Lockridge Device - Peter Lindemann

[mbrownn]

Could you be so nice and explain me this further.
You take the generated current trough the motor windings to compensate
an increasing load on the motor ? why is this load increasing on the motor ?

When we draw current from the generator, it causes drag, the motor slows and the BEMF in the armature reduces. This allows more current to flow. Also when a load is placed on the secondary of a transformer, the impedance drops and more current can flow. Normally all the extra current comes from the source, but as we are creating current in the generator it makes sense to use that too.

The voltage drop across the motor is very small, so if we make the voltage of our output higher than the motor, it will draw generator current through the motor with little voltage drop. We can still power our load but the current flow has assisted the motor. This extra current in the armature causes more generated current so it is a self compensating loop.

As the transformer action is lowering impedance, more current flows, which in turn causes stronger generation due to the higher magnetic fields in the armature. Again it is self compensating the the generator.

if the motor is very low in voltage this is better because it draws more
current from the generator. so your kind of generator will be happy to give us
more current but its unhappy to supply a higher voltage ?

so the key is to use an low impedance armature And low impedance
field coil ?

Not exactly, we can drop the impedance with the transformer action, We want very low ohmic resistance both in the field coils and the armature. Big wire. This is why I play around with starter motors as their ohmic resistance is often below 1/10th of an ohm. The problem here is I may be too low on the inductance, another compromise.

Your asking the right questions

[HansKammler]

#13 efficience 2:
In effect we are using our electrical draw from the generator to compensate for the increased load on the motor by passing its current through the motor windings first. Yes, the motor will slow but by not as much as expected. The lower the voltage requirement of our electrical load the more current drawn and the greater the compensation.

Could you be so nice and explain me this further.
You take the generated current trough the motor windings to compensate
an increasing load on the motor ? why is this load increasing on the motor ?

if the motor is very low in voltage this is better because it draws more
current from the generator. so your kind of generator will be happy to give us
more current but its unhappy to supply a higher voltage ?

so the key is to use an low impedance armature And low impedance
field coil ?

[mbrownn]

No problem, its so obvious to me because I know how it works, but I forget that no one else has seen anything like this I will go through it again with this drawing http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...-coilsetup-jpg

q2:Magnetic reactance or electrical rectance do you mean ?

The ability to make the current lag or precede the voltage.

my first idea would be a CAP in series with the generator winding (Motorcap) to filter out the DC component and clip it to a fixed level (biasing).
the DC i filtered out with an bridge recifier and collecting in a second cap. So i can use both of them after.
Is that you want to tell me ?

Congratulations, you have thought of another of the methods of spiting the AC from the DC, but I never figured out how to get the DC out, and so have never mentioned it on the forums. Its one of the many things I call "a work in progress"

I think we are going to make some progress

q3: Its because you switch off the current in the armature coil before it passes the field coil ? Right ?

Correct, hopefully you can now see why.

I suggest you build the "Interesting Motor", I call it the Motor Assisted Generator (MAG) or Motor assisted Dynamo (MAD) Then run some tests on the pulsing so we can narrow down the options for splitting the AC and DC

Sorry for the long and in depth post

[HansKammler]

There is another way around this problem using reactance (I think thats the correct term) ie the voltage may drop to zero but current still flows. Its something I am trying to figure out.

q2:Magnetic reactance or electrical rectance do you mean ?

my first idea would be a CAP in series with the generator winding (Motorcap) to filter out the DC component and clip it to a fixed level (biasing).
the DC i filtered out with an bridge recifier and collecting in a second cap. So i can use both of them after.
Is that you want to tell me ?

It is how the device is made to motor that is different. Little or no BEMF is generated in the field coils because no armature coil passes them while it is energized.

q3: Its because you switch off the current in the armature coil before it passes the field coil ? Right ?

[mbrownn]

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...ing-motor.html I talk about the construction from the 7th post

q1.2
the magamp is wired as a recifier than an amp ?

Yes, that is one way to do it.

q2:is the overlapped ac peak smaller or greater than the dc peak on the generator ?

If the generated DC is 12v the AC will vary this DC between 24 and 0 v. Effectively the AC gain is lost when the voltage drops to zero.

There is another way around this problem using reactance (I think thats the correct term) ie the voltage may drop to zero but current still flows. Its something I am trying to figure out.

q3: how did you reduce the bemf on the generator to 2/3rd ?

The generator is absolutely standard and so works in a conventional way.

It is how the device is made to motor that is different. Little or no BEMF is generated in the field coils because no armature coil passes them while it is energized.

[HansKammler]

[mbrownn]

Are you telling about a kind of transformer?
So in a transformer you need ironcore or metglass as a magnetic
media. so the air coiled trifilar cannot deliver enough energy to the 300W light bank.
300W -> my Trifilar will melt away !
240 turns of magnet wire 21 is not very much.
even if you use the tesla patent "Coil for Electromagnets," patent #512,340
(bifi selfcircuited)
you cannot transfer 300W

Yes a transformer, but not the trifilar coil. The powered field coils and the armature act as the primary, the other field coils act as the secondary. So if we pulse the primary using the commutator as the switching mechanism, with the powered field coil and the armature in attraction, we will get a strong transformer action in the generator coil. As this generator coil is also producing DC in it at the same time, we have the problem of separating the AC and DC signals. If we use diodes the AC becomes self cancelling and we cant extract it.

Ill say it again to try and make it clear to understand. So we use one powered field coil and the armature as the input as a low BEMF motor, as I have described before. the 90 degree configuration with one of the generator shoes forces the motor to turn and generate DC in the coil mounted on the un-powered shoe. As this is pulsed we get a pulsed AC wave also occurring in that generator coil. This is only half of the field coils in the case.

The second powered field coil is opposite the first and set in attraction. Normally this would lock the motor and it would not turn, but because the case is split, there is no flux path and this does not happen. The flux from this second powered field coil follows a second path around to the second output coil. Transformer action again creates an AC wave in this second output coil. The two act purely as a transformer as it is arranged in the case so that the powered armature does not sweep the shoe of the second output coil.

We have a motor, a generator, and a transformer all in one case. Only one friction loss, only one iron loss for all three devices so our efficiency is much higher than three separate devices.

We use the output of this transformer section like a magamp to turn the AC produced in the first generator coil into DC while powering a load at the same time.

We have one pulsed input x. We have inductive kickback from this which can be collected which will be in the region of 17 to 35% efficient, so now our input to the transformer is 1.17 to 1.35x

If the inductive kickback is fed to a capacitor across the load, it will reduce the input so our input is now 0.65x. Are you starting to see the gains? For an input of 0.65 we get an input to the transformer of at least 1.17. Allowing for a relatively poor transformer efficiency of say 60% we still have 0.7x as a transformer output.

The generator is more efficient than out donor motor as we have reduced the BEMF by 2/3rds. Normally we would expect this motor to generate with around 50% efficiency but we know it will be better than that. however if we only apply a generation factor of 0.5x our total output is 1.2x.
If our device is running at 1000w, for an input of 650w, we have an output of 1200w and with no use of a trifilar coil.

So the only part is to use the CASE of LR as an Ironcore.
but rotating fields destroy / shifts the phase of magnet flux away ?
this will really weird but maybe a key to the function.

So you need to transform the 12V AC to 220V AC for the bulbs ?
we need 10 times more windings on L3 than L1 to shift the voltage
from the generator to the bulbs, with 12 V trifilar you will see not even
a glow in the bulb.



A relay to switch the light bank as an ballast to the generator
not to burn the gen coils ?

We can wind out output coils to whatever ratio we want



Normally a motor is set up in repulsion with flux leaking out of it all over the place. By setting it up in attraction we keep the flux in the core and improve transformer efficiency.

Read my thread here and you will see how to set up the motor in attraction. http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...ing-motor.htmlI came up with this while I was trying to resolve the AC problem in the generator coil but eventually discarded it because the trifilar coil is 90 degrees out and so could not have this effect.

An OpAmp is fast enough to do an PID , measure the resistance and
instaneous output a difference signal to the MOSFET driver -> adjust L properly.

I dont think we had this technology in the 1940s

but in resonance the losses in the coils are almost zero. Xl=Xc=0 (in theory)
so drop in Amp from the power supply at constant rpm (when you feed constant Voltage to the motor)
or rising RPMs with constant current supply.

another approach: (not tested, but inspired from JB SG Cap Discharger)
charge a capacitor (diode) inside the Resonance loop.when you reach the 30V then you can "click" an relais
to push the joules from the cap to the Motor. (KICKMode)
say "in the right moment"
Resonance is short lost, but the motor turns further (momentum)
the resonance should reestablish and the cycle repeats.


Ismael Aviso:

He find a way to short circuit the motorcoils at the right moment to
(on the peak of the sinus wave) and charge insteanous a cap without
"lenzing" the generator out !

so you could use 2 Coils of the generator and close them
with lowest (!) resistance at the peak (when rotorfield approach the statorwinding)
so you recycle power and say bye to Mr. Lenz
No Lenz no Drag on the generator. perfect


OK Mr Brown.
I will shortly forget the resonance mode.
So if there is no LCR system at the moment.
how will you connect the parts to get a working model ?
What I have overseen ?

[HansKammler]

Remember folks, no one has a working model of this device except possibly the government in some warehouse somewhere. ..

Hans, if this is truly a reactive or radiant device, you will be working with a slightly different form of energy. Without conversion, our scope and meters are useless. Caps help with this problem. JB has shown us how to collect this in a cap. My experience with this form of energy is you must allow for a "break in" of the conversion components before measuring efficiencies. I wish I could remember my second source of information regarding the resonance component because I also remember the statement by Lockridge himself not to use anything other than light bulbs on the generator or risk burning the whole thing up. Also a clue to high voltage and/or frequency.

Randy

[tachyoncatcher]

Voltage?

Remember folks, no one has a working model of this device except possibly the government in some warehouse somewhere. We have no way of knowing voltage or frequency of the output to the bulbs. We can assume they were standard 220v/50Hz bulbs used in Germany and 120v/60Hz used in US. Bulbs are not picky and actually work better with high voltage and high frequency. They will use less current and illuminate fully, even cold if high enough.

Hans, if this is truly a reactive or radiant device, you will be working with a slightly different form of energy. Without conversion, our scope and meters are useless. Caps help with this problem. JB has shown us how to collect this in a cap. My experience with this form of energy is you must allow for a "break in" of the conversion components before measuring efficiencies. I wish I could remember my second source of information regarding the resonance component because I also remember the statement by Lockridge himself not to use anything other than light bulbs on the generator or risk burning the whole thing up. Also a clue to high voltage and/or frequency.

Randy

[HansKammler]

stuck on theory

The lockridge appears to have this configuration. Remember you do not have to drive that second coil, by using it as an output current flows and impedance changes. In a motor generator configuration like I have done, the lowering of impedance causes the device to draw more current. By drawing current from the generator coil when supplying the device with AC we get acceleration. Acceleration under load. This was using a simplified armature but even worked a little with a standard armature.

I dont know if your idea about how it works is the same as mine, but you seem to be looking at similar principals

As for resonance and using it as an LC circuit, it seams to be leading me away from that, but we just dont know.

I use the reverse engineering approach and let the device teach me, and it has taught me a lot.

Are you telling about a kind of transformer?
So in a transformer you need ironcore or metglass as a magnetic
media. so the air coiled trifilar cannot deliver enough energy to the 300W light bank.
300W -> my Trifilar will melt away !
240 turns of magnet wire 21 is not very much.
even if you use the tesla patent "Coil for Electromagnets," patent #512,340
(bifi selfcircuited)
you cannot transfer 300W

So the only part is to use the CASE of LR as an Ironcore.
but rotating fields destroy / shifts the phase of magnet flux away ?
this will really weird but maybe a key to the function.

So you need to transform the 12V AC to 220V AC for the bulbs ?
we need 10 times more windings on L3 than L1 to shift the voltage
from the generator to the bulbs, with 12 V trifilar you will see not even
a glow in the bulb.

Robert49 did report a "clicking sound" here. A possible clue to a missing component. What makes clicking sounds? A spark gap maybe? I also heard about the resonance sound from another source who I just can't remember. JB or Mark McKay? Not sure.

A relay to switch the light bank as an ballast to the generator
not to burn the gen coils ?

If I am correct, and it works in attraction, the flux will be held within the case and very little will leak out. This would mean that the reason the the trifilar coil are wrapped around the case for only one reason, convenience.

I still believe it is possible for the trifilar coil to be used in a way that Babcock showed us, as a choke to store energy. This coil would then impedance match by supplying whatever voltage is required to maintain current in the motor.

Yes you could. But the magnetfield arround the trifilar will interferere with
the rotating field in the GenMo (Generator/motor combo).

The Idea of resonance in the motor is not without merit, but suffers from problems. The bigest being that the inductance in a motor constantly changes as it rotates, and as load varies. How to make a circuit respond to this is problematic and I was unable to do it.

An OpAmp is fast enough to do an PID , measure the resistance and
instaneous output a difference signal to the MOSFET driver -> adjust L properly.

but in resonance the losses in the coils are almost zero. Xl=Xc=0 (in theory)
so drop in Amp from the power supply at constant rpm (when you feed constant Voltage to the motor)
or rising RPMs with constant current supply.

another approach: (not tested, but inspired from JB SG Cap Discharger)
charge a capacitor (diode) inside the Resonance loop.when you reach the 30V then you can "click" an relais
to push the joules from the cap to the Motor. (KICKMode)
say "in the right moment"
Resonance is short lost, but the motor turns further (momentum)
the resonance should reestablish and the cycle repeats.


Ismael Aviso:

He find a way to short circuit the motorcoils at the right moment to
(on the peak of the sinus wave) and charge insteanous a cap without
"lenzing" the generator out !

so you could use 2 Coils of the generator and close them
with lowest (!) resistance at the peak (when rotorfield approach the statorwinding)
so you recycle power and say bye to Mr. Lenz
No Lenz no Drag on the generator. perfect


OK Mr Brown.
I will shortly forget the resonance mode.
So if there is no LCR system at the moment.
how will you connect the parts to get a working model ?
What I have overseen ?

[mbrownn]

Robert49 did report a "clicking sound" here. A possible clue to a missing component. What makes clicking sounds? A spark gap maybe? I also heard about the resonance sound from another source who I just can't remember. JB or Mark McKay? Not sure.

Think about this as a cause for the clicking, at startup and low speeds anyway. If we have capacitor discharge into the motor, the currents could be huge, this would cause all the components to flex with the pulse of magnetism. Imagine the coils and even the wound capacitor flexing with each pulse. If the capacitor was charged as high as 400v as I believe either JB or PL suggested, the current could be kA and the magnetic field monstrous. It would be like a MRI scanner being turned on.

Wonderful! A saturation issue for sure, but not a brick wall. Yes, on the "waaa waaa wa ..."

I have no idea, but it got very hot and started to smoke

With the expertise mbrown has collected on magnetic flow in motors/generators and your firm grasp of resonance, Hans, I believe you two could solve this thing.

Good Luck,
Randy

Thanks for your complement, but my expertise is only a result of persistence. It may sound like I am saying the thing that Hans is looking at wont work, I am not. Remember I thought this way too at one point, and even tried to make it work. Unfortunately I was unsuccessful so I can only report my failure. Its not about telling people to do it my way, its about finding out how it worked. Even when we do get it to work, it may not be the way it was actually done hehehe

[mbrownn]

for the Lockridge device there are not so many possibilities of working
with such a small count of pieces. But maybe not all pieces are present to us
(like always )

This is very true

EM Radiations ?

If I am correct, and it works in attraction, the flux will be held within the case and very little will leak out. This would mean that the reason the the trifilar coil are wrapped around the case for only one reason, convenience.

>but a series LCR will live with an cap in series of an L
around a case and then you will certainly put the cap arround the coils !!!


so I like the idea of a L1 and Cap in series , parallel with L2 and a R load
but this needs now to be build and measured.
everytime the magnetic lines will travel across the coil (yes that will 90 degrees from the other coils in the generator in faradayspeech)

Yes, the coil would seem to be wound the wrong way. There is another possibility that I looked at. If you wanted to create a magnetic diode, that is make it so the magnetic poles do not reverse despite any AC in the coils you could put a coil around the part of the flux path to do so, but as you pointed out, again it is 90 degrees out.

Q1:
but for this idea, the the coil is not winded horizontal for this, it is winded vertical to collect rotating lines of force (magn.)
or what you think ?

So you get a kick in L1 and then a damping wave will occur with C that will
induce a higher voltage with less current in L2 to the R (300W bulbs)
to consume the power.



Fig A, B
some possibilities how to connect the trifilar coil with C and R

Fig C:
You can light a 230 VAC bulb with 40Volts if you drive it resonant to
get as much light as a 230V 25W bulb on mains directly.
the cap is not a polarized one like an EL-Cap you buy a motorcap for
this because this LCR (R=lamp) circuit is a damped oscillator at
50 hz .

Paul Babcock and Jim would be happy now because we talk about their project
as you learned in "babcock magnet secrets" how to multiply the power of light vs. fuel consumtion.
Paul: "going forward and back to the load , over and over again" JIM: "use the power more than one time" etc. etc.
they build a LCR oscillator/transformer with the windings from the diesel gen.
But this you know allready ?



Humming coils:

Sorry I didn't. I gave up on resonance as a primary function of the machine and followed a more simple and obvious path but that does not mean I am right. I encourage you to investigate this as far as you can, you will probably do a better job of it than I did

Keep giving us your thoughts as there is probably a lot that I missed on this

[tachyoncatcher]

What is your source that you mentioned eye witnesses in first sentence? I've seen every video made on the Lockridge device. Did I miss something?

Robert49 did report a "clicking sound" here. A possible clue to a missing component. What makes clicking sounds? A spark gap maybe? I also heard about the resonance sound from another source who I just can't remember. JB or Mark McKay? Not sure.

I have literally heard this, waaa waaa wa wa wa wa waaaaaa is the best way I can describe it.
I believe I got a gain, the voltage went up, the current dropped and the motor got very hot. The gain was in heat.

Wonderful! A saturation issue for sure, but not a brick wall. Yes, on the "waaa waaa wa ..."

Humming coils:

With the expertise mbrown has collected on magnetic flow in motors/generators and your firm grasp of resonance, Hans, I believe you two could solve this thing.

Good Luck,
Randy

[HansKammler]

humming coils and measure coils

The idea of the variable LEM Radiations ?

>but a series LCR will live with an cap in series of an L
around a case and then you will certainly put the cap arround the coils !!!


so I like the idea of a L1 and Cap in series , parallel with L2 and a R load
but this needs now to be build and measured.
everytime the magnetic lines will travel across the coil (yes that will 90 degrees from the other coils in the generator in faradayspeech)

Q1:
but for this idea, the the coil is not winded horizontal for this, it is winded vertical to collect rotating lines of force (magn.)
or what you think ?

So you get a kick in L1 and then a damping wave will occur with C that will
induce a higher voltage with less current in L2 to the R (300W bulbs)
to consume the power.



Fig A, B
some possibilities how to connect the trifilar coil with C and R

Fig C:
You can light a 230 VAC bulb with 40Volts if you drive it resonant to
get as much light as a 230V 25W bulb on mains directly.
the cap is not a polarized one like an EL-Cap you buy a motorcap for
this because this LCR (R=lamp) circuit is a damped oscillator at
50 hz .

Paul Babcock and Jim would be happy now because we talk about their project
as you learned in "babcock magnet secrets" how to multiply the power of light vs. fuel consumtion.
Paul: "going forward and back to the load , over and over again" JIM: "use the power more than one time" etc. etc.
they build a LCR oscillator/transformer with the windings from the diesel gen.
But this you know allready ?



Humming coils:

[mbrownn]

What is your source that you mentioned eye witnesses in first sentence? I've seen every video made on the Lockridge device. Did I miss something?

Sorry so scattered,
wantomake

I believe it was Robert49 but I could be wrong.