the micro-controllers to perform the changes based on battery type as well as voltage.

Yet I would still like to hear someone express how John's H11DX opto's became suddenly obsolete for use with cap dumps and how discharges effect batteries better.

This question is only for those who have built these circuits and know something more than speculation please.

It seems that if 100MS yes thats right microseconds (mS) is good for John's batteries why should I change it? Or what question should I be asking?

Or is that figure 100mS "ON TIME" ? It can't be as Mario has pointed out Opto's are slow and rise times are in the uS.

If you understand my question please give the answer. Maybe 100mS is "ON TIME"??? I wonder what the rise time is? On this pump diagram what would be the fastest rise time possible?

It sure wouldn't be 10ns and it wouldn't be 500ns yet it could be somewhere around 30uS.

Any ideas let me know.

Thank You.

Mike

[Dupe]

Cap Charging

@ BroMikey

Have been watching your posts and progress with interest, I've experimented for the last few years on and off with various charging methods, and had a lot of pleasure and varied success. I currently use HV pulse BEMF spike charging for my power tool Ni Cad's which charge quite rapidly.Component parts accumulated over time from scrap HV chargers etc have proved useful for my experiments. I'm using BSP452 mosfet switching devices, four of these in parallel connected from PV panels through a salvaged chunky inductor and driven via a 555 timer provide the charge voltage. These devices are SMD types but can be easily soldered onto a copper heat sink using their tabs. You can experiment with the drive frequency and M/S ratio, 50% for my circuits but keep a close check on running temperature. I use a small computer fan when the PV's are receiving maximum sun ,,, 20 volts output. Kind Regards Mike,
Dupe

[BroMikey]

Attending the Conference

Mike,
I myself am 56, so I understand the energy "difference potential" that you are talking about.
As well as the increasing strength of my reading glasses when soldering small connections through my magnifying glass.

Tom Bearden speaks every chance he can about putting the fundamentals of radiant energy in front of our best and brightest. In every tech school in the country.

My first impression, when I joined the the Bedini Yahoo groups so many years ago was; Hey, these guys are sharing everything, their failures as well as their success's. This is really an honest discussion toward a new understanding the natural world.

Before the internet, the only model we had for this kind of research was a business model or an academic model, where you would bring a group of like minded people together to solve a specific problem. The best part (and this was understood) was often, unintended processes would reveal themselves and be turned into other useable systems.
The internet has changed so much. This is that model X 1000!
But without the pressures of profit or merit. Egalitarian to it's core.
I am so grateful to be a part of it.

Peter L. told me once, that the point of this entire exercise is to make sure you are pursuing what it is that you love to do.

This forum is a passionate place. I know there are people here that are doing just that. Keep doing what you're doing.

Peter is right. It's the little things in the right places that will make the change big changes we are all looking for.
Sincerely
Stephen

P.S. Will you be attending the 2014 Energy Science & Tech Conference?
If so we can continue this discussion.
I attended last year and it was completely inspiring.

Hello Stephen

No I won't be there this year. I will look for a CD or a John Bedini process in DVD form or a book by those other guys.

I remembered back in the 80's how all of us young guys spent 1000's on PC's having little get together's in rented building putting parts on machines.

80-81 Kapro and other Pc's had my interest.

Then the 8088 chip came and from there 286,386.486,686 Pc's.

Yeah we are on the same page.

In 1995 I went online.

I will tell you what, those high energy discharges are powerful surges. I can't find the words to share their significance.

I will be sharing more video of battery pulsing.

Thanks for your input Stephen

Mike

[Stephen Brown]

Do what you Love.

Mike,
I myself am 56, so I understand the energy "difference potential" that you are talking about.
As well as the increasing strength of my reading glasses when soldering small connections through my magnifying glass.

Tom Bearden speaks every chance he can about putting the fundamentals of radiant energy in front of our best and brightest. In every tech school in the country.

My first impression, when I joined the the Bedini Yahoo groups so many years ago was; Hey, these guys are sharing everything, their failures as well as their success's. This is really an honest discussion toward a new understanding the natural world.

Before the internet, the only model we had for this kind of research was a business model or an academic model, where you would bring a group of like minded people together to solve a specific problem. The best part (and this was understood) was often, unintended processes would reveal themselves and be turned into other useable systems.
The internet has changed so much. This is that model X 1000!
But without the pressures of profit or merit. Egalitarian to it's core.
I am so grateful to be a part of it.

Peter L. told me once, that the point of this entire exercise is to make sure you are pursuing what it is that you love to do.

This forum is a passionate place. I know there are people here that are doing just that. Keep doing what you're doing.

Peter is right. It's the little things in the right places that will make the change big changes we are all looking for.
Sincerely
Stephen

P.S. Will you be attending the 2014 Energy Science & Tech Conference?
If so we can continue this discussion.
I attended last year and it was completely inspiring.

Hello Stephen

Such a grown up response is always much appreciated. I know that few many can and will offer their work up on the chopping block so to speak, but this is the way to getting the young guys running with the ball.

My energy level at 57 is much less than when I was 20 and I think young men should be directed into work that gets them away from the wrong thing.

To do that we must get them an entry point that is effective and satisfying, where the results of their work keeps them inspired. Leading a project can be time consuming yet those following will benefit so it is worth it to me.

We all work on many times over long periods of time with it failing in the end only to be replaced with a new one, so I don't see anything wrong with letting the younger guys in on our experience.

About the time I think I have something to show off a younger guys shows out more than I did. Not that the purpose should be to show off. Showing off right is Okay I guess

If enough serious minded people find an entry point, devices that run a home would be popping up everywhere.

I know a few of you guys out there already have some to show soon and I will be looking forward to seeing it produce results that are unheard of.

You are a kind man to say such a nice thing as you did to me and I thank you.

Mike

[BroMikey]

Open Source is Open and Honest.

Mike,
Your motives are selfless and true.
I think there are many good souls here on this forum like you.
Thanks for being here.
Keep up the good work.
Stephen

Hello Stephen

Such a grown up response is always much appreciated. I know that few many can and will offer their work up on the chopping block so to speak, but this is the way to getting the young guys running with the ball.

My energy level at 57 is much less than when I was 20 and I think young men should be directed into work that gets them away from the wrong thing.

To do that we must get them an entry point that is effective and satisfying, where the results of their work keeps them inspired. Leading a project can be time consuming yet those following will benefit so it is worth it to me.

We all work on many times over long periods of time with it failing in the end only to be replaced with a new one, so I don't see anything wrong with letting the younger guys in on our experience.

About the time I think I have something to show off a younger guys shows out more than I did. Not that the purpose should be to show off. Showing off right is Okay I guess

If enough serious minded people find an entry point, devices that run a home would be popping up everywhere.

I know a few of you guys out there already have some to show soon and I will be looking forward to seeing it produce results that are unheard of.

You are a kind man to say such a nice thing as you did to me and I thank you.

Mike

[Stephen Brown]

Motivations are everything!

Mike,
Your motives are selfless and true.
I think there are many good souls here on this forum like you.
Thanks for being here.
Keep up the good work.
Stephen

Oh Well til the day we die learning and relearning is my excitement. When I am done others will be able to see the diagram, see what the circuit can do and put it together without burnouts.

There are circuits all over the web and barely one that is complete and made easy to understand how to build it. Always some part left out that sends you looking for the engineer who thinks it should work but never built one.

I see a great deal of talk and thats about all I see most of the time.

Basically no one on youtube is showing one inside and out that is a practical unit that has industrial qualities. Just gator clips and wires splattered out all over the room that will end up at the bottom of a closet somewhere.

Breadboards with temporary connections proof it works a little.

Just one guy and his name is John Bedini.

Well there might be one or two that put their stuff into a practical application.

These sites are for beginners as well as rocket scientist and I feel that most guys have a specific ability and they maybe can't engineer some things.

Nothing wrong with that. I think sharing means if I can do something others can do then making the road easier to travel is the first step in getting others to get an entry point so they can begin to work on some of these projects.

I started with pulsing a battery because pulsing circuits are a large part of obtaining extra energy. Many look at pulsing coils and caps as if it was a beginners toy real simple and yet not that big of a deal.

I am telling everyone right now, if you can't pulse a cap, coil or battery you don't know what you are missing. You are missing a building block that will stop you from understanding the more advanced aspects of Tesla technology.

So if people what to think pulsing is unimportant or insignificant then they have failed the test of learning all together.

So getting people to build simple easy effective circuits is very important. There is nothing more frustrating for a learner than to be misdirected so after they build something it constantly fails.

Show me one besides JB who is doing it.


Mike

[BroMikey]

Learning

I'm just a decade or so younger than you.

Yes it is good, low side switches are much simpler to drive.
Learning to drive high side switches well does open up a lot of other possibilities,
like two stage pulsers, capacitor voltage doublers, half and full H bridge switching solutions ect.

I'm very much a learner myself, and I enjoy learning new stuff so I'm happy to
be a learner. I'll review what I've missed lately.

..

Oh Well til the day we die learning and relearning is my excitement. When I am done others will be able to see the diagram, see what the circuit can do and put it together without burnouts.

There are circuits all over the web and barely one that is complete and made easy to understand how to build it. Always some part left out that sends you looking for the engineer who thinks it should work but never built one.

I see a great deal of talk and thats about all I see most of the time.

Basically no one on youtube is showing one inside and out that is a practical unit that has industrial qualities. Just gator clips and wires splattered out all over the room that will end up at the bottom of a closet somewhere.

Breadboards with temporary connections proof it works a little.

Just one guy and his name is John Bedini.

Well there might be one or two that put their stuff into a practical application.

These sites are for beginners as well as rocket scientist and I feel that most guys have a specific ability and they maybe can't engineer some things.

Nothing wrong with that. I think sharing means if I can do something others can do then making the road easier to travel is the first step in getting others to get an entry point so they can begin to work on some of these projects.

I started with pulsing a battery because pulsing circuits are a large part of obtaining extra energy. Many look at pulsing coils and caps as if it was a beginners toy real simple and yet not that big of a deal.

I am telling everyone right now, if you can't pulse a cap, coil or battery you don't know what you are missing. You are missing a building block that will stop you from understanding the more advanced aspects of Tesla technology.

So if people what to think pulsing is unimportant or insignificant then they have failed the test of learning all together.

So getting people to build simple easy effective circuits is very important. There is nothing more frustrating for a learner than to be misdirected so after they build something it constantly fails.

Show me one besides JB who is doing it.


Mike

[Farmhand]

Hey Farmhand I am 56yrs

My desire to do more electronix has blossomed these past few years.

I use the far right hand terminal source to bring in the negative side of my cap bank so my red wire goes directly from the cap hot to the battery hot.

So I pulse the negative wire. Is this good?

Mike

I'm just a decade or so younger than you.

Yes it is good, low side switches are much simpler to drive.
Learning to drive high side switches well does open up a lot of other possibilities,
like two stage pulsers, capacitor voltage doublers, half and full H bridge switching solutions ect.

I'm very much a learner myself, and I enjoy learning new stuff so I'm happy to
be a learner. I'll review what I've missed lately.

..

[BroMikey]

Answering my own Questions

Capacitor types

Ceramic capacitor: The ceramic capacitor is a type of capacitor that is used in many applications from audio to RF. Values range from a few picofarads to around 0.1 microfarads. Ceramic capacitor types are by far the most commonly used type of capacitor being cheap and reliable and their loss factor is particularly low although this is dependent on the exact dielectric in use. In view of their constructional properties, these capacitors are widely used both in leaded and surface mount formats Read more about the ceramic capacitor



Electrolytic capacitor: Electrolytic capacitors are a type of capacitor that is polarised. They are able to offer high capacitance values - typically above 1μF, and are most widely used for low frequency applications - power supplies, decoupling and audio coupling applications as they have a frequency limit if around 100 kHz. Read more about the electrolytic capacitor



Tantalum capacitor: Like electrolytic capacitors, tantalum capacitors are also polarised and offer a very high capacitance level for their volume. However this type of capacitor is very intolerant of being reverse biased, often exploding when placed under stress. This type of capacitor must also not be subject to high ripple currents or voltages above their working voltage. They are available in both leaded and surface mount formats. Read more about the tantalum capacitor



Silver Mica Capacitor: Silver mica capacitors are not as widely used these days, but they still offer very high levels of stability, low loss and accuracy where space is not an issue. They are primarily used for RF applications and and they are limited to maximum values of 1000 pF or so. Read more about the silver mica capacitor



Polystyrene Film Capacitor: Polystyrene capacitors are a relatively cheap form of capacitor but offer a close tolerance capacitor where needed. They are tubular in shape resulting from the fact that the plate / dielectric sandwich is rolled together, but this adds inductance limiting their frequency response to a few hundred kHz. They are generally only available as leaded electronics components.



Polyester Film Capacitor: Polyester film capacitors are used where cost is a consideration as they do not offer a high tolerance. Many polyester film capacitors have a tolerance of 5% or 10%, which is adequate for many applications. They are generally only available as leaded electronics components. Read more about the polyester capacitor



Metallised Polyester Film Capacitor: This type of capacitor is a essentially a form of polyester film capacitor where the polyester films themselves are metallised. The advantage of using this process is that because their electrodes are thin, the overall capacitor can be contained within a relatively small package. The metallised polyester film capacitors are generally only available as leaded electronics components.



Polycarbonate capacitor: Polypropylene Capacitor: The polypropylene capacitor is sometimes used when a higher tolerance type of capacitor is necessary than polyester capacitors offer. As the name implies, this capacitor uses a polypropylene film for the dielectric. One of the advantages of the capacitor is that there is very little change of capacitance with time and voltage applied. This type of capacitor is also used for low frequencies, with 100 kHz or so being the upper limit. They are generally only available as leaded electronics components. Read more about the polypropylene capacitor
Glass capacitors: As the name implies, this capacitor type uses glass as the dielectric. Although expensive, these capacitors offer very high levels or performance in terms of extremely low loss, high RF current capability, no piezo-electric noise and other features making them ideal for many performance RF applications.


So going by this info the polypropylene caps are high tolerance over a wide range of voltages and for low frec's.

For those of you who are still exploring this chip (TL594) and it's application to energy pumping, "Stay Tuned".

When this circuit is done we can all build it with confidence.

Mike

[BroMikey]

More questions

Also I have noticed engineers putting a .001uF cap from pin 2 to pin 3.

Some say polypropylene. Why? Does it filter better than a ceramic or what?

Here is the diagram



These questions will only apply to those who have built these circuits using the 594 chip.

Thanks, Mike

[BroMikey]

Dump Frequency

So far using the above formula I get this





1.1/ 200,000Ohm X .000001 Farads =5.5HZ

Mike

[BroMikey]

TL594 Timing

Here is what I found from the semiconductor company



So going by this approx I need 200k of resistance using a .1uf cap.

Just more resistance should bring the pulses down to a slower speed according to this information.

Let me know if anyone is into using the TL594 and understands this question.

Mike

[BroMikey]

TL594 Question

If anyone has any experience with the 594 as single pulse operation please fill in the blank. I have a picture below of the TL594 and you will notice the TIMING CAP and the TIMING RESISTOR Rt AND Ct.

The red arrows point at this section of the chip.

Question

What two part values would I start with to get say 10 pulses per second?

Thanks. I can do trial and error but maybe someone has used this circuit before for a cap dump.


Mike

[BroMikey]

Capacitor Sizes

One very interesting thing I should add about capacitor sizes. Let's take two separate caps to look at so i might get this across to each of you.

I have one cap bank that is 48,000uf and it has a max voltages rating of 100vdc.

Next I have another cap bank that is 85,000uf with a higher than 100vdc max voltage rating.

Okay so now i have one bank almost twice as big as the other and each bank will only be charged to 31vdc.

What do you think happened? Well it is quite surprising really to me that the meter for the small dump shows a one half amp pulse.

The larger bank I figured should have shown double that or even better, yet it produces a 5 amp pulse.

Wow! Of course the bigger value dump is physically larger by 20X than the smaller value uf bank.

So we can see that for the same uf rating the figures are very deceiving and if you want a bank that holds more and can give back energy faster you need a larger physical size.

The smaller bank actually gives me less than i quoted so don't be fooled into thinking that all you will need is certain uf number without spreading out capacitance over a bigger area.

Caps types vary. They can all be electrolytic and still be worlds away from being anywhere near the same. A 50,000uf bank can be the size of a softball ( I have one) or it can be the size of a beach ball (I have that one also).

Another interesting thing to note about the larger dump i just mentioned is that when I charge the caps to 31vdc i get a 5amp pulse but when i lower the voltage down only a handful of volts to 25vdc my pulse is cut in half to only 2.5amps.

Using 250vdc capacitors is the way to go for the serious cap dump builder. The price is much higher for good reason. I think I paid $20 for the small one and the big one is worth over $700 depending on how much you want to spend.

Mike