My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[Zara]

Thanks

I will look into that UFO politics... That sounds a lot better then how I'm doing it now.

[iankoglin]

G'day UFO
The AWG is #22 according to this chart I have had for years
The chart is here

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...DataChart3.jpg

I will wind one with the Bifilar I want to get this wound and send the last 4 off to be varnished and balanced and please should I solder over the commutator hooks on the smaller motors and the P56 forced into grooves

I realise that the Ohms is continually changing that is one reason why I like to measure when it is cool.

With regard to the AWG18 0.1mm wire I might try again to wind the full half Pole into the P56 Like I mention as I really did wind those turns into the Slots and I will again ascertain the amount whether I can fit all the poles on each distance between the comm's and the laminations is 18.5mm

I measured the wire the same way for the last 3 motors the 250w 20 pole and the 150w 16 pole MY motors look like here These were wound with .67mm wire but they got Hot so I rewound with I think 20? wind with .6mm wire and they look the same then again I might not be able to fit the wire into the groove in the comm these motors are here

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...r/IMG_0105.jpg

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...r/IMG_0099.jpg

If The AWG18 wire will not wind I think I would have the sane trouble with the AWG 22 as I calculated the Winds the same way

I really appreciate all that you teach me. Some people learn from others experience and some have to learn from their own mistakes.
I am usually the latter and that is why I sometimes take so long to do something and feel like

Eventually I get there

Thank you for your input and interest I really appreciate what I am learning from you

Kindest Regards to you my friend


Kogs wanting to get it right

[iankoglin]

G'day UFO and Team
A few weeks ago I saw an advert regarding a flatpack it was called the Ikea Tabby it is a OSvehicle that can be assembled in 1 hour I the cost is $6000
I made an inquiry for the OS Plans
A copy of the request is here
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Ian Koglin <[email protected]>
Date: 2014/1/14
Subject: CAD Request from Ian Koglin - self
To: [email protected]

From: Ian Koglin <[email protected]>

Company: self

Applications:

I am my self involved in R&D of asymmetric electric motors and would like to fit one into a car to show the benefit of these motors and I like the idea of the Tabby as it appears to be light and therefore it allows me to fit my own body.design
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Today I received this reply--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Mr. Ian Koglin,

We can offer you Tabby without electric motor, may be in future we could cooperate in electric motor.

regards.

Silvia Xiao

Osvehicle Limited

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The details about this car can be found here
OSVehicle - Open Source Vehicle | TABBY

One option for me
To buy a flatpack OSVehicle and fitting one P56 motor if that is not strong enough then fit 2 P56 motors end on end of course one would have to be wound in reverse so they would match each other.

Second option to buy a second hand motor vehicle and alter it to fit the motor in

Kindest regards

Kogs Just thinking ahead (would need my test drivers approval first)

[Cornboy 555]

G'day UFO and Team
A few weeks ago I saw an advert regarding a flatpack it was called the Ikea Tabby it is a OSvehicle that can be assembled in 1 hour I the cost is $6000
I made an inquiry for the OS Plans
A copy of the request is here
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Ian Koglin <[email protected]>
Date: 2014/1/14
Subject: CAD Request from Ian Koglin - self
To: [email protected]

From: Ian Koglin <[email protected]>

Company: self

Applications:

I am my self involved in R&D of asymmetric electric motors and would like to fit one into a car to show the benefit of these motors and I like the idea of the Tabby as it appears to be light and therefore it allows me to fit my own body.design
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Today I received this reply--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Mr. Ian Koglin,

We can offer you Tabby without electric motor, may be in future we could cooperate in electric motor.

regards.

Silvia Xiao

Osvehicle Limited

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The details about this car can be found here
OSVehicle - Open Source Vehicle | TABBY

One option for me
To buy a flatpack OSVehicle and fitting one P56 motor if that is not strong enough then fit 2 P56 motors end on end of course one would have to be wound in reverse so they would match each other.

Second option to buy a second hand motor vehicle and alter it to fit the motor in

Kindest regards

Kogs Just thinking ahead (would need my test drivers approval first)

Hey Kogs, option #2, would be the best way, Australia has some of the most stringent ADR rules in the world, and i am sure the Tabby wouldn't meet those rules.

Of course if you just want to use it on private property, and not on public roads, it would be fine.

Converting existing roadworthy vehicles to Electric is the way to go, you can pick up small older cars for peanuts now, especially if they have a motor problem.

When the time comes we need to use a vehicle that everyone can acess cheaply to follow us.

Regards Cornboy.

[Ufopolitics]

Imperial Winding

G'day UFO
The AWG is #22 according to this chart I have had for years
The chart is here

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...DataChart3.jpg

I will wind one with the Bifilar I want to get this wound and send the last 4 off to be varnished and balanced and please should I solder over the commutator hooks on the smaller motors and the P56 forced into grooves

I realise that the Ohms is continually changing that is one reason why I like to measure when it is cool.

With regard to the AWG18 0.1mm wire I might try again to wind the full half Pole into the P56 Like I mention as I really did wind those turns into the Slots and I will again ascertain the amount whether I can fit all the poles on each distance between the comm's and the laminations is 18.5mm

I measured the wire the same way for the last 3 motors the 250w 20 pole and the 150w 16 pole MY motors look like here These were wound with .67mm wire but they got Hot so I rewound with I think 20? wind with .6mm wire and they look the same then again I might not be able to fit the wire into the groove in the comm these motors are here

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...r/IMG_0105.jpg

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...r/IMG_0099.jpg

If The AWG18 wire will not wind I think I would have the sane trouble with the AWG 22 as I calculated the Winds the same way

I really appreciate all that you teach me. Some people learn from others experience and some have to learn from their own mistakes.
I am usually the latter and that is why I sometimes take so long to do something and feel like

Eventually I get there

Thank you for your input and interest I really appreciate what I am learning from you

Kindest Regards to you my friend


Kogs wanting to get it right

Hey Kogs,

I recommend to go over again my first Asymmetrical Winding Video...

Asymmetrical Winding Part 1 - YouTube

It is important to see how I could NOT wind this Motor with 16 awg...(That was the reason why I left that footage on video) as I explain why in terms of space and calculations of how many future coils must run through same slot...then I start with the 18 awg.

If you are going to use the Bifilar 22 awg ...the purpose is that you could fit way MUCH more turns than with the single 18 awg, in order to generate a stronger magnetic field...BUT, if it would end up in the same or around same number of turns, then, it is not worth to do it with 22 awg...in previous post you mentioned you could go 29 T per Coil, or 56 in Pair.

You really must learn to see (in the future) how the final Pairs (P26,27,28) would fit, in your mind, when just doing P1...If you would have enough room to hold them tight in rotor slots, and still be able to run the retaining hedges. I believe with your experience so far...you could do it my friend...


Kind Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Double Post, delete one...

G'day UFO
The AWG is #22 according to this chart I have had for years
The chart is here

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...DataChart3.jpg

I will wind one with the Bifilar I want to get this wound and send the last 4 off to be varnished and balanced and please should I solder over the commutator hooks on the smaller motors and the P56 forced into grooves

I realise that the Ohms is continually changing that is one reason why I like to measure when it is cool.

With regard to the AWG18 0.1mm wire I might try again to wind the full half Pole into the P56 Like I mention as I really did wind those turns into the Slots and I will again ascertain the amount whether I can fit all the poles on each distance between the comm's and the laminations is 18.5mm

I measured the wire the same way for the last 3 motors the 250w 20 pole and the 150w 16 pole MY motors look like here These were wound with .67mm wire but they got Hot so I rewound with I think 20? wind with .6mm wire and they look the same then again I might not be able to fit the wire into the groove in the comm these motors are here

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...r/IMG_0105.jpg

http://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...r/IMG_0099.jpg

If The AWG18 wire will not wind I think I would have the sane trouble with the AWG 22 as I calculated the Winds the same way

I really appreciate all that you teach me. Some people learn from others experience and some have to learn from their own mistakes.
I am usually the latter and that is why I sometimes take so long to do something and feel like

Eventually I get there

Thank you for your input and interest I really appreciate what I am learning from you

Kindest Regards to you my friend


Kogs wanting to get it right

Hello Kogs,


You have a Double Post here , please delete one, then I will delete this


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

@ Midas
34 hrs,...hard to image people willing to pay for the amount of time and work to build. But, now that people will understand the work involved,...if anyone is actually willing to pay for my work,... I will build motors, only imperials, not balanced or vacuum sealed. That could be done but extra. I would have to get $2000.00 , plus your shipping from my biz.

Now I have two, here now, so I could sell one and since it was done at a prototype level, still works great, fabulous in fact, I would knock $500.00 off.

Hope things are going well UFO, everyone.

Machine

Hello Machine,

Yes, I believe Midaz is right...too cheap man!...

I thought you were going to build one of the Imperials as a Dual Rotor System?!

[IMG][/IMG]

Ok, I propose a deal...I will make ALL the CAD drawings for Outer Rotor Laminates and the Bridge Piece...plus the Four Stators "H" Frame to be wound instead of permanent magnets (it would run also on AC this way, a "Universal Asymmetric Motor" )...then you can get them Waterjet cut and make me a Set for my second Imperial...I will pay the freight to me...sounds like a fair deal?

I want Us to make this Imperial Dual Rotor System...pulsing four stators and Gates with the Monster Pulsers respectively in the same sequence I have presented here...with off times (Gate1/S1, G2/S2, G3/S3, G4/S4)...Unfortunately, at this time I do not have the funds to make it happen all from scratch.

I am very sure this would be a VERY Strong Machine and Combination of Controlling System my Friend.

Then you could try running your Generator(s) with this New Asymmetry...and then later on you could mount it on your future Motorcycle and get 200 plus MPH...


Regards


Ufopolitcs

[Zara]

Asymmetric 10 Pole

Yeah I think I figured this out... Here is my first asymmetric 10 pole motor. More to come.


[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

[ajaya999]

Let's take it to the next level - Making UFO Machine from Scratch

Dear Sir and Team ,

Namaste.

After completing the post I understood it's not in order. Please excuse me for this as it's written in some aggravated and agonized moods.
( don't have enough energies to repost it in proper order and presentable language )

Please read...

Have been going by the thread last 3 days and making notes as well (topic-wise) on discussions. Will try making a complete document (already making ) with the questions and answers by respected UFOPOLITICS and other learned members. I am also keeping the relevant links to the posts so that the reader can directly land in that particular post. So far done about 50 pages of the thread.

Before that I surfed across the thread several times. Please note just surfed. But I understood the biggest issue and so far unsolved issue here is the coil gauge. Nowhere it has been standardized with respect to using a particular gauge as our machines are not confined to any particular conventional built.

Now I want to present here my approach. I want to maintain the same gauge (as given by the manufacturer of motor) and the resistance of about 1 ohm as directed by respected UFOPoLITICS) per coil. This demands more room in the armature slots/poles, which is not available if we try winding on the motors we have. Let's not forget that what we are building here is not rebuilding that lousy motor. We are building a UFO MACHINE, not a motor. It has its own demands. Let's not compromise to bring this unique and wonderful machine out - having put in so much of effort, moneys, time and other resources besides the private life of us and our near and dear.

Friends, I don't know whether you are with me in this idea. But I'm going ahead. I'm going to leave experimenting with this 1 hp 15 pole lousy motor. I call it lousy as I think and strongly believe that it is limiting the powerful designs of UFO with its narrow slots in which that witch has been living in for decades. The angels cannot live in narrow and clustered places. They need more room and sufficient open areas to roam freely and happily.

I am going today itself to my workshop to make a design where all the coil sits happily without compromise which I call a red carpet for the angel to get in and happily move around.

I believe I will never face heat of the witch where the angels roam.

If I hurt any of you because of this emotional driven ( not science driven) post, please excuse me. Please correct me f I am wrong on topic I mentioned here.

Dear Sir, I will never leave a space for the witch to enter my UFOMACHINE for silly compromises. Yes I call it silly to compromise on that cluttered stinking narrow slots of the witch, sorry for the unparliamentary words, but please let me as I'm very much agonized over our compromises. As I told you I surfed the thread several times just to understand proper coil configuration like gauge and number of turns and other aspects of it. I couldn't get a solid and confident reply for any questions on that.
I know that you have an answer already with you for those questions.

I know you were looking for more replications those days in the beginning of this thread so that people will understand your machine's concepts and stop speaking ill of your machine (in future) as several replicators would already post their experiences. I know you looked for more replicators so that future builders of your machine should be able to do this without fear , worry and tension. Dear sir, it is accomplished. I am the living example. I never tried replicating your machine on those tiny motors as I didn't belong to the first gen here. By the time I's in, it forwarded a lot. It traveled so much where it didn't leave a scope of doubt for me about its efficacy and that drove me to take it up straight on 1 hp motor.

I know people won't replicate if you ask them to build such a machine from scratch for their good own reasons.

But sir, those days are over. Who remained here are a very few of the batch 1 people and I don't know I'm from which batch but I am also here.

Correct me if I wrong. We'll build it from scratch. We'll give it a measurement Unit of our own. I named it already. THE UNIT IS CALLED UFO or UP.

I think we need to look into this and create some new parameters with respect to the machine capacities, like how conventional motors designed for a particular HP. Please forgive me if I am crossing my limits. But I strongly believe that we NEED to give it some measurement - I mean OUR OWN MEASUREMENT. Let's bring in a gauge called UFO ( i already named it like HP) We need not prove anything here to anybody about the efficacy of UFO machines. Again I apologize for this initiation. Anybody can not and shouldn't bring in any sort of comparisons.

Let the naysayers research to arrive at the conversion constants with other areas of Physics.

We are not bothered.

Friends, need to take a break as I am very much in agitated moods. Give me a short break. I'll settle mentally and come back again to post my next course in detail.

Regards and Namaste


Kumar

[ajaya999]

Zara,

Are you going to release a film that runs silver jubilee ?

[machinealive]

Sorry, I've been really busy this week, and I had to think a bit on this,...deal.

In Other News,

I thought a lot higher than $2000!

Yes, I believe Midaz is right...too cheap man!

Too Cheap?...Ok, so how many did you and Midas want again?

I can do all the refitting in shop. Maybe I'm a little quicker with the winding.
A couple people did email me and I'll answer general here, you can email me again if I forgot something.

I really don't want to wind any generators, because that was a lot of work, and I was never happy with something, either wire ga, you know just not something I would want to sell, plus the brushless alte is not price matchable.

But motors, yeah, at 60v @ 24amps, I spun the alte 3600 rpm, with 400 watt load, in my video. That's all I can tell anyone, that's as far as I got.

Check out the scariac

The Scariac (Poor Mans Variable Power Controller) - YouTube

I'm sure have enough parts and ideas now to get something geared up, to test limits, eventually.

That also wasn't the price of motor, you would have to either buy from imperial and get it shipped to me, or I do that and I get a down payment, for price of motor.

I thought you were going to build one of the Imperials as a Dual Rotor System?!

I am going to use an imperial for the big gen, but I can get another one wound, I was just saying, I have one here now, but used, and worked on, you know.

So, the UFO deal. Hmmm,.. have you looked up companies to see if there is a stator size already, we could use. I stop in the motor shop and check now and then, in the scap pile, no luck so far. I would have to get a quote, and go from there. The owners are young, and like racing, and the thoughts developing products, they have water jet, and a brand new 3d printer. I will have to talk to them.

As soon as I was able, I was going to take my plates to have a laminated drum turned (too big for my lathe). Then I can finish the big gen.

But you know I have been more then a little distracted, a few ideas that I can't seem to shake off, and until I finish building a couple other things to test, I think I'm useless for much else, except doing things I already have an understanding in, like the motors I already have built. You know what I mean, I need to finish this.

We will finish this build, UFO, that design looks great, BTW.

Edit: btw it was $450.00 CND shipped to my door, last time.

machine

[Midaztouch]

UFO motor bidding price

Too Cheap?...Ok, so how many did you and Midas want again?

Machinealive

Here are my thoughts:

1.) It's a Prototype motor that takes about 34hours of touching to hand build it!

2.) It can run a 6kw generator @ 48v ~ 60v(up to wire gage) no problem

3.) EV applications; electric motorcycles, small ev cars, go karts...etc (perfect for 250cc class motorcycles = most sold and currently on the road world wide)

4.) It has the capability to run on 2 channels for ECO mode; charge back the battery pack and extend range\highway driving. (It looks like it's better than regenerative braking!) *WOW FACTOR*

5.) I've haven't found a motor in the same weight that comes close to the efficiency. From UFOs homemade torque test, this motor would be considered by National Electrical Manufacturers Association(NEMA) in the Super Premium Efficiency class(IE4) = $$$$$!
*NOTE* Hopefully we will have official lab test results soon.

6.) Asymmetric Imperial motors are super rare! Less than 10 handmade motors on the planet. Your motor is number two and it's been in all the YouTube test videos!

Conclusion: The bidding has started at $2000 for the #2 Asymmetric UFO Imperial prototype motor By: Machinealive......

*HINT* I feel as though a regular UFO motor should start @ $3600, if it was in production phase. If it's efficiency rating is in the IE4 class by NEMA from lab testing, It would be a lot more$$$$$

Here's a chance to buy a Cutting Edge Technology that you can't buy off of the shelf. Good luck with your bidding ladies and gentlemen


Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

[iankoglin]

G'day UFO and Team
I did as UFO suggested and wound with the thicker wire not thinner bifilar.
I have finished winding 3 Poles on My P56 Motor I wound it with AWG18 which is 1 mm diam. I wound each half pole with 15 turns which makes 30 turns for each pole I measured the Ohms on my DMM and it read 2 Ohms I then read each Pole on my motor and it read 6 Ohms each minus the DMM Ohms = 2 Ohms for each Pole.

Could all those who wound these Imperial motors Please tell me what was the Ohms for each pole on their motors.

Kindest Regards


Kogs gradually getting there.

[Ufopolitics]

Resistance on PAIRS

G'day UFO and Team
I did as UFO suggested and wound with the thicker wire not thinner bifilar.

Hello Kogs,

What I said was that IF the Bifilar would end up in similar or equal turns as the single wire...then go single
BUT, if the Bifilar was much larger number of turns than Single, then go Bifilar.

Hope your choice came after realizing the above...

I have finished winding 3 Poles on My P56 Motor I wound it with AWG18 which is 1 mm diam. I wound each half pole with 15 turns which makes 30 turns for each pole.

Ok, you mean 3 Pairs, not Poles, so you did P1, P2 and P3...and 15 turns is excellent!

I measured the Ohms on my DMM and it read 2 Ohms I then read each Pole on my motor and it read 6 Ohms each minus the DMM Ohms = 2 Ohms for each Pole.

Something wrong there friend...DMM=2 Ohms, Total Resistance=6 Ohms, so 6 minus 2=4 Ohms and not 2 Ohms at Pair...BUT, still, there is something wrong...you must have near 1.0 Ohms per Pair of Coils or around 0.9 to 0.7 Ohms and not 4 Ohms.

Check with another DMM...besides, honestly I never heard of DMM Internal resistance though... ...when I set my DMM's to measure resistance they give me the already physical reading from whatever component am measuring, without doing any extra adding or subtracting...but make sure you have low resistance capabilities on DMM...like 200 ohms or lower the more precise reading.

I recommend to get a One Ohm Resistor...and measure it with DMM...See what you get...and go from there

Could all those who wound these Imperial motors Please tell me what was the Ohms for each pole on their motors.

Kindest Regards


Kogs gradually getting there.

My Imperial read around 0.8 to 0.9 per PAIR (not Pole... )

Machine Alive Imperial went from 0.7 to 0.6 Ohms but He used like 19 awg

You are doing just GREAT!...I am sure these are DMM issues, errors...Your Imperial is gonna kick some A**!!...


Kind Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

One More thing...

G'day UFO and Team
I did as UFO suggested and wound with the thicker wire not thinner bifilar.
I have finished winding 3 Poles on My P56 Motor I wound it with AWG18 which is 1 mm diam. I wound each half pole with 15 turns which makes 30 turns for each pole I measured the Ohms on my DMM and it read 2 Ohms I then read each Pole on my motor and it read 6 Ohms each minus the DMM Ohms = 2 Ohms for each Pole.

Could all those who wound these Imperial motors Please tell me what was the Ohms for each pole on their motors.

Kindest Regards


Kogs gradually getting there.

Hello Again Kogs,


One more thing Friend...

[IMG][/IMG]

Make sure you attach the right pair of commutator elements (remember there are 56 elements, so Two per pair) to P1 just like I show above diagram and from there everything would be fine with the rest.

Regards


Ufopolitics