Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera

[Ufopolitics]

The commutator has to be made with three brushes set 120 degrees apart. The first 2 sets of N and S coils are charged by the first brush, the second pair of N and S primaries are charged by the second brush set 120 degrees behind the first brush. The third pair of N and S primaries are charged by the third brush running 120 degrees behind the second brush. This brush also charges the seventh set of N and S primaries.
The secondaries that are marked Y stands for a Y connection of the coils instead of a delta connection so that they produce 440 volts of 3 phase electrical current. The 7th secondary is used to produce 110 volts which is used to charge the primaries by using a diode bridge rectifier to make D C current and to run the motor for the triple (Brush?) commutator. The Primary Coils are made in the shape of a Block C with square corners and wrapped with 40 turns of 16 gauge copper wire.
The secondaries are straight bars that connect to the top and bottom of the C primaries. They are wound with 400 turns of 22 gauge copper wire and there is one secondary coil between the N and S poles at the top and another secondary between the S and N at the bottom. So there are 14 primaries and 14 secondaries. The upper secondaries are all set with their turns going the same direction and the lower secondaries are all set the same direction but opposite of the upper set. The secondary coils are wired in series in each of the 3 sets of 4 secondaries withe the beginning wires of the three sets wired together and the discharge wire coming off of the last coil of 4 in the three sets is the one leg of the three phase 440 Volts. Remember to factor in the RMS.
The resistor R is an induction coil wound on a 1 inch square iron bar 12 inches long divided into 7 sections each section being wound with first 100 turns with a beginning wire and an ending wire , then another 100 turns in like manner and finally a third layer of 100 turns so that each section is divided into three parts and the inner 100 turns runs the first brush of the commutator and the second layer runs the second (Brush?) commutator, and the outer layer runs the third (Brush?) commutator and all of this is running in three parts so that they (Brushes?)are 120 degrees apart so they can make a 440 volt circuit.

FIRST: Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to ALL Reading here, Members and just visiting Members.


Hello Greywolf,

Great enhanced design of Figuera's Generator!

I see -by reading your post several times while picturing all in my mind- that you have "amplified" according to your interpretation, to a Three Phase AC Output Generator. And that is great!, it delivers almost what is needed for almost any household.

I, still have some confusion, as there are no Diagrams on this design, could you please enlighten Us all?

1-There are some red "brush(es)" corrections (I've made above) that I believe are missing from your original post, correct me if I am wrong, please.

2- Now, according to your description, you have Three Sets of Primaries, which are excited (powered) by Three Rotating Brushes separated by 120º, mounted on the same rotating shaft...So, then you will need three sets of slipping rings, one for each brush...correct?

3- Each set of Primaries are wound on a "C" Core...So, then you have Three PAIRS of "C" Cores?

4- I understand Secondaries are just straight bars, which connect to the "C" Primaries Cores, upper-lower...Then STRUCTURE should look like:

First Phase: Two Primaries "C" Cores facing each others?, with respective Secondaries Bars connected in between the two "C" Cores...upper and lower.

And so on for Phase 2 and 3...

Conclusion: Three "Blocks" of two C Cores (One each of the Three Phases) facing each others with secondaries in between, closing in a "O" or an ELLIPTICAL Shape...

That is the way I "see" your diagram...


Thanks for your time.


Ufopolitics

[Cadman]

Grey Wolf,
Great news. I gather this is a small proof of concept generator, but I was wondering if you could give us some amperage figures to go with the voltages.

I could never get any significant amp output from my build attempts.
.

[boguslaw]

The commutator has to be made with three brushes set 120 degrees apart. The first 2 sets of N and S coils are charged by the first brush, the second pair of N and S primaries are charged by the second brush set 120 degrees behind the first brush. The third pair of N and S primaries are charged by the third brush running 120 degrees behind the second brush. This brush also charges the seventh set of N and S primaries.
The secondaries that are marked Y stands for a Y connection of the coils instead of a delta connection so that they produce 440 volts of 3 phase electrical current. The 7th secondary is used to produce 110 volts which is used to charge the primaries by using a diode bridge rectifier to make D C current and to run the motor for the triple commutator. The Primary Coils are made in the shape of a Block C with square corners and wrapped with 40 turns of 16 gauge copper wire.
The secondaries are straight bars that connect to the top and bottom of the C primaries. They are wound with 400 turns of 22 gauge copper wire and there is one secondary coil between the N and S poles at the top and another secondary between the S and N at the bottom. So there are 14 primaries and 14 secondaries. The upper secondaries are all set with their turns going the same direction and the lower secondaries are all set the same direction but opposite of the upper set. The secondary coils are wired in series in each of the 3 sets of 4 secondaries withe the beginning wires of the three sets wired together and the discharge wire coming off of the last coil of 4 in the three sets is the one leg of the three phase 440 Volts. Remember to factor in the RMS.
The resistor R is an induction coil wound on a 1 inch square iron bar 12 inches long divided into 7 sections each section being wound with first 100 turns with a beginning wire and an ending wire , then another 100 turns in like manner and finally a third layer of 100 turns so that each section is divided into three parts and the inner 100 turns runs the first brush of the commutator and the second layer runs the second commutator, and the outer layer runs the third commutator and all of this is running in three parts so that they are 120 degrees apart so they can make a 440 volt circuit.
All three of the commutator brushes MUST be on the same shaft and turning together so that they maintain the 120 degrees of separation. I am still working on getting the final output to the level I want but have achieved 295 volts on the output so far. I sincerely believe that it will be necessary to use a bench power supply that converts 120 volts to D C that is variable between zero and 36 volts. The higher the voltage input, the higher the output. So far 24 volts has been my maximum input. There will need to be a transformer to divide the 440 volts to household current of 220 and 110 volts. There will also need to have a regulation of the input voltage to keep the output constant.
Contrary to the popular opinion that the primaries need to be N to N, even given the fact that that arrangement will give higher voltage, ALL of the sine wave curve is above the zero plane and there is no sine wave in the negative. Therefore it MUST be set N to S at the top of the primaries and S to N on the bottom.

Excellent. I think Figuera commutator was a bit more complicated because he had no diodes ;-) I do think he didn't limited himself to 3-phases , the rest looks nice however I feel he later used better closed iron core ;-) It's all in Faraday laws folks The source of energy produced are movement (kinetic) or magnetic field or both. All currently used generators are converters of kinetic energy into electricity exactly how Figuera stated....

[Grey Wolf]

Working Infinite Energy machine

The commutator has to be made with three brushes set 120 degrees apart. The first 2 sets of N and S coils are charged by the first brush, the second pair of N and S primaries are charged by the second brush set 120 degrees behind the first brush. The third pair of N and S primaries are charged by the third brush running 120 degrees behind the second brush. This brush also charges the seventh set of N and S primaries.
The secondaries that are marked Y stands for a Y connection of the coils instead of a delta connection so that they produce 440 volts of 3 phase electrical current. The 7th secondary is used to produce 110 volts which is used to charge the primaries by using a diode bridge rectifier to make D C current and to run the motor for the triple commutator. The Primary Coils are made in the shape of a Block C with square corners and wrapped with 40 turns of 16 gauge copper wire.
The secondaries are straight bars that connect to the top and bottom of the C primaries. They are wound with 400 turns of 22 gauge copper wire and there is one secondary coil between the N and S poles at the top and another secondary between the S and N at the bottom. So there are 14 primaries and 14 secondaries. The upper secondaries are all set with their turns going the same direction and the lower secondaries are all set the same direction but opposite of the upper set. The secondary coils are wired in series in each of the 3 sets of 4 secondaries withe the beginning wires of the three sets wired together and the discharge wire coming off of the last coil of 4 in the three sets is the one leg of the three phase 440 Volts. Remember to factor in the RMS.
The resistor R is an induction coil wound on a 1 inch square iron bar 12 inches long divided into 7 sections each section being wound with first 100 turns with a beginning wire and an ending wire , then another 100 turns in like manner and finally a third layer of 100 turns so that each section is divided into three parts and the inner 100 turns runs the first brush of the commutator and the second layer runs the second commutator, and the outer layer runs the third commutator and all of this is running in three parts so that they are 120 degrees apart so they can make a 440 volt circuit.
All three of the commutator brushes MUST be on the same shaft and turning together so that they maintain the 120 degrees of separation. I am still working on getting the final output to the level I want but have achieved 295 volts on the output so far. I sincerely believe that it will be necessary to use a bench power supply that converts 120 volts to D C that is variable between zero and 36 volts. The higher the voltage input, the higher the output. So far 24 volts has been my maximum input. There will need to be a transformer to divide the 440 volts to household current of 220 and 110 volts. There will also need to have a regulation of the input voltage to keep the output constant.
Contrary to the popular opinion that the primaries need to be N to N, even given the fact that that arrangement will give higher voltage, ALL of the sine wave curve is above the zero plane and there is no sine wave in the negative. Therefore it MUST be set N to S at the top of the primaries and S to N on the bottom.

[Dwane]

Hi Dwane,

That's why I posted about using ground. Or in other words, use the shaft itself for the wire feed. No grinding, no slip ring.

Regards,

bi

Hi bistander,
I do remember that now, thanks for reminding me. That's correct. The shaft is isolated, so can be used as a source. However, as much as the diagonal windings on the armature assist with a smoother operation of a motor, i was expecting parallel windings. Not sure if these I have will hinder any attempt at radiant collection. Suck it and see might be the best approach!

I would have had the shaft machined out of a parallel wound armature, and rewound it for a couple of tests I want to try. Longer shaft will be helpful.

Anyway, I'll set up a basic drive as per the approach on the thread as a learning exercise. Meanwhile, back in the jungle, I shall look for a different motor to hack.

Edit: Isolated from the coil and commutator.

Regards

Dwane

[bistander]

Wire feed

... Stepped shaft will complicate the grinding requirement for the wire feed, ...

Hi Dwane,

That's why I posted about using ground. Or in other words, use the shaft itself for the wire feed. No grinding, no slip ring.

Regards,

bi

[Dwane]

edit: Hi UFO,
I have just seen your post, and I would confirm your comments about shaft. I might look for another, although finding one like yours is going to be difficult: with parallel laminations.

Hi guys,
Have stripped the motor down. Not quite what I was expecting. Stepped shaft will complicate the grinding requirement for the wire feed, Also, the diagonal armature laminations will not assist me with testing what I would have like to rewind. Also, I think it will well nigh impossible to extract the shaft without doing a lot of damage to the winding and the commutator. I do not know anyone with a bin full of old motors.

Back to square one.

Regards

Dwane

[Ufopolitics]

Hi guys,
My washing machine motor arrived today. First thing I want to do is to push the shaft out and replace it with a longer shaft. Give myself a bit of room to move so to speak. Has anyone pressed the shaft out on one of these motors?

Regards

Dwane

Hello Dwane,

I would not mess with shaft replacement!!...In my experience they are VERY hardly pressed in, plus shaft have spines which sink into the laminated armature steel plus on commutator.

You may end up ruining commutator-windings and possible armature frame...

If you think do not have enough space to add the slip ring...then think about adding a flat-horizontal type that works with a vertical brush (parallel to shaft)...and install it in between two of the lower frame extensions to Center stator frame.

Other choice is to check if your shaft is isolated from outer casing...or even if not you could use whole housing as the positive from source, then just jumping from comm shaft area to one element.

Brushes should be isolated from metal housing

Anyways...just my advice.


Ufopolitics

[Dwane]

Hi guys,
My washing machine motor arrived today. First thing I want to do is to push the shaft out and replace it with a longer shaft. Give myself a bit of room to move so to speak. Has anyone pressed the shaft out on one of these motors?

There are two clues i wish to follow from my thread reading. First is the Hooper statement, the other was a comment by MM to look at Walter Russell coil winding techniques. There is a common denominator between these two obscure references - Coil winding. I am sure that there are plenty of you guys that would know a heck a lot more than I on coil winding scenario's.

Regards

Dwane

[boguslaw]

Maybe Tesla was right when he commented article about Figuera ? In many articles it's also stated Figuera tapped atmospheric electricity. I agree that the secret lies in what is not said and what is said in mystery manner...
Think about again...what is the real requirement to produce large current ?

[dragon]

I'd say we are all ignorant of what Figuera actually built back in 1902. It's been 116 years since his patent and not one person has successfully demonstrated a working device. Is it possible we simply don't have access to the radioactive iron ore used in building it? So many devices used various ore's back then, before it was so massively regulated out of existence because of what it could do. What did Mr. Figuera die from I wonder.... ? Wasn't it Stubblefield that lost a son to this interesting ore that made so much energy he could power and heat his home. Hubbard was another one that disclosed the use of radioactive ore. What about hendershot? Moray used it exclusively and stated so.

So I ask again, what do you believe the mechanism is that propels this device to produce an output 200 times it's input? The energy must have come from somewhere - we all know there are no magic coils. Some of the smartest people in the world are still running their devices on batteries... go figure...

I've played with various scenarios that would allow a near unity operation by utilizing a forced collapse of the non powered " N or S " coils making the feedback as close to the same voltage and current that produced it. "Near unity" is as close as it gets without an external force to propel it over the edge... of course it isn't overunity if we know where the extra energy is coming from is it...

[Ufopolitics]

Hi guys,

I am reappraising my approach to Figuera. I think the mystery is not in the patent but what he is no saying about his output!

I am sure you have discovered "the mystery" about Figuera... Dwane

It's very clearly understood, without absolutely any doubts... based on your years of experience plus skills in building, testing and developing so many different setups as possibilities, based on the same principle...

That We, all the ignorant about Figuera development...and with not as near/close as much experience as you have...are eager waiting to hear it...sorry, to read it.



Ufopolitics

[Dwane]

Unable to post

Hi guys,
I learned something interesting yesterday, I was unable to post a reply. This has happened to me before when a thread was locked or closed or whatever. Let's see if this post goes through!

Regards

Dwane

Edit: well it did, so I have no explanation for yesterday's issues.

I am reappraising my approach to Figuera. I think the mystery is not in the patent but what he is no saying about his output!

[seaad]

The input current is .9 amps and 23.9 volts DC. for an input wattage of 21.51 watts. The output voltage is 1.08 volts AC across the 10 ohm resistor for an output wattage of 116.64 milliwatts.
That is very low output for such a large input.
The coils I was using for the primary and secondary are the same ones seen in the earlier picture.
Carroll

Hi Carroll
I send some of my old pics from this thread and a link to my explanation of the realtionship between DC and AC signal just as info.

http://www.energeticforum.com/294837-post1576.html

Regards Arne

[Ufopolitics]

I finally got some time to make some more extensive tests of the modified motor used as a part G. I have attached a picture of a scope shot of the device under test.

The bottom trace in blue is the input signal to one of the primaries. The other primary of course looks just like this one except for the 180 degree phase shift. The top trace in yellow is the output signal measured across a 10 ohm 10 watt resistor. At the bottom of the scope shot you can see that the input signal setting is for 10.0 volts per division. The top signal is set for 2.00 volts per division.

The input current is .9 amps and 23.9 volts DC. for an input wattage of 21.51 watts. The output voltage is 1.08 volts AC across the 10 ohm resistor for an output wattage of 116.64 milliwatts. That is very low output for such a large input. The coils I was using for the primary and secondary are the same ones seen in the earlier picture. Three coils all on the same core of multiple strands of electric fence wire. I have used the electric fence wire many many times for cores and they have always worked great.

So why such a small output? I don't know. I tested with a compass and individually applied power to each primary to make sure I had opposing magnetic fields and I did. As a side note if the fields are not opposing the output drops to about half of what I got with this test. Could the problem be that all coils share the same core? Do I need to put separate cores in each coil and just mount them close together?

I did some further tests on the modified motor as the part G. You can clearly see from the scope shots that the modified motor is in fact putting out an AC signal. And you can see that with the output loaded by the 10 ohm resistor the spiking seen in the primary signal is almost totally gone in the output signal.

I took some measurements with my precision LCR meter of the modified motor. Here is what I found. As I rotated the armature by hand the resistance went from 2 ohms to 34 ohms. So there is quite a bit of resistance in this small motor. I think because of the small gauge wire used. A larger motor would probably show a lot less resistance.

The other measurement I made was to measure the change in inductance as I rotated the armature by hand. The inductance changed from 0 mh to 51.4 mh. So there is also a pretty good change in the inductance when the armature is rotated.

So it appears my changing input signal to the primaries is both a combination of resistance change and inductance change. I believe rewinding the motor for lower resistance would improve this. Or a much larger motor would already have much lower resistance and probably much more inductance. Will lower resistance and higher inductance make the primary to secondary more efficient? I really don't see how that change would make any difference in the output.

Until someone can come up with a way to make the transfer of power more efficient between the primaries and the secondary I don't see any reason to try to improve the part G.

In all of his rambling posts over the last few years MM has always insisted that the changing current of a loaded secondary will somehow give a push back on the magnetic field of the reducing primary. And this magic is supposed to explain how the Figuera device can produce more power than it consumes. Has anyone in their testing found any evidence to support this claim? Obviously my testing is pretty much a failure in that regard. I did try a much lower resistance load to try and test that idea but that only succeeded in lowering my output voltage even lower. The interesting thing is I really could not see any difference in the amount of current going to the part G slip ring or going to the motor driving the part G.

I am open to any suggestions as to how I can get a better transfer of power from the primaries to the secondary.

Take care all,
Carroll

Hello Citfta,

Excellent tests!...now do not get disappointed by your low output.
And I agree that you should not change your armature windings now, I believe the 34 ohms will allow much higher voltage for future tests.

Amazing the Inductance fluctuations just by hand spinning armature!!

Figuera's success is mainly based on maintaining SAME PRESSURE between both opposed fields.
From the above fact derives A lot of things involved) like each primary field MUST HAVE sufficient strength PLUS SPATIAL SIZE in order to Displace ALL ALONG Secondary axis...maintaining SAME HIGH PRESSURES.

So, NOT ANY combination of Volts-Amps will work for your SPECIFIC COILS-CORES mass (Volume) and length (SPECS). This also applies to any transformer or generator...if we do not get the right V & A to build the correct FIELD (can call it flux density if you will...) at primary or exciting coils for generator... it simply will not work...will not output nada.

IMHO I believe you should try different VA ratings at INPUT, until you kick a pretty decent output.

The only reason I used separate cores, was to test different size (length and thickness) Secondaries....but as long as you make coils that could slide off core...then different lengths of coils could be tested....remember, the shorter the secondary, the less displacement required....but you could grow in coil diameter since field expands beyond core.

I have tested what you wrote finally about MM opinion on secondary...and He is correct.

When we load secondary, (literally shorting it) we are generating a VERY STRONG INDUCED FIELD which naturally reacts with our Varying exciting fields...and so, by tendency it will affect more the "retracting"(decaying) primary since it is weaker and lower in flux density. NOW, This is NOT always good as it could throw off FIELD PRESSURES, dropping output.

I would test at INPUT a HIGHER Voltage that your armature can easily take...like 50V and like 2.0 Amps (about double of what you've tested)...then compare results ratio to this test.

Also, if you could measure your primaries fluctuations INDEPENDENTLY on Volts and Amps, (two meters V-A per each primary) it would reflect if they are balanced in HI-LO INPUT...I would test first at low speed...then operating 3600 RPM'S.


Wish you the BEST of results, truthfully and sincerely!


Regards



Ufopolitics