Just magnetic fields

[barbosi]

Keely

One of the things I didn't understand was his use of black and white regions in his illustrations.

I hope the following clip will take out of the picture the black and white blockage, just name them north/south, or +/-, or In/Out. It shows also the third "region", the Great equilibrium.
Magnetic Current 1.1 - YouTube

[machinealive]

Yes, AC

That is a fantastic little tool. Plus It led me to Oleg Jefimenko. I bought one of his books today. Electrostatic motors: Their history, types and principals of operation. I have the parts to put that together tonight after work, and start looking at some things, Thanks.

Hey Barbosi,
Careful of the Planck, the old QuantumMeister,
your mind may go blank,you'll become,...QuantumGeister,.

Machine

[BroMikey]

ThX

Great tool with 2 LED's as indicator.

Mike

@Machinealive


It was one of my greatest insights to see we are all delusional, there are no objects, no matter as we perceive it only an aggregate of smaller parts making the whole appear tangible. As well no field has ever acted on our conductors it has acted on all of the constituent parts of the conductor individually, one field acting on another. It is a peculiar thing that the translation of force always acts from field to field, that is no force has ever been applied to matter directly only the field fundamental to it.

I will tell you how to build a simple device which will forever change the way you look at everything. Take an N channel mosfet and attach a 9v battery with the negative terminal to the Source pin with a red LED in series (a series resistor may be needed)and the positive to the Drain pin. The N channel mosfet generally has a pinout of GDS(Gate,Drain,Source)from left to right looking from the front. The red LED turns on when a positive charge is present on the Gate pin.
Here is an equivalent circuit, Build this simple "electronic electroscope," a FET electrometer

Now leave the Gate pin open not connected and solder on a 3" piece of wire then touch it and the red LED will turn on indicating your body has a natural positive charge. Now hold the gate with one hand and touch only the single negative terminal of a separate 12v battery. The red LED turns off indicating the whole of your body now has a negative charge. You may now see the unseen which is ever present everywhere without our knowledge.

Now take a P channel mosfet and connect it to the same 9v battery, pinout is GDS, with the Source pin to the positive terminal with a green LED in series and the Drain pin to the negative terminal. Solder the P channel Gate to the N channel gate with the 3" piece of wire. If a positive charge is present the N channel mosfet turns the red LED on and if a negative charge is present the P channel mosfet turns the green LED on and if the charge is neutral neither will turn on which rarely if ever happens.

Now take a short length of wire and touch your charge detector to one end of it. Then move a magnet past the wire and you will see one of the LED's turn on indicating which state of charge is present. Now it gets interesting, connect a 1' piece of high resistance wire across a low voltage battery then touch the gate wire of the charge detector to the negative end of the resistance wire and move it towards the positive end. You will see the green LED come on bright at the negative end then at the center of the wire the green LED slowly goes out and the red slowly comes on all the way to the positive end. You have just learned through demonstration that at the center of every capacitance, every inductance, every resistance, every circuit, every field, of everything is a fulcrum or zero point dividing the forces. Why if you move the detector from your bare feet on the ground to your head you will find your feet more negative than your head, a separation of the charged state due to the resistance of your body. You will see your body charged highly positive near electronic devices when your feet are insulated from the ground by socks and shoes.

This is the unseen world that everyone has missed and it is also the reason most of my circuits and devices look like nothing anyone here has ever seen. I build things under an entirely different premise and they make absolutely no sense to those who can only think in terms of voltage and current, North pole and South pole.

So now you have a new tool to work with which will show us things we never could have imagined. Move past the narrow minded view the masses have created for themselves, there is a whole new world waiting for you to discover.

AC

[Allcanadian]

@barbosi
I always have to laugh at that image, they tell us it is only the free electrons which are mobile in a conductor and yet they show the current from positive to negative. In fact no scientist I have known has ever used conventional flow notation and I switched to electron flow notation over 15 years ago. The proper electron flow in a conductor is in fact from negative to positive. The negative has an abundance of electrons repelling each other while being attracted to a positive region of fewer electrons.

The general rule is that if an Electron(-) moves it is a current and if the Proton(+) moves the conductor is moving. It's funny that after a while conventional notation just seems ridiculous and I can't imagine why anyone would use it, I guess old habits are hard to break. In any case everything became much more clear when I made the switch and I am thankful I did early on.

AC

[barbosi]

@Siggi

[Allcanadian]

@Machinealive

There is one other scientist whose work I remember as a kid in school, I always thought that it was the coolest experiment, it always had me thinking. Robert A. Millikan. I always forget about this but I always get reminded.
In terms of the oil drop experiment, he was able use fields to basically float or lift an oil drop with a negative charge, he used this to measure the charge of an electron. I can't help but think that we are all just large oil drops, and if we could put a large enough static charge on ourselves, we could also float or lift.

It was one of my greatest insights to see we are all delusional, there are no objects, no matter as we perceive it only an aggregate of smaller parts making the whole appear tangible. As well no field has ever acted on our conductors it has acted on all of the constituent parts of the conductor individually, one field acting on another. It is a peculiar thing that the translation of force always acts from field to field, that is no force has ever been applied to matter directly only the field fundamental to it.

I will tell you how to build a simple device which will forever change the way you look at everything. Take an N channel mosfet and attach a 9v battery with the negative terminal to the Source pin with a red LED in series (a series resistor may be needed)and the positive to the Drain pin. The N channel mosfet generally has a pinout of GDS(Gate,Drain,Source)from left to right looking from the front. The red LED turns on when a positive charge is present on the Gate pin.
Here is an equivalent circuit, Build this simple "electronic electroscope," a FET electrometer

Now leave the Gate pin open not connected and solder on a 3" piece of wire then touch it and the red LED will turn on indicating your body has a natural positive charge. Now hold the gate with one hand and touch only the single negative terminal of a separate 12v battery. The red LED turns off indicating the whole of your body now has a negative charge. You may now see the unseen which is ever present everywhere without our knowledge.

Now take a P channel mosfet and connect it to the same 9v battery, pinout is GDS, with the Source pin to the positive terminal with a green LED in series and the Drain pin to the negative terminal. Solder the P channel Gate to the N channel gate with the 3" piece of wire. If a positive charge is present the N channel mosfet turns the red LED on and if a negative charge is present the P channel mosfet turns the green LED on and if the charge is neutral neither will turn on which rarely if ever happens.

Now take a short length of wire and touch your charge detector to one end of it. Then move a magnet past the wire and you will see one of the LED's turn on indicating which state of charge is present. Now it gets interesting, connect a 1' piece of high resistance wire across a low voltage battery then touch the gate wire of the charge detector to the negative end of the resistance wire and move it towards the positive end. You will see the green LED come on bright at the negative end then at the center of the wire the green LED slowly goes out and the red slowly comes on all the way to the positive end. You have just learned through demonstration that at the center of every capacitance, every inductance, every resistance, every circuit, every field, of everything is a fulcrum or zero point dividing the forces. Why if you move the detector from your bare feet on the ground to your head you will find your feet more negative than your head, a separation of the charged state due to the resistance of your body. You will see your body charged highly positive near electronic devices when your feet are insulated from the ground by socks and shoes.

This is the unseen world that everyone has missed and it is also the reason most of my circuits and devices look like nothing anyone here has ever seen. I build things under an entirely different premise and they make absolutely no sense to those who can only think in terms of voltage and current, North pole and South pole.

So now you have a new tool to work with which will show us things we never could have imagined. Move past the narrow minded view the masses have created for themselves, there is a whole new world waiting for you to discover.

AC

[Siggi1974]

Siggi,

It is cool that you want to put in some experiments magnetic fields and their interaction.
About 4 years ago I made a simple experiment to observe the behaviour of a conductor passed by DC in a magnetic field. Essentially the conductor was shaped as a swing free to move in top of a magnet. We all are being thought about a force F, field B, current I.... See Figure 8. It puzzled me that beside that force which drove and "locked" the cable in one direction, there was another stable position on the other side of the magnet. The other equilibrium position of the swing was giving the fieling the swing was "floating".
So Figure 8 tells the story of one force and yet there were 2 equilibrium positions. That law did not specified other prior positions of the conductor with regard to the magnetic field.

As a friend said, it is more usefull to see the field shape rather than the coil shape. And later, the fields interacton.

Good luck and don't let details escape you.

Barbosi,

Sorry, which Figure 8 are you refering to?

Regards Siggi

[barbosi]

Siggi,

It is cool that you want to put in some experiments magnetic fields and their interaction.
About 4 years ago I made a simple experiment to observe the behaviour of a conductor passed by DC in a magnetic field. Essentially the conductor was shaped as a swing free to move in top of a magnet. We all are being thought about a force F, field B, current I.... See Figure 8. It puzzled me that beside that force which drove and "locked" the cable in one direction, there was another stable position on the other side of the magnet. The other equilibrium position of the swing was giving the fieling the swing was "floating".
So Figure 8 tells the story of one force and yet there were 2 equilibrium positions. That law did not specified other prior positions of the conductor with regard to the magnetic field.

As a friend said, it is more usefull to see the field shape rather than the coil shape. And later, the fields interacton.

Good luck and don't let details escape you.

[thx1138]

I'm sorry, I could not read your document. Open office (is what I use) can open it but it shows blanks instead of pictures. Do you have the possibility to make it pdf?

Here you go. Grab it now. It's 10 times larger than the Word document so eats up my upload space. So I'll be deleting it again in a few days. Also note that the links don't work. The program I use to convert to pdf apparently doesn't handle the links correctly so I included the URL's in the pdf version.

[barbosi]

I got it. It's not a veiw of the actuality but a categorized model. Thanks.

You mentioned Keely in your post with the electron animation. I did a similar thing with Keely's work comparing it to the Standard Model particles some time ago. The illustrations aren't a representation of the physical structure of matter but a representation of the categories of matter's sub-particles. It's absolutely mind boggling when you consider he did his work with sound waves rather than magnetism or electricity. I attached the document.

One of the things I didn't understand was his use of black and white regions in his illustrations. When I put the document together I was thinking he was maybe showing matter and antimatter. But it could well have been that he was showing the two dominions, as I call them. The end of the document gets into radiant energy which would be Keely's energy derived from the disassociation of matter which we call nuclear fission today.

I'm sorry, I could not read your document. Open office (is what I use) can open it but it shows blanks instead of pictures. Do you have the possibility to make it pdf?

Recently I found this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZvv44IRabY) and if you pay attention to the first quote in the clip you'll be surprised about the identity of its author.

Some of your inquiries are briefely stated there.

As for the use of sound in Keely's work, I was surprised too. But regardless its methods which remain obscure to us till today, I think I understand the reason. It is the most commonly known form of longitudinal wave transmission. When one considers how sound propagates, thinking about transversal is really laughable.

Regards.

[machinealive]

Hey siggi

That looks like a fantastic setup to start testing. Seriously, that is a better setup then most would ever even try.

One other thing, AC mentioned the field, the workers noticed at the plastic shop. There is one other scientist whose work I remember as a kid in school, I always thought that it was the coolest experiment, it always had me thinking. Robert A. Millikan. I always forget about this but I always get reminded.
In terms of the oil drop experiment, he was able use fields to basically float or lift an oil drop with a negative charge, he used this to measure the charge of an electron. I can't help but think that we are all just large oil drops, and if we could put a large enough static charge on ourselves, we could also float or lift..

Machine

[Siggi1974]

Hey siggi

This is the 3 rd time I've tried and got booted, hate that. Have to re type everything.

I, personally, am trying to finish a couple things, not able to find a lot of free time. But I was trying to understand by following Tesla. His motor generator patents. The toroid, with coils oriented as you described, is what I was building, it looks as though same waveforms are obtained with double coils as Er has used, which look more like Leedskalnin's style, but I can't really comment on Er's work, but it looks similar to signal from my toroid. So, that is there, to explore.

So, I don't know if anything changes, this thread kinda got more philosophical than needed, but, in my mind, I was just trying to mentally picture and understand what Heaviside was talking about in terms of " the source of energy must, therefore, first supply the dielectric surrounding the wire before the substance of the wire itself can be influenced; that is, the dielectric field must be the real primary agent in the electromagnetic phenomena connected with electric current in the wire". I find this of the same nature as what Leedskalnin pounded away at, when he showed with practical examples in his book," from this you can see that the magnet can be shifted and concentrated and also you can see that the metal is not the real magnet. The real magnet is the substance that is circulating in the metal.

Also, I was loosely connecting quantum, Russell, four quadrants, it maybe all bs, but seems related to me, and also to sacred geometry, so that is interesting, at least to me. Nothing new if you knew, just trying to visualize.

One other thing, about pulsing magnet. Leedskalnin also," each particle in the substance is an individual magnet by itself, and both north and South Pole individual magnets. Each north and South Pole magnet is equal in strength, but the strength of each magnet doesn't amount to anything. To be of practical use they will have to be in great numbers". So, you know, if the earth is a big magnet, maybe start burying one end of conductors, and putting another conductor in space( dielectric) and try pulsing, or what ever you can think of, again, that is not a new idea..

Machinealive

Hi Machine,

Thanks for your comment. I know that you know the stuff very well and are very experienced in building machines and wonderful motors. So Erfinders find also made me think again in several directions. The patents in my opinion show most of the time machines but do not reveal the basic mechanism or understanding behind them. Therefore I appreciate a platform like this thread to look behind the walls and try to find out. Once one understood the nature of magnetism the rest could be fairly easy.
Ed did understand the Basics and therefore was able to build a motor and establish antigravity. I also believe that geometries do have an influence on phenomenas appearing in our space time. Maybe in terms of magnetic field shaping or energy flow patterns. But how can we find out if we do not try things on our own? So I am thinking of attached tests with my test rig to start with. However any comments would be highly appreciated.

Best regards
Siggi

[thx1138]

To be more clear, I find this an easy example (for those familiar) of Russell's concept: the Undivided ---> divided ---> reunited. Colors from my picture were not random eighter.
From the gravity center [the Undivided] the lines spring out [as divided] and when they reach the equator they return to the source [as reunited]. And that for each pole, thus forming a torus.

I got it. It's not a veiw of the actuality but a categorized model. Thanks.

You mentioned Keely in your post with the electron animation. I did a similar thing with Keely's work comparing it to the Standard Model particles some time ago. The illustrations aren't a representation of the physical structure of matter but a representation of the categories of matter's sub-particles. It's absolutely mind boggling when you consider he did his work with sound waves rather than magnetism or electricity. I attached the document.

One of the things I didn't understand was his use of black and white regions in his illustrations. When I put the document together I was thinking he was maybe showing matter and antimatter. But it could well have been that he was showing the two dominions, as I call them. The end of the document gets into radiant energy which would be Keely's energy derived from the disassociation of matter which we call nuclear fission today.

[machinealive]

Hey siggi

This is the 3 rd time I've tried and got booted, hate that. Have to re type everything.

I, personally, am trying to finish a couple things, not able to find a lot of free time. But I was trying to understand by following Tesla. His motor generator patents. The toroid, with coils oriented as you described, is what I was building, it looks as though same waveforms are obtained with double coils as Er has used, which look more like Leedskalnin's style, but I can't really comment on Er's work, but it looks similar to signal from my toroid. So, that is there, to explore.

So, I don't know if anything changes, this thread kinda got more philosophical than needed, but, in my mind, I was just trying to mentally picture and understand what Heaviside was talking about in terms of " the source of energy must, therefore, first supply the dielectric surrounding the wire before the substance of the wire itself can be influenced; that is, the dielectric field must be the real primary agent in the electromagnetic phenomena connected with electric current in the wire". I find this of the same nature as what Leedskalnin pounded away at, when he showed with practical examples in his book," from this you can see that the magnet can be shifted and concentrated and also you can see that the metal is not the real magnet. The real magnet is the substance that is circulating in the metal.

Also, I was loosely connecting quantum, Russell, four quadrants, it maybe all bs, but seems related to me, and also to sacred geometry, so that is interesting, at least to me. Nothing new if you knew, just trying to visualize.

One other thing, about pulsing magnet. Leedskalnin also," each particle in the substance is an individual magnet by itself, and both north and South Pole individual magnets. Each north and South Pole magnet is equal in strength, but the strength of each magnet doesn't amount to anything. To be of practical use they will have to be in great numbers". So, you know, if the earth is a big magnet, maybe start burying one end of conductors, and putting another conductor in space( dielectric) and try pulsing, or what ever you can think of, again, that is not a new idea..

Machinealive

[barbosi]

All I shared is a result of few years of quiet analysis of a few seemingly unrelated facts I found. As I stated before, I don't have the whole picture, yet I shared all I take as valuable. Many will find my findings of no value and understand and accept that. For anyone thinking there is some value, all I have to say is that things go more diversified when we consider the myriad of different situations when a magnet is involved.

First is the shape of the magnet itself: bar, horse shoe, cone, etc.
Second, the shape of the coil (helicoidal, [flat] spiral and any other coil shape one can imagine)
Third is the interaction with the coil, the relative position of the magnet to the coil and Siggi showed his interest towards the orthogonal position between the coil and the magnet. But there is more that two positions and Newman with his motor showed that a magnet can occupy a position inside a coil:


I think is fair that anyone can think of any possible combination, make his/her own judgment and perform some tests if necessary, to prove or disprove any theory under scrutiny.

Regardless the complexity of any embodiment, at the core remains the basic phenomena of a single wire passing through the magnetic field. The complexity of a coil or embodiment will follow the rules of a single wire passing through the magnetic field AND the rules imposed by self-induction.

A common denominator is the relative speed between the wires composing a coil and the magnet. And that is a common denominator with the electrostatic machines too.

All I'm saying is that one man's work may not reveal one machine to help making a hot tea. But by his sharing it may inspire another one's work. And if by Cosmic chance the others will have access to all progress and share their work too, we all we'll have a win situation. I know there are a lot of casual readers, a lot will look for inspiration for a new patent, but at the end of the day all I hope is that I could have inspired somebody generous enough to share for free his consequent ideas. Now is the best time to express all my gratitude for all inspiration I got thus far and it's more than fair if I pass on my findings. I am just happy if I could share what I got.

I pointed in two occasions to a youtube clip (the last one being http://www.energeticforum.com/249978-post185.html) demonstrating that what we take as granted, namely the inductance of a coil, is not a constant. It depends on the quantity/strenght of magnetic field in which is immersed into. If one rule has been broken, why not others cannot? But back to the coil, if we have a coil with a certain inductance and we let pass a certain current through it, that coil it will be immersed in its own generated magnetic field. The inductance it will change accordingly. A different current it will mean a different magnetic field, hence the inductance it will be different.
Ask yourselves questions and you'll see that many dogma are nothing but words covering a very specific situation, that's is nothing more nothing less, yet not enough to pass as a law.

I vividly watch Erfinder's thread (Self-induction) and the more I watch the more I come to the conclusion that pure dogma cannot stand anymore. We need to move on.

Anybody if you can add some value, you have the floor!