Gray Tube Replication

[Electrotek]

Hi folks, yes electrotek that is the color. So its possible Stephen King did some studying of technologies and possibly knew that this green emission has technological value. Maybe.

It amazes me that the movie studios know what the color looks like. This errie green light is a Scalar energy, due to the way it's produced with two potentials traveling in different directions. Reminds me of the iridescent blue light from the alien ship in Independence Day. And yes, it has technological value.

For what it's worth, I was with IATSE for 12 1/2 years - the International Alliance of Theatrical Stage Employees. Our five leaf clover emblem is in the credits of just about every movie ever made.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, yes electrotek that is the color. So its possible Stephen King did some studying of technologies and possibly knew that this green emission has technological value. Maybe.

[Ghst]

Spokane1: This is all very interesting. There's so much which is still unknown and left to be rediscovered. It's too bad that Gray himself didn't understand what was going on or he might have put it in his patent. Thanks for the update.

I don't really think I'm breaking any new ground. I'm just trying to take what is provided and build something which does more than pop a coil.

Yes, this is also my goal. However, I use the popping coil as a tool to determine, what energy is in the discharge. Now with Mark's help, maybe we can see how much energy is lost, magnetizing the coils. If we can prove that one can power three sets of coils from a one capacitor discharge without much losses, then, I think that Gray was power swapping the discharge from capacitor to capacitor,(as you Tek have often mentioned). After the initial charging of 3. 6, or 9 capacitors, the caps would only need to be topped off by the ignition coil(s). I think that the larger 14 gauge wire offers less resistance to the discharge of the large caps, thus low loss as the energy flashes through the coils. I also think that the collapsing fields from six of these large coils will produce a "humdinger" of a spike for recovery, powering lights, a TV, and maybe a small space craft! These are just my thoughts rambling.

[Electrotek]

Spokane1: This is all very interesting. There's so much which is still unknown and left to be rediscovered. It's too bad that Gray himself didn't understand what was going on or he might have put it in his patent. Thanks for the update.

I don't really think I'm breaking any new ground. I'm just trying to take what is provided and build something which does more than pop a coil.

[Spokane1]

Some Early E.V. Gray Arc Stretching History

Has anyone seen the picture in which Ed Gray is showing the effect, with the meters connected, to Fran Litz? Gray's expression seems to say: "Now why is there more energy coming out than going in?" (Sorry, but my DVD drive has an I/O error so I can't upload that picture at this time. Perhaps someone else has it and can post it?)

I may post a picture of my effect later. This effect has perceivable correlations to systems other than Gray's, but that would be off topic.

Dear Electrotek,

I don't have a photo in my collestion that shows Mr. Gray working with an arc directly, however the photo you are describing with Fred Lenz (Grays new father in law to his second wife) was taken in late 1973 by Tom Valentine. They were doing the "popping coil" demonstration as a photo opportunity. The electromagnets used at the time had three wire each connected to them. Several Topologies can be devised with that many wires.

Mr. Gray did disclose to an observer (1973) that all "his" circuits required a spark gap as part of the initial charging process.

What I do have, on the matter, is a short attempt at a technical paper written by some "insider" that describes how the popping coils were actually striking an arc between the metalic coil cores as they moved. When the arc was broken the remaining energy was left in the capacitor. From my classical calculations this only gives you about a 22% savings after the first cycle - but every little bit counts. My limited research with popping coils (at 3.5KV and 40uF) with a seperation arc between them only shows regular classical operation (No OU). Something else is involved that we haven't discovered yet. I agree with you that the stretching arc is important but we are missing the next step - what ever that is.

I don't know if arc stretching was what was being done in the 1973 photo with Fred Lenz. It appears that as the years rolled on the demo equipment was modified. I suspect the neither Mr. Gray or Mr. Hackenburger knew how all that stuff worked and had to dumb it down to what they did know as time went on.

When Mr. Hackenburger died he was putting all his limited resources into stretching the arcs in the "donuts" of the modified EMA6 before it got snatched by the FCC (early 1979). He was driving a cab at the time. Anyway he thought that the mechanical stretch of the spark was important, but it is obvious he didn't have all the clues in one hand. He knew it was magic and spent the rest of his life attempting to restore what was lost by using his memory and personal theories about what was going on. I hate to say it, but Mr. Gray was no technical help at all . All he could contribute was general descriptions and analogies he had picked up from Mr. Cole. Mr. Gray really thought that all you had to do was increase the voltage level across a coil and all the energy losses would dissapear.

Hope this helps.

Spokane1

[Electrotek]

Hi folks, this may have no value what so ever, however the correlation is extremely odd. There is a movie that was made for TV called 'Tommy Knockers' and the devices the people were building due to being influenced by an e.t. source, all emitted this same green color and were self powering devices, is this coincidence or does Stephen King know something. Maybe.

I remember hearing that there was a movie by that name, but I didn't see it. Did the green light look like the light in this picture, especially the part at the bottom, under the area where the camera is saturated? This wasn't a self powering device. Rather, this effect was produced by my circuit which is powered by a High Voltage capacitor. Has anyone else produced an effect by this kind of High Voltage capacitor powered circuit?

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, this may have no value what so ever, however the correlation is extremely odd. There is a movie that was made for TV called 'Tommy Knockers' and the devices the people were building due to being influenced by an e.t. source, all emitted this same green color and were self powering devices, is this coincidence or does Stephen King know something. Maybe.

[Electrotek]

Re: Arc Stretching

A few posts back I mentioned that I've been experimenting with an arc stretching effect. I believe that this is related to what Gray was doing when he was able to generate excess power (OU) without using his motor.

What I've found is that I can stretch the plasma arc (ie, Puff Spark) away from the point where it is created, using no other support for the arc than that point, where it continues to manifest. As the arc travels, it fans out. And there seems to be no practical limit to how far the arc can be stretched, other than the fact that it gradually becomes less intense with distance and cross section. (My belief is that it can travel 20 feet or more, even if it is no longer highly visible.)

The appearance of the arc, after 8 or 9 inches has a slight bluish tint. To me, this resembles the color and consistency of what appears to be plasma inside Gray's air core FFF tube, as I showed in the accompanying picture linked to in that post.

Has anyone seen the picture in which Ed Gray is showing the effect, with the meters connected, to Fran Litz? Gray's expression seems to say: "Now why is there more energy coming out than going in?" (Sorry, but my DVD drive has an I/O error so I can't upload that picture at this time. Perhaps someone else has it and can post it?)

I may post a picture of my effect later. This effect has perceivable correlations to systems other than Gray's, but that would be off topic.

[Electrotek]

Your coil at the bottom is connected to the + of a can and the - of another cap at the same time in addition to being tied to a point at a gap..that is three places.

Do you mean my NST? That's the power supply. The "coil" is the inductor labeled 36.

And I am moving this thread forwards. I said I'm not going to waste time discussing this matter further on this forum and I responded to the current posts.

[Ghst]

Spokane1,
Great job! I have a word of caution. If You are using a battery as I, watch out for this. Be sure that you discharge that mean old cap before doing any adjustments, (Positioning the array under the LV electrode) and allways disconnect the wire feed to the coil. If you do not disconnect the feed wire to the coil and try to adjust the array position, the cap can discharge through you back through the ignition coil and on to the Battery. I can assure you that this is very unpleasant! And How!
Again great work Mar....Spokane1!

[Aaron]

please no more misinformation

Yes, I can do the same thing. This fall under the realm of electrical equivalency. And I have also stated that "diode polarity doesn't matter". But where is my coil connected in three places? And my two capacitors are in fact tied to the same ground.

Your circuits that you've promoted use a LV capacitor. This Puff Spark circuit of yours uses a HV capacitor. (Like Gray's circuit.) And it will not produce a plasma burst without the inductor.

If you're never going to admit that the circuits are the same then we may as well drop the matter from this forum and move it to a different arena.

I don't see how I'll be able to post anything else of value to your forum. This deprives me of something of value.

If that falls under electrical equivelancy, then you are doing nothing more than copying Gray's cicuit...but you're not.

Your coil at the bottom is connected to the + of a can and the - of another cap at the same time in addition to being tied to a point at a gap..that is three places.

Your claims are incorrect. Every circuit I have produces the plasma burst without the inductor...just more of your willingness to ignore the facts. How many times have I said that it makes the white plasma burst without the inductor and it is green with the inductor...you have some agenda here and it isn't about moving this thread forward.

You HAVE seen this as everyone else has but you insist on persisting with making false accusations against me and spreading misinformation about my circuit.

This below pic has been posted here for all to see months ago:

http://www.energeticforum.com/44188-post560.html

And every youtube vid of a plasma burst from my spark plugs, etc... are without inductors.

Here are some plasma burst with NO INDUCTOR that I have shown before...this is the second time I had to post this vid since it was taken down the first time. Watch the whole video.
YouTube - Water Sparkplug | Plasma Ignition| Booster Caps

[Electrotek]

Good work Mark! I'm impressed with the speed and professionalism of your replication effort. I'm looking forwards to your results, even though I'm not going to experiment in this area myself.

The fanning out of the arc that you mention is also what I've observed with my arc stretching experiments. I think this is an important effect.

[rave154]

Nice work Spokane & Ghst, i will be in the near future joining you in this replication as this thread is quickly becoming a classic.

keep up the good work :-)

Ahimsa,

David. D

[Spokane1]

Back to the Ghst Apparatus

Dear Forum Members,

I have compleated about an 85% reproduction of the proposed Holographic Appratus as disclosed and contributed by Mr. Ghst. My present circuit varies in that I am using brass threaded rod for the end connections of the spark gap array - it should be copper. Also I'm using 4" of a #2 HB pencil in lieu of the carbon fiber shaft. These variances will be corrected later this week end.

When the circuit is started up, at least in my version, small arcs are formed between the copper donuts and then quickly melt small channels in the nylon washers. After this, all arcing between the copper donuts takes place at these same locations. Therefore there are six fixed small arcs along the spark gap array during operation.

My pencil is aimed at one of these small arcs at a gap distance of 0.140". The voltage across the storage capacitor (5uF 5KV) was observed with a 3KV Electroscope. Storage capacitor discharges, in fresh air would take place starting at 1.8KV then the breakdown voltage would increase to 3KV over a period of 10 min. This implies that the atmosphere inside the plastic jar begins to increase its breakdown strength. Generally, the breakdown strength is reduced in a closed container when using metal electrodes. Perhaps the out-gassing of the nylon or the graphite is responsible for the observed breakdown increase?

What is interesting (at this point) is the large gap that this system is able to jump. Typically a 3KV potential will not strike between sharpened metal points as close as 0.015". In this experiment we are almost an order of magnitude greater than that. The nature of the discharge arc is also interesting in that it forms a triangular "Fan" that is as wide as the gap is long. I have not seen this kind of arc formation in a multidude of other HV experiments. It appears that the discharge wants to connect to at least three of the smaller arcs that are formed across the copper donut spark array at the same time. This suggests some intersting plasma dynamics.

A scope trace of the charging current through the ignition coil primary shows a peak of 6 Amps. The chopping frequency is 116 Hz. There is an abudance of EMI being produced that needs to be explored to see if it can be reduced through better shielding. It takes about 6 seconds to fully charge the storage capacitor.

This is a low energy shake down experiment running at 3KV max. Mr. Ghst reported his anamolous events at a voltage around 6KV or higher.

Setup photos and scope traces to follow.

Spokane1

[Electrotek]

I can power the coil by discharging into it from the front or I can power the coil by having the cap behind the load discharge from behind it toward the grid. In either case, they BOTH work, they give the same burst for the same equivelant charge, etc...

Yes, I can do the same thing. This falls under the realm of electrical equivalency. And I have also stated that "diode polarity doesn't matter".(edit) However, with the way I show the diode, electrons move against the arrow, so this IS the positive terminal of the power supply. (/edit) And where is my coil connected in three places? And my two capacitors are in fact tied to the same ground. (edit) None of your "differences" holds up. (/edit)

Your circuits that you've promoted use a LV capacitor. This Puff Spark circuit of yours uses a HV capacitor. (Like Gray's circuit.) And it will not produce a plasma burst without the inductor.

If you're never going to admit that the circuits are the same then we may as well drop the matter from this forum and move it to a different arena.

I don't see how I'll be able to post anything else of value to your forum. This deprives me of something of value.