Free energy?

[wonza]

Thanks for the suggestions Ufo, that could certainly make the gluing easier.

I had all the magnets polarities facing towards the front, see diagram:



I was going to next try, turning them all to face outwards to the side, rather than to the front as they are now.

Thanks,
wonza

[wonza]

I just finished turning the magnets to face outwards to the side, and still the same result. I tried approaching slow, but nothing happens. All magnets polarities are facing the same direction. Not sure what else to try now.

[wonza]

Attached is a basic diagram as to how I have it set up now.

[wonza]

Use two magnets, one glued permananetly, the other one you need to move at different intervals to attain a gate. When properly spaced, after much expermentation, the wheel should run. One magnet will pull the wheel, while the other one pushes. When proper spacing and distance is found, it will work. The magnets will work better at the very extreme distance of their influence. Good Luck as many hours of experimentation is required to get it right. stealth

Yeah, I have tried with two magnets, to try to induce a push/pull force, but they always find a spot they prefer to be in.

It sounds like you've had one running yourself, have you got any diagrams or pictures to assist me at all?

If this is indeed possible I'm willing to invest more time/money into it, but at this stage I think it's looking unlikely. It could be the structure I'm using just isn't strong enough.

Also, does anyone know of a decent place to buy hard plastic sheeting?

Apologies I'm no engineer, but I'm willing to learn

Thanks

[Slider2732]

Is it for the first video, spinny motor ?
If so, i'd suggest a simple CD. Tough, thin and even has a hole in the middle. You can remove any label or the metal coating, by lightly scoring the coating and then putting packing tape over. Scrub the tape well with fingernails and then rip away...the coating should come off readily, leaving what looks exactly like those clear CD's top and bottom of multi-CD stacks - cos that's what they are

Or, you can get a large variety of sizes of plexiglass from hardware stores (up to a couple of feet). Can make very clean 90 degree corners etc, by firm scoring with a new hobby knife, but its not so good for making circles with.

[wonza]

Is it for the first video, spinny motor ?
If so, i'd suggest a simple CD. Tough, thin and even has a hole in the middle. You can remove any label or the metal coating, by lightly scoring the coating and then putting packing tape over. Scrub the tape well with fingernails and then rip away...the coating should come off readily, leaving what looks exactly like those clear CD's top and bottom of multi-CD stacks - cos that's what they are

Or, you can get a large variety of sizes of plexiglass from hardware stores (up to a couple of feet). Can make very clean 90 degree corners etc, by firm scoring with a new hobby knife, but its not so good for making circles with.

Yeah, it's for just for the first spinning one. Funny you should say that, I've just got my magnets glued down to a CD this time. I've ordered a motor prop adapter to more securely attach it to the CD. However just from my current flimsy mounting it still doesn't look like it wants to turn.

[Slider2732]

I've ordered a motor prop adapter

Heck, I usually use a couple of circular pieces of cardboard and a quantity of superglue Your rotor has much more of a chance of being truly centered
A good way of becoming used to the forces in such a thing, is to bring a hand held, same polarity magnet toward the side of the rotor at varying speeds. At some speed or other, from experimentation, you'll find the rotor to rotate. If you get things just right, the rotor will spin with just 1 magnet on it and a dummy plastic piece or something on the opposite side to balance. It may actually be much easier with 1 or 2 magnets than more.

As I see it (usual caveat type stuff included), the action of bringing a magnet near and removing again, is what a finished assembly would need to emulate.
The strength of the actual magnets you have there, will govern the exact speed of operation of any method to get around the sticking magnetic forces..
One way of mentally viewing this whole thing, may be to consider the permanent magnet in your hand as a permanently switched on electromagnet. If only you could switch off the magnetism at some exacting points, so ways have to be found to emulate that effect. The simplest is to remove it from the rotor and hence the quick jabs (no doubt) toward and away from the rotor at exact timing intervals.
How could something mechanical do that ? could such a system use the energy of the previous magnet now dragging the system down in a 4 magnet rotor, to bump the stationary magnet out of the way and actually make use of an otherwise negative force. Would all forces equal zero, no matter what was tried along those ways of thinking ?
Or, is it possible to have a magnet weighted at one side and have it flip over when travelling down toward a static magnet ? It would then flip over again, through gravity, as soon as it passed the static magnet. Could that action be strong enough to also work a small wire, that pushes the static magnet away. Though, the shock to the rotor of the flip may be perfectly equal to, or more, than any momentum built up...and have a net effect of zero gain. In that system, too fast a rotation with light magnets would cause the same effect as kids on the 'Wall of Death' fairground ride...all pressed up against the perimeter and going nowhere with gravity !

Well, just a few thoughts, bit of a ramble really. Looking forward to what you come up with

[wonza]

Heck, I usually use a couple of circular pieces of cardboard and a quantity of superglue Your rotor has much more of a chance of being truly centered
A good way of becoming used to the forces in such a thing, is to bring a hand held, same polarity magnet toward the side of the rotor at varying speeds. At some speed or other, from experimentation, you'll find the rotor to rotate. If you get things just right, the rotor will spin with just 1 magnet on it and a dummy plastic piece or something on the opposite side to balance. It may actually be much easier with 1 or 2 magnets than more.

As I see it (usual caveat type stuff included), the action of bringing a magnet near and removing again, is what a finished assembly would need to emulate.
The strength of the actual magnets you have there, will govern the exact speed of operation of any method to get around the sticking magnetic forces..
One way of mentally viewing this whole thing, may be to consider the permanent magnet in your hand as a permanently switched on electromagnet. If only you could switch off the magnetism at some exacting points, so ways have to be found to emulate that effect. The simplest is to remove it from the rotor and hence the quick jabs (no doubt) toward and away from the rotor at exact timing intervals.
How could something mechanical do that ? could such a system use the energy of the previous magnet now dragging the system down in a 4 magnet rotor, to bump the stationary magnet out of the way and actually make use of an otherwise negative force. Would all forces equal zero, no matter what was tried along those ways of thinking ?
Or, is it possible to have a magnet weighted at one side and have it flip over when travelling down toward a static magnet ? It would then flip over again, through gravity, as soon as it passed the static magnet. Could that action be strong enough to also work a small wire, that pushes the static magnet away. Though, the shock to the rotor of the flip may be perfectly equal to, or more, than any momentum built up...and have a net effect of zero gain. In that system, too fast a rotation with light magnets would cause the same effect as kids on the 'Wall of Death' fairground ride...all pressed up against the perimeter and going nowhere with gravity !

Well, just a few thoughts, bit of a ramble really. Looking forward to what you come up with

Right now, whenever I bring the external magnet close enough to move it, it always starts to move up/down (as well as to the side) so I really need to get it fixed into position better.

I can get it to spin by moving the external magnet closer/further away but, that would be me putting energy into the system, and that's not what I'm trying to achieve In one of those videos the contraption of the spin pushes the magnets further away at the right point for the device to keep being attracted/repulsed at the right points. Again, I would have thought that the energy required to do that would counter the rotational energy.

[Slider2732]

i think that what you're seeing and experiencing, is exactly why people decided there were motor wires going through the table in the video.
The assembly the guy had was very crude and didn't look to be exactly aligned, micrometer perfect.
That energy that you put in has to be replaced with something that could only use the rotational forces of the spinning, minus or plus the effects from the chosen magnets.
All in all, it's the problem everyone has with such a system for a hoped endless rotation. I've not done much with such devices, preferring to power with a Bedini or Adams or similar setup...but a system that only just falls short would also help those other types of common enough battery powered systems.
That's why I like how you're going ahead and having a look anyway

There is another method that I reminded myself of, while thinking about this yesterday. I can't find the references off hand, it was a few months ago and will try to find them if interested. It relates to energizing a coil to counter the magnetic drag after a magnet goes past.
The summary is, that in a video on YouTube, Tom Bearden talks of a Japanese motor which uses a coil to fire an opposite polarity magnetic push at the passing magnet. A link from that showed that John Bedini at least partially built such a system (you see it on his workbench in part completed form).
In the actual motor, I believe a battery is used to power the pulses, as and when required.
Another implementation of it, derived just by my own thoughts and offered as an idea to remove the battery is - an aircore coil is energized by a passing magnet at a set position, a reed switch is then closed by that magnet as the rotor continues and that closing shorts the coil energy into an electromagnet. The electromagnet energizes and forms an opposite pole to either that magnet, or another on the rotor. That specific magnet though is the one that would have formed a drag on the static magnet. The pulse negates the pole and the magnet passes through inert.
Such a system would work by attraction, the static magnet pulling the next magnet toward itself, the electromagnet pulsing just at the point of the next moving magnet passing past the static magnet.

[wonza]

I know, I keep finding other examples too like this and this. To me at least, they look very real and I have to prove it one way or another just to myself and then at least let others know my findings.

I'd be very interested in any extra info you could provide. I've been reading these forums most my spare time for extra information since I joined last week, and there's some truly interesting things going on.

I may well move onto some of those ideas you mentioned if I make no progress with just this basic idea. Thanks

[Slider2732]

Best wishes for yours too Stealth

Those videos are proving elusive. I'm 100% that the Bearden Japanese motor discussion is within a long video, perhaps 50 minutes. The Bedini version of it is only a couple of minutes in another video (which may in fact be on Google videos).
After viewing several, i'm confident it's within the interview where Bearden has the tree/plant behind him, but it may be the one where he has the dark red/white shirt on. It's not a radio interview. This is bugging me, but I want to find it !

[wonza]

Thanks for the encouragement.. I have most of the parts made and am nearly ready to start assembly. The biggest obstacle facing most of these motors is not so much technical, but it is fabricating your own parts. You can't just purchase the parts needed as they do not exist. Each one has to be made and tested before putting into your system. It is like building a jigsaw puzzle with pieces to form a complete picture, but you are making the pieces yourself. Most people can design a system, but most haven't the expertise or machinery to build the parts neede for it to operate. This is the reason most successful replications are made by a group of people dedicated to one cause. Each one contributing to the replication by using the skills they possess. Engineers, scientists, and fabricators can't do it alone, each one has to contribute to make it work. As an experimenter and inventor, I do it all alone. It takes me many experiments sometimes to find a solution to the problems I encounter. Any mechanical or electrical problem can be solved, and made to work with minimal friction, gravity and or thermal losses. The problem is most of the parts needed to do that are very expensive to purchase. Good Luck stealth

I've actually been looking into 3D printers as they've been coming down in price recently. I know it's only plastic molding, but that could be useful for quite few things. Engadget article If I get more into this I'd be very tempted to purchase one of these. You're right though, collaboration on these sorts of projects is a must a times. I've also started to follow RWG research of replicated Stan Meyers water powered car (which I've only just found out about). He seems to be getting a lot of help from people all over in getting the parts he needs.

[EnergyExpert]

Free energy is a mis-statement...

E=MCC tells that energy is a stage of matter, so as long as matter exists energy is available. However the problem with the magnetic motor, is that, in my non-empirical opinion, is that the device is running off the energy stored in the magnets during their manufacture. In other words the magnets are a lot like pieces of coal. As you see magnets, even hard ferric magnets will gradually become disorganized if constantly subjected to other magnetic fields. As a result the device pictured will gradually stop operating as the magnetic fields become increasingly disorganized.

I think that those companies using environmental energy harvesting, like gravitational systems engineering, will stand the test of time.

[wonza]

At least for my own peace of mind I think I have disproved most of those magnetic motors in the videos I posted. I received my motor prop and attached it with a couple of washers to the CD and made sure it was aligned correctly. It spins pretty smoothly without very much 'wobble' at all. I tried placing magnets around the outside repelling/repelling and attracting at opposite sides, and various directions etc I also tried getting it spinning first and then introducing the magnets. Not at any point did it seem to want to start to spin faster.

I may make further attempts with electromagnets and possibly a reed switch that gets activated my the proximity to a magnet to turn it on/off. Though I may wait first to see what UFOpolitics has to say first.

[maggie]

free energy

it is said a high torque motor with permanent magnet generator can get free output energy

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