Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[Lidmotor]

Coil shorting--energy conversion??

@Rod
I kinda came to the same conclusion that the energy wasn't increased---just converted. That is really not so bad if you can control it and use it your advantage to do something. The question is-- does this have ANY bearing of the Romero Muller "situation".
I am starting to think that nobody is going to just "tune" their Romero Muller replication to produce twice the energy out that is put in. This WAS either a tremendous hoax or we are missing something major. With all the brillant minds working on this project for over a month now, someone should have seen some magic.
The relativly simple machine that Romero built used a very uncomplicated triggering and energy recovery circuit. The magnet and coil arrangement, though interesting, doesn't appear to be where the secret lies either. Someone with a true replication would have already reported on that by now. We are missing something big. Either how the dynamic of the entire device setup some freak event----- or how Romero cleverly got the extra power into his machine.

Lidmotor

[toranarod]

@All
I tried the generator coil shorting idea on my testing setup and got some interesting results. Patrick-- I basically used your shorting circuit with the trigger coil and transistor but simplified it. It worked on my rig but it might not work on someone elses. I could not come to any real conclusions about this coil shorting idea with my test but it did improve the generator output performance. The way that I did it there was a slight increase in amp draw and a slowing of the rotor ---but the output gain seemed worth it. I liked what I saw.
Here is the video of the test:

YouTube - ‪Muller Dynamo-- generator coil shorting test.ASF‬‏

Cheers,

Lidmotor

the coil shorting process appeases to be a way of converting voltage to current.
the circuit below was able to draw 900 m Amps but at a very low voltage
3.9 volts

Do the math on this and you end up back where you stated. the only positive gain is it does not load the coils.

after the bridge rectifier the hi voltage collected into a capacitor could be used to drive the motor. or at least off set the current used to run the device. it does go some way to over unity. because there is very little load on the motor.

[Lidmotor]

Muller Dynamo ---Generator coil shorting test

@All
I tried the generator coil shorting idea on my testing setup and got some interesting results. Patrick-- I basically used your shorting circuit with the trigger coil and transistor but simplified it. It worked on my rig but it might not work on someone elses. I could not come to any real conclusions about this coil shorting idea with my test but it did improve the generator output performance. The way that I did it there was a slight increase in amp draw and a slowing of the rotor ---but the output gain seemed worth it. I liked what I saw.
Here is the video of the test:

YouTube - ‪Muller Dynamo-- generator coil shorting test.ASF‬‏

Cheers,

Lidmotor

[minoly]

Hi Pat, at 12 seconds of the video he states if you were watching Saturday evening i had the Muller spinning on its own power, maybe i got that wrong sorry about that .

Ash

Ash, he sure does say that.
I watched the justin.tv episode so I did not think twice when he said it, he probably did not think twice saying it either

Patrick

[minoly]

I was pulling 980 m Amps out of the generator coils

created a dead short circuit across the coils and added the 1.5 Uf capacitor.
this is half wave loaded on the positive cycle only.
was able to get some really good results today this is looking good.

I over heated the coils and damaged them. They melted the former and came unglued from there base plate.

Winding some new one tomorrow.

this is the circuit for todays test.

yes, this works much better with the cap where you put it. I did not have luck w/ the caps I purchased today and the coils I have on hand so I will start winding new coils to test, but the effect is definitely there. it changes the timing where you put it, just like you say.
awesome
Rod, can you start the new thread with this one. I'll add JB's/Bolt's Amplified ssg short to it, but I like your's better. others can add theirs as well.

Patrick

[Joit]

he states if you were watching Saturday evening i had the Muller spinning on its own power
Ash

Yup Ash, before he did speed it up with a Dremel, now he wind and test Coils and installed the first one, as you see in the Video. But hes very busy at the moment because of a Tornado there and he may work not that much on it as he want to.

[ren]

I was pulling 980 m Amps out of the generator coils

created a dead short circuit across the coils and added the 1.5 Uf capacitor.
this is half wave loaded on the positive cycle only.
was able to get some really good results today this is looking good.

I over heated the coils and damaged them. They melted the former and came unglued from there base plate.

Winding some new one tomorrow.

this is the circuit for todays test.

This is awesome news Rod. I want to try it as soon as I can.

Can you share your circuit for triggering the Mosfet? Also what is the Fet rated at?

Will you be looking to short it on the + and - of the cycle eventually?

How did you measure the 980ma? With a load permanently shorted to the cap?

Excellent work

Regards

[ashtweth]

Ash,
what result did he get, all I saw him do was spin it up. did I miss something?
Zero sure is thorough w/ his build so far.

Redrichie made a nice find, shorting coils w/ an AC cap right on the pickup coil

Patrick

Hi Pat, at 12 seconds of the video he states if you were watching Saturday evening i had the Muller spinning on its own power, maybe i got that wrong sorry about that .

Ash

[minoly]

good idea - not just coil shorting though. should be coil shorting causes increase speed in rotor or something like that.
Patrick

[toranarod]

I think it would be a good idea to have a thread dedicated to coil shorting. Romerouk recently told people to get their rotors speeding up under coil short/load before proceeding to the full replication as it can be applied to most applications, not just the muller style motor.

I agree I want to look into this for all motor generator applications.
Romero said he choose the muller for this technique. its the technique thats important not the muller motor so much.
I am going to run some test on my other motor using the same technique as i have on the muller.
My Adams motor is larger and can handle the abuse . It has .5 ohm 9 m H coils 6000 Gauss magnets.
I also had it at COP 1 so close it stabilized its battery.

[Zooty]

I think it would be a good idea to have a thread dedicated to coil shorting. Romerouk recently told people to get their rotors speeding up under coil short/load before proceeding to the full replication as it can be applied to most applications, not just the muller style motor.

[minoly]

cap short

didn't mean to get into any trouble here.
Redrichie actually only noted that this was something Romero was experimenting with. not that he discoverd it himself.
I have not read all the posts after mine yet thought I better type this out ASAP.


What if any results did you get w/o the switch?
using the cap in parallel to the coil and prior to the FWBR as I have been experimenting w/ this AM?

Patrick

[penno64]

Hi Rod,

3 steps forward 2 steps back

better than 2 steps forward 3 steps back

Great work

I think you're so close to nailing this


Regards, Penno

[toranarod]

I was pulling 980 m Amps out of the generator coils

created a dead short circuit across the coils and added the 1.5 Uf capacitor.
this is half wave loaded on the positive cycle only.
was able to get some really good results today this is looking good.

I over heated the coils and damaged them. They melted the former and came unglued from there base plate.

Winding some new one tomorrow.

this is the circuit for todays test.

[Steve220]

I see

Thanks Zooty,

You explained it very well
If you can time it just right, and only for the time required, I can see how it works.
There is the zero current at TDC and a little on each side of the repulsion and attraction to work with a properly timed short.
I know many different ways to bypass Lenz law have been tried in the past, but I still think it can be done.
I always thought that somehow a person might be able to disrupt a magnetic field for a split second to cause it to stumble, just a little.
It would not have to be 100%, just enough to gain a little ground each time around.
If that little ground could be scaled up, it would be huge.
Your work has given me an idea to check out for sure.