Proof that flyback is enough to sustain a self-runner

[brian516]

Hey there all,

Here is the rundown: I built a simple pulse motor similar to the one Lidmotor has. I have dubbed it "The Simple Amazing Pulse Motor". I have been playing with it for a week or so now. I actually got it tuned to the point where it is no longer draining the battery I have connected. The battery is a single-cell NiMH 1.2V 2000mAH. I have made a video of it for all to check out. I am going to leave it running until something happens to stop this effect from manifesting, whether that be a cat messing with it, the nail-axle that I'm using breaking free from it's position, or whatever else may happen to mess up my tuning. Right now, it is all about the positioning of the reed switch that matters... Once I got the device to create/allow the flyback to make it back to the battery every single time the magnetic field of the coil collapsed, the effect began manifesting itself.

I wanted to start a thread for this device so I could share it with you all, and so I can better understand exactly what is happening, and what the factors are that matter most in re-creating this effect. I will gladly take more video for you all, and draw up to-scale diagrams of the parts necessary to attempt a recreation of it if you would like.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5AMHdxCbo3g

(sorry for the narrow vid, I only have my cell phone camera to use for now - at least it's HD though! )

It's now about 2 hours since I made that vid, and it vibrated the wire out of position a little, but fortunately I was able to get it back into sync. I got smart enough to put a dab of hot glue to hold it in place. Let's see how long this little baby will keep it up!!

[mbrownn]

These Devices are great aren’t they

The truth is without collecting the other things going on in the device it will never quite be 100% self running. The amount of power in the inductive kickback will be equal to the input less ohmic losses so is less than 100%.

Transients do contain electrical charge with no current and so can have an effect on charging batteries, particularly lead acid ones, but the truth is you are collecting both the transient electrical charge plus the inductive kickback current which makes your device unexpectedly efficient.

Lead acid batteries charge with anomalous efficiency when charged this way and this may be the case with your device. As Bedini said "Its in the batteries"

With a Bedini SSG I was never able to get it self running because electrically the device was only 97% efficient and I never had a suitable battery swapper, but by converting the mechanical output to electricity it should be possible.

What you are not collecting is the motor mechanical power and the magnetic field energy outside of your coils. If you do this then you will join the select few that have performed this feat.

Unfortunately the problems increase when you scale it up but the principals are sound. One problem is batteries, they are very expensive when compared to the amount of usable power gained but learning from these simple devices it may be possible to do away with the batteries where our gain is manifesting. (Capacitors perform much worse that batteries)

This is oversimplifying but this is the basis of my thoughts

Input = 1
Inductive kickback = 0.9+

Both of these can be used to power the motor

Motor efficiency @ 35% = 0.665

Total 2.5625

I only achieved 1.15 but it was proof enough for me.

I wish you every success in this endeavour.

[Zardox]

Hi Brian, I like it. Take a look at this video ( Ferrite Core Coil Induction - YouTube ) you might try adding this to your setup.

[Joit]

Your video Zardox?



I am still curios what the Batteries are at after 24 hrs or 2 Days

[brian516]

Last night, about two hours after posting, the wire I had propping up the reed switch seemed to vibrate out of position, causing the battery to drop down to 1.229V before I had put it back into position and secured it with glue. I decided to give it a break and mess with it more today and see if I could get the effect back. Apparently it has a lot to do with the specific battery voltage of 1.233V -- This morning I put a fresh charged battery in and just let it run, and it has now been at 1.233V again for an hour or so. We shall see if the same thing happens again that happened yesterday, and if so, the wire never moved, and it has something to do with the inefficiency of the batteries.

--mbrownn - it is a NiMH 1.2V rechargeable, not lead acid. I think you know that and were speaking of if this device were to be scaled up and using lead-acids, but I thought I would mention it just in case.
How would you suggest I go about trying to harness the energy from the magnetic field around the coil? If I am to attempt to harness any mechanical energy from such a small device, I am going to need to use magnetic, frictionless bearings instead of the cheap pressure fit nail setup I've got going on right now, that way I'm not creating any more drag on the device than I am right now..... It's definitely a great idea and I greatly appreciate your knowledge, input, and support, as I do everyone elses!

I think I'm going to design and build a new device on the simple pulse motor foundation to attempt to harness the energy that you have mentioned I am currently not taking advantage of. I'm going to try to do it economically, yet make it so I'm able to customize it as much as possible - A simple pulse motor testing platform, if you will..

--Zardox - thanks for the link, I will definitely give a ferrite core a try, once I find one that's thin enough to fit inside of that tiny coil. It's about 4mm I.D..
For now, I'm going to leave this motor as-is, and any mods I do to it will be mods that I can do without adding to or removing any of the main components. I will build a testing platform asap which I will make so I can change rotors, magnets, add/remove coils, different types/sizes of batteries, etc. I just don't want to modify this device to where I can't get it back to exactly where it is right now... for obvious reasons.

I'm getting some fantastic results out of the device that I have next to the simple pulse motor, the mini Bedini SG that I made for charging my 3.2V batteries until I build a real LiFeSO4 battery charger... I've had it running on the same 3 batteries for 3.5 days now, and it is just now getting close to shutting off. I've charged up nearly 8 Volts worth on batteries so far, so maybe all these effects have something to do with the NiMH batteries, specifically?? I'm going to have to do some extensive research into all of this....

I really appreciate all of your support, input, advice, and knowledge in my endeavors to learn as much as I possibly can, and contribute back into this awesome quest for cheap, off-grid energy, and more knowledge than we currently have!
--Brian

[Zardox]

Joit - No it is not my video as I don't have a camera.

Brian - The video is not about the main coil. He uses a second coil with a ferrite core at 90 degrees to the main coil to light a led without the motor slowing. Possibly another way to draw energy from the system for routing back into the system or charging or lighting or whatever. Just looks like there is some potential there.

Best of luck with your experiments.

[Joit]

Ok Zardox. Ty

I was only about to mention that Magentite works better for cores, it got close no drag on the Rotor, when there is drag, then its from the Coil. The Induction is the same or even better then ferrrit with some simple cores.

Brian if you got some at the hand, you can try it to fill a small tube like a pen with Magnetite as core, stamp it in and seal the ends with something hard. glue or wax or whatever.
You can try some iron wire too and put it one by one in as J.B does at his cores.

This NIMH Batteries what are now on the market hold the Voltage better at her max and deplete the current first. I used some too at a device and it runs pretty empty at her max Voltage.
Even, i got once one weird motor running too a while without loose anything, maybe there is a resonance point at this Voltage. May you try more Batteries to see if you come out of this point or the Batteries still keep the charge and its the flyback effect. But still, 2 ah take a while to run them off.

[brian516]

Zardox - I'll have to give that a try. for now, it'll have to be a coil that is near the same size as the drive coil I have on there, so it might not work too well, but I'll also try it on my other devices, too. I'll post the results.

Joit - I don't have any magnetite off hand here, but I don't think it will be that hard to find in my town. lots of jewelry/bead stores that sell all kinds of minerals and crystals. The core that I'm currently using is made of the iron wire you speak of, actually. It's the 'rebar tie wire' that is used as a substitute for the R60 weld rods. I'll have to try some other batteries, like the LiFePO4's if it can handle the voltage, and I'll also give it a shot with some alkalines, too. We'll get to the bottom of this and see if I really am getting a semi-self running effect or if it's just depleting the current before it registers any voltage drop... I need new fuses for my fluke, so I am currently limited to only measuring current up to 200mA. No one has the fuses around here, so I'm going to have to just order some, and they are quite pricey. $15 per fuse is pretty crazy.... maybe someone knows of a better place to find the busman 44/100 and 1000 fuses...

I definitely need to figure something better out for my axleshaft, this nail setup just isn't going to cut it when I'm attempting to obtain such precision tuning.... I'm definitely going to go with mag-lev for my next setup, that's for sure.
The pulse motor ran for 4:45 and stayed between 1.322V and 1.324V, but while I was over there messing with the batt charger, the axle got a little off center and scrooged it all up. I'm going to continue testing with what I've got now anyway though. Just going to have to figure out the proper amount of weight to put on top to keep just enough, but not too much pressure on the axleshaft. Hopefully I get my hands on fuses or a new meter soon so I can actually measure current on my devices. I've got some more vids from my other devices that I'm uploading now - Slayer exciter fun and going to do the batt charger soon, too.

Thanks for all the input, guys!!!
Brian

[mbrownn]

--mbrownn - it is a NiMH 1.2V rechargeable, not lead acid. I think you know that and were speaking of if this device were to be scaled up and using lead-acids, but I thought I would mention it just in case.
How would you suggest I go about trying to harness the energy from the magnetic field around the coil? If I am to attempt to harness any mechanical energy from such a small device, I am going to need to use magnetic, frictionless bearings instead of the cheap pressure fit nail setup I've got going on right now, that way I'm not creating any more drag on the device than I am right now..... It's definitely a great idea and I greatly appreciate your knowledge, input, and support, as I do everyone elses!

I think I'm going to design and build a new device on the simple pulse motor foundation to attempt to harness the energy that you have mentioned I am currently not taking advantage of. I'm going to try to do it economically, yet make it so I'm able to customize it as much as possible - A simple pulse motor testing platform, if you will..

The first way to harness magnetic energy from the motoring is to simply put a generator coil next to the spinning rotor but this introduces drag and cogging. The cogging can be reduced by having multiple coils, but always equally spaced around the rotor and one less than the number of poles in the rotor. The output coils be AC or DC depending upon your rotors magnet configuration.

The second method is somewhat counter-intuitive, we close the loop on the power coil and set the motor to run in attraction That means we have a piece of iron coming from the back of your power coil to the opposite pole of the magnet on your rotor. This way you maximize the flux in the rotor/coil interaction and maintain it within the core of the iron. Now you wind a second coil on that iron in a different location to your power coil but as far away from the magnets as is possible. This coil will then have an AC but not sine wave output via a transformer action, and as it is distanced from the magnetic poles any BEMF will be reduced. The downside of this, is that due to the lowering of the inductance of your power coil, caused by the transformer action, your recovery to your battery will be less, but this energy is not lost as it is seen in the AC output coil.

As your device is so small it will be very difficult to do but consider this on a larger version.

At the moment you are limiting the current to reduce power consumption and this modification has the opposite effect as it increases current. This isn't a problem as we see that current as an output in the transformer action in the first half of the AC wave. The second half of the AC output is what you get for free (not exactly but would take too long to explain here)

You would need very low resistance power and secondary coils, but with relatively high inductance so the coils will be big. What you need for good motor torque is ampere turns (Amps x Turns). Notice voltage is not part of the equation so this is how we limit the input power, use low voltage. The input DC voltage is effectively doubled in the output. A 1v DC pulse results in a 1v output on your secondary, when the pulse stops the coil goes negative and you get a second -1v pulse in your secondary, effectively a differential of 2v.

In fact what I am proposing is so different to what you are doing, we probably should not discuss it here, and should talk about it on a different thread.

[brian516]

mbrownn - - I have no 'quams' about discussing the type of machine you propose on this thread, especially since it seems that you are the only person actually giving any feedback to me on it. I believe I get what you are saying.... without an illustration, let's see if I can describe what you are speaking of and get it right.... if we are looking at my current device (scaled up), if I were to take a G shaped soft iron 'core', place the top of the 'G' at the back of my coil, and have the inner hook part of the 'G' going underneath, under the rotor, and pointing at the inside portion of the same magnet that is currently facing my coil, I would have the soft iron 'core' you speak of...
However, doing so in that manner on that setup would leave me with nowhere far away from the rotor to put my 'transformer coil' that would effectively reduce the BEMF... so rendering the current design ineffective for a setup such as that.

Maybe the larger setup that I've built but am not currently utilizing would be a good way to fast-track a test platform for this. (it's not the one I have the mini sitting on in that vid, but is similar. lots more magnets and much better mounting)
I can see that there are many different ways of doing this. having the magnets positioned at the outermost edge of a rotor sounds easier to me. Kind of like the device 'MrAngusWangus' has in many of his vids, except whatever he is doing in those vids seems to be completely off base for anything other than strange experimental designs... in my opinion.

In order to have low resistance, high inductance coils, I would be using much larger diameter wire, correct? thus making my coils much bigger, requiring a bigger platform, bigger magnets, etc.... sounds like in order to get such a device correctly built, it would all need to be to specific proportions to maximize the effects we're looking for, and minimize the ones we are attempting to avoid... going to have to build a setup with what I have and perform some testing to figure out how best to do this. I'm still at the beginning stages of all of this, but the best way for me to learn is hands-on+research, not just research. I'm a visual learner!!

On another note, I broke the reed switch on the lil guy!! haha oh well, i'll just have to attempt to tweak it til I get it back where I want it.... but at the moment, it seems that I may have created a little solid state charger of sorts. It ran the batt down, and when I repositioned the rotor so a magnet was facing the coil (the way it was sitting was sucking every last bit of juice out of the battery), the voltage began climbing, and I don't think it was only the battery settling. I'm going to leave it overnight and see what happens. It seems to only happen when I have it set up as an air-core. It seems like everything that I touch, something cool happens!!!

[mbrownn]

, if I were to take a G shaped soft iron 'core', place the top of the 'G' at the back of my coil, and have the inner hook part of the 'G' going underneath, under the rotor, and pointing at the inside portion of the same magnet that is currently facing my coil, I would have the soft iron 'core' you speak of...

Correct

However, doing so in that manner on that setup would leave me with nowhere far away from the rotor to put my 'transformer coil' that would effectively reduce the BEMF... so rendering the current design ineffective for a setup such as that.

Just place your second coil on the G shape as far away from the pole pieces as possible. The same has to be done with your power coil too.

Maybe the larger setup that I've built but am not currently utilizing would be a good way to fast-track a test platform for this.

Sounds good

I thought about modifying a Bedini SSG with a bicycle wheel but the problem is getting the back of the G close enough to the back of the magnet. The Bedini circuit might limit the current too much.

In order to have low resistance, high inductance coils, I would be using much larger diameter wire, thus making my coils much bigger, requiring a bigger platform, bigger magnets, etc

Correct

....... sounds like in order to get such a device correctly built, it would all need to be to specific proportions to maximize the effects we're looking for, and minimize the ones we are attempting to avoid... going to have to build a setup with what I have and perform some testing to figure out how best to do this. I'm still at the beginning stages of all of this, but the best way for me to learn is hands-on+research, not just research. I'm a visual learner!!

your just like me

On another note, I broke the reed switch on the lil guy!! haha oh well, i'll just have to attempt to tweak it til I get it back where I want it.... but at the moment, it seems that I may have created a little solid state charger of sorts. It ran the batt down, and when I repositioned the rotor so a magnet was facing the coil (the way it was sitting was sucking every last bit of juice out of the battery), the voltage began climbing, and I don't think it was only the battery settling. I'm going to leave it overnight and see what happens. It seems to only happen when I have it set up as an air-core. It seems like everything that I touch, something cool happens!!!

Thats what is so good about real experiments

As we wish to have torque in our motor to power the generator coils it may be that a reed switch wont be able to handle the power, so consider a commutator.

If you do decide to take this project on, start to think of it like this, It is a transformer/motor/generator combination.

It is an offshoot of the work I am doing, so your results will be very interesting to me. and I will assist as best I can. The configuration of the coils is important in this respect, they cannot be wound on top of each other or bifilar, they must be side by side coils as this will force the flux of the transformer to pass through your magnets.

The reason we move the coils far away from the poles, is to eliminate as much as possible BEMF. BEMF is caused to some extent, by the lateral movement of flux within the coil, as your coils will be a distance away, there will be little lateral movement, especially if there is a bend between the poles and the coils.

You need to switch off the power to your coil before the current has maxed out. Higher inductance means you have a longer pulse. Drawing current from the secondary will lower inductance, so we have a trade off here.

We can experiment between pulling the magnets in, and pushing them away, with the pulse to see which gives the best output. I favour attraction as it keeps the flux of the magnets in the core longer.

There is more to come but the post is getting a bit long now

Good luck

[brian516]

have you read anything from UFOpolitics about his Asymmetric electrodynamic machines? it seems that the same exact thing we have all been working against (BEMF or CEMF) is exacly what we should be working to harness and have assist us. Apparently it gives quite large 'feedback' pulses (though at a different frequency than the input) when the magnetic field collapses... and just like any inductor, the polarity of that is reversed from that of the coil when it is energized. I'm going to continue with the build we are talking about, since I have the magnets/rotor completed already anyway, but I'm going to continue to research his work also and at some point build a small model of his device. you should check it out too. In my opinion, he is heading in the right direction, as the UFO motor/generator corresponds directly with the motor/generator on Tesla's patent 390,721.

For a much better representation of what I'm talking about, check out his vid:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mj4rV0AoI-Q&list=TLcZhQ6kt6uPqRokI-1RgpZbCKAUQtrYEp

also, the links for the pages on this forum:

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/11885-my-asymmetric-electrodynamic-machines-215.html#post253407

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/10529-my-motors-got-me-tap-into-radiant-energy-31.html

(sorry I didn't want to have to lose my place on them, so they aren't the first pages)

There must be other ways that we will be able to have CEMF work with us instead of trying to fight it, other than only a device in the config that he is currently using. It's going to take a lot of research and learning to figure it out, after all, I still don't 100% understand exactly the different types of motors and their windings and how they work... yet. It shouldn't take me long to get it, and when I get it, I can apply Mr Tesla's gift to me, his mental abilities, and 'run simulations' in my head! haha

[brian516]

Just place your second coil on the G shape as far away from the pole pieces as possible. The same has to be done with your power coil too.

So if I were looking at a standard Bedini setup, having an 'imaginary' G core setup (though it doesn't work on it, lets just say its there for the purpose of this question), I would most likely need to have my power coil a bit farther away than the standard 1/4-3/8" that is used? I would most likely keep this adjustable, using a few dots of hot glue at the ends of the coil to hold in place for each experiment/run, or maybe some thick rubber bands on front and hot glue on back.

I thought about modifying a Bedini SSG with a bicycle wheel but the problem is getting the back of the G close enough to the back of the magnet. The Bedini circuit might limit the current too much.

Couldn't you just redo the magnets so they are mounted on their side, so that N faces left, S faces right, or vice verse, and mount your power coil to one side? That way you can still utilize your current device and not have to build a whole new machine..... thus saving you some money?

Thats what is so good about real experiments

As we wish to have torque in our motor to power the generator coils it may be that a reed switch wont be able to handle the power, so consider a commutator.
:

I don't have any experience with anything more than transistors or reed switches yet, but the concepts are quite simple to me still. I'd definitely like to get into some hands on with commutators, and also opto switching.. I find opto a little more fascinating at the moment, since it looks a little easier and cleaner once you learn how the control circuitry works, unless I'm missing something.... If this device is intended to charge batteries via cap dump for later use thru inverter, then a commutator would probably be better, wouldn't it?

If you do decide to take this project on, start to think of it like this, It is a transformer/motor/generator combination.

It is an offshoot of the work I am doing, so your results will be very interesting to me. and I will assist as best I can. The configuration of the coils is important in this respect, they cannot be wound on top of each other or bifilar, they must be side by side coils as this will force the flux of the transformer to pass through your magnets.

The reason we move the coils far away from the poles, is to eliminate as much as possible BEMF. BEMF is caused to some extent, by the lateral movement of flux within the coil, as your coils will be a distance away, there will be little lateral movement, especially if there is a bend between the poles and the coils.

You need to switch off the power to your coil before the current has maxed out. Higher inductance means you have a longer pulse. Drawing current from the secondary will lower inductance, so we have a trade off here.

We can experiment between pulling the magnets in, and pushing them away, with the pulse to see which gives the best output. I favour attraction as it keeps the flux of the magnets in the core longer.

There is more to come but the post is getting a bit long now

Good luck

When you say 'the coils must be side by side' are you saying that, in order to do this properly, the G core will have to 'split' at a point, so the power and generator coils can be directly beside of each other, or is that just a loose way of saying that it cant be bifilar (since their magnetic flux would interact and more or less kill the purpose of the machine). If the latter, then they can be 'end to end' style, but obviously as far away from each other as possible, and gen coil as far from magnets as possible?

So as far as controller/input circuitry goes, a 555 timer setup should work for now? or am I going to need to go full on FET's (haven't really gotten into learning much about those just yet, but again, the concept seems fairly straight forward, but I'm sure there are many variables, as there are many, many, many different FETs out there..)

Sorry for all the noob-ish questions... I don't mean to be a PITA, but I want to make sure I know what Im doing so I don't waste my time on simple noob screw-ups.

I'm definitely going to build this, regardless of the UFO motor project. It seems that it would be quite a good learning tool for me, and useful to you, too. I already have a rotor and stand setup made, and it will allow for me to add-to, such as adding a commutator, or opto, or flywheel, or generator at the other end.... actually it already has a second rotor on it now that acts as a flywheel. It's all magnets from speakers, though. I'm not really seeing that as too much of a drawback, though. they are quite powerful. I've noticed that no one seems to be noticing that those specific style of magnets act as two separate ones when you center your coil to their center.... they make their devices with them, center the coil on the magnet, and don't realize that there isn't crap for a magnetic field where their coil is aligned to, except for the outer edges, so instead of N S N S N S, you get NN SS NN SS.... but if using w poles facing all same direction, obviously its like doubling the magnets. One of my rotors (the 8 mag rotor) is set up N S N S, and the 6 mag rotor is all poles same direction. if need be, I can take the mags off the 8 mag and put them all facing same side, but maybe it would be nice to have the two the way they are now for testing purposes. what do you think? I'm about to go to bed, so ill take a few pics of it tomorrow and link them on here so you can see what Im talking about....

[mbrownn]

UFO does some excellent work, but I must admit I haven’t been following it. He is right about asymmetry and he is working on ways of solving the problem, I’m sure he will have great success. My method of asymmetry is quite different although people have told me often about his success and made comparisons.

So if I were looking at a standard Bedini setup, having an 'imaginary' G core setup (though it doesn't work on it, lets just say its there for the purpose of this question), I would most likely need to have my power coil a bit farther away than the standard 1/4-3/8" that is used? I would most likely keep this adjustable, using a few dots of hot glue at the ends of the coil to hold in place for each experiment/run, or maybe some thick rubber bands on front and hot glue on back.

The ends of your core want to be close to magnets but the coils themselves want to be further away, preferably after a bend in the core. Imagine a square shaped core with part of one side removed so that the magnets can pass through.

Couldn't you just redo the magnets so they are mounted on their side, so that N faces left, S faces right, or vice verse, and mount your power coil to one side? That way you can still utilize your current device and not have to build a whole new machine..... thus saving you some money?

yes

I don't have any experience with anything more than transistors or reed switches yet, but the concepts are quite simple to me still. I'd definitely like to get into some hands on with commutators, and also opto switching.. I find opto a little more fascinating at the moment, since it looks a little easier and cleaner once you learn how the control circuitry works, unless I'm missing something.... If this device is intended to charge batteries via cap dump for later use thru inverter, then a commutator would probably be better, wouldn't it?

I like commutators for # reasons, I am a mechanical guy and the switching is as abrupt as you can get. the third reason is im not good with electronics

When you say 'the coils must be side by side' are you saying that, in order to do this properly, the G core will have to 'split' at a point, so the power and generator coils can be directly beside of each other, or is that just a loose way of saying that it cant be bifilar (since their magnetic flux would interact and more or less kill the purpose of the machine). If the latter, then they can be 'end to end' style, but obviously as far away from each other as possible, and gen coil as far from magnets as possible?

Each coil can be located at any point on the core as long as it isn't near the poles. the coupling between the coils has to be done through the core and not directly as it is in normal transformers.

So as far as controller/input circuitry goes, a 555 timer setup should work for now? or am I going to need to go full on FET's (haven't really gotten into learning much about those just yet, but again, the concept seems fairly straight forward, but I'm sure there are many variables, as there are many, many, many different FETs out there..)

Any pulse generator would work as tong as you can synchronise the timing and control the duration, that’s automatic for a commutator.

Sorry for all the noob-ish questions... I don't mean to be a PITA, but I want to make sure I know what Im doing so I don't waste my time on simple noob screw-ups.

Don't worry, thats how we learn.

I'm definitely going to build this, regardless of the UFO motor project. It seems that it would be quite a good learning tool for me, and useful to you, too. I already have a rotor and stand setup made, and it will allow for me to add-to, such as adding a commutator, or opto, or flywheel, or generator at the other end.... actually it already has a second rotor on it now that acts as a flywheel. It's all magnets from speakers, though. I'm not really seeing that as too much of a drawback, though. they are quite powerful. I've noticed that no one seems to be noticing that those specific style of magnets act as two separate ones when you center your coil to their center.... they make their devices with them, center the coil on the magnet, and don't realize that there isn't crap for a magnetic field where their coil is aligned to, except for the outer edges, so instead of N S N S N S, you get NN SS NN SS.... but if using w poles facing all same direction, obviously its like doubling the magnets. One of my rotors (the 8 mag rotor) is set up N S N S, and the 6 mag rotor is all poles same direction. if need be, I can take the mags off the 8 mag and put them all facing same side, but maybe it would be nice to have the two the way they are now for testing purposes. what do you think? I'm about to go to bed, so ill take a few pics of it tomorrow and link them on here so you can see what Im talking about....

Good, Im glad you see the benefits of learning, I learned a huge amount from the SSG.

Im not sure about speaker magnets, but we can try it if that's all you have. I would like to run tests both as a monopole NNNNNN and as NSNSNS just to see what we get and how we can take advantage of each situation.

If you use a large square shaped core you can even put generator coils on the poles, but that would introduce a problem of interactions between the generated current and the transformer action. The reason I mention this is because that is the exact problem I have with my machine.

By building it without the generator coils on the poles we can isolate the transformer actions to some degree and study that, then by introducing the generator coils we can study that interaction.

If your wondering what my machine is, its the Lockridge device. This device I am proposing you build is basically a method of using a transformer to power a motor. The transformer will drop a little in efficiency because of the air gaps but effectively the motor is running for free. If the motor power is greater than the transformer losses then again we have proof of overunity.

[brian516]

Keep telling yourself that you aren't good with electronics and you won't allow yourself to learn more!! I know you don't want to hear that, probably due to the frustrations in trying to understand the functions of the electronics, but don't limit yourself.... if you allow yourself, you will learn in time. just give it a break when the real frustration kicks in, and come back to it, but don't give up on it altogether. That's how I learn things that don't just come to me easily. I don't mean to sound like some kind of therapist or something, sorry.

Do you have a link to the patent for the Lockridge device? or was it open source from day one? I'd like to get my hands on some documentation for it so I can understand your issues with it better. Videos just don't give me the opportunity to look at a static drawing, make notes on it, and visualize it and it's functions, advantages, drawbacks, and possible solutions.. etc.

Pics of the setup I've been speaking of:





It may not be ideal, but it's what I've got for now. At the moment, I am between jobs, so that is why I have so much time on my hands. It won't be this way for much longer, but this stuff is what interests me, so I will be working on it nearly every day after work. I'll be able to put in at least a few hours a day, and weekends.... But being back at work will be good for me, it will give me time to get everything else off my mind, and when I'm not thinking about certain this is when the creativity is at work on the other side of my brain, coming up with unique ideas and solutions. So once I have the resources to get more parts, I will build a more ideal device. It will be good to mess with things people don't normally use and see what effect it has, anyway. I'm an 'always outside the box' kind of guy, just like Mr Tesla was.

If you use a large square shaped core you can even put generator coils on the poles, but that would introduce a problem of interactions between the generated current and the transformer action. The reason I mention this is because that is the exact problem I have with my machine.

What are the advantages of using a square core over a round one?? When you speak of 'transformer action', you are speaking of the transformation of magnetic energy (or flux) into electrical energy via a coil on the core, correct?? One thing I think I'm missing here, is that I was thinking that the generator coil and transformer coil were one in the same, but it seems I am wrong... can you elaborate? Is 'transformer coil' being used as a loose term for any coil acting as a transformer, whether it be the power coil, or generator coil?? I believe this is an essential part of your description that I am completely missing....
--Just so you know where I am right now with the whole transformer thing, I know a transformer to be any coil of wire around a core that is connected to an input coil/core or magnetic device via the same core, that 'transforms' that input signal into USABLE electrical energy... therefore, when you are speaking of a transformer and power coil together, I'm picturing a bifilar (or tri, multi..) coil where one or more wires is used as power, and others are being used as a transformer output..... and when you are saying "transformer to power a motor" I am picturing that output energy being put right back into the power wires of the coil...... and the only way I see that really working is if there is an inductor of sorts between input and output that is being used to amplify the 'signal' via collapsing magnetic fields, since the same action taking place in the bifilar coil is going to be nearly the exact same 'power' on both wires(due to being on the same spool, same core, same magnetic field)... therefore needing some external amplification to improve the signal to compensate for the losses..... are you following me, or did I completely confuse you? I could be wrong, and making no sense, but that's how I'm seeing it with my current understanding of all of this.

Also what I see problematic about what I'm picturing that you are speaking of, is that, when the magnetic field collapses, its output is reverse polarity, higher frequency, etc.... so it most definitely will require an 'outside' device (**such as inductor, caps, fet... like a standard signal booster circuit**) to adjust the output before attempting to feed it back into the power coil. My understanding of magnetic fields and collapse effects, signal boosting, losses, all that stuff, is in it's infancy, so I could be completely off base, and if I am, please do correct me!! I don't want to continue learning something incorrectly and be stuck forgetting it all and starting over again!!

** If I am correct about this, and we do need to use a signal booster circuit, we could use the commutator to control the 'fet gate, that way it is all still in proper timing with the rest of the device, but we are going to need to constantly adjust the commutator until we get the right settings, so maybe for this, something a little different would be best, maybe the Arduino setup?? Which kinda bums me a little, because I'm learning so much already, and if that is the case, I'm going to have to learn more circuitry and also code.... which I don't really have a problem with doing, but it is going to take time away from the actual hands on with the machine... :/ and I don't have any arduino stuff, so i'll have to go buy it when ive got the money.. Talking it all over, and just giving it a shot with the commutator is probably the only way we are going to find out for sure. I know people have a natural problem with tending to overcomplicate things, so we will just start simple for now.... I hope I'm not frustrating you by talking about all this stuff that our project could lead to!! If I am just tell me, and I will just put it on paper for now and we will stick to what we must and get to the other stuff as we progress. Actually that sounds like a good idea to me, if it works for you!!