Lockridge Device - Peter Lindemann

[Matthew Jones]

Why do you get offended when I call someone out who says they know how to build an overunity device but are unable to provide a working device.

Who says I can't? See thats just what I talking about. You need someone to provide you proof before you'll try anything. You need someone to walk you through it.

Your generator idea is just brilliant except it wont work.

WHY? At least give me an explanation. You are the only one who says so, so go on and explain yourself.

Matt

[Mark]

If you dont know why then its because you haven't done the experiments. I've already tried it. Efficiencies are too low, loses are too high, simple math. Go ahead and give it a try. Can't wait to see your video of your working overunity device.

[Matthew Jones]

If you dont know why then its because you haven't done the experiments. I've already tried it. Efficiencies are too low, loses are too high, simple math. Go ahead and give it a try. Can't wait to see your video of your working overunity device.

Ya but Mark thats not a "Why", that general little ignorant answer. What your saying is I have not exceeded anything you yourself have done. I have tweaked and tuned to anymore extent than you have. My motor is not any better than yours? I must have come to the same conclusion as you or I didn't do anything at all.

See those are assumptions, your assuming that you know it all because your testing has not been successful. Its funny how you never post anything on your failed tests. You just always have something better and then all of a sudden "It won't work"... Go back and check your numbers that you actually did post. They always exceeded mine.

I pity you Mark. If I were you I would not try anything anymore. Just go away and stick my head in the sand and not do anything to try to improve anything. Stop learning, give up, raise goats or something. LOL

Don't worry about it Mark. I got your game. You can play all day long if you want, when the thing is done I'll make a video and you ask stupid questions about mundane things until your convinced I must be lying cause you can't make it work without someone like me holding your hand.

And for the rest of YA'll who might have actually read this. Think about mixing a low voltage higher amperage with your output in pulses. There are several things out there that do not have a heavy cost on short bursts of amperage.

Cheers
Matt

[Michael Kishline]

If you dont know why then its because you haven't done the experiments. I've already tried it. Efficiencies are too low, loses are too high, simple math. Go ahead and give it a try. Can't wait to see your video of your working overunity device.

Mark you obviously bring nothing to the table except complaints, your posturing is no longer solution oriented. Albeit your frustrated, you must push through these periods and stay focused on the objective. Peter has made it perfectly clear as to the extent of his involvement and how this thread was to be conducted. I am not one to wish silencing anyone but if you persist on interrupting this thread I will petition Aaron and Peter to put you on "READ" only.
Please don't attack the fine researchers, experimenters and inventors on this thread, it's an honor to be here and participate with so many great thinkers and stand on the shoulders of so many just so I can climb this learning curve at an incredible rate.
All I can tell you Mark is you don't know what you have until it's gone!

Peace and Good Will!

Mike

[mbrownn]

Sorry guys for butting in but I find it sad that so much time is given to the negative comments. The work done by many on this and other threads is exceptional, it tarnishes that work to go into lengthy rebukes.

I must say that the work done by Mathew is excellent, he has reported what he has done and the results he achieved. It will take more than this one aspect of a motor to achieve our goal but this is a very important step. I am one who wishes to attain that goal and Mathews work, as well as others, has moved me a little closer.

I commend you all

[Peter Lindemann]

Sorry for the Misunderstanding

Peter,
I didn't mean to offend by posting that link about "ARC Motors." I did it because they will build motors to spec, and we might have some people who are interested in doing what the rest of us are doing, yet are incapable of building the motor themselves....no shop...no tools, etc. I thought that might give them the opportunity to also participate. That was my only intention. They could spec it out and have it built, with the proper bearings, two sets of brushes (or one), the right windings, etc, etc. That was the ONLY reason I posted that link here. I didn't mean to upset you.

I have done what you recommended. I have built my motor, hooked it to my energizer and have been trying various circuits with different caps to see what results I get. I have built a motor with two sets of brushes to use with batteries, and a motor with one with one set to use with caps. I also modified an alternator to see if I could duplicate my results with the magnets on the rotor and the coils around the outside on the stator. But FIRST, I did as you instructed us to do. And I did it twice, before I started fooling around with a different configuration. I couldn't be happier with what I have learned and am learning. And I continue to play with all three of these devices because I haven't learned everything there is to learn about them yet. It is possible that I never will.
You will not see me here complaining about not having an OU device. You and I have talked personally, and I KNOW what we have here. As far as I am concerned, THIS information is THE most valuable information that has ever been released, and we HAVE been shown how to do it step by step. I have built Bedini motors, and I have a ten coiler I cleared off my workbench when I saw what I could do with THIS device. I don't post my results here because people need to build this for themselves, but I can tell you this. My son is an electrical engineer, and he almost wet his pants when I showed him what I had in my basement. He's a big boy now and he can read his OWN meters. I am working on the best possible energizer to couple with this motor because as far as I am concerned, this motor is as good as it is going to get unless I get someone with professional equipment (hence the post I made that started this) to wind the rotor for me. That is something I have been considering, just because it might fractionally improve performance, and those fractions add up.

Again, I am sorry if that offended you. I meant no disrespect whatsoever. I have the greatest admiration and respect for the willingness you have shown to lay it all out for us, and I never cease to be amazed at all the people who try to change pieces and parts of what you say to do, and then are all bent out of shape when it doesn't turn out like you said it would. As for me, the motor I rebuilt is one you yourself said would be "perfect" for this exercise, and danged if you weren't absolutely right! Now the alternator I modified is something a little different, but gee, it isn't what you SAID to use, so I didn't EXPECT it would perform the same way. Although it isn't that bad either, just performs differently and you have to adjust to that. The nice part is I don't have to mess with brushes.

I feel like I have MORE than what I was told I would have. When we started this, you said this would be the most efficient motor possible from off the shelf components. That was all you said about the motor, except that coupled with an energizer we could expect it to be something really special. As far as I'm concerned, the motor ALONE is pretty dang special.

You will get NO complaints out of me. Just sincere appreciation. And Matt, thanks to you too. You guys are my heroes.

As a side note, I have NO flywheel on my motor / energizer combination. My energizer has four rotors on it, each with their own magnets, and each one is offset from the one before it so that there is literally NO cogging of the energizer. The four rotors act as my flywheel and are enough to smooth out the pulsing of the motor, which is ALL you need a flywheel for, and the shafts are directly connected together.

Dear Turion,

I wasn't offended. I was surprised. Apparently, I misinterpreted your purpose for posting the link to ARC Motors, primarily because you didn't state your purpose. At first glance, it seemed like a diversion rather than a resource for specially fabricated parts. Thank you for clarifying the reason for the link.

But I think it has all turned out for the better. Apparently, the thread needed a "recap" of the basic thesis from me and it also gave you an opportunity to give us a more detailed report on your progress. Personally, I'd like to hear even more details, like the meter readings that your son was impressed by!

Your participation here has been exemplary, and I deeply appreciate your contributions.

@Mark,

I'm sorry I don't have more time to devote to this thread and the experiments that would move things forward. I understand if the thesis is still difficult for you to fully appreciate. It took me 30 years to think it through myself. Like Matt said, some of your earlier experiments looked quite promising. Thank you for the contributions you have made. I wish you complete success on all of your projects. I realize it is more fun to focus on what you are interested in at the time. I'm that way too.

@Matt,

Your idea of combining voltage and current from separate sources to produce a power cross-product is right on. This process clearly happens in some types of plasma ignition systems, and I believe is the basis of Baldinelli's power amplification methods from the early 1970's. As you progress with this aspect of your project, it may be better to post in a New Thread, so this thread can stay focused on the motor modifications. Your experiments and innovations are always inspiring to me.

Thanks, everybody.

Peter

[pault]

generator or not?

@Peter

I wonder if I (like many) am confused about what the next step will be. Because "lockridge" is mentioned, I've assumed that we're going to build a generator next. I looked back at the very beginning of this thread and found your post:

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/6792-lockridge-device-peter-lindemann-6.html#post124919

that appears not to use a generator per se.

I'm at the stage where I've done the mods, got my motor running at 3x voltage (36 instead of 12), got some dynamometer results and am stalled waiting for a friend to machine me a safe flywheel. I've been playing with energizers and have built a 3500-turn high-v (as yet untested) coil with the expectation that I will use an energizer in the generator portion (that's also why I brought Muller into this thread).

Am I overlooking something obvious?

@Peter, Matt

Uh, are you saying that potential and current are independent quantities that can be summed? I've got a lot of un-learning to do, in that case. Is the older "motor secrets" thread a place to help me with such un-learning?

Thanks
pt

[Michael Kishline]

My apologies

Sorry guys for butting in but I find it sad that so much time is given to the negative comments. The work done by many on this and other threads is exceptional, it tarnishes that work to go into lengthy rebukes.

I must say that the work done by Mathew is excellent, he has reported what he has done and the results he achieved. It will take more than this one aspect of a motor to achieve our goal but this is a very important step. I am one who wishes to attain that goal and Mathews work, as well as others, has moved me a little closer.

I commend you all

Sorry mbrownn and everyone,

I'm just trying to focus on learning and I got frustrated with the constant *****ing. I didn't enjoy responding in length.

My apologies!
Mike

[qvision]

Deleted. Deleted.

[Matthew Jones]

@Peter, Matt

Uh, are you saying that potential and current are independent quantities that can be summed? I've got a lot of un-learning to do, in that case. Is the older "motor secrets" thread a place to help me with such un-learning?

Thanks
pt

Yes they can be summed together from 2 different sources. But it has to be done in the same time . You cannot charge a cap with high voltage then charge it with low voltage at a higher amperage. Both the amperage and the voltage must discharge at the same time.

The key is how to mix them.

If you have what I have then whats happening is you fire the motor. The energy you fire go's to ground. Then windings pass the magnets in one direction and make a pulse they turn 180 degrees and pulse again. This creates somewhat of a sine wave on the scope.

Now if you want to add amperage from another source the output of the generator that makes it has to make it in the same time frame or all the time.

All the time is going to drag the motor down unless you use a means that does not hinder your mechanical energy via Lenz. (*We'll get back to this)

The 2 sources of power also do not need to mix within the source. IE...2 batteries in serial are a mix in the source..
You can accomplish this by adding an equal bridge rectifier to the output of both the generator and the motor. Then you serialize the 2 bridges. This keep each power source independent of each other. But the power accumulates.

So if the motor is dumping 100 volt at .01 amp and the generator at the same time is dumping 2 volt at 4 amp, granted they do it in the same time frame, and you serialize the outputs (NOT COUNTING DIODE LOSS) you have have 102 volt at 4.1 amps.
Just like 2 batteries in serial.

So you need to test to prove to yourself this can happen. But you do not have a low drag generator YET.

*So now all you need is a relatively low drag, low voltage, high to mid amperage generator.

We have several options. I have tested 3 options and only one is looking like a candidate at this time. But I have 2 tests slated when I get the time and money before I settle on anything particular. 1 test was 2 coils wound with heavy wire, 2 magnets, ect.... It didn't work. The second test was homopolar generator. It bogged down to much.
The third test which is a candidate was N machine type assembly, it actually put out a small amount of amperage and did not bog down the dremel tool I ran it on very bad. We have to test larger magnets and better brush assembly. Peter also said this machine had some problems. So I am not counting on it 100% till I see the marriage of the motor and generator actually work together.

The next test though I am going to do, is to try and inductive style generator with no magnets. And this is where some of you might be able to help if you have the time. I am not promising results, but it needs to be looked at.

The output of the motor could be discharged through a set of coils on a rotor to create a magnetic field. This field in turn could be used to generate a low voltage high amperage pulse on a coil and the stator. Then both could be output at the same time.
This allows for several possibilities. We could store the output of the motor. Then put the charge we're storing to the gen.rotor coil while the motor is ON. So that we can negate the small amount of Lenz that will be present at the time we generate.
We can also use the gen.rotor coil to step up the output voltage to above the motor input voltage. So we have a higher potential when we finally collect the power. Everything will be separate when leaving the generator and can be collected separately or as described above.

Now I have background info to base this test on, in fact its so much that I cannot possibly write it all down.
I will make up an slide show of images or some pseudo schematic to help someone along if anybody else is willing to test this.
I DO NOT HAVE specifics for windings to regauge the magnetic fields into the power structure that is needed. I have been reading alot and I have some idea of how to do it, and I am sure Peter could answer a few of the specific questions as to where to start or where to look for the info.

I know its good test a good place to look.

The fifth test I have slated someone else gave me at first it didn't interest me but then I decided it might be worth looking at. But I am not going share it as its not mine.


I know this direction will lead to something good. I do not have a working prototype and if I DID I would not give it away in the open in light of some peoples behavior when it comes to PROFIT and CREDIT. I have only done tests to see if going further in this direction is the right thing to do. But everything I have done leads me to believe this is going to work if done correctly, with the correct apparatus.

So there it is. Take it or leave it. I'll be moving forward with this as time and money allows. How about YOU????

Your probably going to need more detail to understand what I am saying. And I home today so please ask away. And I'll work on some drawing to help explain.

Cheers
Matt

[pault]

Thanks for the inspiring in-depth discussion. You're right, I'm going to need to ask questions, after re-reading it a few more times and mulling. Later today, I hope.

Some points that come immediately to mind:

a) The "classical" solution to generating high current from high voltage is to use a step-down transformer. PowerOut = PowerIn - SomeLosses. This is where I was heading. I tried a monopolar rotor attached to the motor, inducing voltage into a coil. Then I added a shorting-coil reed switch and the generated voltage jumped way up. My test 12V (not mod'ed) drive motor was generating 100V into a cap. I was wondering, if I had enough coils around the disk, whether I could generate enough power into a step-down transformer to satisfy the pulsed current needs of the motor.

b) No idea where this is going but ... on the surface, Lenz' Law looks like the magnetic equivalent of BEMF. Peter showed us how to harvest BEMF. Is there a trick for harvesting Lenz? Lenz doesn't happen if the circuit is open. Lenz (?) causes a harvestable spike in a short circuit.

c) The Romero thread on EF appears to have found that drag is reduced if you short the coil at precisely the right moment.

thanks
pt

[mbrownn]

Yes they can be summed together from 2 different sources. But it has to be done in the same time . You cannot charge a cap with high voltage then charge it with low voltage at a higher amperage. Both the amperage and the voltage must discharge at the same time.

The key is how to mix them.

If you have what I have then whats happening is you fire the motor. The energy you fire go's to ground. Then windings pass the magnets in one direction and make a pulse they turn 180 degrees and pulse again. This creates somewhat of a sine wave on the scope.

Now if you want to add amperage from another source the output of the generator that makes it has to make it in the same time frame or all the time.

All the time is going to drag the motor down unless you use a means that does not hinder your mechanical energy via Lenz. (*We'll get back to this)

The 2 sources of power also do not need to mix within the source. IE...2 batteries in serial are a mix in the source..
You can accomplish this by adding an equal bridge rectifier to the output of both the generator and the motor. Then you serialize the 2 bridges. This keep each power source independent of each other. But the power accumulates.

So if the motor is dumping 100 volt at .01 amp and the generator at the same time is dumping 2 volt at 4 amp, granted they do it in the same time frame, and you serialize the outputs (NOT COUNTING DIODE LOSS) you have have 102 volt at 4.1 amps.
Just like 2 batteries in serial.

So you need to test to prove to yourself this can happen. But you do not have a low drag generator YET.


Matt

Sounds interesting, how do you do that? could you post a simple circuit so that I can understand the concept?

Or is it like Peters regenerative circuit with a capacitor in parallel at the source separated by a diode?

Sorry if this is taking things at a tangent but you were the one to bring it up.

[Turion]

Matt, you know me. I'll build anything. On my way out now to pick up a couple squirrel cage motors from the junk yard. They can be had for about $5.00 each. For those who have never messed with them, here's a little info that helped me out the first time I played around with them.

Induction Generator

Peter, I see this as the next logical step, but we should probably take the results of our work on this to a new forum and leave this site for the construction of the motors. Matt, do you want to start that thread?

David Bowling

[Matthew Jones]

Thanks for the inspiring in-depth discussion. You're right, I'm going to need to ask questions, after re-reading it a few more times and mulling. Later today, I hope.
thanks
pt

Your Missing what I am saying. I think??

Sounds interesting, how do you do that? could you post a simple circuit so that I can understand the concept?
Or is it like Peters regenerative circuit with a capacitor in parallel at the source separated by a diode?
Sorry if this is taking things at a tangent but you were the one to bring it up.

I have 2 circuits posted. One is the complete ciciut and the other is the gen circiut.



So you have to follow me through the circiut. And remember this is pure theory at this time but SO WAS THE MOTOR at one time.

We are going to start at the 120 VDC input of power into the motor. This is important. Most ya'll going to say 120 vdc is alot of voltage. But the higher you go the less amperage you'll use. Potential is easy to make or recover amperage is not.
1. We charge the motor and it spins.

2. The coil in the motor then gets charged from passing the magnets in the motor and we relieve it of that charge into the high voltage capacitor. We also convert it back to DC before the cap.

3. Now follow the wire into the generator on Gen.Rotor input. Look at the second diagram you can see what happens. The output from the motor that we stored in the High voltage capacitor is then sent through the Generator to induce a charge onto the winding of the generator.
Now this part is critical because we are not wanting to charge the generator's coil to high voltage we want a REGAUGING at this point. We want to generate more amperage on the Generators coils then exist on the rotors coils. So the winding ratios are going to be different from rotor to stator.
ALSO we have to have the Rotors coils charged at the same time the motor fires, so any Lenz that shows up gets pushed through by direct power on the motor. Remember the motor only fires for a brief time.

4. Now the part that makes the rotor charge is the "Timed Switch". With this switch we have effectively made a Buck/Boost circuit (Look it up). This will step up the voltage we have a bit so that it is higher than the voltage we started with.

5. Now here's the magic. We mix the High voltage coming out of our rotor with amperage coming off the Stator. We do this by serializing 2 bridge's
This prevents the High voltage and High Amperage from MIXING at the source.

6. Then we charge the storage cap and route that charge back to the origin. This might require more switching I haven't thought it through because its really simple to see once the rest of it starts working.

So I hope your following me now. If not speak up and point me to the part your having trouble with.

Now lets talk about what use.

Since we already have plenty of cheap scooter motors around and they are going to line up as long as the motor case and gen case are the same type.

What we can do on the rotor is wind 4 coils in parallel and hook them 180 degrees out on the commutator. This will make our switch and our rotor coil.
Next we knock the magnets out of the case and replace them with some FLAT coils of something like 20 turns of number 12 awg.
This is the experimental part.

We may want Peter to chime in with his opinion on the subject. If he doesn't show up in a couple of days I'll remind him were here.

I know every AC generator uses a small 12 volt homopolar generator inside to produce a current on the windings to make a larger current. I am not sure if it is possible to use a higher voltage with smaller current to make lower current in a generator, but my best guess is it is possible.

So thats MY experiment number 4 if anybody wants to take it on. And if you get it built please just share what you have done to accomplish or fail for that matter.

Thanks
Matt

[john_g]

Flywheel - Motor Cycle?

Hi Matt

Great progress. Just a couple of thoughts. The era for the lockridge device, I wonder if the flywheel was say a motor-cycle flywheel with a magneto? This could provide HV and maybe step down via a transformer, i.e. the trifiler coil with an over-winding as by me:

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/6841-lockridge-type-principal-device-tesla-self-run-motor-generator-8.html#post142967

I'm waiting for a 6 magnet BSA ( ex German WW2design) to be machined out to fit onto a 15mm shaft so I can try this concept, but thought I'd throw it into the pot.

Regards

John