LiFePO4 Batteries - Lithium Iron Phosphate

[Aaron]

Here is some info about the LiFePO4 batteries. 5 time the life cycle of lead acids and way safer than typical "Lithium Ion" batteries (cobalt), which are toxic and flammable.

They can be used with the Bedini SG technology or even Bedini's chargers. These batteries are constant voltage until they drop off the cliff so you get full capacity for nearly the entire time.

Lead acids need to be pushed to 15.0 to 15.2 to be truly charged and fully desulfated - these LiFePO4 batteries only need to be pushed to 14.8 to be fully charged.

At the end of this article, there is a link where you can see a video by Peter talking about these batteries and there is a link under that video where you can download a free powerpoint presentation on these batteries.

LiFePO4 – Lithium Iron Phosphate Batteries | A & P Electronic Media – Digital Publishing by Aaron Murakami & Peter Lindemann

[moflint]

Hi, can LiFeP04 batteries receive a direct charge from flyback voltage, or does this kind of stuff need to go through a capacitor?

[Aaron]

lifepo4

Hi, can LiFeP04 batteries receive a direct charge from flyback voltage, or does this kind of stuff need to go through a capacitor?

It wasn't thought that they should receive the flyback, but Paul Babcock has a 24v SSG system and he charges the output lifepo4 batts with the flyback and his system works great. I don't know what the long term effects will be but they do indeed charge incredibly well. I can't guarantee that there won't be negative effects and the batteries are expensive so go for it if you're willing to take the risk.

For sure, they do like steady DC.

For capacitive discharge, I don't know anyone that has done that with lifepo4s.

[serendipitor]

Do the LiFePO4 cells also exhibit the same type of differential rates of movement between the positive and negative charge carriers, as do flooded lead acid batteries? This would mean that these cells could also be induced to "charge themselves". It would be great to get away from the old lead weights!

[moflint]

It wasn't thought that they should receive the flyback, but Paul Babcock has a 24v SSG system and he charges the output lifepo4 batts with the flyback and his system works great. I don't know what the long term effects will be but they do indeed charge incredibly well. I can't guarantee that there won't be negative effects and the batteries are expensive so go for it if you're willing to take the risk.

For sure, they do like steady DC.

For capacitive discharge, I don't know anyone that has done that with lifepo4s.

Thanks Aaron - that's interesting to hear Paul's results with lifepo4 batteries - worth a try as the benefits are considerable in a mobile application.

[spacecase0]

I have 2 sets of LiFePO4 batteries
they are quite amazing,
very hard to get when I got them,
but now quite easy to get
I payed about 100% of the price in shipping
so it seems to me that the officially allowed lithium ion batteries are only viable due to them being easier to get...

[altnergy]

I have an URGENT need to know if this type of battery needs to have a BMS installed when charging with Bedini style radiant crarging technology. Likewise does LIfepo4 batteries need BMS to discharge them in normal use as in powering an AC Inverter. God bless and be well!

[Aaron]

BMS was never used on any of the lifepo4 banks that were used in any of the SG type applications.

[altnergy]

Greetings and Felicitations of the Holiday Season to one and all!

I AM contacting you because there are No Power Lines here so I AM truly Off Grid. As such I Am only interested in large batteries appropriate for a homestead, 100Ah 12v minimum.

I Am retired, on Social Security and working on building up a homestead with indoor plumbing, electrical, heated building, etc. I recently moved out of a tent and into a small cabin. There is much to do, I AM in good health, multi skilled, familiar with solar power and radiant energy, and Highly Motivated.

As such I want to maximize all the power I can get and the usage of my time.

Many of you here have ANSWERS that can help me a lot in saving time and stretching my budget.

Last year I as budget allowed, I purchased (6) 100AH FLA batteries and MPPT charge controllers. I Am now reconditioning those 100Ah batteries using radiant charging.

To help with power in the meantime two weeks ago I got (2) 6v 235AH, FLA Golf Cart batteries.

Still I need more power. So before I budgeted for more batteries I want to learn more about Lifepo4 and radiant charging.

My experience with these so far is xix months ago I was refunded for (2) 100Ah Lifepo4 batteries that kept "going to sleep" and needing to be revived to accept a charge. Apparently it was a BMS issue. I used MPPT charging for these because I was misinformed on a solar forum that radiant charging is not good for LIFEPO4 batteries. (Likely this is also a BMS issue) So i haven't considered any more Lifepo4 acquisitions.


So what I want to know is from any of you who are actually using radiant tech and Lifepo4 is HOW to use radiant charging with LIFEPO4 batteries.

ANY diagrams, videos, etc. showing / teaching charging of lifepo4 batteries with Bedini style charging will be graciously appreciated!

The only ones I have seen relates to the Bedini Tracker chargers that are not available for sale.

Additionally I would like the option to use Solar Panels as input power.

Also the option to use solar oscillator circuit that operates in as little as .7vdc would be nice to use at times.

My condolences on the passing of Paul Babcock. In his video he described a process of battery swapping, which he said is essential.

Will you who are actually doing this, (not just theory) be kind enough to share detail with us how this is done. I purchased the Energetic Poor Mans Battery Swapper video stuff years ago, surely these has to be a better, simpler way by now.

Some DETAILED step by step instructions would truly be a blessing to all of us.

Thank you Aaron for letting me know that NO BMS has been used with radiant charging or the usage of Lifepo4 batteries. For a few years I have studied how to build my own LIFEPO4 battery packs for individual 100AH cells. I can get these at an affordable price and perhaps build up one or two per month.

Also Aaron, I've read up on what you have to say on GROUNDING RODS used in conjunction with Bedini charging methods. Do you think grounding the solar oscillator circuit would have any benefits?

ANY assistance and advice is GREATLY appreciated!

God bless and be well!

[Aaron]

altnregy,

lifepo4's can go to "sleep" if they are charged a bit too high because either the bms or charger allows it because nothing is perfectly regulated. The circuit will cut out and will prevent it from delivering power until the voltage drops below what it is supposed to be at. I've seen this happen multiple times with 16.8v 2300ah or so lifepo4s. Charger goes green, I disconnect charger and turn on the device and nothing. It's frustrating.

As far as I know, Paul never had any bms system for his banks. He charged some 24v bank with a Bedini SG using the normal spike from the inductor and it worked great. Batteries were swapped and "stair stepped" up in voltage to where both batteries wound up higher than they were when he started. Peter and I saw that in Paul's garage years ago.

In more recent times before he died, Paul had larger lifepo4 banks on the front and back to run the multie coil air core SG type systems with automatic battery swapping and they were charged with the spikes. It worked better than any lead acid variation because the impedance of the battery was lower. Any impdance dissipates the potential of that high voltage spike so lower the battery impedance, the more gain you'll get.

That's about all I've witnessed. Of course, I can't guarantee anything with your own lifepo4 results.

For the ground rod, please see if you can find a relevant discussion to ask that in or start a new one if you can't - in the relevant place. I'll respond there.

[Mario]

Hi Aaron,

do you know the approximate battery size of his smaller 24V system, and from what voltage to what voltage he was dcharging/ischarging? I ask because I haven't been able to see step charging, this with 4x8 Ah LiFePO4 batteries. I also wouldn't know where to find batts without BMS, do they sell these?

regards,
Mario

[Aaron]

Hi Mario, you can get 3.2v "prismatic" cells to build your own battery and there is not BMS. I don't recall the Ah rating for each 24v bank. You can get these cells on Amazon, Ebay, etc.

Here's an example of what they look like: LiFePO4 Cells

It's pretty amazing that you can now get these kind of batteries for less than some lead acids for the same Ah if you really look. It took years, but it's happening.

4 x Trojan T105 batteries parallel and series is 12v 450ah or so and costs over $800 now. I have this bank from years ago in my boiler room.

Here's a 12.8v 460Ah LiFePo4 battery (with BMS) for close to the same price: LiFePo4 Battery

It's 105 pounds and is a constant voltage battery.

The Trojans are 62 pounds each for 248 pounds!

Before spending big money on these kind of batteries, I'd just start experimenting with smaller size to get a feel for them.

Paul had those results with a pretty normal SG. For his larger, more sophistocated builds, keep in mind that his switching circuit was quite a bit different. Paul's circuit had faster on/off times and wasted almost nothing when turning on and when they're off, they're like a mechanical switch as much as possible. Some of this will be explained here if there is enough interest.

[Mario]

Hi Aaron, thanks. There sure is interest from my part and I'm sure from others as well.

regards,
Mario

[altnergy]

Happy Thanksgiving Day one and all

And I AM truly thankful that God has directed me to good people like you!

YES Aaron the BMS sleeping issues is weird!

Also on the BMS issues, the battery. brand is called NewtiPower and AFTER purchasing I found info in their literature that they recommend that their batteries NOT be assembled in banks or they will not charge properly! Yet even as singular batteries the sleeping issues persist and it has NOTHING to do with OVER charging. The MPPT controllers are set to the Newtipowwer Specs for charging and the BMS would not even allow the batteries to go above 13.3VDC even though the battery specs called for more!

ALSO I totally concur with Mario on this matter where you say...

"Paul had those results with a pretty normal SG. For his larger, more sophisticated builds, keep in mind that his switching circuit was quite a bit different. Paul's circuit had faster on/off times and wasted almost nothing when turning on and when they're off, they're like a mechanical switch as much as possible. Some of this will be explained here if there is enough interest."

We are not only interested, we NEED as much details, directions, schematics, parts listings, etc. as you are willing to give us on ALL of this!

The WONDERFUL difference between you Aaron and a lot of others in the matters of alt energy is that YOU ALWAYS GIVE DETAILS and HIDE NOTHING!

You TEACH with CRYSTAL CLARITY!

I Am reminded of a comment you made on the Meyers Fuel Cell Forum when you admonished others in the forum saying something to the effect..."When we all started it was agreed our collective results would be OPEN SOURCE and now it seems some of you are NOT keeping your word!"

Aaron it pleased my heart to hear you say that! And it reaffirmed to me that YOU are a MAN of Good intentions and standing! Indeed worthy of my friendship and trust!

More than ever before we Need your help!

God bless and be well!

[altnergy]

Hello again Aaron. I just received qty 12 74Ah Lifepo4 cells and I Am hoping to have any charging and battery swapping information you possess as per your comment Dated 11/26/2025

"Paul had those results with a pretty normal SG. For his larger, more sophistocated builds, keep in mind that his switching circuit was quite a bit different. Paul's circuit had faster on/off times and wasted almost nothing when turning on and when they're off, they're like a mechanical switch as much as possible. Some of this will be explained here if there is enough interest."

Aaron ANYTHINg and Everything you have to share and teach us on this matter is useful to and will be GREATLY appreciated by everyone on this forum thread. as echoed by Mario! We are ALL Eager to learn what you know.

You are certainly one of the BEST teachers we have!

God bless and be well!