Bedini Earth Light

[Lidmotor]

Charge pump

@Lidmotor,
You going to give it a try?... Chuck and I also found that circuit and had to change all kind of things. But you get the basic Idea of how it works. It took a while to lay it all out. LM in the diagram does not give the gain of the devices But I have gone by the factory diagram. To do it right I would need a real chip. The 2n2222 worked better then the 2n3904 and the switch worked with the MPS A18 the 2N3906 was fine.
John B

I don't know maybe I will give it a try. The more that I looked at the circuit the more it made sense. I looked at the chip spec sheet at the Futurlec company link that still sells them (the chip is only about $3) and they say that it will blink an LED for 6 months on a AA alkaline.

Lidmotor

[chuck H]

Lm3909

I don't know maybe I will give it a try. The more that I looked at the circuit the more it made sense. I looked at the chip spec sheet at the Futurlec company link that still sells them (the chip is only about $3) and they say that it will blink an LED for 6 months on a AA alkaline.

Lidmotor

@ Lidmotor, John is correct on this circuit. You want all 1% resistors in it. It was a real BEAR to tune. I spent 2 days on it then John made a different variation with it and we added the A13 and it starts every time. You have to really tune this as it will latch on start until the cap is full then you have to restart it. The key is knowing the impediance of the cell or battery and then the impediance of the load you want to run. The $3 chip may not work on all the batteries or loads you may want to use. Thats why this was made discreet to do what we want with it.

[plengo]

I have two good news. One is that my last cell that uses Carbon + Sand + Mg with Sodium Silicate and Iron Pyrite works as a beauty.

The iron pyrite seems to stop the corrosion on the Mg (you can see the construction on my last video Cell 17 , 18).

I know that because I created a test cell using Mg plate tin as .08mm for one week and no signs of corrosion at all. It does create an oxidation layer where Iron Pyrite does touches the Mg but that's all. It comes out good power and no need for Alum either.

The second good news is that this cell LOVES water. It does not "drown" like the other ones, so the capilar effect will work as a charm without having to worry about controlling the level of the water going in.

I know that because (again you can see the test cell on my video) I created a cell with an extra cup with water and a little tube that feeds the cell as it needs via gravity. Somehow the lack of Alum and the presence of Iron pyrite makes the cell a little happy fish cell. It loves it.

Fausto.

[Lidmotor]

Difficult circuit

@ Lidmotor, John is correct on this circuit. You want all 1% resistors in it. It was a real BEAR to tune. I spent 2 days on it then John made a different variation with it and we added the A13 and it starts every time. You have to really tune this as it will latch on start until the cap is full then you have to restart it. The key is knowing the impediance of the cell or battery and then the impediance of the load you want to run. The $3 chip may not work on all the batteries or loads you may want to use. Thats why this was made discreet to do what we want with it.

Thanks Chuck
The more and more that I looked at this it seems that it was going to eat up alot of time (like you mentioned) to get it working right. I found a couple of simple "charge pump" circuits that are a little easier that might work down into the "ultra low" power range. Hard to say until I try them.

The LM3909 chip doesn't look like much of an advantage over my "Penny" oscillator right now. She is going to be hard to beat. It starts up at around 1 uA and .45v. I got it to run (finally) off ambient RF using an antenna and an earth ground wire. It took a combination of caps and 1N914 switching diodes. I have been trying to do that for months and what I was missing was an AC cap on the antenna feed circuit. Somebody on Youtube helped me out. Perhap I can combine this with the crystal cell and get more power. Either series it or put them in parallel.

Lidmotor

[jehdds]

Thanks Chuck
The more and more that I looked at this it seems that it was going to eat up alot of time (like you mentioned) to get it working right. I found a couple of simple "charge pump" circuits that are a little easier that might work down into the "ultra low" power range. Hard to say until I try them.

The LM3909 chip doesn't look like much of an advantage over my "Penny" oscillator right now. She is going to be hard to beat. It starts up at around 1 uA and .45v. I got it to run (finally) off ambient RF using an antenna and an earth ground wire. It took a combination of caps and 1N914 switching diodes. I have been trying to do that for months and what I was missing was an AC cap on the antenna feed circuit. Somebody on Youtube helped me out. Perhap I can combine this with the crystal cell and get more power. Either series it or put them in parallel.

Lidmotor

Dear Lidmotor,
Could you elaborate on the diode placement etc.
Great Job.
Jim

[b_rads]

@lidmotor:
Last spring, I purchased a couple of LM3909 IC’s and tried to get some of our homemade cells to drive it without luck. I went with the circuit shown on the datasheet using the lower voltage red LED and tried different types of cells in parallel and serial. It was a learning experience though to actually see how different cap values would change the blink rate. While I did not get 6 months out of a AA battery, it does last a very long time and the blink rate did not seem to influence how long the battery lasted. Thank you for showing us your low power circuits, as you already know, I am a big fan of those circuits.

@NickZ:
A while back I made a gravity battery that is still running and has been terrific fun. Search wikipedia for gravity battery. Also, nurdrage has a very nice video on youtube. It is not necessary to use the zinc sulphate as he shows as the cell will make its own, just takes a little longer. It is extremely cheap to build and quite a workhorse. Here in the US, pennies minted after 1982 contain approx 97% zinc. I rough up some pennies, place them in the cell and it runs the oscillators very well. You were wise to point out the Daniell Cell as history of the battery development is very important if one is to exceed what is currently available.

[plengo]

Guys, i dont know how express this better. Iron Pyrite simply is magical.

It reversed the corrossion process and allows the cell to love water without loosing any power the opposite.

In the end just add very diluted alum, about 1ml, to the already wet cell for a boost in power.

Please, someone try it.

Fausto.

[cgalvisardila]

Plengo, im gonna try this right now, ive had good results with pyrite myself, just havent tried it this way before... ill let you know how it goes...cheers

[NickZ]

Brad:
The Daniell Cell idea was related to me by SeaMonkey, in another forum, and I thought that it would come in handy here, right about now.
The idea is that you use a double electrolyte, with the second one, feeding from the waist gases of the first. Thus the problem of the build up of gases is dealt with to some extent. This was done to avoid a depolariser. But, if we use a depolarizer or not, at least the idea of how the gases need to be removed were known, even then, or there would to be problem with the cells output if that issue was not dealt with.

[plengo]

One supporting evidence of my claim above is that when i add water to the test cell with the .08mm tick Mg plate, its voltage and current comes back to the same as day one.

As water is gone power goes down.

Usually, on previous similar tests, the cell lower its power output as the Mg gets corroded.

Fausto.

[jehdds]

One supporting evidence of my claim above is that when i add water to the test cell with the .08mm tick Mg plate, its voltage and current comes back to the same as day one.

As water is gone power goes down.

Usually, on previous similar tests, the cell lower its power output as the Mg gets corroded.

Fausto.

Fausto,
Are you seeing the Iron Pyrite being consumed or converted?
Great work on your tests. Always good to carve new paths.
Jim

[John_Bedini]

Iron Pyrite/LM3909

@ All,
First let me address the LM3909 chip problem @b Rads. The LM 3909 charge pump oscillator, that chip requires about 70 Ma to run correctly as I have been analyzing it. It actually was designed for D cell operation. It was stated in the 70 to 80 that in some way it was magical. Let me just say it was. If you study the chip and do a little analyses you will find the reason it ran so long was it returned the unused voltage to the carbon zinc battery. I could understand why it did not run on your crystal cells as The impedance of the cell is not enough to supply the power required.
However when you build this discreet you can get this to work in the Microvolt range because we have done that. You can not unfortunately get into the chip so you can not adjust those parameters. The crystal cells have a very high impedance so the circuit that charges the capacitor must be changed to accommodate that. The switching part is a piece of cake and the gain must be chosen in-between the highs and the lowest for it to perform right. My statement is that we have one running for two days now at 2Ma and the crystal cells stay charged as it is possible to charge them backwards.

@Fausto
Yes what your saying is totally correct about Iron Pyrite. it does protect the Magnesium as I have seen the same thing as you.It under examination does plate a very strange layer on the Magnesium. The more you can add the better. I just want to let you know Fausto that we have some of those cell running right now and what your saying is correct.The combination of Pyrite and Mn2/03 works very good together. I will try the carbon pole with this mix next week.
John B

[plengo]

Fausto,
Are you seeing the Iron Pyrite being consumed or converted?
Great work on your tests. Always good to carve new paths.
Jim

Jim, I don't think it is being corroded BUT i have not vindicated a method to empirically test that yet.

For the Mg I do have a method and it works very fast and well.

Subjectively speaking, I think the iron pyrite is not corroded at all.

Fausto.

[plengo]

@ All,
@Fausto
Yes what your saying is totally correct about Iron Pyrite. it does protect the Magnesium as I have seen the same thing as you.It under examination does plate a very strange layer on the Magnesium. The more you can add the better. I just want to let you know Fausto that we have some of those cell running right now and what your saying is correct.The combination of Pyrite and Mn2/03 works very good together. I will try the carbon pole with this mix next week.
John B

Thank you John and Chuck for the try.

Fausto.

[jehdds]

Jim, I don't think it is being corroded BUT i have not vindicated a method to empirically test that yet.

For the Mg I do have a method and it works very fast and well.

Subjectively speaking, I think the iron pyrite is not corroded at all.

Fausto.

Fausto,
Again thank you for your great work.
Here is something I ran across I bet Lidmotor will find this interesting!
Iron Pyrites RF Oscillator.
Very best regards,
Jim
PS pyrite is reactive to water and has been noted to be a no no for structural aggregate constituent for structural slabs etc..... So what is negative in one use may provide a benefit for this use!
Molecular dynamics simulation of water in a contact with an iron pyrite FeS2 surface
Acid Mine Drainage, the Unseen Enemy

Step one: The pyrite oxidizes upon contact with air and water.

1) Fe+2 + 1/4 O2 + H+ --> Fe+3 +1/2 H2O

Step two: Iron oxidizes to ferric iron

2) FeS2 + 7/2 O2 + H2O --> 2SO4-2 + Fe+2 + 2H+

Step three: Precipitation occurs with ferric iron to ferric hydroxide.

3) Fe+3 + 3H2O --> Fe(OH)3 + 3H+

Step four: All combined to show a full formation of sulfuric acid

4) FeS2 + 15/4 O2 + 7/2 H2O --> 2H2SO4 + Fe(OH)3 4