Joule Ringer!

[mk1]

With all due respect, and plenty of astonishment towards this thread and lasresabre's / fusionchip's findings... doesn't one need to pretty much ignore the "9 watt rating" on the bulb? Illumination of a bulb rated at a certain power is no real indication of what power went in, is it? Just a thought. Not trying to sound negative, I am following this thread closely too, it is very very interesting any way you look at it. Thanks

You are right i don't think its a negative thing to light a 9w bulb and getting usable light from 0.7414 % , less then 1% from the promoted power usage .

Mark

[kcarring]

You are right i don't think its a negative thing to light a 9w bulb and getting usable light from 0.7414 % , less then 1% from the promoted power usage .

Mark

I agrre, I did not want to sound like a naysayer, I'm not. I have a 15 watt fat tube that provides a nice evening light in my room now, on 6v / 47mA. I'm not complaining. Any way you look at this lasresabre circuit one could save money, and I'll be building it as soon as I can "get it" into my head just how to. I tired a couple of times but I have the pinning on the transformer wrong and the wrong capaciter. I'll get it tho. It's definitely cool. I now ignore the "watts" written on a bulb, and I'm pretty much assuming that either normal conventional means of operating these bulbs is extremely wasteful, or, it's a great mate to the spikes created on collapsing a coil. Either way, it's cool! I intend on having a great greenhouse on these circuits and I am very thankful to all of you for that!

[kcarring]

I'm just waiting for the CRTC van to show up when I flash up this big Exciter tower I wound LOL. I wonder just what bandwidth - I am - broadcasting on LOL Hopefully not my neighbours portable phone LOL or blocking out the local AM station. Not that anyone listens to it.

[Lidmotor]

Flyback transformer Joule Ringer

@Xee2 & All
I got my Electronicgoldmine flyback transformer and threw a Joule Ringer circuit on it. This thing works pretty good and your excellent diagrams Xee2 made wiring it up very easy. I didn't have much time to work with it but I tried running it on different voltages and transistors. It liked 6 volts and a TIP3055 so I made a quick video of it running.

YouTube - Flyback Transformer Joule Ringer.ASF

My boxed Joule Ringer is still running after 8 days. Don't get too excited--it has a 9 volt battery in it---but it is the original cheap carbon zinc 9v that I used in the video that I made of it over a week ago. I turned it down so it was just glowing and it has been a nice night light. I never expected to last this long running 24/7. If I can scale this thing up using the flyback transformer and run this on a 6v or 12v SLA maybe we really have something here folks.

Lidmotor

[seth]

Thanks for video. I assume it will also light a fluorescent tube.

Yep!
It'll light 2 36W CFLs, but extremely dim. Heres a pic of a 14W on the ringer/flyback part which is being charged by the exciter (with 2 14W CFLs for comparison). The exciter is powered by 1AA in a charger.

Sorry, but i made a mistake in my last circuit - ive corrected it below. Sorry for not doing it sooner but my net connection wasnt working.

[nul-points]

hi Seth

the diodes on the AV plug are shown the wrong way round

as shown, the AV-plug/supply-capacitor would develop a -ve voltage across the NPN darlington pair transistor setup (and NPN needs a +ve supply)

cheers
sandy

(PS i've already posted this correction on the OU.com JR thread a few days ago )

[Muon]

@ Muon

Read through the Joule ringer thread and you will see that there is no "how to". LaserSaber said he would post a video showing how to make one, but that has not happened yet. Many of us have gotten a few minutes of run time, but he is the only one able to get 20 to 40 minutes that I recall and he can only do it with one type of transformer.

To use Fuji board as Jule thief, just replace large capacitor with a fluorescent tube or neon bulb.

Great way to start! Just need to remember to discharge the flash before opening, and then discharge the capacitor when opened up. (I got a little shock the first time, when I neglected this discharge step.)

I was able to get a couple of Fuji disposable cameras for free from the recycle bin at Walmart -- just asked the guy there, he asked his supervisor.
One is the AA battery kind, the other the AAA kind.

Here are the results from my first try with a DSO scope (BitScope). I did as you suggested, Xee2 -- cut off the big cap, and then I simply looked at the output of the two connecting post-wires (previously to the cap).

Fuji AA-battery type flash circuit:
Vp-p = 23.6 V
Vrms = 11.3 V
Frequency = 4.1 KHz

Fuji AAA-battery type flash circuit:
Vp-p = 23.6 V
Vrms = 11.1 V
Frequency = 6.6 KHz

It makes a nice square-wave signal generator running off its own battery -- and CHEAP! I figured out how to turn on the "switch" in each camera -- just push the copper "switch" down (easy).

BUT -- when I tried my Tenmac power supply instead, at 1.5 volts, it maxed out the current trying to draw over 3 Amps!
I turned down the voltage to 1.1V then it was finally on-scale at 3 amps, but it would not ring (oscillate).

What I would LIKE to do, rather than dis-assemble the parts of the Fuji circuit to get Lasersaber's JouleRinger or a good mod, is to keep the Fuji circuit where possible, and make CONNECTIONS WITH LEAD WIRES at appropriate points.

Is there a way to do this -- keeping the steps simple for a hobbyist like me? I'd like to make it easy for beginners like myself, start with opening up a little flash camera, discharge the big cap and remove it, and THEN make a few connections to get the output, with as high output power as possible relative to the input power.

What I'd really like to know is how to proceed to get the input power-consumption down. To check the input power and output power. I know how to use a scope, and would use the multiply function V*I to display (and later calculate) power -- this is an area where perhaps I can contribute to this open-source-type effort which I sincerely like very much.

Any suggestions on how to proceed would be appreciated, starting with simple (?) mods to the Fuji circuit please, if possible.

[FRC]

Lucky

I was able to get a couple of Fuji disposable cameras for free from the recycle bin at Walmart -- just asked the guy there, he asked his supervisor.
One is the AA battery kind, the other the AAA kind.

You people are lucky. I asked the clerk at the photo department at Wal-Mart here what they did with their disposable Fuji's and Kodak's and she said they recycle them by sending them back to Kodak. Guess I will have to buy one
for $8.98 and throw the film part away.

FRC

[Muon]

Great if you can get them for free... I found a source at Amazon, about $4 or $5 including shipping per Fuji disposable.

Today, my colleague and I playing with the Fuji circuits destroyed one, just by putting about 100 ohms across the output (where the big cap used to be)... We were trying to measure the input and output currents... With this condition, the input current went way up -- pegged the 3 Amp analog ammeter.
I think it may be better to remove the transistor and transformer, or just get these from basic parts.
We have built a couple of Joule Thief circuits, these work well.

[fusionchip]

@fusionchip I've seen the runaway condition when the cfl is disconnected from - rail, cfl goes bright, draw goes way up. I'm not sure if that's the same thing as what your talking about. This happened to me without any coils, just res and cap.
What's the brightness like on your 40 hour mod? That was using just a Hazens coil and led on secondary? or with a bi-filar as well?

Hi . Sorry it took so long to get back . I have been laid up in the hospital. The runaway as i call it took the cfl to full brightness and blew every component including the transformer and all 6 germaniums . . The 40+ hours is half bright . I am able to read a book with it and i have bad eyes. It all depends on the cfl you are using . I have 7 other cfls and only two will produce good light at such low draw . Still 40+ hours on the fugi mod is good for an aa battery . the cap resistor thing i did two years ago so nothing new on that . there is something new on putting a coil on top of the transformer thought . and two coils are even more mysterious with my runaway on an almost dead cell . i have three other boards i am almost finished and have 10 10000uf caps now but no luck running the circuit with them at all . just like kooler . we are missing somthing and i suspect its a transistor issue . I have another 40+ hour gadget Boxed and useable . The older AA fuji(with neon) are available in the two pack only at the faimily dollar Store for 7 bucks . the single packs were AAA with the led indicators and are 6.50 .

Albert

[fusionchip]

Great way to start! Just need to remember to discharge the flash before opening, and then discharge the capacitor when opened up. (I got a little shock the first time, when I neglected this discharge step.)

I was able to get a couple of Fuji disposable cameras for free from the recycle bin at Walmart -- just asked the guy there, he asked his supervisor.
One is the AA battery kind, the other the AAA kind.

Here are the results from my first try with a DSO scope (BitScope). I did as you suggested, Xee2 -- cut off the big cap, and then I simply looked at the output of the two connecting post-wires (previously to the cap).

Fuji AA-battery type flash circuit:
Vp-p = 23.6 V
Vrms = 11.3 V
Frequency = 4.1 KHz

Fuji AAA-battery type flash circuit:
Vp-p = 23.6 V
Vrms = 11.1 V
Frequency = 6.6 KHz

It makes a nice square-wave signal generator running off its own battery -- and CHEAP! I figured out how to turn on the "switch" in each camera -- just push the copper "switch" down (easy).

BUT -- when I tried my Tenmac power supply instead, at 1.5 volts, it maxed out the current trying to draw over 3 Amps!
I turned down the voltage to 1.1V then it was finally on-scale at 3 amps, but it would not ring (oscillate).

What I would LIKE to do, rather than dis-assemble the parts of the Fuji circuit to get Lasersaber's JouleRinger or a good mod, is to keep the Fuji circuit where possible, and make CONNECTIONS WITH LEAD WIRES at appropriate points.

Is there a way to do this -- keeping the steps simple for a hobbyist like me? I'd like to make it easy for beginners like myself, start with opening up a little flash camera, discharge the big cap and remove it, and THEN make a few connections to get the output, with as high output power as possible relative to the input power.

What I'd really like to know is how to proceed to get the input power-consumption down. To check the input power and output power. I know how to use a scope, and would use the multiply function V*I to display (and later calculate) power -- this is an area where perhaps I can contribute to this open-source-type effort which I sincerely like very much.

Any suggestions on how to proceed would be appreciated, starting with simple (?) mods to the Fuji circuit please, if possible.

you want to short the diode to get an ac signal at the cap /out termanals . that will get you closer .
Albert

[FRC]

Cap value ?

the cap resistor thing i did two years ago so nothing new on that

Hope you are feeling better fusionchip ! I was wondering, what is the cap value
in the stock fuji camera, and can it be used in the "cap resistor thing" or what
value cap is best to change to? Can anyone else answer or add their input
also ?

FRC

[fusionchip]

I'm probably over optimistic in my calculations. From the scope shots shared by others here, it seems the CFL is only lit for a tiny fraction of each cycle. correct me if this is not the case.

Hi . Well in the real use of a cfl wattage rating it's actually the heater Filiment wattage and nothing to do with the light it produces . We are just lighting them without creating the mercury vapor first with heat. So i don't think you can do a cop calculation on them even thought i have always cried wolf . They are just like us lighting up a hundred watts of luxon leds full bright from a few milliamps . How can you calculate that . One thing is for sure if technology would allow what we know and learned to be put to use it would put a hurt on battery suppliers and power companies . Imagine lighting up that department store with what we already have using no filiments at all . forget the rfi i say they already are baking us with the full spectrum Plus like you say the cfl running on standard Ac current is still oscillating . what they need is to shut the heater off after the bulb lites . Brilliant and simple solution but no they keep that bulb sucking filiment hot all the time .

Albert

[fusionchip]

Hope you are feeling better fusionchip ! I was wondering, what is the cap value
in the stock fuji camera, and can it be used in the "cap resistor thing" or what
value cap is best to change to? Can anyone else answer or add their input
also ?

FRC

I used 68pf in the old mods .I put the cap across the pot and then used the center and outside leg . I used it as a small tank circuit where the bias resistor was. it is a fact that each transformer is a little different even if they are the same version . Some have 6 to 8 turns on the primary on the outside of the little transformers . I have wound more wire around the outside of some of the older ones to increase the out volts .I am ok thanks for asking . each day i wake up in my own bed is a good day

Albert

[mk1]

@Albert

Glad to hear from you , i was getting worried .

I think i figured out the iron and copper coil , John showed that a similar coil one of iron and one of copper , will exhibit opposite polarity with the same current direction feeding the both coil .

Now what is stronger North or South , Or both in attraction or repulsion .

Lets say we make a Jt 4 coils 2 pairs iron and copper , feeding from both ends of the battery .

Anyway it brings even more questions , but basically the induced current in the second wire of the pair would be in phase instead of the opposite , i hope you see what i getting at .

Take care !

Mark