Joulethief SEC exciter and variants

[totoalas]

Hi Slider and Jim
Thats what this thread for
Watch and learn not only do the talk but also do the walk lol
Every post is always an improved replication or new variation
keep it up

totoalas
MIB welcome here joke joke joke

[Slider2732]

No probelsm over here at least, that's my own line too and really does relate very neatly within this thread, in my opinion.
The mixtures, concoctions, experimental results that combine and evolve are part of what we see within these pages that Jonny started.
The pie tin oscillator has the incredibly efficient for size trigger coils, the Tesla towers mix principles of Tesla's work with modern day electronics. Elsewhere discussed, the pulse motor JT firings by Lidmotor bring in neodymium exotics, to potentially deliver high potential SEC's.

I hope to post my new combination device later and do think it relates to this thread...or at least will do. It may need a thread of its own, though, I know the principles are again an assemblage of techniques well documented, yet only self discovered and used in recent days.
It's a PC fan, powered normally, but at 6V and using 130mA. 6x neodymium magnets around the outside of the now bladeless rotor. A coil is mounted on one side and, by using a triggering Hall sensor and transistor at the exact firing point to collapse the coil by shorting it, we get a neon to light. A small neodymium is placed behind the coil, increasing the output and reducing cogging (a link to the RomeroUK/Muller work by others). All of this foray follows the watching of some videos about Ed Leedskalnin and Coral Castle, combined with the recent self runner pulse motor that fleetingly graced my work table.
Output so far is recorded crudely with my Sperry SP-6A as 8V AC with 25mA, yet the neon lights.
Next is to single wire rectify the output of the coil (just like the aforementioned White Crow pulse motor), feed it back in to the motor drive circuit and see what happens.
Also, to run the rectified output through a Joule Thief circuit of probably Mr. Nunnerley's recent design or the one I made similar to Dr. Jones' circuit...to power a Walgreen Tesla tower.
If my table begins to lift and the USS Eldridge appears on top of the house, then i'll consider the experiment a success

[jimboot]

Maybe something for Jim (if indeed this wasn't his original idea), to use pick up coils from a pulse motor to directly power a Slayer exciter. Wireless energy powering a wireless energy device

Wish it was trouble with my pulse motors is when running on a hall switch the speed keeps picking up until the physical limits of the rig are reached. On a Rodin coil setup with a pick up I got a neo spinning at 250k which charged a cap to 50v in under 12 secs. Think I may burn out a tranny pretty quick? My company has been occupying my time recently sooo many great projects so little time

Since working with single wire, rodin, tesla longitudinal waves, SEC etc, im finding I have a disconnect with devices like the muller, bedini & joule thief type circuits even tho I want to build them this idea that electricity is a natural phenomena that we should be tapping into resonates with me more (pun intended) . The fact that we can create plasma, power 4' fluoros etc at 5v with 2 coils and a tranny is insane and far more worthy of investigation than Steven Jones circuit even though I think it's great he is embracing alternate research. My ultimate goal like most ppl here, is to take my house off the grid. I believe that, now more than ever, it will come from extracting power from the aether. Even prof jones doesn't understand where this extra energy is coming from in his device. 1 wire circuits vs 2 wire seem like apples and oranges to me. I know I only started building circuits 17 months ago but We've all seen some extraordinary things in that time. I don't have a point here except To say I want to understand more what is happening with a sec and single wire than i do with two wire , apologies if im being a bit ranty

[twinbeard]

I am pretty sure. Tested with multiple scopes, Plus I chose the core material and tuned the windings for a high Q resonant circuit in that band, so its pretty much what I expected. There is a parasitic capacitance in there between the two layers of windings that handles the C part of the LC, it appears.

Cheers,
Twinbeard

Are you sure that the ringing is not caused by the test equipment? A scope probe, for example, has some capacitance, and that may be interacting with the inductance. It may help to put a resistance in series with the probe to damp the ringing.

My Supercharged JT (Watson's eBlog) seems to have a point where it is broadly tuned. Typically it likes to have a capacitor in the 560 pF to 1 nF range. The frequency is typically three or four times that of a conventional JT.

[Slider2732]

The 1 magnet motor of Jonny's is something else to look at yeah...there are so many ultra efficient ways of doing stuff in these forums to have a go at !


Experiment today is to further modify one of my own pulse motors, with 24V relay generator coils. After that, build one using Joule Thiefs - which type of Joule Thief might even include the Michael John Nunnerley design that he posted yesterday.
I'm intrigued as to what gen coils may add or subtract or alter at this small size of device. After adding a coil last night, I saw the spinning wheel begin to wobble slightly at low revs, which answered a question about the replications, also that there was definitely a sweet spot for power out vs speed of rotation. LED's will light well with no FWBR on this dinky setup.
Perplexing situ though occurred. When I looped back with an LED across, the LED lit at 3V, went dimmer as the voltage was raised and then went suddenly to white hot at 12V and fizzled with a puff of smoke. Also, a 1000uF capacitor that was put in the loop got very very hot on one leg
It's a pretty good wireless energy distance when drawing a relay coil near the spinning motor LOL...I mean, that's how it could be considered with such systems...a transmitter coil and then all the way over the other side of the spinning disk you can pick up energy with no wires !

Maybe something for Jim (if indeed this wasn't his original idea), to use pick up coils from a pulse motor to directly power a Slayer exciter. Wireless energy powering a wireless energy device

[totoalas]

You can run an exciter off a Joule Thief as is. It w

Lid's Romero/Muller on twin Joule Thiefs is something to behold indeed. I haven't worked out how he uses the generator coils as the coils for the JT circuits yet though. Would like to try that..

Hi Slider
Jonny's one magnet motor has also a big potential on the Muller gen
Everybody ' s racing to OU but here is much better efficiency well proven
by our guru's lol

totoalas

[Slider2732]

Want to see if I cant get output high enough to run my exciter

You can run an exciter off a Joule Thief as is. It was something tried personally a while back and just out of curiosity. Folks were using the cellphone boosters and I thought the output most probably would be working like a JT.
Any setup that will run from 1.5V has no troubles with the 3V or so off the end of a JT. The pulsing carries no parasitics it would seem, off to the exciter transistor. I would imagine that things would be best with the JT transistor switching at half the speed of the exciter one, but imagine is all that I have for that idea, cos it works as is

Lid's Romero/Muller on twin Joule Thiefs is something to behold indeed. I haven't worked out how he uses the generator coils as the coils for the JT circuits yet though. Would like to try that..

[jimboot]

The new variant has caught my attention too. I'm happy to read that you have one running Jim
Mine began its run almost 36hrs ago and is fading off now. Components were similar but not exact. Dr. Stiffler mentioned in the named thread about this, that a red LED isn't the best of choices for results assessing...reds can light off an AV and wire to Ground for example and I see that point. White LED's would appear to be a better choice, particularly as they would form any long run lighting solution for casual viewers/users.
My first one has used an AAA battery that was found in a door pocket of our car. I'd changed the batteries on our older digital camera in winter and a couple of dead batteries had just sat there from probably November. We got the new camera at New Year. Transistor is a 2SC1213, 11 turn 1" toroid.
Pics below.

Where the circuit may help your thoughts boguslaw, is that by default design the output can be adjusted with the 10K pot that sits in line with the output LED. It regulates the output as expected and is about the simplest method for current control eh. On the input side, I guess you're thinking about efficiency with known constraints, the way that the circuit would have known values independent of input current from the powering source ?
The Wiki entry for current limiting shows a few tricks: Current limiting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Collector current reductions of a transistor seem viable. I can certainly see the point of the load draw creating swings of difference inside the circuit, rather than relying on input from the power source to change. And there being little point to warming up a simple resistor as input clamp.

The pics below show my Steven E. Jones replication at start up (voltage reading 1.4V), after 24hrs (voltage reading 1.0V) and now at nearly 36hrs (voltage reading 0.6V). Not scientific in any way, just shows the circuit runs well and for a good length of time.

Nice work Slider, I'm seeing 1:4 ratios on my scope for volts (not power) in vs out and .03 lost overnight after a run of 9 or so hours. Not that impressed yet based on other stuff I've seen folks do. Will do some more tuning tonight. Great to see academia getting involved in some of this alternate research though. Want to see if I cant get output high enough to run my exciter

[totoalas]

Lidmotor JT driver for Muller gen

Great work Lidmotor
Hope somebody can try a Slayer mini to drive and even replace the cores of Neogen coils






totoalas

[Slider2732]

The new variant has caught my attention too. I'm happy to read that you have one running Jim
Mine began its run almost 36hrs ago and is fading off now. Components were similar but not exact. Dr. Stiffler mentioned in the named thread about this, that a red LED isn't the best of choices for results assessing...reds can light off an AV and wire to Ground for example and I see that point. White LED's would appear to be a better choice, particularly as they would form any long run lighting solution for casual viewers/users.
My first one has used an AAA battery that was found in a door pocket of our car. I'd changed the batteries on our older digital camera in winter and a couple of dead batteries had just sat there from probably November. We got the new camera at New Year. Transistor is a 2SC1213, 11 turn 1" toroid.
Pics below.

Where the circuit may help your thoughts boguslaw, is that by default design the output can be adjusted with the 10K pot that sits in line with the output LED. It regulates the output as expected and is about the simplest method for current control eh. On the input side, I guess you're thinking about efficiency with known constraints, the way that the circuit would have known values independent of input current from the powering source ?
The Wiki entry for current limiting shows a few tricks: Current limiting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Collector current reductions of a transistor seem viable. I can certainly see the point of the load draw creating swings of difference inside the circuit, rather than relying on input from the power source to change. And there being little point to warming up a simple resistor as input clamp.

The pics below show my Steven E. Jones replication at start up (voltage reading 1.4V), after 24hrs (voltage reading 1.0V) and now at nearly 36hrs (voltage reading 0.6V). Not scientific in any way, just shows the circuit runs well and for a good length of time.

[boguslaw]

I have a question related to Steven E. Jones circuit , well maybe not directly.
How I can power such a circuit with steady input amperage ? I mean I'd like to have a power source or circuit producing steady amperage and a variable voltage (but voltage should be variable by hand not randomly).
Is there a way to suppress input current to any level for example no more then 50ma ?

[jimboot]

Prof steven jones claims ou with joule thief variant Steven E. Jones demonstrates overunity circuit

Built one of these this afternoon. Not getting same results yet, need to do some more tuning.

[jimboot]

Well, the problem may be that the AV plug is made with 1N4148 diodes. These are good for a maximum of 75 volts, some go as high as 100 volts. So say you used two 1N4148 diodes to make the half wave voltage doubler (AKA AV plug), and the two diodes have about 180 volts breakdown voltage total. So when the rectified voltage gets up to 180volts, one or both of the diodes break down, and limit the maximum output to 180 volts.

So you could play games with the 1N4148s and put two in series instead of one. That should double the breakdown voltage. But it also doubles the forward voltage drop and there will be more loss. You could get some higher breakdown diodes such as the BAV21 (200V IIRC) or get some UF4007 rectifiers. The 1N4007 rectifiers have poor reverse recovery time and are very lossy at frequencies above powerline frequencies. They may be 1000 volts and common as dog doo-doo, but they are not recommended for this situation.

If you put two 1N4148s in series, the voltage may climb up to 300 to 400 volts, and then the breakdown could again become a problem.

Thanks Watson!

[jimboot]

Prof steven jones claims ou with joule thief variant Steven E. Jones demonstrates overunity circuit

[totoalas]

Collateral Damage

Below is an excerpt from Ewatson blog




Collateral Damage
What I find laughable and dismaying is that some of these neophyte experimenters have burned out a half dozen or more transistors on this or similar circuits in a single day/evening, and yet they still persist on feeding it transistors. They apparently have not learned that a transistor has maximum limits that must not be exceeded. When the transistor is switching between on and off, it is at the point where it must dissipate the most power. But if it switches quickly, then this period is small compared to the overall time of one cycle. The transistor can handle quite a bit of current, without requiring a heat sink.

The transistor has a certain Vce(sat) or saturation voltage, collector to emitter. If you switch the transistor on, then the Vce(sat) multiplied by the current will give the power dissipation during this on time. For instance, if the Vce(sat) is 0.5V at 1 amp, then the power dissipated is a half watt.

This power and the power during switching add up to the total amount of power the transistor dissipates. Transistors have a maximum power and if this is exceeded the transistor will overheat and go into thermal runaway and most probably will be damaged.

However there is another action that happens when current gets high. A local spot in the transistor chip may get hotter than the surrounding area. Then the heat causes it to be lower resistance than the surrounding area, so it draws more current. This vicious cycle continues and quickly causes the transistor to overheat in that area and it will melt and permanently "punch through" and become a short - you can check it with an ohmmeter and it will measure zero ohms emitter to collector.

If your circuit needs more current, then you should replace the smaller transistor with a larger, higher power transistor. You can use one that is made to be used with a heatsink. Or you can keep the current low and save transistors.

One thing that may help prevent this is a simple miniature incandescent lamp. One that has a rating of 6 volts at a quarter of an amp, for instance. This is inserted in series with the transistor and as the current goes up. the lamp's resistance goes up, too. When the current is low the lamp barely glows or glows not at all. As the current goes up, the lamp starts to glow and more and more of the power is dissipated across the lamp. If the lamp suddenly gets bright, then it is likely the current has become excessive and the circuit may have stopped working, or the transistor has gone into thermal runaway.

But this lamp is no excuse to have a poorly designed circuit. The circuit needs to be designed so that it will be inherently stable and not destroy itself. If you're finding that you are using a steady stream of transistors, it's time you had better step back and do a little learning about electronics and how to prevent this "collateral damage" due to your experimentation.

However I really don't get my hopes up. You have to remember that some of these "experimenters" are way out in left field when it comes to theory (or maybe even out of the ball park), as can be deduced from the way they go through transistors like toilet paper. Some go through 2N3055 power transistors at an alarming rate, and don't seem to learn anything from the experience. Like one of our instructors said, every expert was once a beginner. But when one doesn't learn what not to do from one's experiences, then it's obvious they should take up skydiving and save the rest of the world from their short circuited circular pattern of repeating the same mistakes over and over.