water wheel power

[garrypm]

W,

Would you be kind enough to give more detail about the HPG?

I would like so much to replicate.

Thanks, Garry

[willy96]

i can but i hate to waste space here

W,

Would you be kind enough to give more detail about the HPG?

I would like so much to replicate.

Thanks, Garry

just because but it could easly be adapted to a water wheel i guess...

a hpg is nothing more than a copper disc and a magnet with 2 brushes comeing off it .. now this can be built many many ways does not half to be a disc .. you can use bronze rod as axel if you can afford it .. run 1 brush off axel and other on edge of disc spinn magnet and disc togather to beat back torque if neos are used use a ring neo ... and insulate it from disc ie paper ... with a ring neo ... it is ballanced easyer ... look up faraiday disc spg hpg teslas unipolar dynmo the n machine .. i could go on but i wont .... look at any of those devices ...

W

[tjnlsn255]

Water Powered PMG

Hi Rick,

Have you checked this water powered generator on Ebay?

PMA Generator for Pelton Water Power 12-36 VAC 1000-3000 Watt | eBay

Looks like a good deal.... I wonder how much water would be required to get 1000 to 3000 rpm.... is that unreasonable?

Todd

[rickoff]

Hi Todd, and thanks for the link. That generator actually puts out 3 phase AC at over 50 Amps per phase. It is rated 1,000 watts at 1,000 rpm, and up to 3,000 watts at 3,000 rpm for continuous 24-7 use. Getting this range of rpm would not be difficult at my stream if a water wheel of sufficient diameter and width is employed to take best advantage of the water flow, and would simply be a matter of appropriate gearing ratios and flow control. While this unit is made for a water driven Pelton Wheel, it could just as well be driven by a standard water wheel, and at a price of $159 is not a bad deal at all. No reason why 2 or 3 additional units could not be driven by a large water wheel, as it is said that the unit has "very little cogging torque."

I'll definitely look into this some more. Thanks.

[navigator]

yeah Rick
do you ever have realy stupid thoughts and then spend the day wondering about them?
well here goes a real good one for you. instead of the dogs or ponys lets say a guy builds a forty foot high set of vortex towers os that they dump back and forth dropping about four foot or so each time and each time you get increased velocity power so you would be running about 19 generators with the same water by the time you get to the bottom.
now for the stupid part how much energy would it take to pump the water back to the top?

A wirtz pump is a simple efficient way to pump water 40+, although it would take several for that volume.

[nueview]

@ navigator
please post a link so i can look it over.
i once saw a guy pumpimg water with an old oil barrel he had gotten it had had vegatable oil if i remember right he painted it black and covered it with plastic and it had two check valves on it during the day it would push the water up about twenty feet and at night it would suck up more water.
long cycle for fifteen gallons a day but it was free to get water for his flush toilet.
as i remember it he said it worked best if the barrel had some air space left in it i remember thinking that it made sense at the time due to the expantion rate for the air.
i still think about the tower idea allot so do please post some information about this form of pump.
Martin

[navigator]

The Spiral Pump: A High Lift, Slow Turning Pump

Hope this helps

Seems like it would be an easy addition to an existing water wheel.

[rickoff]

Speaking of spiral pump water wheels, here's a link to one I noticed a few days ago. Notice it is sandwiched between two water wheels. This type of pump is excellent for lifting water to a higher elevation because it can be attached to a water wheel without causing any drag to slow the wheel down. It would be almost foolhardy not to employ a pump like this on a water wheel installation, as the pumped water could be used to irrigate a garden and/or drive a Pelton type turbine connected to a generator for additional power production. The lifting capacity appears to be figured at somewhere between 1/4 and 1/3 the length of the coiled pipe, depending upon size of the pipe used for the coil and the delivery line. The speed of rotation doesn't have much of an effect on the height that the water can be pumped, but of course determines how much water will be pumped in a certain time period. On a 10 foot water wheel the coil could probably serve to elevate water 50 to 60 feet above the stream, which would be dandy for driving a turbine.

On another note, since we had talked about a pony tethered to post attached to a merry-go-round type of affair to drive a generator, I thought the following two videos would be of interest:

Horse sweep water pump

Cow driven water lift (This one uses cups to grab and lift water, which is then dumped into a trough, and is a method I mentioned earlier, though I had suggested mounting the cups on a water wheel [like in this example] and sloping the trough downwards to a hydraulic ram for pumping to a higher elevation. Much of the ram action would waste water, though, and would be way less efficient (per amount of water pumped) than the coiled spiral tubing water lift method). On the other hand, though, the coiled spiral method only picks up water once per revolution of the wheel, whereas the cup type pump (as seen in the last link) can pick up water at multiple locations on the wheel. Thus, even considering the water wasted with a ram pump, this method could equal or surpass the spiral coil method in actual volume pumped. Here's an example of the intermittent output from a spiral coil pump on an 8 foot diameter water wheel.

[rickoff]

I spent the past two days at my new home, getting it cleaned and ready to move into. After a couple days of rain, and a snowstorm last night, the water in the stream is picking up volume and speed. This really does appear to be a great place for a waterwheel project. I didn't get to venture out with my video camera, as I had a lot of cleaning to do at the house. One of these cleaning chores was to go up in the solar attic and vacuum up dead flies. I don't know how they got in there, but there were lots of them. In the summer there are screened vents at both ends of the attic that are left open to exhaust hot air, and perhaps one of those screens is damaged. The vents were closed in October in preparation for the winter months. Anyways, when I opened the attic door and stood there in the attic with vacuum in hand, I was nearly bowled over by the heat. It felt like a furnace in there!

I was curious to see just how hot it was, so went to the store and picked up a indoor/outdoor thermometer set which uses a separate unit to transmit outside temperature to the main unit indoors. First I placed the transmitter outdoors, and found it was 30F degrees. It felt quite a bit colder, because the wind was howling. I then brought the transmitter back inside and took it to the attic. Then I watched the main unit every few minutes from the comfort of my living room. The attic temperature kept climbing and climbing, and was at 126F degrees by noon time. The main unit automatically saves a high and low temp for the day, and the attic actually went to 137F degrees in the early afternoon. I had completely shut off the supplemental electric baseboard heat early this morning, and even with it being a bone chilling day outdoors my house maintained a comfy temperature range between 65 and 73F degrees from sunrise to sunset. Two hours after sunset, when I left to drive to my other home, the attic temperature was 86F, and the house was at 70F degrees. I'm really pleased with this solar heating arrangement, and will make a video later on showing how all of this works. Incidentally, the water tank in the solar attic did a great job of heating water before feeding it to the electric water heater downstairs, and I'm sure this will save a bundle on water heating costs. If the dishwasher, clothes washer, and shower water were used during the early afternoon each day, it is doubtful that the electric water heater would even kick in on a sunny day.

I can hardly wait to get started on some solar enhancement projects this winter, and not a day goes by that I don't think or dream about setting up the waterwheel project. I have absolutely no doubt that, between the solar heating and waterwheel electric production, I could definitely run an all electric home off grid.

[gene gene]

Hi Rick,

I think of you often & wonder how you are doing at your new property. I came across this video that shows a number of different vortex water turbines, some look to be home built from salvaged parts. I don't know what language they speak but the pictures are great and tell a lot.
Green Energy: Hidrokinetic Turbines - YouTube

Regards, Gene