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  • Tidal Energy Idea

    Tidal energy could be exploited in the same manner as ships and weights used to generate electricity in locks. Steel structures similar to those used in construction or offshore oil rigs could be anchored to the sea floor near the shore. The steel beam “legs” of these rectangular or square shaped oil rig-like structures would be secured to the ocean floor and between the “legs” large ships, barges manufactured hulls and other vessels would float up and down with the tides, precision fitted between vertical rails that are attached to the main frame. Along the sides of the frame large weights would slide up and down pulled by steel cables connected to the vessel and looped around the top. Alternatively instead of weights, horizontal steel siding beams could be installed around the frame and connected to the vessel and slide up and down on outside rails. Cogwheel type turbines, and the floating vessel could be fastened to the 4 (or more) inside vertical rails for sliding up and down.

    First experimentally a decommissioned offshore oil rig could be floated to a desired site and a decommissioned very large ship could be placed between the “legs” of the rig and arranged as a see saw system. Eventually several such giant structures could be linked together near the shore and where the shore line is steep anchored to the shore for extra support. There is virtually no limit of placing a large number of such bobbing hollow vessels in favourable tidal areas, - perhaps hundreds or thousands. These vessels could be filled with very heavy “fake” cargo as long as the ocean is able to lift them up, after all aircraft carriers are lifted up by tides. Tidal barrages are considered environmentally damaging, while such floating devices pose less of a threat for the environment. But large floating structures raise several safety issues: storm damage, collision, snapping steel cables, etc. Aesthetic considerations could be ameliorated by placing containers with marine tolerant vegetation on the top of tidal posts, which from the distance would appear as artificial islands. Ice build up in cold climate waters perhaps would be broken up by the continuous motion. Also most of the world’s tides are not very high, and average 3 to 6 feet, though some areas boast several meter high tides, but the capacity of tides is expected to increase in future as the result of sea level rise due to global warming.

    This idea is in response to some discussion started in my original post about "Gravity as an Energy Source" (see the link below).


  • #2
    I see you're back to the idea of using decommissioned barges (or oil rigs) but if they're decommissioned due to corrosion, you're no further ahead. Did you notice corrosion as one issue with tidal generation although it can be reduced (to what extent?) through ionization and if you're generating electricity, that's not a problem.

    The ideas we discussed on that previous thread may be worth looking into. You may wish to contact university or gov't departments, environmental NGOs, etc to get an idea as to how feasible these ideas are. The next step then is to initiate public discussion about going ahead with them:
    a) inserting micro-hydroelectric generators into canal lock inlet/outlet ports
    Let's assume we have a 5 metre x 25 metre lock with a 5 meter drop that takes 5 minutes to fill or empty. That's 2.08 cubic meters/second falling an average of 2.5 metres producing 20 to 35 kWs. That's not much but how does it compare with small-scale solar or wind for initial cost and return on investment? The only question is about 'system efficiency' which is said to range from 40 to 70% in these micro-generators. Does it drop exponentially when water levels approach equilibrium due to backflow?

    Gross Head x Flow x System Efficiency x C (a constant) = Power (kW)
    2.5 m drop x 2.08 m3/s x from 40-70% x 9.81 = 20 to 35 kWs

    Recommendations:
    1. contact micro-hydroelectric generator manufacturers/distributors to discuss the feasibility, system efficiency.
    2: Contact canal operations staff for specifics: lock capacity, water throughput.

    b) Surface-based wave generating platforms (possibly coupled with some underwater current capture mechanism) to take over the functionality of protective breakwaters near harbours or coastal regions threatened by by erosion.
    Recommendations: same as tidal--see below

    c) Tidal power: here's what the the Canadian Encyclopedia says:
    "... estimates of hydroelectric potential do not include the long-recognized but still undeveloped TIDAL power potential of the Bay of Fundy in NS, a major source of low-head hydro power adjacent to populated areas of NS and NB. Like river-based hydro, tidal power is a natural hydraulic source that can be converted directly to mechanical and electrical energy by means of a turbine. However, tidal power is very expensive to develop, and the cyclical nature of the energy makes it less useful than river-based hydro."

    Without having looked into the mechanics of tidal generating, that last comment intrigues me. One would think, as with wind turbines, any reversal of water flow wouldn't affect the ability to harness the energy. Furthermore, river-based hydro would seem even more cyclical, dependent as it is on seasonal and weather conditions? How many rivers and streams only capture a fractional amount, particularly in spring?

    Recommendations:
    1. Get the facts the figures behind the assertion that: "...tidal power is very expensive to develop."
    2. Compare them with current state-of-the-art technology and costs

    Comment


    • #3
      a. Corrosion is a factor. Prebuilt empty hulls could be made of corrosion resistant metals (oil rigs stand in salt water for a long time).
      Micro hydro generators have a low output but using several locks in a canal would increase the total output.
      b. In regard to breakwaters, wave energy is intermittent, so is solar and wind energy. There are days and weeks without significant wave action. The sea has to be fairly stormy before there are high enough waves to produce appreciable energy. Nevertheless a series of fairly large gondolas, each set consisting (3 or 4 together) could be used and anchored between 2 steel poles in front of breakwaters.
      c. Tidal currents occur in a few places, about 20-30 in Europe. There are lots of experimental installations and ideas about this form of energy.
      The Nova Scotia tidal power plant was meant to be a demonstration project. The other plans were postponed probably because of cost and environmental concerns. Please google: Annapolis tidal power plant ... (located on the Annapolis river…)
      The run-of-river energy is already used at the outflow of dams and other river projects. Please google: run of river hydroelectricity … (Wikipedia ...)
      As to the feasibility and cost effectiveness of each of these hydro energy projects, each nation would consider the national requirements, available energy resources and the efforts expanded to use the resources.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Pal View Post
        a. Corrosion is a factor. Prebuilt empty hulls could be made of corrosion resistant metals (oil rigs stand in salt water for a long time).
        Corrosion-resistant metal isn't cheap. Now you know why it isn't feasible.

        Originally posted by Pal View Post
        Micro hydro generators have a low output but using several locks in a canal would increase the total output.
        The value in this is is that it tests and helps focus a jurisdiction's commitment to renewables. As I recommended, we'd need to consult with micro-generator suppliers/canal operators to verify the feasibility. Shall I do this or do you want to take this on and report back?
        Originally posted by Pal View Post
        The other plans were postponed probably because of cost and environmental concerns. Please google: Annapolis tidal power plant ... (located on the Annapolis river…)
        Probably? We won't know unless we fact-check that encyclopedia entry--it could be merely conjectural based on past energy projections? As for the Annapolis tidal station, that same link provides its MW capacity--a tiny fraction of the entire proposal. How about you check up on this and report back and I'll do the same for canal lock micro-hydrogeneration?

        Comment


        • #5
          Yes go ahead and investigate the micro-hydro generation proposal, basically it is your idea, but be careful an eager salesman might want to sell you a turbine.
          In the meantime I will look into the cost factors etc. of tidal power plants and will report to you shortly.

          Comment


          • #6
            I've emailed 2 Canadian micro-hydro generator distributors and also got a dozen hits on microhydropower.net for 'canal' one of which reads:
            HydroVolts Big Canal Turbine installed in Washington

            Working with the U.S. Bureau of Reclamation, the company this month deployed its "Big Canal Turbine" in Washington state.
            The turbine was 'plunked' carefully into the Roza Canal, which moves water east from the Yakima River to irrigate crops in one of Washington's most important agricultural regions.

            Hydrovolts said the device, capable of putting out up to 10 kilowatts (kW), was expected to produce 5 kilowatts (kW) in a flow of 2 meters per second. But with the water flow exceeding that speed, the turbine was steadily cranking out at least 6 kW, the company said.

            This actually isn't the first time Hydrovolts has dropped a turbine into the Roza Canal; it did so last spring and summer with smaller turbines, demonstrating ... (read the rest)


            So, not only is it feasible, but more efficiency than anticipated!!! As with any other 'claim', now all we've got to do is replicate it!

            So, the next step would be to promote the idea among canal operators elsewhere. There are at least 2 canal systems in Ontario, Canada with locks. Any others?

            Comment


            • #7
              It’s great, that this idea is being developed and already in use. These are fast flowing irrigation canals, some probably have locks. The same amount of water flowing in a canal must go through the locks.
              In regard to locks one must remember that a turbine at the in-and-outflow would block the passage of ships therefore the turbine has to be vertical, attached to the outer edges of the 2 wings of the gate, positioned so as the gate slowly opens, the gushing water would be able to rotate the turbine.
              Alternatively the turbine could rest on the floor of the lock just at the farthest end of the completely open gate. As the gate opens the turbine would start sliding upwards pushed by the rising water governed by a hydraulic system so that it always remain just below the surface of the incoming water.
              The micro hydro turbine (still several meters long) then would swivel to the side of the lock so that the ships could pass through the canal.
              In addition to the Welland Canal which is used by ocean going ships, Ontario has 2 other major canal systems, The Trent (45 locks) and the Rideau (47 Locks). Both these canals are primarily used for recreational boating, though they can accommodate larger boats as well.

              Comment


              • #8
                Here is what I found out
                Electric Power Generation by source 2011
                Canada gigawatt hours
                Hydro 374,417.8
                Wind 3,665.7
                Tidal 27.7
                Solar 0
                Thermal 215,684.4
                Conventional steam 104,190.8
                Nuclear 85,219.9
                Internal combustion 1,073.4
                Combustion turbine 25,164.0

                Since 1984 when Annapolis was completed several extremely large dams have been built in the north. Since then “…high up-front costs and lack of government support deterred tidal projects. “
                Tidal barrages take a long time to build, because of the large very amount of earth that has to be moved to block off the wide and deep bay. The costs are very high in the context of total electric power available in the country. The available power capacity of the Bay of Fundy is quite high, but looking at the map it becomes clear that extremely long and deep barrages would have to be built to harness the power of the tide.

                Eleanor Denny (Prof. at Dublin University – her subjects cost analysis of wind & tidal energy-) ”estimates that in order for a facility to be profitable, its capital cost should be less than $700,000 USD per MegaWatt, which with the current technology is not a realistic goal, meaning that so far the industry produces negative net benefits.” She adds that on the plus side tidal barrages have a long life with relatively low maintenance.

                Comparison with other countries
                The world’s largest tidal barrage
                South Korea lake Shiwa mean capacity 254 MW
                Annual production 522.7 GW
                The world’s second largest tidal barrage
                France La Rance mean capacity 240 MW
                Annual production ½ billion KWhour
                The world’s third largest tidal barrage
                Canada Annapolis capacity 28 MW
                South Korea and France do have hydro capacity, but they have to rely on imported oil. Tidal energy is needed to supplement the electricity supply. While Canada has oil and the tar sands and generates fairly large amount of hydroelectric power (second in the world). Actually it is the world’s 5th largest energy producer. (World Almanac 2013) Tidal energy is not a priority at this time!
                __________________________________________________ ___________
                In some areas or the world the shoreline and the terrain are not suitable for tidal barrages, or tidal current exploitation, or it is too expensive to start, but if they have high enough tides, than floating vessels could be a substitute. As to corrosion, some ships have been converted into museums or restaurants and stand in saltwater for years. It would be necessary to purchase used or retired barges or ships (plenty for sale) which are still in good condition.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I managed to locate a lock in England which is producing hydro power. Although it required a lot more construction work than simply placing a turbine in the water. (The first in England)
                  I googled: Manchester locks hydropower
                  The first item: Hydro-electric generating station built within a canal lock system.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Here's one of the 2 replies I got. It's from microhydropower.com:
                    Whether doing what you suggest is feasible or not is mostly a financial question. Since this would be intermittent power, it is much less likely to make sense compared to using the usual sources or hydropower which are largely underutilized on a small scale.

                    Regards,
                    Paul Cunningham, CEO
                    Energy Systems and Design
                    Email: [email protected]

                    By 'intermittent' is he suggesting the natural water throughput in (most?) locks is insufficient to make this worthwhile? At least we know there are locks with installed generators so the question is what throughput would make this economically viable given a jurisdiction's overall (and peak-load) electricity costs (whether from generating or from grid purchases).

                    I'm still looking at this from an accountant's perspective given that it's doable, but from an engineer's, I imagine it would be a single generator turbine, submerged at the base of each lock, rather than 2 separate ones for efficiency reasons but I don't know.

                    Thanks for listing those canal systems in Canada. I'll research water throughput when I get a chance?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      America is the world’s fourth largest hydroelectricity generating nation, and it also imports oil, and strives to achieve energy independence. Even a small turbine on the Roza canal in Washington State is welcomed. But the overall contribution of micro hydro is so minute in the context of the total renewable energy picture (ethanol and wind take the lead) it can be very easily overlooked.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Pal View Post
                        But the overall contribution of micro hydro is so minute in the context of the total renewable energy picture (ethanol and wind take the lead) it can be very easily overlooked.
                        Solar, wind and tidal are also minute but I'd love to see a cost comparison between solar and micro-hydro (in a canal, river or creek). My brother's installed solar panels on his Ottawa bungalow rooftop--I'll ask him for details.

                        When I get the time, I'll find out about canal (lock) water throughput.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Regarding Canal Hydro-electric potential:
                          At least in Ontario, Canada,the Trent-Severn system currently produces nearly 100 Mws with an added potential of 50 Mws. With hydro everywhere, there's a lot of unused potential, especially in spring.

                          Comment

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