3 Battery Generating System

[Turion]

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[garrypm]

Hi Dave,

Hope you had a look at the link I posted in tesla switch.

Garry

[FRC]

Hi Dave, I did a second attempt since I posted on the Lockridge thread. This
time I used the small motor instead of the larger one I used the first time. Now
the bad battery went to zero volts instead of rising. More interesting results
the first time. Will try again.

George

[FRC]

Replication success

Replication success or kind of. This time I used a third much smaller sla for the
bad battery. I observed everything that you have described and shown in your
videos, load on bad battery speeds up motor, load on motor increases bad battery output, etc. The hard part seems to be finding the right "bad battery".
Could there be some way to replace this part of the system ? Capacitor bank ?
Or some kind of circuit, maybe attached to another good battery ? I think you
have something more here than what someone claimed at Overunity.com that
it was just the arcing or sparking of the motor brushes causing this. I think
this might turn out to be an important discovery if the bugs can be ironed out
so that it will work on a consistent basis. Thanks for telling us about it Dave.

George

[FRC]

Turion

I checked out Garrypm's Tesla thread link to the tinman's L.A.G. motor. He seems to be getting similar results when in oscillation mode. I think he is using three good batteries. He claims that you can not do this with a regular off the shelf motor.without major modifications. But you have proved him wrong. An off the shelf motor does work here. Have you tried this with three good batteries ? Or will it not work that way ?

George

[FRC]

Another question

Dave have you tried charging a fourth good battery as a load on the bad battery ? I think you would have to use diodes or a FWBR.

George

[Turion]

I have hooked a chargeable battery to the third battery in parallel, and got the fourth battery to charge. If you put a good battery in the third position it doesn't seem to work. But at this point I will try anything, and am documenting EVERYTHING with video. I have also hooked FOUR batteries in series with the bad battery and another battery I wanted to charge also in series (reversed) with the bad battery, so that I had the voltage differential. Since my motor is rated from 12-110 volts, it just ran faster. I have put SIX batteries in series vs two reversed, and the motor REALLY runs off that higher voltage, plus the six batteries easily run loads and recover quickly from the little draw down. I think it helps that the motor is spinning faster with these higher voltages. There is just a lot of experimenting that needs to be done with this.

Here is the link that was mentioned:
The L.A.G new circuit_strange scope shot 2.flv - YouTube

I DON'T agree that this can't be done with an off the shelf motor, because I know for a FACT it can, but then again, everyone's setup is different, so what I have seen may not apply to what someone else has going.

I have been seriously thinking about combining a motor in line with Matt's Tesla Switch on the Use For The Tesla Switch forum, so that when two batteries in series are connected to one, they are always passing through the motor to get there.

Again, we are just scratching the surface, which is why I posted here. We need more people messing with this and it is NOT some big expensive thing to set up, at least not for people who are already experimenting and probably have ALL this stuff lying around in their shops...except perhaps the "right" bad battery. And YES the bad battery seems to be the critical part of the equation.

I am experimenting with the one I have, so I will discuss that here a bit. I have a 7.5 amp hour "bad" battery. When I connected it to the motor, the motor didn't start immediately, but within a minute or two it started up. Voltage went down to 18 and motor started. Voltage went down to 13 and leveled off. It never dropped to 9 and shut the system down. I put metal filings in two of the cells on the battery, waited overnight, and repeated the experiment. The motor didn't start right away, which means adding filings destroyed that "alignment" inside the battery I talked about. And it took longer before the motor would start up...about 5 minutes. I put metal filings in two more cells and repeated. Again, the motor wouldn't start right up and this time it took 9 minutes before the motor kicked on. I ran out of metal filings, and am sawing things up with a hack saw to get some more. But my bench vise is stripped, so I had to get a new one (yesterday) so will continue in this mode to see what happens and report.

David

[wrtner]

Your three battery idea reminds me of this:
THE TESLA SWITCH

[Turion]

wrtner,

That is the diagram I saw four years ago, and what got me started down this road. The difference here is that this circuit requires you to rotate the position of the batteries. I'm saying that IF you have the right setup, you don't have to do that. IF you have the right bad battery and IF you balance the load on battery three with the load on the motor, you get some really, really interesting results. I'm not claiming to have invented this circuit. I'm just saying that people need to put some bad batteries in the third position and see what they see.

Think about this. It has already been proven that when you pass voltage from a higher source through a load to the lower source, almost none of that voltage is used. That's the whole theory behind the Tesla switch in the first place. But if that load ALSO produces or adds power of its own to the system, NOW what do you have? That's what I believe we are doing here.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, again, this looks very similar to magnacoasters first videos.
Where he had a bedini type rotor energizer feeding radiant pulses to a dead battery i believe, then he would hook a standard inverter to his car battery and would try to run medium loads like a power drill and the inverter shut off sounds and lights would kick in.
Then when he turned on his energizer and then tried to run the loads off the inverter connected to his large dead battery, it would run the drill and many other loads.
So something similar to this setup is happening inside the battery with this setup.
I don't think the 3 batteries are needed in all setups, there is an effect here inside the battery that needs to be figured out, I bet bedini knows all about it and I bet the Watson machine used a similar principle.
peace love light
tyson

[FRC]

Thanks Turion

Thanks Dave for replying with all the extra info. This definitely works. My good
batteries returned to their full charge after resting for a while. That last test I ran for well over half an hour. I want to try different possible configurations
now. I will try my first two bad batteries in parallel first, then go from there.
This does seem to be the Tesla switch principle working. Lets hope more
people start messing around with this so we can uncover the secret of the
"right bad battery". Thanks again for revealing this.

George

[Joit]

A few Observations what I got from bad Batteries.
When i charge them on a Bedini charger, my Rotor indicates if the Battery has less or more Resistance in it, with the noise what the Coils make.
Bad Gel Batteries have mostly less Resistance in herself. The measured Resistance is may different.
Once it happened to me, that one from the bad Gel-Batteries had little Resistance, and as I did start to charge it, it was like, the Current did break like through a Barrier and the Accu had less Resistance again, rised fast in Voltage and did not keep charge anymore.
At Lead Acid Batteries it looks like its the other Way around, once i damaged the Transformer inside a Charger, it did overhead because of the high Resistance from a LA Batterie, what was a few Years outside Summer and Winter.

But the Effect i see here seems like is, as if the 3rd Battery is kinda a Load, what change its Resistance with the State from its charge from low to higher, as more Current runs through,

[FRC]

Well I did not try the two batteries in parallel. Instead I tried the battery that worked after draining it. It worked for a while but then stopped and the voltage was at about 12.3v. Then I put it on a 2 amp charger and now it was taking a charge whereas before it did not. I think somehow it might be restored now. Then I tried a battery that had been in my car which I had replaced with a new one. After taking a while to start the motor, it worked for a while also but when it became charged it quit. Seems like you need a battery that will not take a full charge, but still has to be able to take some charge. Adding loads also helps
to keep the battery from taking too much charge. We need something that can mimick these qualities. Maybe a motor with a cap or caps, that can take a charge (at the right rate) and then send the rest into the load of the motor.
Maybe some kind of cap pulser like Bits and Bytes has.

George

[LutherG]

Hello Everyone,

I've been playing with this setup for the last 3 weeks before I have had to charge the first 2 batteries. In this time, I've used a 12-volt CIM motor like those used in robotics, model FP801-005 and a Pacific Scientific motor rated at 2.5HP, 124-volts @ 18amps. The PacSci motor is from a treadmill - so it has a shaft that comes out of each end of the motor... With the differential of only 12 volts, I've used welding gloves and my hands to apply a load to the PacSci shaft and there is so much torque developed that it literally smokes the gloves...

I am more inclined to think there is something going on in the magnetic domain than just a charging effect from pulsing, though I don't have the equipment to see what the magnetic fields are doing. Maybe we can some up with some way to see? A Hall maybe? I think its interesting how there is a sudden "switch" and the motor jumps up in rpm. My first thought is that its a magnetic domain switching? I don't know enough about this to understand why the instant increase in RPM. I would think that if a battery is slowly gaining in charge, that the motor would slowly gain in rpm but that's not what happens here... it leaps up in rpm as you can see in the video...

Also, the increase in load on battery 3 seems to relieve the generated power in the motor which would normally be fighting the incoming power according to Peter Lindemann's DVD "Electric Motor Secrets"... The goal here is to pull as much of the generated power out of the motor as we can thereby lessening the motor's voltage requirement to run. Plus the faster the motor turns, the more it generates... you stairstep your way up... load on battery 3, more load on motor, more load on battery 3, more load on the motor... The motor load does NOT have to be mechanical. It can be a nose or belt coupled motor being used as a generator adding more load to it. That in turn will create the mechanical load on the first motor...

BTW, that's my video at Valerifon1 that David posted the link to. I shot this while out in the garage waiting for a load of clothes for work late at night.. I hadn't planned on sharing it with the "masses" else I might have been a little more clear about what was going on wth it... It was originally just meant for a couple of people but then decided to share it with the group... I really didn't want to post anything until I had it really and completely working... which I do not yet....

My initial thoughts about this circuit were that as the battery gains some charge, it gains enough that it can send something back across the motor to batteries 1 & 2. If you read Leedskalnin's book on magnets he explains that current, even in a DC circuit, flows both ways even if synchronously... In our discussions, David said he thought the voltage lowering on the meter was showing the difference between the 24-volt stack and the 12-volt battery. That may be the case - I'm not certain of that yet. There are several things we're not certain about - hence the thread here. Then, once the motor is turning, the voltage continues to drop...

Now, about this voltage drop. Since the battery is a bad battery that won't hold a charge, its apparent to me that there is some kind of shorting or bridging going on between the plates of one or more of the cells in the battery and the result is that the battery is discharging itself. What this means to me, is that there is a resistance between the positive and negative plates and this is not far off to seeing the positive pole as the plate in a vacuum tube, and the negative pole as the cathode. The resistance between them, allows each side to "see" just a bit of the other. This is like putting a resistance between the signal path and ground to increase gain in a vacuum tube circuit. At least, in my mind this is how I relate to this.

Since my 3rd battery kept wanting to recover, I put the dome light between the terminals to mimic what is happening inside the battery to some degree. It did help. Now I'm thinking of using a variable resistance across the terminals of battery 3 in an attempt to see if it can be tuned. (I will also try it in series with battery 3). Being that there is a little negative bias on the positive terminal and a little positive bias on the negative terminal of battery 3 due to the inner resistance bridging due to the material falling off the plates and shorting the cell, I then wondered if this little bit of negative bias (like the grid in a vacuum tube) is causing a polarity flip in the motor and I wonder if THIS is why the motor suddenly leaps upward in RPM?

My batteries took 2 days to get back to original voltage but they are now sitting at the voltage they were at when I started this run. In an earlier video I made of this setup running, they did not fully recover - but that run was done after playing with and running the setup with 2 different motors for almost 3 weeks...

So this is pretty much the bulk of where we are with this setup at this point. Other things I want to try, are putting a variable resistance across battery 3 to see if I can help tune-in what might be happening in David's original bad battery... and of course, trying other "bad" batteries in position 3. I have one more out in the garage that is sitting at 1.8 volts that might be a good candidate... this setup has the "bad" habit of fixing bad batteries...

It may be a resonant system that we retune by adjusting the load on the DC motor which in turn keeps the voltage in a range that can accomodate the inverter...

regards,

Luther

[nueview]

I built the following circuit to test a concept of Don Smith it is not the same as your motor as it drains the battery of any current such that it will not run anything yet it retains its voltage to a major extent.
it was designed to use the base collector as a diode rectifier to collect any reverse charge pulse from the oscillators and it has run for more than 38 days before i stopped it lighting a LED the whole time.
though it is not the same it may have some clues for someone here as a reverse action to what you are seeing so want to pass it along.

Flip-Flop Double Joule Thief - YouTube

Martin