Desulphating batts. w/ bedini type method

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, I have a couple of old 12V, 7A.H. lead acid gel and they can only hold about 9 volts, I've tried the flyback pulsing but it overvoltages instantly although at lower inputs it doesnt over volt so quickly but still doesnt seem to be raising and holding the voltage or rejuvenating or de-sulphating these batteries, has anyone had much luck reviving batteries that are apparently this sulphated or has anyone used Bedinis methods to actually revive old unused lead acids. If so, I'd like to know what methods or procedures are used so I can as well. Any info appreciated, thanks.
peace love light

[Hoppy]

Hi folks, I have a couple of old 12V, 7A.H. lead acid gel and they can only hold about 9 volts, I've tried the flyback pulsing but it overvoltages instantly although at lower inputs it doesnt over volt so quickly but still doesnt seem to be raising and holding the voltage or rejuvenating or de-sulphating these batteries, has anyone had much luck reviving batteries that are apparently this sulphated or has anyone used Bedinis methods to actually revive old unused lead acids. If so, I'd like to know what methods or procedures are used so I can as well. Any info appreciated, thanks.
peace love light

Hi SkyWatcher

If the batteries have not been left too long in a discharged state, conditioning can restore some capacity to gel cells. The method I use is to discharge the battery right down to a volt a two and then connect to a Bedini SG wheel energsier straight away. Once fully charged, continue to discharge (down to 10.5V) and recharge and the battery should improve in capacity over a few charge / discharge cycles. The down side is that this process can take a long, long time and a lot of energy is used in the process, so I no longer bother to restore small SLA batteries unless they are quite new and have been left discharged for a short period of time. Old used SLA batteries which have been laying discharged for many months are very difficult if not impossible to restore.

Hoppy

[citfta]

Hi Skywatcher,
I have also restored several old 7 AH 12 volt batteries using my SSG. I have found that sometimes if the sulphation is really bad then I have to connect a large value capacitor in parallel with the charging battery. A capacitor of 10,000 uf or so with a voltage rating of at least 50 volts should do the trick. After a couple of charge - discharge cycles you should be able to charge the battery without the capacitor. As Hoppy said you will spend a lot of time trying to restore these batteries. And if they were abused by overcharging with a conventional charger then the gel may have been dried out. If this is the case then they cannot be restored. Hope this helps,
Citfta

[Tecstatic]

Hi,

Here is my 2 cents.

I have a relatively new 12V 7,2 Ah SLA from an emergency power supply.

One cell dried out, and I could not recharge it, normally or solid state SSG.

I took off the lid plate, one of the pressure security caps was released. I removed all caps and used a syringe to refil 10ml distilled water in each cell. Later I added 5ml more.

After the third charge with the SSG for one hour it seems normal again. I use it for my PCB drill. I have not been through a complete discharge cycle yet, as I just used it for the drill.

Before rejuvenating it could run the drill for 45 seconds after a "full" charge.

I don't know if it is that significant, as this is the only Bedini circuit I have built. I use a 4 bifilar 100ft wire "mirrored" circuit with a PNP instead of a NPN, and an open laminated iron core from a large CFL choke. Only the two extra wires of the 4 do charge the battery.

I use the FTZ953 high bandwidth PNP transistor in surface mount version. It runs with a heat sink of thin brass foil 20 x 60 mm, 4 degrees C above room temperature, not hot at all. Consumption while charging is12V, 470mA.

It rejuvenated NiCd batteries discarded 12 years ago to above spec capacity in 6 cycles.
the first being only one minute duration. the last a little more than 1 hour.

It has the disadvantage that it "squeals like a pig", It is apparently not that loud, but it is very unpleasant, probably some high frequencies. I wear a protective headset to avoid pain in the ears when using it .

Eric

[Aaron]

1AU - Universal Charger

I have rejuvenated SLA's that have sit around for 5 to 10 years. In the past couple weeks, I've rejuvenated about 7-8 of them. 3 I can't get to charge so that is pretty good #'s. As long as the SLA's don't have a shorted cell or are dried out, you can bring them back pretty good.

I've done this with my own Bedini circuits but the recent tests were all done with a 1AU charger.

1AU - Universal Charger

[Shamus]

I've got an old 12V UPS gel cell (actually, it's just two 6V cells connected in series) that was pretty abused. I tried connecting the battery directly to my SSG but the impedance of the thing was so high that the neons were on pretty much continuously (spot checks showed it sitting around 25V or so almost immediately after starting the SSG--not good!). Also, even though the battery shows 10.5V it immediately dives down to zero when you attempt to put a load on such as a 12V automotive taillight. This thing is dead, dead, dead.

I'm going to try the capacitor method outlined above and if that doesn't work, see if I can find some way to unseal this bad boy and put some distilled water back in. Will post results either way the outcome goes.

My experience with NiCads is that they charge very well with the SSG; I can charge up the 4.5V battery in my cordless phone in half an hour. No memory effect at all. I really need to go get a bunch of these so I can stop feeding 1.5V/9V cells to the trash. I think it's ridiculous that this type of charging isn't more widespread in the stuff we use everyday as it would reduce waste to almost nil. But then again, the economic system (i.e., system of slavery) in which we live would come to a grinding halt if people didn't have to buy stuff like this anymore.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, thanks for replies. Ok I hooked up one of the SLA's to a 12v tail bulb and it lights it starting at 5.8volts and its rising now to 6.42 volts, strange. Thought I would drain it down to a couple of volts then use solid state collapse method (flyback).
Citfta: Do you mean just connect the cap in parallel as a buffer type setup in combination with high voltage spikes or cap dump. thanks.
Also can we really just add distilled water to these gel cells, if we can get them open, If a cell needs more fluid.
well 10 minutes went by and the batt. is up to 6.5 volts while discharging into a 12v tail bulb. Ok now after 15 minutes the batt. is slowly dropping below 6.5 volts. odd behaviour maybe.
your comments.
peace love light

[citfta]

Hello again Skywatcher

Yes I meant to just connect the capacitor in parallel as a buffer. This just seems to help keep down the flashing of the neon. I think what is happening is the radiant energy is being converted be the cap into regular energy and some of the pulses are still getting through to help with the desulphation process. I think Aaron has worked with the cap pulser circuit so he may be able to help you with that idea. As far as prying the top off and adding distilled water I haven't tried that either but it sure sounds like a good idea. I'll try that on my next stubborn battery. See ya, Citfta

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, well it took 60 minutes to bring the loaded voltage down to 2.5 volts with the tail light bulb and after an hour is sitting at 7.77 volts unloaded. Now time to try charging it again.

[Tecstatic]

Just one thing if you add distilled water to a SLA battery.

Don't overfill the cell and allow time for the water to "suck" into the electrolyte gel/fabric, looking into the cell you maybe can see when the gel/fabric is saturated, no additional free water when done!. Maybe 1 or two add-ups is necessary. Keep track of how much you add so you don't have to repeat an error in case you added too much.

Remember the battery is then not sealed anymore.

Do not experiment gluing the security caps back on. If your glue is stronger than the original glue, you risk an explosion.

Eric

[Shamus]

Putting a cap (10K uF, 100V) in parallel with the battery seemed to do the trick this time--at least it seemed to take some charge. It remains to be seen, though, whether or not this battery will come back all the way. Interestingly enough at first the voltage of the cap/battery combo was sitting at around 70V but after about 9 hours or so it had dropped down to 18V. A good sign.

After I took it off the charger it was sitting at around 15-14V (and dropping, as it usually does) but this time it was able to power a 12V tail light for some minutes. It dropped down to 3V under load, but this is progress! The filament was glowing somewhat dimly, but it was glowing *and* it held the voltage for a while where before it would just go to zero under load.

[patmac]

citfa

Hi, you're right I've a 4aH SLA battery without success is near to be impossible.

I've another 2.5aH no work,removed the cap to see the cells, the problem with SLA batt is that the plates is very near one to another. Then in the process to charging them, generates many bubbles, this bubble over sulphates the plates, avoiding the contact with the eletrolyte this is a mess with this batteries. The solution in my concept is use the process to recovert them to alkaline. Or well using epsom salts to remove the sulphate but shorting his life.

[SkyWatcher]

Good results with the cap in parallel method

Hi folks, I almost forgot i had this thread, I wanted to let folks know that this method of putting a cap parallel to the battery works great the question is why does it work so well, is there a resonance happening to get the battery into the proper voltage range so quickly, My battery was dead, 0 volts on any load and without a cap in parallel I dont think I could have brought it back, im using a 2400 uf,450V polarized cap. This is the quote from earlier in this thread "Hi Skywatcher,
I have also restored several old 7 AH 12 volt batteries using my SSG. I have found that sometimes if the sulphation is really bad then I have to connect a large value capacitor in parallel with the charging battery. A capacitor of 10,000 uf or so with a voltage rating of at least 50 volts should do the trick. After a couple of charge - discharge cycles you should be able to charge the battery without the capacitor. As Hoppy said you will spend a lot of time trying to restore these batteries. And if they were abused by overcharging with a conventional charger then the gel may have been dried out. If this is the case then they cannot be restored. Hope this helps,
Citfta."
So my question to you folks, any ideas why this works so well. The answers may shed light on this radiant energy stuff.
peace love light
Tyson

[Web000x]

Hi folks, I almost forgot i had this thread, I wanted to let folks know that this method of putting a cap parallel to the battery works great the question is why does it work so well, is there a resonance happening to get the battery into the proper voltage range so quickly, My battery was dead, 0 volts on any load and without a cap in parallel I dont think I could have brought it back, im using a 2400 uf,450V polarized cap. This is the quote from earlier in this thread "Hi Skywatcher,
I have also restored several old 7 AH 12 volt batteries using my SSG. I have found that sometimes if the sulphation is really bad then I have to connect a large value capacitor in parallel with the charging battery. A capacitor of 10,000 uf or so with a voltage rating of at least 50 volts should do the trick. After a couple of charge - discharge cycles you should be able to charge the battery without the capacitor. As Hoppy said you will spend a lot of time trying to restore these batteries. And if they were abused by overcharging with a conventional charger then the gel may have been dried out. If this is the case then they cannot be restored. Hope this helps,
Citfta."
So my question to you folks, any ideas why this works so well. The answers may shed light on this radiant energy stuff.
peace love light
Tyson

SkyWatcher,

Remember that radiant energy moves as an incompressible gas under pressure. It sounds like the impedance of your battery was too high to allow this gas to permeate.

The capacitor in parallel with the battery acts as an overflow reservoir for the radiant energy. Just think of the capacitor as a balloon filled with energy. It fills up with energy, and then it discharges the energy across the battery. This way, you will get as much radiant energy as possible from your configurations because you have somewhere to temporarily store this large amount of radiant energy that cannot "fit" into the battery.

Hope that helps

[sucahyo]

Adding 10000uF/50V to my radiant charger increase charging time from 7 hour to 3 hour. But it seems to hold less charge. Maybe capacitor reduce the effect of the spike and make the charger behave more like normal charger?