William F. Skinner - 1939 Gravity Power

[shylo]

video

Hi All, just got the video posted over at ou, if somebody wants to put it here their more than welcome. Here it just keeps saying failed to load maybe not enough room I don't know?
artv

[shylo]

lower shaft

Hi All, I made a video put it in zip format tried to load it but after 45min. I gave up. It shows clearly how the top shaft does an orbital motion along with the back and forth all by itself.
The real question for me is the way the lower shaft is connected to the translation plate. I tried a bearing in the shaft , solid pin in the shaft , in both case the shaft was free to move on its' own, but when I loaded the output the bottom would stop rotating.
So I'm going to try locking it solid or maybe partial slip then engage.
Maybe the plate is solid to the upper only I'm not sure?
artv

[ARMCORTEX]

You know what, just have 3d printed an elliptical path and just motion control it with 4 elecromagnets , on the edges of the ellipse.

And I prefer my chain drive arrangement, I call it ARMCORTEX slotted chain drive''.

Encoder on the weights, 4 small motors, can bus, ARMCORTEX LPC4300 series

Get the party goin. Ur so jelly Aaron.

Schweet !

[Aaron]

Montreal troublemaker

Hey scumbag !

Thx for the idea !

I was thinking all day long about a curbed chain and attachment.

Back off with your mouth Lawrence!

[purelyprimitives]

I came across this patent application, it seems on the outset that the principle is very similar, here is the patent

Patent US20130047754 - Mechanical advantage machine - Google Patents

I have not yet fully thought about this yet (the patent), but the system for power generation of this thread is very doable, it is as of yet the most promising free energy machine if looped, and why not.

regards

Mike

Interesting. It seems with this design you could eliminate the entire top half of the Skinner design.

[ARMCORTEX]

Hey scumbag !

Thx for the idea !

I was thinking all day long about a curbed chain and attachment.

[Aaron]

Murakami Elliptical Drive

Here - one of my secrets I was testing a year ago on small scale, which essentially replaced the translation coupler with a pulley to cause the lower shaft to move in slightly elliptical orbit. The degree of the ellipse was limited to the angle that a self-centering bearing would allow for so I only was able to do a slight ellipse by tilting the input motor to drive the pulley. Ideally, it would be a pulsed motor pulsing when the shaft is at the ends of the ellipses.

The translation coupler is best but again was just some tests I was doing.

However, using the translation coupler and needing to move the upper part of the input lever in an ellipse, I will show what I think is the simplest method to DIRECTLY convert a circular motion in one plane to an elliptical motion in another plane. Others might be doing this concept in other applications but since I can't find it online, I'm calling it the Murakami Circular to Elliptical Converter or Murakami Elliptical Drive.

I've never shown this before. I have gone back and forth over various ideas and tests in the last 1-2 years on all of this and I think this will make it easy for just about anyone to create the elliptical motion for the input lever in the most simple way...as long as we can get a self centering bearing or similar part that accomplishes what is in the video.

Arto - you probably know exactly what is needed for this - it is pretty self-evident in the bicycle wheel demo that I do at the end of the video. After going back and forth through many ideas, this was actually the original concept I came up with and is why I have that pulley with the offset bearing in it because that is what I started with for testing quite a while back. The degree of elliptical-ness is determined by the tilt of the wheel...the more the tilt, the more elongated the ellipse. Do you know of a self centering bearing or something else that would give me 45 degrees tilt for example to give a serious ellipse?

Here it is - hope you all like the concept. Murakami Elliptical Drive - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbMUrY5MynA

[Aaron]

empty can

In one shot you can see the bottom of the top weight, much to my surprise it looks like it might be mostly empty, anyone see that? There is what appears to be a bar across the bottom of the empty can of a weight..

On the original machine video? Please elaborate.

[Aaron]

looping the machine

it is as of yet the most promising free energy machine if looped, and why not.

With this kind of gain, it looks easy to loop. The output can turn a generator to produce way more electrical than is necessary for the input motor and since it is a disconnected or isolated energy feedback, the machine still stays open. "pseudo-looped"

[Aaron]

tilted advantage

I came across this patent application, it seems on the outset that the principle is very similar, here is the patent

Patent US20130047754 - Mechanical advantage machine - Google Patents

I have not yet fully thought about this yet (the patent), but the system for power generation of this thread is very doable, it is as of yet the most promising free energy machine if looped, and why not.

regards

Mike

PS. I note at the moment on other forums as well as here, the normal people who feed on putting things down, really have stayed away, I wonder why!!! maybe they don't really have an argument against it

I don't know how related this is but the patent drawing of the tipped wheel reminded me of some toys I'm starting to see on new playgrounds.



Everyone knows what a plain merry go round is...perfectly level with the ground so the whole thing is balanced.

This toy is different, the triangle platform is tilted just a couple degrees and makes all the difference in the world - I know because I played on one! lol

Just by being tilted just a bit, gravity can contribute...of course coming up against gravity on the other side has resistance against gravity but the point is, if you sit or stand on it after jumping on and getting it spinning around, by "pumping" it by holding yourself out and pulling in at just the right moment when you're on the falling side of the tilt, it will spin pretty fast and will keep going and going and going. There really is no comparison to a level wheel.

[eltimple]

I've seen those before, I really like that - if it can be beefed up to handle our desired purpose, might work well. Here is en easy one for people to see a mechanism. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQRa1hjYbfs

I will have finished my very simple one in a few days , just 2 cogs..

[eltimple]

In one shot you can see the bottom of the top weight, much to my surprise it looks like it might be mostly empty, anyone see that? There is what appears to be a bar across the bottom of the empty can of a weight..

was able to get my coaxial lever made to day, it will sit in my gimbal mech being able to transmit ellipsoid or circular paths..

Nice drawings!

[Aaron]

Elliptical mechanism

I think the expression you are looking for is "Orbital Ellipsograph"

I think this may explain what you are trying to say ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3kqxyDjuBo&feature=kp

this being the rotation imparted to the shafts right up at the top.. Ellipse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

now if you had one of those guiding the shaft around just imagine

I've seen those before, I really like that - if it can be beefed up to handle our desired purpose, might work well. Here is en easy one for people to see a mechanism. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQRa1hjYbfs

[artoj]

Center Section

Hi All, regarding the spring loaded lower wobble shaft(WS), the action reminded me of some a the parts I have supplied for some old devices I had supplied some bearings to about 20 years ago, it had a very delicate torque requirement, very light about 100 grams force or it would break the product otherwise, we opted for swivel joints that we spring loaded, this would give low counter force when its balance was upset and would not force lock the mating surfaces and begin frictional torque actions, it proved a success. When I first seen the WS in action it looked as though the frictional torques had been removed by a end device design of some sort, or acted like a gravity center guide that had a small possible variable length.

I have help thousands of engineers and designers complete the details of their material needs of their production machines, each machine has hundreds of moving and swiveling parts, they just need to be orchestrated correctly so the input requirements aren't too demanding. With the Skinner Device he used what was available and used his knowledge of machine design with that of orbital mechanics to reduce the input and gain leverage within a system, Aaron is correctly stating, if you only use circular motion, you will end up with what you started with added losses, no matter how hard you try. Nature does not use perfect circles.

Only by understanding the translation of circular to elliptical can you start to engineer the bifurcation of forces that will give you a chaotic equilibrium, which is the first design nature uses in all its works. All natures ellipses are perturbed, so you must design a system that begins with a circle, creates an ellipse then use the nature to allow a natural perturbation, this will give you what I refer to as Egg dynamics, The nature in the Skinner machine is his great understanding of counter forces and the decoupling from all stages until both spinning and gravity add to the imbalanced dynamic.

I am glad to see everybody taking a great interest in this machine and some of the geometry involved. The debate of the top mechanism, is simple to resolve, apply all possible solutions then a consensus can be gained. In my way of thinking, you cannot actually see the mechanism, so as I have done, I came up with many solutions, and will slowly discard those that will not function to give me the best results, less friction, correct actions to maximize the perturbations of elliptical cycles that will always give you 2 or more centers of gravity. This can be done by physical experiments or by mental gymnastics and a good general knowledge of all the multiple problems involved. I have chosen the second route, as I have had 30 years of solving difficult machine friction and design problem on a daily basis, with the parts supply and supporting the needs of a diverse range of the experienced and highly technical engineers of both the new and old school and hands on machines builders.

The best out comes will be for all those involved as I am happy to share my experiences and knowledge with those who are interested. As I have said previously, I would be very happy to replicate skinners device as we have witnessed on video. Thanks to all the encouraging help from everybody, I am very close to solving all the details and materials lists, so if there are interested parties who live in Sydney, I am only an email away, or a bike ride.

Here is another page I have almost completed, The 13" shaft is not attached to the center pivot(CP) only the offset plate (OP). Regards Arto.

[Michael John Nunnerley]

It seems that the basic principle is the same, that is moving the center of gravity reference to a mass and not the mass itself, the moving of the center of gravity taking a lot less energy than can be obtained from the falling mass, and that is OU with no counter argument "as of yet"

I think the idea had been foregotten, especially with no internet and at that time cheap oil. Being an engineer of 63 years, I am really quite excited by this, as of yet I have not found a fault in how it works, really something so simple few have thought about it, I take my hat off to Mr. Skinner

With modern day means of fabrication, a reasonably cheap generation unit could be made, and improved upon. The only thing against it at the moment is possibly it's size, but there again in the basement of a home with a small DC motor to start it up off a battery, would not be a problem, the battery being maintained by the generator.
I think also it could be made to run very quietly, certainly no more than a diesel generator.

Keep up the good work guy's, I think we have a winner here

regards

Mike