Coil Shorting Techniques.

[Zooty]

Has been on investigation about the capacitor(.47uF) in series with the shorting switch. I do not have a .47uF but I tested a varieties of cap values available. None of them charge output expect for the huge 4700uF. This is interesting why a cap there and how it should work at all. I put a DC meter across the series cap and observed the voltage fluctuates up and down randomly(this agree with the random pulses). I shorted the coil completely and the voltage fluctuates the same. This makes me conclude that my ON time is too long to have any shorting effect with cap in series. Will further investigate if this is the key or one of the keys to OU or at least cause no drag/increase speed.

As far as i know it only works with an AC cap. Is your 4700uf cap AC? Apparently the cap acts like a high pass filter, filtering out the low frequency sine wave generated in the coil and only allowing the high frequency spikes from the shorted moment. You can also short the peeks of the high frquency component to get much more power but switching has to be very fast and accurate with some sort of peek detector.

[quantumuppercut]

As far as i know it only works with an AC cap. Is your 4700uf cap AC? Apparently the cap acts like a high pass filter, filtering out the low frequency sine wave generated in the coil and only allowing the high frequency spikes from the shorted moment. You can also short the peeks of the high frquency component to get much more power but switching has to be very fast and accurate with some sort of peek detector.

Thank you Zooty,

This morning I realized there are two positions one can place that AC cap; before the bridge rectify or after the bridge rectify. Yesterday test was before bridge rectify configuration so my assumption on the ON time may not be accurate. I tested again this morning with after bridge rectify configuration and it works although slower charging than direct connection with no Cap. I think the cap has a very important roll but I have to do further testing to confirm this.

QU

[redrichie]

I know shorting a coil lowers the inductance. Does shorting also lower the resistance?

From yesterdays experiments I forgot to mention. Intially beforeI bleww out all the bulbs I had, I had them connected straight to the piggyback coil. the bulb would light full brightness. then after say one minute, the bulb would only blink. I could disconnect for a brief time and reconnect and the bulb would come back on and then after time it would start to blink. Is this due to the capacitance of the coil?

Also in a bit only related to this thread because it happened while shorting. I tried to utilize Teslas impulse technology like bedini showed in a EFTV vid. It totally destroyed any shorting effects I had going at the time. Voltage to the cap from the shorting dropped. I was running a small hobby motor from the cap from the shorting coil. When I connected the impulse tech the motor rpms decreased then stopped.

[quantumuppercut]

Hello all,

I could not go further with testing due to lack of equipments but I think the only way to speed up any magnet motor is to apply a reverse current to induced emf by the wheel. The capacitor might have done this.

Anyway, has been tinkering with some more ways to produce cheap voltage with coil shorting. I connected a coil to the input of a small 2-6V dc motor and rotate it by hand. It can produce high voltage, but after abusing it by running a 9V through the motor, hand rotate doesn't give good result. Probably due to motor abuse.

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QU

[barbosi]

I find this video fascinating

It is the simplified version of the theme presented in this thread. 1 rotor with magnets, 1 coil and 1 reed switch.
Personally I believe this is the perfect setup for investigating the phenomena.
YouTube - ‪Magnet Motor Coil Switch‬‏

The only one it could beat this would be the one which will replace the reed switch with a more reliable one. Although I'm thinkering about it for some too long time, I know this will appear some time soon.

And if I may at the end, in case you read this - excellent work lasersaber.

[Neight]

It is the simplified version of the theme presented in this thread. 1 rotor with magnets, 1 coil and 1 reed switch.
Personally I believe this is the perfect setup for investigating the phenomena.
YouTube - ‪Magnet Motor Coil Switch‬‏

The only one it could beat this would be the one which will replace the reed switch with a more reliable one. Although I'm thinkering about it for some too long time, I know this will appear some time soon.

And if I may at the end, in case you read this - excellent work lasersaber.

that is a very basic pulse motor, and it works very well

I am beginning to work on coil shorting, trying to learn how to do it in the first place...
right now I have my SSG running and I have a second coil setup with a reed switch and some LEDs. the coil is a bifiler coil though i have wired the two coils together in series to make one coil. the two ends of the coil wires are connected to 3 regular LEDs that came out of an assorted bag that I got from radio shack. the LEDs are wired in series, and as far as i know, that means they are only using 1/2 of the available AC current coming from the coil. I tried using a FWBR, but it wouldn't light the LED's for some reason, and I am not really sure why...
I am using a reed relay (not using the relay leads, just the switch leads at either end of the relay switch the same as in redrichie's video in this thread). I have also been playing around with different caps in series with the LEDs after reading this post.
I am using an aircore coil that will not light the LEDs on it's own. when I hook the reed switch to the LEDs and coil the LEDs light very brightly even when the coil is over 1/2" away from the rotor magnets. I have found so far that i get the best results (brightest and most consistent light from all three LEDs) if i have my gen coil 180 degrees from the driving coil of the SSG, and the reed switch 90 degrees from the gen coil, between the gen coil and the driving coil. full bright light from the LEDs and no drag on the rotor
I have a few pieces of ferrite, and when I use those in the coil, I don't need the reed switch, though I get a lot of drag.
with the reed switch, i don't need a core, and I don't get any noticeable drag on the rotor.
I am buying one of those laser tachometers to double check that the rotor is not slowing, but if it is slowing, it's not perceptible amount.

I am going to find a hall sensor I can use with this in place of the reed switch, but at least I have a rig I can learn on at the moment.
because of the setup I am using, it is a bit tough to check the voltage and amps with a meter, but i am going to set this up a bit differently in the next few days so it's easier to test.

very interesting, and I am learning a lot. thanks for posting this thread It helped me get started, and showed me where to start looking for some basic shorting techniques

thanks
N8

[Zooty]

that is a very basic pulse motor, and it works very well

I am beginning to work on coil shorting, trying to learn how to do it in the first place...
right now I have my SSG running and I have a second coil setup with a reed switch and some LEDs. the coil is a bifiler coil though i have wired the two coils together in series to make one coil. the two ends of the coil wires are connected to 3 regular LEDs that came out of an assorted bag that I got from radio shack. the LEDs are wired in series, and as far as i know, that means they are only using 1/2 of the available AC current coming from the coil. I tried using a FWBR, but it wouldn't light the LED's for some reason, and I am not really sure why...
I am using a reed relay (not using the relay leads, just the switch leads at either end of the relay switch the same as in redrichie's video in this thread). I have also been playing around with different caps in series with the LEDs after reading this post.
I am using an aircore coil that will not light the LEDs on it's own. when I hook the reed switch to the LEDs and coil the LEDs light very brightly even when the coil is over 1/2" away from the rotor magnets. I have found so far that i get the best results (brightest and most consistent light from all three LEDs) if i have my gen coil 180 degrees from the driving coil of the SSG, and the reed switch 90 degrees from the gen coil, between the gen coil and the driving coil. full bright light from the LEDs and no drag on the rotor
I have a few pieces of ferrite, and when I use those in the coil, I don't need the reed switch, though I get a lot of drag.
with the reed switch, i don't need a core, and I don't get any noticeable drag on the rotor.
I am buying one of those laser tachometers to double check that the rotor is not slowing, but if it is slowing, it's not perceptible amount.

I am going to find a hall sensor I can use with this in place of the reed switch, but at least I have a rig I can learn on at the moment.
because of the setup I am using, it is a bit tough to check the voltage and amps with a meter, but i am going to set this up a bit differently in the next few days so it's easier to test.

very interesting, and I am learning a lot. thanks for posting this thread It helped me get started, and showed me where to start looking for some basic shorting techniques

thanks
N8

Nice work Can you give us a bit more detail on how your bifilar is wired? One wind is series connected with the other wind but which direction?

[Neight]

Thanks Zooty
This coil was one I wound up to run an SSG, so it's 150' of 30 gauge and 150' of 26 gauge. the way the coil is oriented as I am using it, the winds are CCW facing the rotor.
I hope the diagram I uploaded helps, it's one of the first I have drawn from scratch
I have marked the ends of each coil as start and end. not sure how well it came out in the photo after it was uploaded, so I just wanted to point out that is what I wrote in

also, I messed around a lot with positioning last night, and I did notice that when I pulled the coil and switch away, the rotor did speed up some. it wasn't much, but I am getting some drag...
I think why i didn't notice it before is when I am putting the reed switch in, it will slow the rotor down until I get the position right, then it speeds back up.
I must not have moved both at the same time before last night, so I never noticed the very slight drag on the rotor.
when i have the switch in the wrong place, the rotor slows quite a bit, and the LEDs either blink or don't come on at all. once it gets close to the right position, the LEDs will go to a very very fast blink, nearly imperceptible.
when everything is in the place where it all likes to run, the rotor is very nearly full speed (as I now know, sometimes i get impatient and post before I have done enough testing ) and the LEDs appear to be steady on, though I am sure they are just blinking faster than my eye can catch
hope this helps understand my ramblings a bit
if needed, I can upload a video, just let me know
thanks
N8

edit: ok, I checked the diagram I uploaded and it is backwards for some reason I used my comps built in camera, and it must have inverted the image...
I will just flip it and re-post, make life easier on everyone

[Neight]

ok, here it is again...
hopefully it's readable

[Neight]

ok, I have a quick question maybe someone can help me with.
I have been playing with this setup all day, and have found something that confuses me a bit.
I replaced two of the LEDs with a 1ohm 10w resistor, so now I have one LED and a 1 ohm resistor, and now the LED starts to light even before I use the reed switch.
why am I now getting enough current to light the LED through the resistor where as before, I didn't get any lights at all without any resistors...
are two LEDs more of a resistive load or is something else going on here?
the meter that I have that will check resistance is currently sitting with a dead fuse in it, so I can't just test the resistance on my own.
I figure it's a pretty simple question, I just don't have all my test equipment usable right now to test it myself
thanks in advance to anyone who can shed a little light on this for me
N8

[Zooty]

ok, I have a quick question maybe someone can help me with.
I have been playing with this setup all day, and have found something that confuses me a bit.
I replaced two of the LEDs with a 1ohm 10w resistor, so now I have one LED and a 1 ohm resistor, and now the LED starts to light even before I use the reed switch.
why am I now getting enough current to light the LED through the resistor where as before, I didn't get any lights at all without any resistors...
are two LEDs more of a resistive load or is something else going on here?
the meter that I have that will check resistance is currently sitting with a dead fuse in it, so I can't just test the resistance on my own.
I figure it's a pretty simple question, I just don't have all my test equipment usable right now to test it myself
thanks in advance to anyone who can shed a little light on this for me
N8

The reason the LED lights is because you removed the other 2 and placed a 1 ohm resistor in series with it. The 1 ohm resistor may as well be an extension on the wire because it will allow a good amount of current to flow. Most normal led's need at least 2.5v to 3v to light up. When you had 3 of them in series, you needed at least 7.5v to 9v to light them. I am assuming you are using ceramic magnets on your rotor which will not induce that much voltage in the coil but that also depends on the amount of wire in the coil. Measure the AC across the coil without anything connected, it will probably be around 3v - 5v. What you are doing is how i started with coil shorting. You will discover many things as you go. Neodymium magnets + coreless coils but done in such a way that you take advantage of the surface area of the wire to magnet like in a window motor is where i think there is the most potential. I have 2 separate coils on my small motor, not that many winds and i am generating 30v dc. When i short the coil, it almost kills a neon bulb. I am glad people are looking in to this phenomena, i really think there is potential here. Keep up the good work . A vid would be great by the way. Might do one myself

[Neight]

The reason the LED lights is because you removed the other 2 and placed a 1 ohm resistor in series with it. The 1 ohm resistor may as well be an extension on the wire because it will allow a good amount of current to flow. Most normal led's need at least 2.5v to 3v to light up. When you had 3 of them in series, you needed at least 7.5v to 9v to light them. I am assuming you are using ceramic magnets on your rotor which will not induce that much voltage in the coil but that also depends on the amount of wire in the coil. Measure the AC across the coil without anything connected, it will probably be around 3v - 5v. What you are doing is how i started with coil shorting. You will discover many things as you go. Neodymium magnets + coreless coils but done in such a way that you take advantage of the surface area of the wire to magnet like in a window motor is where i think there is the most potential. I have 2 separate coils on my small motor, not that many winds and i am generating 30v dc. When i short the coil, it almost kills a neon bulb. I am glad people are looking in to this phenomena, i really think there is potential here. Keep up the good work . A vid would be great by the way. Might do one myself

excellent, thanks for the reply!
that is pretty much what I figured was going on, but wanted confirmation. I really need to get some new fuses for my meters, I blew one a while back and keep forgetting to buy new ones when I am out...
I am actually using neo mags on my rotor, but I have one with ceramics on it as well, but it's much bigger. my neo mag SSG fits on a small table i use for testing, so that is the one I use most often.
I really don't know much of anything about window motors, but that is also on my list of things I would like to build. I don't have enough wire to build a proper window motor, but I am getting to the point where I have to buy more wire, or rewind some old coils...
I am winding a few small ones on sewing machine bobbins with some 30g wire I was able to get @ radio shack. following the romeroUK posts have me pretty interested to see what a few small coils can do

I have my whole setup torn apart at the moment, so it's more flexible.
I had everything soldered to a small PCB, but now that I am really getting into testing I have taken that apart and I am moving it all to a breadboard to make testing different ideas that much easier.
once I get what I had back to working, I will take a short vid and post it to youtube!
thanks a ton for the confirmation, I am learning a lot really fast right now, and should probably slow down a bit so I don't miss any steps along the path

N8

[redrichie]

so from my experiments and observations shortin one winding of a coil will lower inductance. so what else can do this? Anyone looked more into magamps? from what I can tell a small dc bias is applied to a common core to help saturation. so will a coil with a rectifier applied to another coil do the same thing? timing as always would be critical. maybe why JB said a small version wouldnt work that well.

1 coil to generate a bias voltage to another multifilar coil to simulate a short. no switches, but the same effect?

[Zooty]

so from my experiments and observations shortin one winding of a coil will lower inductance. so what else can do this? Anyone looked more into magamps? from what I can tell a small dc bias is applied to a common core to help saturation. so will a coil with a rectifier applied to another coil do the same thing? timing as always would be critical. maybe why JB said a small version wouldnt work that well.

1 coil to generate a bias voltage to another multifilar coil to simulate a short. no switches, but the same effect?

Red, you've lost me now So you would rectify the AC output of a coil and pass the DC to another coil?

[redrichie]

Ok here is the link to the basic principle of the mag amp. this may not be related to this thread but somehow I feel it is all related to what we are looking for.
Homemade Magnetic Amplifiers.

So basing shorting on this idea, you could do the following to lower the inducatnce of a coil. This idea uses 2 coils. A bias coil and a multifilar type of coil. this could be any coil of at least 2 windings that share a common core.

1. a bias coil is placed up to the rotor.
2. the energy created by this would be A/C. a magamp needs a D/C current. so it should be rectified and fed into a cap or directly....
3. into a winding of another coil, that shares a common core with the main generating coil. This would electrically lower the inductance of the multifilar coil. this coils inductance would be lowered right at the peak as to simulate shorting at the peak. all that is required for the tuning of this "short" should be to move the bias coil into the propper position, so as its energy is timed to bias the main generator coil at the propper time.

The strength of the lowered inductance would be determined by the energy produced by the bias coil, and by the number of turns of the coil it is connected to.