Stanley Meyer tec devices test and debugging suite

[bussi04]

[bussi04]

[bussi04]

[Tecstatic]

Hi eric,
I suggest to scan the frequency bandwith of the vco trying to identify the real resonance frequency of the tank circuit by analyzing the indicator signals of the 4046.
bussi04

Hi bussi,

I agree, I was going to suggest the same now we "stabilized" the circuit by getting rid of the faulty switchover circuit.

So like we did earlier, we now have to open the loop again.

MOD 1447#1 Break connection between R12-R13 and U4 pin 9
MOD 1447#2 Connect RV7 pin 1 to U4 pin 9

Also check the drive capability of U4 pin 9 by using 2 high bright LEDs and 2 resistors.

MOD 1447#3 Connect one led to VCC having light on when connected to GND via a 10K resistor (test it), but the resistor is instead of GND connected to U4 pin 2
MOD 1447#4 Connect one led to GND having light on when connected to VCC via a 10K resistor (test it), but the resistor is instead of VCC connected to U4 pin 2

If this load presented to U4 pin 2 is to much (not able to saturate to rails), increase resistors to 15K. That U4 must be able to drive.

This is a nice indicator to have a you just have to watch the LEDs to monitor the U4 pin 2 level during phase shifts on U4 pin 3-14.

Then scan the VCO range with RV7 and observe C10 voltage, when the phase shift occurs at U4 pin 3-14 at the same time the C10 voltage should shift from saturated one rail to saturated other rail ( a rail is either GND or VCC ). Having checked the voltage with a meter, you know the relation to the amount of light from the LEDs.

Check also the signal levels at P3-P4 and U2 pin 1 when scanning, use the scope for this.
Please describe in detail what you observe.

This way we can determine if the 4046 is broken.

-------

Maybe we don't get it running, because the resonance is not pronounced.
Of cause to test a PLL this way, we need a proper resonant circuit.

Please watch Andrews 5 videos I posted some posts ago yesterday, if you have not done it yet. This is an excellent education on how to make a resonant circuit and test the resonance.

What I fear is it might be a problem we don't have simultaneously resonance in both the primary and secondary of the transformer. But for now lets begin the examination as described above.

Eric

[bussi04]

[bussi04]

Hi bussi

OK.

By the way don't consider

MOD1428#1: swap of feedback wires of tank circuit at P3-P4

as a permanent one, but something you try swapping at each test, as we don't know which polarity is the right one.

Eric

Hi eric,
I suggest to scan the frequency bandwith of the vco trying to identify the real resonance frequency of the tank circuit by analyzing the indicator signals of the 4046.
bussi04

[Tecstatic]

Hi bussi

OK.

By the way don't consider

MOD1428#1: swap of feedback wires of tank circuit at P3-P4

as a permanent one, but something you try swapping at each test, as we don't know which polarity is the right one.

Eric

[bussi04]

As we also have some parasite capacitance in the transformer winding, it is hard to say how much capacitance we must add.

With a center frequency (/32) close to resonant frequency, we should have close to 2.5 V on C10, not saturated to 5V.

So unfortunately we have not solved it yet, and time is up. You could consider replacing the 4046 with a new one if it is in a socket. It may have been hurt during the "fight".

Thank you for today, good work
When do we continue ?


Eric

[Tecstatic]

As we also have some parasite capacitance in the transformer winding, it is hard to say how much capacitance we must add.

With a center frequency (/32) close to resonant frequency, we should have close to 2.5 V on C10, not saturated to 5V.

So unfortunately we have not solved it yet, and time is up. You could consider replacing the 4046 with a new one if it is in a socket. It may have been hurt during the "fight".

Thank you for today, good work
When do we continue ?


Eric

[bussi04]

From 1nf to 2 nf is 100% not a few % like e.g. 5%

Please tell your observations on the 4 lock conditions, else I'm out of clues.

[Tecstatic]

From 1nf to 2 nf is 100% not a few % like e.g. 5%

Please tell your observations on the 4 lock conditions, else I'm out of clues.

[bussi04]

Re condition #3: 212kHz divided by 32 = 6625Hz
Re condition #4: Yes let us refer frequency to the Q5 of the CD4024.

----------------

Redefinition of the PhaseLockedLoop "locked" condition:

1. Phase difference between U4 pin14 and 3 are close to zero all the time.
2. C10 voltage is a DC voltage with low ripple voltage, 1V < V(C10) < 4 V.
3. Frequency at U4 pin 3 is stable close to the "resonance" frequency of the tank circuit.
4. U4 pin 1 pulsing at U4 pin 3 frequency, so D6 is on.

-----------

Now try to add one more capacitor parallel to the capacitor on your 230V transformer winding so the capacity is increased by a few %.

Q 1438#1 Does the increased capacitance in the tank circuit reduce the frequency at U4 pin 3 accordingly ?

[Tecstatic]

Re condition #3: 212kHz divided by 32 = 6625Hz
Re condition #4: Yes let us refer frequency to the Q5 of the CD4024.

----------------

Redefinition of the PhaseLockedLoop "locked" condition:

1. Phase difference between U4 pin14 and 3 are close to zero all the time.
2. C10 voltage is a DC voltage with low ripple voltage, 1V < V(C10) < 4 V.
3. Frequency at U4 pin 3 is stable close to the "resonance" frequency of the tank circuit.
4. U4 pin 1 pulsing at U4 pin 3 frequency, so D6 is on.

-----------

Now try to add one more capacitor parallel to the capacitor on your 230V transformer winding so the capacity is increased by a few %.

Q 1438#1 Does the increased capacitance in the tank circuit reduce the frequency at U4 pin 3 accordingly ?

[bussi04]

Hi bussi,

I got the new diagram test 0.1
(remember to use the 4th button "page settings" to set the version number n the bottom right "header").

MOD 1436#1: Be sure midpoint R12, R13 only have one connection: U4 pin 9
MOD 1436#2: Be sure U7 pin 1 and 2 are connected (no connection on the diagram)

Please test for "locked" condition again, and report your finding like before, note RV7 is no longer relevant.

I'm not present the next 20 minutes (dinner is served )

Eric

[Tecstatic]

Hi bussi,

I got the new diagram test 0.1
(remember to use the 4th button "page settings" to set the version number n the bottom right "header").

MOD 1436#1: Be sure midpoint R12, R13 only have one connection: U4 pin 9
MOD 1436#2: Be sure U7 pin 1 and 2 are connected (no connection on the diagram)

Please test for "locked" condition again, and report your finding like before, note RV7 is no longer relevant.

I'm not present the next 20 minutes (dinner is served )

Eric