HHO History repeats itself....

[Benjamin]

To all the HHO fans and true believers

I, like you, an assumption of course, spend a lot of time reading and doing research. I found this a few months ago and would like to share it with you. Maybe some of you who has been here longer then I have might of seen this already. But I would like to start my first thread in sharing the little bit of history with you.

Have a great day. And catch you soon.

Cheers

Benjamin

[jdodson]

Is it really from 1917? If so, thats amazing.

What are the current main stream excuses for not using hydrogen power?
I seen a clip on the news years ago about a japanese company that was producing a car that ran on water alone...never heard about it again.

[evolvingape]

Not quite that simple...

Hi,

I would encourage you to check the numbers in the article and see if they add up ? Also, consider what the metallurgical technology of the era was capable of in respect to ICE's and containing the explosive power and heat of HHO.

The system as described here is a ticking time bomb, you cannot safely store decomposed water as HHO under pressure, it must be created on demand and immediately used because it is a primary explosive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primary_explosive#Primary_explosive

Also look into thermolysis and the resultant ionised plasma generated:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_decomposition

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_%28physics%29

Air is not just Oxygen:

Composition of Air

Autoignition is also important as you cannot inject a primary explosive gas under pressure into an environment that is above the temperature required to ignite the gas, without a flashback. It is not the same as a Diesel engine where liquid droplets are injected and proceed to autoignite and phase change to gas, with the resultant volume change that drives the piston.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoignition

I would also suggest you consider how to use the high heat content generated from hydrogen and stop treating it as a waste product. The car radiator that works so hard to get rid of the heat and dissipate it into the atmosphere is wasting large amounts of energy, and therefore efficiency. Combination systems are the way forward, and when waste heat is taken into account all systems are 100% efficient in respect to energy in = energy out (not mechanical losses). Steam engines run because heat is used to cause phase change of the water from liquid to gas, providing a fluid that can be pressurised and used to do work, by controlling the volume, and therefore the pressure.

Internal combustion engine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sure there is suppression of these technologies taking place but they have received virtually zero investment, while alternatives such as gasoline have been very heavily funded. The Diesel engine killed off steam engines in the 60's for example, and these days all the funding goes towards hydrogen fuel cells and other easily controllable infrastructure required technologies like that, with fat grants for people to live very well on. On demand HHO research receives virtually nothing by comparison...

Hope that helps,

Rob

[doobie]

thats cool.
theres pics on Bedinis site where 1 of those old guys has his wireless invention going and next to it is a stack of magazines like that.

theres a site called hathi trust and they have all the old magazines copied from 1800s and early 1900s

[Benjamin]

Cheers...

Your right Rob, back then evrything started as a ticking time bomb

But it just goes to show us that it was feasable then and imagine with what we know today. As an engineer myself, I like to go back in time where inventors aproach a need with a different view, they where limited in there tools but some how found a way on the basis of what they knew to accomplish some very interesting inventions that we take for granted today.

I have a lot of the old books of the time and magazines, I find it a very interesting read. We sometimes over complicate things and forget to look at it with children eyes. Though we live in a complicated world today and simplicity is hard to crasp.

Most of my time these days is undestanding radiant energy and its apllications.

Good luck to you all,

Cheers

Benjamin

[wings]

exploding water see this:

Exploding Water 3 Dusk Update - YouTube

with piston

Exploding Water 4 - Driving a piston - YouTube

--------------

https://sites.google.com/site/aferlab/waterforfuel

http://www.conspiracyoflight.com/waterarc/waterarc.html

water explosion efficiency:

Water Arc Explosion Experiment

[wings]

exploding water see this:

Exploding Water 3 Dusk Update - YouTube

with piston

Exploding Water 4 - Driving a piston - YouTube

--------------

https://sites.google.com/site/aferlab/waterforfuel

http://www.conspiracyoflight.com/waterarc/waterarc.html

water explosion efficiency:

Water Arc Explosion Experiment

.... in order to correctly measure the energy developed it should take into account the pressure that is released into the atmosphere after the bullet is out of the container

[evolvingape]

It is not a feasible system as described

Hi Benjamin,

You seem like a nice fellow and I don't want to upset you, but that article is a non starter for many reasons. I am not a non believer in the potential of HHO for power generation, but we have to be sensible about this, and a bomb in a car is not sensible, or feasible.

Rob

[Benjamin]

Thank you for sharing Rob, Have a great day.

[jdodson]

and a bomb in a car is not sensible, or feasible.

So what exactly do you call a tank full of gas?
Anything that drives a piston must ignite and explode.
Any which fuel that needs to exlpode must be stored in large quantity.
Every tank of gas is a bomb.

So instead od dismissing the idea as not being feasible, what such an explosive fuel would need is extra protection. I'm much more in favor of zero point electrical systems but anything is better than burning dead dinosaurs with our current cave man technology.

[jdodson]

Obviously any potiential in this technology would be surpressed. It is essentially free energy. We are talking about a bottle of water being a bottle of energy. Source of life so they say.

Autoignition is also important as you cannot inject a primary explosive gas under pressure into an environment that is above the temperature required to ignite the gas, without a flashback.

Did you know you can walk across burning hot coals with your bare feet and not get a single burn on your skin? Know why? Do you know lighters explode? Yet people hold them in theyre hand...The most dangerous devices and substances in the world are only dangerous if not properly controlled or protected.

Motors can be engineered with continous collant being supplied to keep core temperatures from reaching specific thresholds.

The system as described here is a ticking time bomb, you cannot safely store decomposed water as HHO under pressure, it must be created on demand and immediately used because it is a primary explosive:

So two thought that come to my mind would be
1. Basically store less than half a gallon tank as an intermediate storage point. Keep plain water in the main large 20 gallon tank, use the electrolsis process to seperate the gas then combine the correct ratio and supply the intermediate tank as it is being used. Therefore no large amount would need be required. Obviously the smaller tank would need serious protection and couldnt be strapped to the bottom of the car like a regular can of gas. Using magnetic configuration the tank could internally be suspended in mid air as an ultimate shock absorber.

2. Could it be possible to compress the gases seperately and inject them at the correct ratio for ignition without needing to store the compressed oxyhydrogen mixture at all.

Its not as if we are talking about harnessing the core power of a nuclear reaction, we are only talking about harnessing the power of burning a gas. It only needs to be strongly protected.

Also why is this technology not used to supply power to the electrical grid?
You dont actually think they cant figure out a safe way to burn a gas in a factory do you?
Last i checked we just landed a roving scientific labratory on mars...

[Benjamin]

lithium-6 deuteride

Actually the military use hydride to store Hydrogen in there thermonuclear weapons, making them safe to handle before we blow them up

This product is not dangerous in itself, but since it’s classified as military product and used for weapons, it’s illegal to buy, unless you’re a qualified weapons builder.

Here is a few links. Have a good read.

Lithium hydride - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Bob Lazar"s Hydrogen Corvette - YouTube

Cheers

Benjamin

[doobie]

it would be safe as houses if it had an implosion mechanism on the tank

itd be like "whoa...whered that explosion go?"

[Duncan]

The sad history and lets hope a bright future ..

Before bleating about feasibility and safety read the original article, if the figures stack up then only a very small amount of hydrogen is actually stored for “starting and emergences” In operation supply as demanded seems to be the order of the day …. much safer than 10 gallons of petrol sloshing about I would assume. Even if a storage system should be required .in a domestic situation it could be made safe and break the energy strangle hold.
It isn’t that it hasn't been done or that it isn’t being used even now on a huge scale …. It is It just isn't going to be put in the public domain.
Consider this simple experiment VTS_03_1.flv - YouTube
Here is Santilli himself demonstrating a slightly larger version of this system... take careful note it is not for use by the shee-people milch cows Alternative fuel Magnegas - YouTube
however this relatively simple and very efficient method of water fracturing has been known about for many years here's a 1898 patent basically describing the same system for domestic use http://www.byronwine.com/files/603,058.pdf this same basic system was developed into a “fuel on demand” by a South African called François Cornish, In order to counter the looming fuel embargo on South Africa, François was tempted to North America in order “to develop” his system, François
joins the ever growing list of “Disappeared” energy researchers Cornish Hydrogen Generator - KeelyNet 01/10/02

Here are a few more videos I uploaded a while ago concerning other methods of fracturing water which are far more efficient than Faraday

https://vimeo.com/user10549783/herman

also note how Bob Boyce addresses the explosion threat previously mentioned on the thread with a series “bubblers” Note Bob is already well over Faraday,
As Bob describes the initial history of how he stumbled on the frequency relationship involving an alternator with a blown Diode that would be effectively a three to one relationship.
Another member on this forum MJN ran a prototype Jet engine on fractured water before being “visited” here he amplifies on this 3xF relationship http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...tml#post111774

Note all these guys Puharich, M.J.N, Stan Mayer, John Kansus Saltwater Engine - YouTube are all either Radio Hams or skilled at RF UHF frequencies (and mixing them) …. this is of course significant.
Here's Puharich talking Tesla … ouch https://vimeo.com/4935037 and as another who “fractured” water here he is lecturing Energy From H2O Resonance - YouTube ….. Its a fascinating subject !
Its a shame so many have been murdered,maimed, threatened and “disappeared” over this system alone.
Opie & Anthony: Stan Meyer's Water Car - YouTube ... I hope I live to see the effects of heterodyning sympathetic frequencies pushed into the public arena, not only for fracturing water but also for medical use just as Rife was doing after all breaking light or Viruses, glass, or water its all the same basic Technology
watch Ella do it at the start of this video How Royal Raymond Rife CURED CANCER - YouTube
It would certainly indicate that we are at last coming out of the “dark age”

[bhaas]

He also said in that article the he separated the oxy/hyd, stored the hyd and liberated the oxygen.
Hydrogen stored by itself will not explode cause it needs oxy. No oxy, no bomb on board.

Brad