Gray Tube Replication

[Electrotek]

Where exactly on your circuit radiant effect occur ?

The radial energy pressure waves are close to the surface of the inductor and are picked up by the 1/2" of the wire sticking under the edge of the bottom of the inductor.

[Electrotek]

Hi Mark,

I think this table is set up to compare the effects produced by various powering methods. Sometimes the hollow core coils were used, sometimes the NST. And there's also what looks similar to the Zetec CSET under the table, sometimes connected. Apparently, the hollow core coils produced the best effect since they are used in the Hackenberger photo. When energized by the Black Boxes these coils would likely take less energy than the NST. Here's another table layout, with clearer wiring:

[boguslaw]

@Boguslaw:

Here's the circuit diagram for my static pickup wire. With the inductor as a primary with thousands of turns the single wire still puts off a spark about 1/16" long. So this is not a transformer effect. And it doesn't work at all when the wire is swung around by 90 degrees relative to the end by the inductor.



@Xenomorph:

I like that effect! Too bad I can't read the text and find out if a straight wire is throwing the radial discharge. I can see they're aware of the IR camera burn and tried to lessen it. I'd like to find an easy to make an IR block filter; the commercial ones are so expensive. Here's one of my new photos, shot through sun glasses:

Where exactly on your circuit radiant effect occur ?

[Spokane1]

GD 1974 Photo Observations of Popping Coil Demo

Hi Teslan,




:

[Electrotek]

Radial Energy Pickup

Here's a block diagram of the circuit:

[Electrotek]

Electrostatic Generators

Hi Mark,

Thanks for all of this background information on Gray's Electrostatic Generators. This is more for me to think about while I look at the pictures, trying to figure out what's in the Black Boxes.

I agree that it's preferable, if not necessary to use an arc producing relay. I see that there are two relays in a micro wave oven. The small one is electronic, powered by 24V, and switches line current to the coil of the larger unit. This second one is mechanical and has 5,000V separation tolerance between the output terminals and the coil. Maybe a few of these in series would work for HV. If not, I can still pulse my NST at a higher rate, on the input side. With a bare control board salvaged from an oven, the relay closes when around 60V AC line power is applied to the board.

I'm not surprised that Gray was able to roll up and switch to new investors, since crucial information was kept secret. Does anyone own the rights to the Electrostatic Generator?

Thanks for the encouragement about the iron. I'm going to sandwich a couple of strips between some acrylic and wire it up as shown in the pictures and see what happens when I stretch an arc along the inside of the tube.

[Electrotek]

@Boguslaw:

Here's the circuit diagram for my static pickup wire. With the inductor as a primary with thousands of turns the single wire still puts off a spark about 1/16" long. So this is not a transformer effect. And it doesn't work at all when the wire is swung around by 90 degrees relative to the end by the inductor.



@Xenomorph:

I like that effect! Too bad I can't read the text and find out if a straight wire is throwing the radial discharge. I can see they're aware of the IR camera burn and tried to lessen it. I'd like to find an easy to make an IR block filter; the commercial ones are so expensive. Here's one of my new photos, shot through sun glasses:

[Spokane1]

Some Economic History of Gray's Electrostatic Generator

It may turn out that Ed Gray's Electrostatic Generator is more important than his motor. Reports claim that this device could power a large drill, among other tools, lights, and appliances. His motor, on the other hand, was specialized and difficult to replicate.

Dear Electrotek,

Keep up those novel exploration experiments with iron and other mateirls that are exposed to arcs.

Concerning Gray's Electrostatic Generator in this thread: While we will never know the whole truth there are some interesting facts about this device.

1. Gray was exploring the manufacturing this device in Portland, OR for a construction price of about $53 per unit in 1974. The deal never happened.

2. The US licensing rights for this technology was sold to a Denver company that formed a coporation called "Electrotech", another coporation was formed to do the same for the motor. These companies never produced a single motor or electrostatic generator. This company (and his 2nd ex-wife) sued Gray in mid 1976. This is when Gray folded Evgray Enterprises and started ZETECH after stealing all of the existing prototypes and documentation.

3. Gray spent the rest of his life attempting to sell this technology and was often strapped for cash, especially in 1978. Yet, he never built a single electrostatic generator in this 14 year period. If this device worked so well and cost so little to build why wasn't he producing these things in his garage to pay his rent? (and medical bills)

From this and other information, my conclusion is this:

The original Marvin Cole Electrostatic Generator worked damn good and was the demonstration device that allowed Cole to get investors to cut loose with their money befor he even had a motor to show off. Richard Hackenberger thought that he knew what was going on in the circuit and made a series of second generation prototypes that used transistors instead of the mechanical vibrator approach. Somehow he over looked something in the translation. When he finally had the proper equipment to analyze his new generation devices it was found out that they were no better than what the Coleman Lamp company was offering. Rather, all he had was a classical and expensive DC-DC converter. Hackenberger thought, at the time, all he needed to do was make corrections to the winding ratios of his induction coil, but didn't have the money to do so since the funding focus was on the motor development.

Actually I think he finally figured out his mistake in 1st quarter of 1976 when he eleminated the CSET's from the EMA6 motor and replaced them with three active dielectric kenitic arcs devices as part of his commentator system.

If you can figure out what Marvin Cole had in his "Electrostatic Generator" then you will really be cooking.

Some hints:

1. It is largely composed of a custom induction coil made by Mallory Electric Company - but could have been made by any transformer fabricator for a 20%premium over the same weight of a clasical coil. It didn't use a ferrite or exotic core.

2. 70% of the cost of the generator was in the coil

3. A sparg gap was required - this is very important because this is where the electrostatic portion of this technology comes from. Note that in 1893 Dr. Tesla was using magnetic arc disruptors, however he was draggin the arc over a mica dielectric that covered the magnet poles in doing so. I believe that this second process was where the action is and what was deleted from the patent documents. It is well hidden.

4. A car radio vibrator was employed for initial primary excitation. I suspect the Pulse Motor patent is accurate on this point.

5. It has been rummored that iron wire was involved - but who knows?

6. The output is in the neighborhood of 1400V pulsing DC. So not all loads can connect to it.

7. The load is typically connected in series.

8. The 8KHz operating frequency is what Hackenberger had for his failed solid state system. I think the original unit operated at 100 Hz.

9. A very high chance that solid state diodes were employed

10. The unit used current recovery, suggesting that a fair amount of classical recoverable energy was used in the excitation phase.

11. Hackenberger is quoted as saying "The technical foundations of the motor are based upon the power supply".

I know this is not a lot and what we have is cryptic - but this is all we have to work with.

Spokane1

[Xenomorph]

I just stumbled upon something interesting to share.
Here is some info about a ukrainian plasma research:


Scary stuff.
It looks as if they created something like the electro-radiant event
having that green color outside of a spark gap.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

http://www.sciteclibrary.ru/ris-stat/st702/ris1.avi

http://www.sciteclibrary.ru/ris-stat/st702/ris2.avi

http://www.sciteclibrary.ru/ris-stat/st702/ris8.avi

[Electrotek]

Hi Teslan,

The camera batteries are charging, so I'll post the circuit drawing this afternoon. And you may have a point about using a real ground for a stronger effect, so I'll give that a shot. But I wonder if the static field pickup transformer needs to be any bigger than Gray's hollow core coils? Here's a picture in which he left one more clue:



The artwork on the wall looks like a treble clef symbol from music, but there's actually a significant difference. Looking closely, I can see what looks like a wide strip in the middle, with coils coming off each end and wrapping around the middle in two layers. This could be a schematic for the coils around his plastic tube. The soldered connections on the actual coil - where radial wires could be going inwards - look like they're offset, so there may be two pickup strips inside. Using two pickup strips would be consistent with pictures of Gray's motor, since he has two complete sets of motor coils, each with their own strips of plastic. The lesser mass of the inner static field coil could well be the reason for the shorter length of one set of motor coils.

[boguslaw]

Electrotek

I hope you post schematic of your arrangement of circuit and defibrillator inductor.One picture is worth a thousands words (at least for me)
I think you've got it. Now make a transformer - for details point to Don Smith lecture. Pack as much transformers as possible in the area of field, primary in series , secondary in parallel. Primary should go to real ground.Radiant flowing that single wire should enlarge itself.

[Electrotek]

Radial Energy Pickup

Or maybe the "floating static" pickup coils - on the energy recovery side - are connected to radial strips of metal, imbeded in the blocks of plastic?

[Electrotek]

I wonder if the radial end of this coil would be imbeded in a block of plastic inside Gray's motor?

[Electrotek]

Radial Energy Pickup

It may turn out that Ed Gray's Electrostatic Generator is more important than his motor. Reports claim that this device could power a large drill, among other tools, lights, and appliances. His motor, on the other hand, was specialized and difficult to replicate. (YouTube replications have yet to show significant energy gain?) So I've been working with my Puff Spark circuit towards the aim of powering a tread mill motor. Using a circuit variation which has two MW oven caps - at 6kV - I've been able to get this DC motor to continuously advance with each spark. The rotation is slow due to the 60 cps frequency but if it turns the same amount per pulse at 6 kilo pulses/sec I may have something.

In the course of my other experiments that day I made a discovery, due to the cluttered nature of my workbench. My three point discharge circuit includes a heavy defibrillator inductor, which is encased in Bakelite. At one point I wasn't using the motor but I noticed that I got a slight shock when I brushed against it. So I inspected my bench and saw that the inductor was sitting on the very end of one wire going to the motor. Remembering that Tesla's positive Radiant Energy traveled straight outwards, I correlated this with the fact that the motor wire was going straight out from the inductor's edge. When I shifted the wire around so that it was parallel to the circumference of the inductor, the shocking from the motor's case stopped.

As long as the wire is straight out from the inductor, I can pull a weak spark from either the motor case or the other motor wire. This is also true when I use a car battery as a polar mass. Interestingly, the broad surface of the side of an alligator clip I put on the end of the second motor wire shows a static attraction to a copper wire going to virtual ground. Only when the clip gets very close to the wire does it spark over.

This particular setup is a single wire circuit. Without a diode anywhere, I have a MW oven cap wired to one end of a sign transformer, with the other side of the cap connected to one wire from the inductor. The other side of the inductor isn't connected to anything. As simple as can be. Then the output wire goes straight out from the inductor to the motor. Without the motor wire, I can feel a vibrating pulsation close to the inductor which feels like air pressure. With the motor wire, I can feel this pressure around the motor case.

This straight out wire pickup reminds me of one of Gray's clues. He has a coil on the wall whose end is bent straight inwards:



In Gray's patent he says that a research program can determine the best combination of materials to use in the construction of his Power Conversion Tube. So I put a piece of steel under the edge of the inductor and found the output spark is heavier than with a copper wire.

I waited until the next day to replicate the effect, and found that it takes a period of several minutes for it to start to work. At the low frequency it apparently takes longer than Gray's 30 seconds to 'charge' the plastic. Also the effect is stronger when the humidity is high.

[vrand]

@vrand and all,
sorry it was not the subject of this thread, so I will not answer anymore to questions on that subject.
Please for more info start here: Tesla Switch Solar Charger to debut at Bedini conference

Okay, thanks. I created a new thread on Bedini's new TS unit and would be interested in your thoughts on it.

Regards