My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[Ufopolitics]

Something wrong there..

UFO,
Measuring ohms across the input brushes I get .7
Measuring across the generator brushes I get 3.2

Good morn Turion,

There is something wrong there...it should be Input=Output/2

Input should give you an average value per One Pair...if it is 0.7 is too low, it means around 0.35 ohms per coil...
Output is the adding of the two Pairs, 3.2/2=1.6

Make different turns of shaft and take other read outs (make sure to read first continuity at both terminals)...not right next to, but turning like one quart turn, same direction of rotation.

The Reason of keeping One (1) Ohm, is not to disturb Voltage or Amperage readings, based on Ohm's Law...while keeping a Constant Value (R) to render equal read outs of those parameters...besides not creating a huge short circuit. However we could always go higher but keeping around same values per Pairs.

Please read my post above...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[s e t h]

getting there

i hope it doesn't disintigrate instantaneously
just the final wiring for both symmetric and asymmetric modes to finish ... and mounting the magnets in such a way that they can rotate

[Ufopolitics]

Wtf?!

i hope it doesn't disintigrate instantaneously
just the final wiring for both symmetric and asymmetric modes to finish ... and mounting the magnets in such a way that they can rotate

Hello Seth...

WOW, Man!!...WTF?...
So, you have switches to jump from Symmetric to Asymmetric?...If I understood correctly?
We must "propose" this set up to Hendrik Lorentz and Associates...
But it looks great...One Assembly, same wiring and...Both Worlds!...great idea!
You are saving a lot of extra time and money!
Just make sure your switches do not create high resistance between circuits when they are closed (Symmetrical way, right?).

Regards

Ufopolitics

[s e t h]

Hello Seth...

WOW, Man!!...WTF?...
So, you have switches to jump from Symmetric to Asymmetric?...If I understood correctly?
We must "propose" this set up to Hendrik Lorentz and Associates...
But it looks great...One Assembly, same wiring and...Both Worlds!...great idea!
You are saving a lot of extra time and money!
Just make sure your switches do not create high resistance between circuits when they are closed (Symmetrical way, right?).

Regards

Ufopolitics

yes you understand perfectly.
coil start and end wires go to the two centre poles on the switch.
thowing the switch with change coil commutator contacts from symmetric design to your design.
then rotate magnets to complete mode change and fire it back up
switches seem to have very little resistance accross closed connection

also i recieved my pulse fet driver board today but i'm going to need a scope.
i have been offered an nice old analog one for $150 but i'm not sure if i should put the money towards a modern little digital one? any suggestions appreciated.

[Ufopolitics]

Well, for the Better...

Something is indeed wrong. I pulled the armature out so I could test each commutator segment for continuity. They all worked. (They better! I tested for that before I put the armature in the motor!) But then I decided to test each coil for ohms, and it turns out, one of the coils is reading WAY, WAY, WAY more ohms than it should, which means I have a coil shorted to the armature body. I haven't looked to see how many I have to unwind to get to that one, but it won't be pretty. I bring this up because i have a "clean" armature I could rewind with either #20 (like the one I have) or #23 (like the original motor). You mentioned in your previous post that you thought we should wrap with the same size and amount of wire as the original, so I can do that. I have an "untouched motor" so can unwrap one coil and measure the length and the resistance. Then since they are all wrapped in series, I will know exactly how many feet of wire is on that coil and can divide it out and figure how to wrap the new one. I should have the same number of wraps in a coil pair as they do in one coil. Easy. (yeah right!!!)

This puts off testing for another day, but we will be comparing apples to apples instead of apples to genetically enhanced lemons. (DId I just say your motor is a lemon? LOL Only kidding)

Dave.

Hello Dave,

Well, all work is to achieve better testing...like you said...Apples to "enhanced" Apples...by the way, I liked "Enhanced" but not "Lemon"...
And about "GMC"(Genetically Modified Coils)...is what we all have been "consuming" so far...The "Real MC Coy" is the one you are "Modifying" now...LOL
About one coil shorted at armature core...wouldn't it read less ohms than not grounded one?... ..It depends I think on type of short...of just one or two wires or more...

Yes, if you are going to "directly compare" Original Machine to Mod...then yes, it needs same awg, same turns per Motor "Impact Momentum" at Input, as resistance...then we are all equal there, and in complete "Harmony"...

I will be rewiring the R/S Motor also...I believe it is originally 33 awg...I do not have a Micrometer...so I will use "Eyecrometer"...however, all bolts down to same resistance...it will equal differences in thickness.

Now, this "SPEC'S" are to test Modified Machines versus the Original Motors...However...This does not means at all...it is the "Way to Follow", the way to go for Better Performance of My Machines...Understand that right?
So, after checking parameters, testings and so on...then let's go back to the Concepts that Regulate the Specific Designs of Asymmetrical Machines to be Evaluated as a Solely Units-Assemblies.

So...Dad Hav...sorry, but you will have to re-make your R/S Testings if you want to be fair here with me...

Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Scopes...

yes you understand perfectly.
coil start and end wires go to the two centre poles on the switch.
thowing the switch with change coil commutator contacts from symmetric design to your design.
then rotate magnets to complete mode change and fire it back up
switches seem to have very little resistance accross closed connection

also i recieved my pulse fet driver board today but i'm going to need a scope.
i have been offered an nice old analog one for $150 but i'm not sure if i should put the money towards a modern little digital one? any suggestions appreciated.

Seth,

I spent a good deal of time shopping for Scopes...they must meet "Motor Testing Capabilities"...that means your probes should be rated at least 10X Attenuation ...plus the processor speed and RAM should be pretty fast...to evaluate High RPM's measuring the Parameters accurately..They must be over 20 MHz
Most small PC Connect and small Nano Versions are dedicated to small applications of electronics signaling...and testing components behavior at a small scale...You will blow them easy with this set up here...
The Old Styles (Analogs) I am sure you could find them in EBAY for around 50.00 USD, and Major Brand Names...like Agilent, and others... There is a Guy that advertise different types in EBAY...He got them even brand new for that price...However...They are slow as Molasses...

I ended Up getting a brand new, RIGOL, Dual Channel 50 MHz Digital Storage Oscilloscope (DSO)...That have a way to save files to PC...and I paid close to 400.00 USD for it...it is fast...and "pretty" accurate...plus it can measure several parameters within the square or sine waves...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Perfect!

for those following along...What I have learned from this latest development is test the continuity and ohms of each coil before moving on to the next one. Saves time and money, but especially TIME.

Also, the razor scooter motor works out to be about 50 winds per coil pair of #23, which is .8 -.9 ohms. From what I remember, UFO, you said to keep it under one ohm, so I am there, barely. Will have it wound in the next hour or so. Had to break for lunch.

Dave

Great Dave!

Bon Appetit Monsieur!

Now, I said to measure resistance at First Coil wound...before going forward to rest of them...is there somewhere...lol

I see you are getting a heck of experience winding this Machines!!...


Regards


Ufopolitics

[DadHav]

Rewind.

Hello Dave,

Well, all work is to achieve better testing...like you said...Apples to "enhanced" Apples...by the way, I liked "Enhanced" but not "Lemon"...
And about "GMC"(Genetically Modified Coils)...is what we all have been "consuming" so far...The "Real MC Coy" is the one you are "Modifying" now...LOL
About one coil shorted at armature core...wouldn't it read less ohms than not grounded one?... ..It depends I think on type of short...of just one or two wires or more...

Yes, if you are going to "directly compare" Original Machine to Mod...then yes, it needs same awg, same turns per Motor "Impact Momentum" at Input, as resistance...then we are all equal there, and in complete "Harmony"...

I will be rewiring the R/S Motor also...I believe it is originally 33 awg...I do not have a Micrometer...so I will use "Eyecrometer"...however, all bolts down to same resistance...it will equal differences in thickness.

Now, this "SPEC'S" are to test Modified Machines versus the Original Motors...However...This does not means at all...it is the "Way to Follow", the way to go for Better Performance of My Machines...Understand that right?
So, after checking parameters, testings and so on...then let's go back to the Concepts that Regulate the Specific Designs of Asymmetrical Machines to be Evaluated as a Solely Units-Assemblies.

So...Dad Hav...sorry, but you will have to re-make your R/S Testings if you want to be fair here with me...

Regards


Ufopolitics

UFO. It may not have looked like it at times but I do want to be fair with you. I'll delete the video next time I go on my channel. I haven't studied the last posts but only skipped over them. Are you saying the same winding scheme will be used but with thinner wire and more turns? I think bringing the KV of the motor down will make a big difference. I don't know if I'll be able to get all the CA off the first amateur or even another crimp on the com segments, but maybe I'll have another whack at it when I get caught up on a few other projects. I've had some really good luck with parallel power coils on a stator outrunner motor and might finish tests with that first.
I'll keep watching and hopping for the best.
John Hav

[Ufopolitics]

Good Luck!

UFO,
I did check resistance on first coil. But didn't bother to check EACH one as I wound it!! That was a BIG mistake. Also go back and check previous ones because pressure of a NEW wind can cause sharp edges to cut and ground out PREVIOUS wind.

May not get this done as soon as I thought---off to a job interview. It would be nice to make some spending money to work on this stuff!!
Dave

Hey, Dave,

Ok, I see what you mean...the idea is that first coil gives you the amount of turns to follow...and still in time to rewind just one coil, either adding or taking off some wire-turns...

Good luck at job interview!...Yeah make some money to spend here with me...

later...

Ufopolitics

[MasterBlaster]

UFO,
I did check resistance on first coil. But didn't bother to check EACH one as I wound it!! That was a BIG mistake. Also go back and check previous ones because pressure of a NEW wind can cause sharp edges to cut and ground out PREVIOUS wind.

May not get this done as soon as I thought---off to a job interview. It would be nice to make some spending money to work on this stuff!!
Dave

Dave, thank you for candidly exposing your mistakes. I am learning a lot from your work.

[ampsvolts]

Dual Armature

post 1199

Hello AV,

The Elongated wires meaning the ones running across the armature length...the wires that cut the magnetic field perpendicular to the .....etc.............

Excellent UFO Guru, Thanks for the reply. We will wait patiently for the mystery to fully unfold.
I remember John Stone contributed a great article on mosfets - I will find and re-read
AV

[sebosfato]

Hello,

I finished my replication and i have some initial results for my tests...

I used a 12v battery, connecting to the motor windings, it consumes 7 amps and runs fast

if i parallel the generator and motor coils the current is not even distributed between the two windings, but it runs faster. same amperage consumption or just a bit less.

if connected the motor and generator windings in series the amps reduce to 3 amps and the rpm is lower maybe half...

The axis become very hot!!! probably because of the collectors in all cases...

The torque seems great anyway is a half horse power motor.

The original motor connected to this same battery turns really slow, and only 0,5 amps flow...

I don't know what is going on but i see that it seems like if the current was not much restricted by the motor.

I'm not sure if i'm not saturating the rotor with so much current... I wound 10+10 turns per coil, using 18awg wire while the original wire was 19awg

It is a 90v motor and should consume just 5 amps to run at 1700rpm

Regards

[sputnik]

on the scope subject

@ S E T H
I spent a great deal of time looking for a scope ('cause I'm so cheap).
I saw several older analog models go by for under $50 on ebay, one 20Mhz even didn't sell for $27 total, shipping included! I would have gone for that except something else came along.
UFO said to make sure you get a X10 probe, most of the scopes that come with probes do have that, a lot of the cheaper deals come with nothing, but you can buy a decent (will let you know in a day or so) X10 probe for $6.35 shipped.
I was very fortunate, I really don't have the space for one of those old analog things, but I was going to get one anyway because of the price. Some of the computer DSO's are nice, but about $160 for a decent one. And then you are tied to the computer. The "android" models aren't really worth considering IMHO. But a really nice $500 DSO full-featured model was being sold AS-IS for $80, I got that. Didn't work, but does now (Shorted diode in the power supply).
My parts are rolling in for the low side pulser every day, can't wait to get started, came to the party late. Unfortunately I bought some Li-Ions from ebay, a mistake I discovered today, so that will set me back a couple of weeks. Zero usable out of 4.

So to make a long story short, them old analogs will do just fine and you can get them really cheap if you work at it.

Also I would like to add there is a really great oscillator that goes for the unbelievable price of about $6 on ebay, it's an AD9850 DSS, how about 0-40Mhz, sine, triangle and square, adjustable 0-99% duty cycle and ULTRA-pure? Linear sweep too (but no log ) Even though I have the parts coming for the John Stone concept, most excellent, I'm going to get one of those as well for general purpose usage. You can control it with a parallel printer cable and your computer to setup whatever scenario, then battery power or wall wart to make it portable. The radio operators are a'gagga over them for VFO's etc. because they are so clean and accurate. You'll have to put it in a case and do a little soldering for the parallel port thing and power supply, but pretty hard to beat. Just search for AD9850. I spent a couple of days comprehending the details, if anyone is interested PM me.

Finally, UFO spoke in a post a while back, maybe it was in the "My motors got me to tap into radiant" thread, that we should use a 1000:1 probe on the coil for that. Sounded good to me with my shiny new scope. So I got the parts to make one, the commercial models are pricey. There is a utube video where a fellow details making one, pretty good, my design is a bit different from his but still using that for a guide. If you do that, I found out that normal 1/2 watt resistors are only rated at 200 volts, just so you know (I didn't). I used 1 watts which are rated at 1000 volts instead of paying the piper for high voltage resistors (and they're aren't easy to find). According to theory I'm good to about 5kv.

Sorry for the length.

[MasterBlaster]

Could be related

I have been looking at this publication and wondering if I should post it here but it may be related:


Motional Electric Field Associated with Moving Charges

http://archive.org/download/MotionalElectricFieldAssociatedWithMovingCharges/motional-electric-fields-kyle-klicker-tbc.pdf

[s e t h]

sputnik ... thanks for your input.

just another scary pic for fun
connections nearly complete and still quite a lot to do before testing.
i'm worried its all going to fly appart catastrophically at some point lol