Bedini Capacitive Discharge Chargers

[twinbeard]

Cap Pulser update

Hi All,

I took the opportunity to put the cap pulser circuit on a scope and watch for a while. I have found that the circuit, as diagrammed, works properly. I changed the cap value to 1000mF @30V. I also changed to a 12.1V zener. I may fool with that a bit more. It works pretty well, giving a stairstepped sawtooth wave across the cap, but only on a reasonably good battery. See attached scopeshot. A battery in bad shape gives a waveform that looks like ringing spikes that only vary by a volt or so.


Good battery:


Not so good battery:


Notice in particular the voltage scale of the two traces... 5V/div vs .2V/div!



Enjoy,
Twinbeard

[twinbeard]

I could have bought one of these 1 farad audio capacitors for $99.95 a couple
months back. Does anyone know if that is a good price for one of those ?

George

That price is a little high.

Hi geotron,

My experience with that kind of circuit is not too good. What happened for me was when the cap got charged high enough to turn on the zener the zener just starts to turn on. This turns on the transistor but not fully on. The transistor conducts just enough to keep the cap at a level that just keeps the zener barely turned on and thus you reach a stable condition which is just charging the battery the same as without the pulsing circuit. I have been meaning to order some diacs. The diac has full on or full off kinda snap action. I think with a diac in series with the zener this would be a good circuit. I haven't tried that yet so I could be wrong about how well that would work.

Later,
Carroll

citfta,

In the past I've found much the same results as you've indicated with
using Schottky diodes, although what I've not found yet is how the transistor
or SCR would react when the potentiometer is such that it will only let through
sufficient current to turn on the Base or Gate when the Schottky diode is fully
open.

Perhaps the voltage of the charging capacitor would pass through the
potentiometer and meet with the Schottky until it is 90% open, and only
then would there be sufficient current to open the transistor. ??

Other than this, and the diac, there seems to be one other method
utilizing an op-amp.

[ The Schmitt Trigger ]

[ Schmitt's Comparator Circuit ]

[ Google Search - Schmitt Trigger ]

[FRC]

Cap

In the dvd I saw him (Mr. Bedini) using those huge electrolytic capacitors with one of the models with mechanical comutator. These capacitors looked like those used for car audio systems. They are rated 1-3 farads and 24V max. If I recall it correctly, he used two of them in series. So we can assume he never went over the 48V at least with that small model.

I could have bought one of these 1 farad audio capacitors for $99.95 a couple
months back. Does anyone know if that is a good price for one of those ?

George

[citfta]

Hi geotron,

My experience with that kind of circuit is not too good. What happened for me was when the cap got charged high enough to turn on the zener the zener just starts to turn on. This turns on the transistor but not fully on. The transistor conducts just enough to keep the cap at a level that just keeps the zener barely turned on and thus you reach a stable condition which is just charging the battery the same as without the pulsing circuit. I have been meaning to order some diacs. The diac has full on or full off kinda snap action. I think with a diac in series with the zener this would be a good circuit. I haven't tried that yet so I could be wrong about how well that would work.

Later,
Carroll

How might this perform? The recovery capacitor voltage would
likely be around normal 16V battery charging level.

[twinbeard]

This setup is giving negative and positive charge?
Zener Diode maybe should open at 18v to batteries what do yoy think?
Thanks

It looks to me that while some of the spike may discharge into the charge battery positive terminal, most of it is going into the cap, which then gets discharged across the charging battery.

Probably closer to 20V I think, as the SCR needs 1.7V to begin conducting by itself.

Any opinions on these caps... say 4 in series for .25F @20VDC?
PB Series, Supercapacitors, Low ESR,

Enjoy
Twinbeard

[rescoalabama]

cap charging

Bedini Cap Charger discussion. The chargers with with bridge to cap setup. Can be with mechanical pulley switch setup, 555 timer switch, neon bulb switch, etc... With rotor or self-oscillating.

I am new to this site but i like what i have been reading, i have been working on cordless battery charger using a capacitor charging circuit of mine which charges really fast, the voltage input from the cap is controlled by the switch speed of a 555 pulse timer. My question is there a way to split the charge voltage and direct some of it back into the storage devise with greater output
at the same time.

[Guruji]

Negative and positive charge

Just watch your voltage and power dissipation ratings on the components you choose.
I may wind up updating that circuit... not sure until I put the scope on the cap pulser to see if it is dumping properly. From what I see on the multimeter, it looks like the SCR is getting stuck open. Perhaps a larger cap bank, more closely matched to the voltage I am working with...

Enjoy

This setup is giving negative and positive charge?
Zener Diode maybe should open at 18v to batteries what do yoy think?
Thanks

[twinbeard]

Good job mate May I know the input current and maybe try with a solar as well???


totoalas

Input current looks like about 200ma with the rheostat pegged at 500 ohms, 375ma at the tuning "sweetspot," and a little over an amp with the rheostat zeroed, so only 50 ohms to the base from the fixed resistor in that instance. The latter drives the fan FAST. The fan is rated with the factory circuit as drawing 2.3A @12V, btw.

Enjoy,
Twinbeard

[twinbeard]

Thanks Twinbeard for sharing. Do you think if I use another SCR and zener will work too?
Thanks.

Just watch your voltage and power dissipation ratings on the components you choose.
I may wind up updating that circuit... not sure until I put the scope on the cap pulser to see if it is dumping properly. From what I see on the multimeter, it looks like the SCR is getting stuck open. Perhaps a larger cap bank, more closely matched to the voltage I am working with...

Enjoy

[totoalas]

I did, in a form and fashion. See image for the circuit I wound up using. This charges a 12V 7AH like a madman.

Good job mate May I know the input current and maybe try with a solar as well???


totoalas

[Guruji]

Scr

I did, in a form and fashion. See image for the circuit I wound up using. This charges a 12V 7AH like a madman.

Thanks Twinbeard for sharing. Do you think if I use another SCR and zener will work too?
Thanks.

[twinbeard]

try this one.

I did, in a form and fashion. See image for the circuit I wound up using. This charges a 12V 7AH like a madman.

Besides the vast storage capacity of a 12V Lead battery, it does not seem
apparent to me why these should be used as the source and destination of
electrical charge when building these motors.

With heavy capacitors in their place, it would seem this technology would
not require a reconditioning and restructuring of the storage medium, yes?

Then additionally, what about the alkaline energy storage cell developed by
Thomas Edison?