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Konstatin Meyl's mistake in Theory and Practice

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  • Konstatin Meyl's mistake in Theory and Practice

    I have found some serious flaws in Meyl's practical work of which I have informed him.
    He did respond to a very small error in his theory, but he did not respond to the fatal error in his practical work. To make matters worse, he is still showing his invalid experimental 'proof' for example at the Keshe meeting on last 21st of September.

    It did take me considerable time to work through his complete theories and to save you all time I shall post my findings here.

    ----- The Meyl Theory -----

    Instead of starting out on an assumption (as Maxwell) we start out with the following:

    E = v × B
    H = -v × D

    We then take the curl of both sides:

    ∇ × E = ∇ × (v × B)
    ∇ × H = -∇ × (v × D)

    This can be written as:

    ∇ × E = B·∇v – v·∇B + v·∇·B - B·∇·v
    ∇ × H = -[D·∇v – v·∇D + v·∇·D - D·∇·v]

    Then we come across a strange note in prof.dr.-ir. Meyl's work, namely that 2 of these terms are 0 for “a non-accelerated relative motion in the x-direction”. Although this is a common sentence found in many scientific works, it does most certainly not apply here. The whole of his theory is based on vortices; a circular motion. Such a motion is per definition constantly accelerating (centripetal force).
    He mentions an x-direction? What is that? Up until this point we have not defined any system of reference. And in an attempt to help him out we should define spherical coordinates centered the center
    of the rotation. Then, assuming a constant angular speed, we can eliminate all second time derivatives of location (meaning acceleration) from these equations.

    ∇·v = 0
    ∇v = ∂v/∂r = 0

    Then we are again confronted with an unusual statement:

    v·∇X = ∂X/∂r · dr/dt = dX/dt

    In words: the change in field strength that I experience moving in the direction of v is only the change in field strength over time. This is obviously only true if the field is homogeneous over the trajectory of movement. Assuming that an EM wave consists of alternating magnetic fields that induce alternating electric fields and vice versa, then the 'electric current' will indeed run over a trajectory in which the magnetic field is homogeneous. So in this particular case it actually does apply, but it is certainly not trivial.
    So assuming |v| = constant and the field is homogeneous over the trajectory of movement we can reduce this to:

    ∇ × E = – dB/dt + v·∇·B
    ∇ × H = dD/dt – v·∇·D

    We then compare the latter to the macroscopic version of Ampère's law:

    ∇ × H = ∂D/∂t + Jf

    Which leads Meyl to believe that – v·∇·D = Jf = -v·ρe= σeE = Dσe/ε
    And the corresponding magnetic variant becomes: – v·∇·B= Jm = -v·ρm= σmH = Bσm/μ
    In order to avoid one of his next mistakes, I do not use his τ-notation.
    Thus we get:

    ∇ × E = – (dB/dt + Bσm/μ)
    ∇ × H = dD/dt + Dσe/ε

    Having this we can derive the wave equation. Since in the vacuum there is no matter, the second term must be 0. So we continue with:

    ∇ × H = dD/dt

    Because B = μH and D = εE it follows that (assuming μ and ε to be constant):

    ∇ × B = εμ dE/dt

    By again applying the curl on both sides and replacing εμ by 1/c2,Meyl arrives at

    c2 ·∇ × ∇ × B = d(∇ ×E)/dt

    It should have said ∇×(dE/dt), the rotation of the time derivative is not usually equal to the time derivative of the rotation. But maybe some special condition applies ?

    We substitute ∇ × E = – (dB/dt + Bσm/μ) in here to get:

    – c2 ·∇ × ∇ × B = d(dB/dt + Bσm/μ)/dt = d2B/dt2 + σm/μ dB/dt

    Then Meyl performs another remarkable trick. Did not he first state that we are in a vacuum in which no matter exists. That is why he could remove Dσe/ε from the equation. Shouldn't he, for exactly the same reason remove Bσm/μ from this equation? He does not, he rewrites it and arrives at:

    – c2 ·∇ × ∇ × B = d2B/dt2 – v2·∇∇·B
    v2·∇∇·B – c2 ·∇ × ∇ × B = d2B/dt2

    Oh well, so much for his theory. He started out good, but he messes up completely.
    Also note how he switches back and forth between full derivatives (d/dt) and partial derivatives (∂/∂t). I believe this is also a source of errors.
    To do this right, it is considerably more complicated, and you will arrive at quite another result. This other result does in fact contain a scalar, a longitudinal and a transverse component (3 parts, not 2).
    I thought it might be illuminating to do this trick in a 4 dimensional space (including time). Unfortunately this changes the nature of the vector fields to such an extend that these simple maths do no longer apply.

    ----- Turning to his practical work... -----

    As I have done a very similar experiment myself I will present my findings.
    The set up is as follows

    (see Meyl1.jpg)

    When L2 is at resonance the LED shines brightly.
    To understand why, we consider the following.
    Because L2 is at resonance, it does neither act as a inductive nor capacitive load. So when considering L1 we do not have to look at L2 and everything behind there.
    This leaves us this:

    (see Meyl2.jpg)

    L1 creates a voltage difference. Having a higher capacitance at one end, this results in higher voltage (swings) at the other end. So what is intended as a ground line actually becomes a transmission line. And of course, shielding C1 or C2 has absolutely no effect!

    (see Meyl3.jpg)

    Removing the diodes means that much less current can flow in L4.

    (see Meyl4.jpg)

    This increases the inductance of L2 (see Colorado Springs Notes of Nov 9, 1899), giving a lower resonance frequency. This results in an inductive load on L1, disturbing its resonance as well. Not because the sending antenna 'feels' the receiving circuit.

    By grounding the 'ground connection' a very different situation occurs with different readings.

    (see Meyl5.jpg)

    The current is transferred in a different manner now and unfortunately with the voltages that I have currently access to the readings become too small. I.e. the LED's do no longer shine...

    In an interview held at 21 Sept, Meyl says he has some difficulties in obtaining resonance when applying his technology to cars. Of course he has, because then he has to use an actual ground instead of the 1-wire transmission line. Remember that obtaining resonance can NEVER be a problem as long as you can convey the right frequency to the receiver.

    Nice try, no cigar!

    Attached Files

  • #2
    Sorry to see that super-scripts and sub-scripts have been changed to normal scripts.
    This may be confusing, but I think the mathematical-inclined will figure it out...

    ∇ × H = ∂D/∂t + Jf
    (f is subscript, meaning free current)

    σm and σe
    (the m and e are subscripts refering to magnetic and electric specific conductance resp.)

    ρm and ρe
    (the m and e are subscripts refering to magnetic and electric charge density resp.)

    Jm and Je
    (the m and e are subscripts refering to magnetic and electric current resp.)

    all occurences of '2' in the equations are superscript, meaning 'squared'.

    Last edited by Ernst; 10-15-2012, 09:45 AM. Reason: clarification + mistake + forgot 2 subscripts


    • #3
      Hi Ernst, I'm not able to understand the Theory well so I can't comment on that,
      but I have done the experiments and I do not agree with Meyls findings, I think I
      agree almost entirely with your findings. It is possible to tune the setup to act in
      different ways it can be made to come "into tune" when a load is added.

      I also notice if I excite a transmitter primary past the resonant frequency at a
      higher frequency a situation occurs where the primary and secondary voltage
      become 180 degrees out of phase rather than 0 degrees in phase although this
      test was done with a ground connected transmitter. I think this could explain
      the two modes of resonance. Although I did consider the possibility
      that it could be caused by a mismatch of primary secondary resonance. If I go
      to about 1/3 of those frequencies I see a strong response for the two modes as

      Blue traces are the primary wave form (direct connection) and the yellow are the secondary wave form
      obtained by a hanging probe near the secondary. The coil is just driven by a
      function generator but it will light neons when driven by the function generator.

      The third and fourth shots are when the primary is excited at about 1/3 of the
      respective frequencies the third shot I think shows the secondary reacting on
      the primary and the fourth shot shows it not affecting the primary much at all. My coupling is close.

      Last edited by Farmhand; 06-18-2014, 11:41 AM.


      • #4
        Nice work Ernst. Now that you have disposed of Meyl and his disinfo, read all posts by user "Dollard, E. P. (N6KPH)" and "T-rex".

        "Knowledge is cosmic. It does not evolve or unfold in man. Man unfolds to an awareness of it. He gradually discovers it." - Walter Russell

        "Once men died for Truth, but now Truth dies at the hands of men." - Manly P. Hall


        • #5
          @ Farmhand,

          It looks like you have some interesting experiment there. But from the description I can not deduce with certainty what you have done exactly and in what order.
          For example: did you first get a 0 phase shift, and then by changing the frequency only, you get a 180 phase shift?
          With these experiments you have to be very precise to eliminate possibly disturbing influences. The pics 3 and 4 show, judging it from here, an interference pattern. That is all I can say.....

          @ dR-Green,

          I believe you have said something vaguely similar on previous encounters?
          I truely trust your good intentions but just saying "Ok, now read through this pile of info" is not helping me. Isn't there some compact overview of Eric's work, preferably with references to more detailed info.
          To be honest, I have been reading large parts of his work, and I find it helpfull at some points. But his work would be much more accessable (for me) if he would leave out his spiteful remarks. I understand perfectly where that comes from and I sympathise with him, let that be understood, but it does not help him getting his views across.
          Also I notice some differences between his theory and Tesla's and as long as I do not understand either to their full extend, I would blindly follow Tesla.



          • #6
            Yes that is what I did, and shots three and four are produced by just
            changing the frequency to about 1/3 of the frequency of the shots 1 and 2.

            Shot one is resonance in phase then I adjusted only the frequency of the input
            up to see shot 2, then I adjusted frequency only down to 1/3 of shot one's frequency to see
            shot 3 and then adjusted up to 1/3 of shot two's frequency is shot 4.

            Yes I know things influence the coils, this was not a factor of influence it is the
            result of simply changing the input frequency. The secondary circuit still oscillates
            at the fundamental frequency when the primary is pulsed at 1/3 of that, as it
            should. Shot's three and four show that, shot's 1 and 2 the primary is excited
            at the full frequency.

            Meyl adjust's his frequency up to about 7 mHz from about 5 mHz and then claims
            the higher frequency is the scalar mode, which I think is complete rubbish.



            • #7
              Originally posted by Ernst View Post
              Also I notice some differences between his theory and Tesla's and as long as I do not understand either to their full extend, I would blindly follow Tesla.
              What are you referring to? Yes I said "read this" because on the previous encounter I had also said that Meyl was doing his own thing not replicating Tesla, so now that you are satisfied that that is the case I gave a reminder of a better alternative since you seem to be interested in the theory. There isn't really a condensed overview, but there are videos that will help.

              Eric Dollard - S.F.T.S. - Dec. 9, 2007 - Part 1 - YouTube

              Eric Dollard Peter Lindemann Tesla's Longitudinal Electricity - YouTube

              Tesla transverse and longitudinal electric waves

              The Tesla Marconi Wireless System - YouTube

              And "Condensed Intro To Tesla Transformers"

              Last edited by dR-Green; 10-15-2012, 09:54 AM.

              "Knowledge is cosmic. It does not evolve or unfold in man. Man unfolds to an awareness of it. He gradually discovers it." - Walter Russell

              "Once men died for Truth, but now Truth dies at the hands of men." - Manly P. Hall


              • #8
                Anyway I very much hope to see some learned discussion about the theory side
                of things you presented. And maybe some more "laymans" explanations if
                possible to go along with it. It's good to see others who are capable like yourself
                looking into these things and posting about it. It is much appreciated, personally
                I would consider your findings on these things very interesting.


                P.S. Ernst, I was wondering if you could provide a link to Meyl's writings or such if
                it is possible ?

                Oh I'm, sorry it's easy to find. Meyl - Scalarwave-Technology - The european website of

                Last edited by Farmhand; 10-15-2012, 03:43 PM.


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Farmhand View Post
                  P.S. Ernst, I was wondering if you could provide a link to Meyl's writings or such if
                  it is possible ?

                  Oh I'm, sorry it's easy to find. Meyl - Scalarwave-Technology - The european website of

                  Having a quick look through this:


                  The self-resonance of the Tesla coils, according to the frequency counter, lies at 7
                  MHz. Now the frequency is ran down and see there, at approx. 4.7 MHz the
                  receiver again glows, but less bright, easily shieldable and without discernible
                  effect back on the transmitter. Now we unambiguously are dealing with the
                  transmission of the Hertzian part and that goes with the speed of light. Since the
                  wavelength was not changed, does the proportion of the frequencies determine the
                  proportion of the velocities of propagation. The scalar wave according to that goes
                  with (7/4.7=) 1.5 times the speed of light!
                  For one thing, he assumes that at 4.7 Mc the propagation is 100% luminal. This will not be the case, as I'm sure that we are all well aware that EM waves will never travel at the speed of light on earth and in coils, supposedly it will in free space/a vacuum, but certainly not in our experiments with wires on earth. What IS the wavelength of his coil? He doesn't say, not that I've seen. He hasn't bothered to calculate the 100% luminal frequency from the wavelength, which is non-existent here, before telling us that 4.7 Mc is "at the speed of light".

                  I would have thought that when discussing velocity, the distance travelled would be quite an important factor to consider
                  Last edited by dR-Green; 10-15-2012, 08:08 PM.

                  "Knowledge is cosmic. It does not evolve or unfold in man. Man unfolds to an awareness of it. He gradually discovers it." - Walter Russell

                  "Once men died for Truth, but now Truth dies at the hands of men." - Manly P. Hall


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ernst View Post

                    This other result does in fact contain a scalar, a longitudinal and a transverse component (3 parts, not 2).
                    Good on you for sticking with that Ernst, though I do need to say that the pure maths is way above my head.

                    I have in the past watched the Meyl demonstration lecture and formed the opinion he had not demonstrated longitudinal radiation at all. I did however feel that he knew and knows exactly what he was and is doing, and that his main aim is for the sale of parts and equipment related to further investigations.

                    I have also felt that Eric's rope demo of longitudinal radiation is quite wrong, because of course there is not a direct connection as his rope suggests, for longitudinal radiation can pass right through a 'solid' metal screen, or even two as the Old Scientist has demonstrated.

                    Which brings me to the scentence I have lifted out of your post, and your use of the words 'scalar', 'longitudinal' and 'transverse' in one sentence.
                    Is that 'scalar' alternating 'longitudinally' such that it is capable of cyclical 'transverse' transduction + re-radiation ?

                    I am attempting to question your maths with a purely imaginary concept, but I cannot be sure my question is understandable, and I don't know of any other better way to put it.

                    Cheers .......... Graham.


                    • #11
                      A Circuit Analyis view - as opposed to using Maxwell-Heaviside Equations


                      Since I don't have a degree in radio engineering nor any related field, here's some select quotes of Eric's posts along with some small commentary by myself. I hope this string of posts will share some of the more technical side of Eric's work regarding longitudinal waves.


                      *First I would like to say that I'm not representing anyone in any way, aside from myself, and anything wrongly stated by myself is solely due to my own ignorance and inabilities. All content in blue and all pictures is Eric's work.


                      ***Posts regarding NEAR-FIELD longitudinal propagation***

                      *Telluric propagation and reception could be argued as being a sudo near-field coupling rather than as a far-field propagation through free-space. Similar to how a 60cycle transformer works but done at long distances. Longitudinal free-space propagation is NOT discussed by Eric,however, he does make mention as to a few ideas on how he would experiment in this direction though. His efforts are mainly with transformers and telluric/ground-radio.*

                      Reference 1#:

                      Extending Inductance and Capacitance

                      In the previous section the following dimensional relation has been established,

                      (1) Henry – Farad, or Second Square.

                      Here given is the dimensional relation uniting inductance and capacitance, time.

                      This dimensional relation (15) can be expressed in a pair of forms

                      (2) Per Henry, or Farad per Second Square


                      (3) Per Farad, or Henry per Second Square

                      Substituting the relations;

                      (4) Henry per Second, or Ohm,


                      (5) Farad per Second, or Siemens,

                      Into relations (2) and (3) results in the following relations;

                      (7) Per Henry, or Siemens per Second,


                      (8) Per Farad, or Ohm per Second.

                      These relations suggest that variation of resistance with respect to time results in an “Elastance” K, in per Farad. Likewise, a variation of conductance with respect to time results in an “Enductance” M, in per Henry. What is significant here is that the variation of resistance gives rise to a reactance, this without energy storage in an actual field. See C.P. Steinmetz, “Theory and Calculation of Alternate Current Phenomena”, 1900 edition, “Pulsation of Resistance”.

                      Henry, time to the zero power,

                      Henry per second, time to the first power,


                      Ohm, time to the first power,

                      Ohm per second, time to the second power


                      Per Farad, time to the second power


                      Henry per Second Square, or Per Farad.

                      Here it is suggested that the variation of a magnetic inductance at a rate which is the square of the time function (cosine squared, etc.) converts this inductance into the equivalent of a Dielectric Elastance. Likewise, the variation of an electro-static capacity at a rate which is the square of the time function (sine squared, etc) converts this capacitance into the equivalent of a Magnetic Enductance. L, in Henry, is transformed thru time squared into K, in Per Farad. C, in Farad, is transformed into M, in Per Henry. Here the principles of Parameter Variation have been extended to include “second order” Parameter Variation, this giving rise to a quadrapolar configuration of inductance, L, M, and capacitance, C, K. Little knowledge exists on this topic, however the principle of the “Negative Resistance” Telephone Repeater is similar. Many experimental possibilities exist here.

                      While the previous material gives alternate expressions for inductance and capacitance in the dimension of time, it is very instructive to consider alternate expressions for inductance and capacitance in the dimensions of space, since they are geometric expressions of space in and of themselves. In the previous writings they have been, for the most part, directed primarily into electro-magnetic relations. Such is the giga-watt D.C. powerline to Los Angeles. The so called current is in opposite directions and the potential is of opposite polarity. Hereby, the magnetic field, as given by L, in Henry, repels, and the dielectric field, as given by C, in Farad, attracts. L and C represent the transverse E.M. forces. However, consider the current is in the same direction, and the potential is the same on both wires. Now the magnetic field attracts, and the dielectric field repels. Here result in alternate expression for the Magnetic and Dielectric Forces;

                      Henry, L, magnetic repulsion,

                      Farad, C, dielectric attraction,

                      And alternately,

                      Per Henry, M, magnetic attraction,

                      Per Farad, K, dielectric repulsion.

                      LC represents the Transverse Electro-Magnetic wave,

                      MK represents the Longitudinal Magneto-Dielectric Wave.

                      The T.E.M., or LC wave propagates along the conductor axis, The L.M.D., or MK, propagates normal to the axis of the conductor. In general, both LC and MK waves exist on a complex structure such as a resonant transformer coil. Here derived is a quadrapolar magnetic/dielectric relationship. Resonance is now on a higher order since two energy exchanges are now FOUR energy exchanges, hence a Fourth order differential equation results. See, L.V. Bewely, “Transmission Systems” book. This fourth order resonance was very important for Tesla’s Transformers and today is ignored. (Corums).

                      Here established is the forms of inductance, and two forms of capacitance. Expressing these in dimensional relations,

                      (1) L, Henry. Trasverse Inductance.
                      Centimeter Square
                      (2) C, Farad. Transverse Capacitance.
                      Second Square per Centimeter Square

                      (3) M, per Henry. Longitudinal Inductance.
                      Per Centimeter Square
                      (4) K, per Farad. Longitudinal Capacitance.
                      Centimeter Square per Second Square.
                      Hence given is the quadrapolar relations

                      L, the self inductance

                      C, the self capacitance

                      M, the mutual enductance

                      K, the mutual elastance.

                      Derived is two time scalar space distributions,

                      LM, Henry per Henry

                      CK, Farad per Farad

                      LM is called the Magnetic Space Factor,

                      CK is called the Dielectric Space Factor.

                      These space factors LM and CK represent this quadrapolar space distribution as extensions of the basic L and C. Also, a pair of frequencies now exist,

                      LC, Henry – Farad, or Second Square


                      MK, per (Henry – Farad) or per Second Square.

                      It hereby can be seen that resonance of a complex structure, such as an oscillating coil, is much more difficult to represent than a simple LC relationship. Here is the major obstacle to the engineering of Tesla type resonant transformers.

                      Reference #2

                      (continued in part2)
                      Last edited by garrettm4; 10-16-2012, 03:13 PM.


                      • #12
                        A Circuit Analyis view - as opposed to using Maxwell-Heaviside Equations Pt2

                        Continuing with: ***Posts regarding NEAR-FIELD longitudinal propagation***

                        Reference #3

                        Lamare Dialogue

                        When considering waves on coiled windings, leave out the electrons, let us forget them once and for all. They are for electronic devices (RG) NOT for electrical devices (LC). Forget the electrons, forget it!

                        It is generally considered that any wave must consist of a conjugate pair of energies, magnetic and dielectric let's say. Only then an interaction between time and space is possible. As I have shown recently it is through the union of a conjugate pair (L and C) that the dimension of time is produced. The propagation constant is then equal to:

                        (1) Negative Gamma Square

                        Having a pair of imaginary roots, plus j Gamma and minus j Gamma

                        It is however that the JJ Thompson Longitudinal Dielectric Motions cannot have a periodic solution, there is one energy only, dielectric. This needs to be resolved.

                        There are four distinct forms of energy stored in a winding,
                        Magnetic Pair:

                        L, Leakage Inductance, Henry
                        M, Mutual Inductance, per Henry

                        Dielectric Pair:

                        C, Leakage Capacitance, Farad
                        K, Mutual Capacitance, per Farad

                        The Magnetic Distribution along the coil axis is given by

                        (2) Epsilon to the square root of LM power. It is an exponential curve along the axis.

                        The Dielectric Distribution along the coil axis is given by

                        (3) Epsilon to the square root of CK power. It too is an exponential curve along the axis.

                        LM an CK are time scalars hence it can be seen that these initial distributions at t = 0 give rise to complex energy exchanges because of the exponential space distributions. We have now a fourth order differential in space and time. Alice lands in Wonderland. Forget Maxwell, forget the Corums, dead ends, forget them once and for all!!

                        Continuing with the four energy co-efficients:

                        LC, this gives the space scalar frequencies of oscillation, having no distribution in space, only in time (dot product)

                        MK, this gives the "Tesla Vector" normal to the coil windings, a counter-velocity in per centimeters per second. (axial product)


                        L/K this gives the clockwise "Poynting Vector" around the circumference of the coil windings, a velocity in centimeters per second (cross product)

                        C/M, this gives the counter-clockwise "Poynting Vector" around the circumference of the coil windings, a velocity in centimeters per second (cross product)

                        (4) Hence (LC + MK(k^2)) + k(L/K - C/M)

                        (5) a +kb

                        The Heaviside relation for the dimension of space. For the condition of balance,

                        (6) L/K = C/M

                        The T.E.M. component vanishes and the "Poynting Vectors" cancel out. The resistance of the coil also cancels out giving rise to a very great magnification factor, as well as a pure longitudinal wave, a "Tesla Coil".

                        Forget the Corums, the Bewelly-Dollard Theory has made them obsolete. Also it is my own belief that we have outgrown Maxwell. The path started by Tesla, Through Steinmetz and Alexanderson, to L.V. Bewelly has taken us far beyond the primordial physics interpretation of J.C. Maxwell. Leyden Jars and scales have grown to giant substation transformers and high speed oscilloscopes. We are entering a brave new world of electricity, electricity without electrons.

                        *Personal Notes on Energy Flow*

                        Single Path "Pure" Modes:

                        1)...LC = Transverse-Electro-Magnetic, T.E.M.

                        .....T.E.M. represents pure TRANSVERSE energy flow

                        2)...MK = Longitudinal-Magneto-Dielectric, L.M.D.

                        ......L.M.D. represents pure LONGITUDINAL energy flow

                        Dual Path "Hybrid" Modes:

                        a)...MC = Transverse-Electric, T.E. & Longitudinal-Magneto, L.M.

                        ......T.E. represents a TRANSVERSE electric energy flow
                        ......L.M. represents a LONGITUDINAL magnetic energy flow

                        b)...LK = Transverse-Magnetic, T.M. & Longitudinal-Dielectric, L.D.

                        .....T.M. represents TRANSVERSE magnetic energy flow
                        ......L.D. represents LONGITUDINAL electric energy flow

                        MK, energy travels in between windings via mutual coupling. LC, energy travels along the entire length of winding, as if it were a pair of straight wires. LK & MC, energy moves in a SPIRAL propagation, each in a different direction, a HYBRID of both the T.E.M. and L.M.D. energy flows.

                        Going back to circuit theory, two forms of resonance can take place in a single layer solenoid, PARALLEL and SERIES resonance. When the susceptances of the C & M parameters are equal, parallel resonance is present. When the reactances of the L & K parameters are equal, series resonance is present. When both forms of resonance take place, two counter rotating energy flows are present due to the energy exchanges between the distributed circuit parameters, LK (T.M./L.D.) and CM (T.E./L.M.). In this condition, the transverse components T.E. & T.M. cancel out, leaving the longitudinal L.D. & L.M. energy flow. This results in a pure L.M.D. energy propagation from the solenoid. Coupling with a distant receiver is done either as L.D. or L.M., where L.M. uses the earth for telluric transmission and the L.D. uses the atmosphere for dielectric transmission. A free-space L.M.D. or L.D. coupling has not ever been proven and is foggy at best. L.M. coupling through the earth is what Tesla referred to when talking about "wireless" power transmission.

                        ***Posts regarding FAR-FIELD longitudinal propagation***

                        Reference #4

                        Lamare Lunar Effort; Ideas

                        The longitudinal antennae ideas seem stuck in the mud. Seems everything is quasi E.M. "Electrical Soundwaves in the Aether", Tesla. Only two ways I see; a form of open ended circular waveguide. One mode, hard to excite, is longitudinal. Please post circular waveguide mode chart (Frederich Terman)!!
                        Another way is a tiny U.H.F. resonant coil, NOT A HELICAL RESONATOR. AN OPEN COIL NOT ENCLOSED IN A COAXIAL CYLINDER.

                        For the circular waveguide the pipe is closed on one end, open at the other end. Open end may require mode stabilizer. The proper mode of excitation is extremely important! (Terman, Radio Engineers Handbook)

                        For the resonant coil, a disk larger than coil diameter at current end, a disk smaller than coil diameter at voltage end. Ratio of disk diameters derived from coil impedance. Excite coil with small loop. As for the frequency; For the waveguide must be greater than 1000 Mc, for the coil must be less than 1000 Mc. These would be my first efforts to create electrical soundwaves in the aether. The longitudinal waves of my work involves Telluric Waves (submarines) and windings (transformers). Free space longitudinal waveforms may not have any relation to my (MK) waves

                        More to follow as I get time.

                        Garrett M
                        Last edited by garrettm4; 10-16-2012, 12:17 AM.


                        • #13
                          Isn't the apparent over luminal velocity of resonant air core coils just the result
                          of the wave not actually having to travel the entire length of the wire but calculated
                          as if it does travel the entire distance of the wire giving the appearance of over
                          luminal velocity ? Layman's answer please.


                          Meyl says this below, however it sounds wrong to me, I don't see how Tesla
                          could have possibly operated the Colorado transmitter at 6 Hz, has anybody
                          seen reference to this feat. I think Tesla merely stated the frequencies he
                          thought the Earth would resonate at going by his experiments.

                          The near field (Scalar wave acc. to Tesla)
                          In the proximity it looks completely different. The proximity concerns
                          distances to the transmitter of less than the wavelength divided by 2.
                          Nikola Tesla has broadcasted in the range of long waves, around 100
                          Kilohertz, in which case the wavelength already is several kilometres. For
                          the experiments concerning the resonance of the earth he has operated
                          his transmitter in Colorado Springs at frequencies down to 6 Hertz
                          . Doing so the whole earth moves into the proximity of his transmitter. We
                          probably have to proceed from assumption that the Tesla radiation primarily concerns the proximity, which also is called the radiant range of
                          the transmitting antenna.

                          It looks to me that Meyl is selling some PCB coils, some misc. parts eg, spheres
                          and a sine wave generator.

                          In reality transmissions the way he does it are easy. It's the circuit to run the
                          transmitter in the mHz range without buying a signal generator that is the
                          difficulty, one that can deliver more power.



                          • #14
                            Ok, let's answer this in FIFO order....

                            @ dR-Green,
                            On the differences I believe to have found between Tesla and Dollard. Let me first say that I am not ready for an in depth discussion on this subject as I do not yet fully understand both theories. But I am quite sure that when Tesla mentions 1/4 wavelength he is talking about the entire circuit length (ground to top-load). In Eric's explanaition of (3 coil) Tesla systems, he talks about 1/4 wavelength or 1/2 wavelength per coil.
                            This is the major difference that I believe I have found. There are some small other issues but those could also be misinterpretations on my side.

                            @ Farmhand,
                            Vector calculus is not actually that difficult, there are some nice video's on youtube explaining the curl, div and grad. These help you visualise what is going on, and from there you'll pick things up quicker than you would now think.

                            @ GSM,
                            The 'old scientists' believed in ether and I think that is a good thing because many things become much more easy to explain that way. The way I interpret it, it is like this:
                            ether is everywhere, in the vacuum, in matter, everywhere. It behaves like an incompressable liquid. Hence, there is 'a rope' pervading all matter and any movement in this liquid results in movements propagating through this liquid.
                            Floating in this liquid there are carriers for certain properties, like electrical charge.
                            Anyway, this is the picture I get when reading the 'old science'. But there are still some issues that I do not yet fully comprehend.
                            Like for instance, sometimes it looks as if a charge carrier is just a mathematical construct with no actual physical presence, just like 'the beginning or end of a trajectory'.
                            Then when I think in terms of vortices things get more interesting but still do not provide a full explanation. A vortex in 2D can be seen as a circle with 2 forces, one on the outside pointing inward and one on the inside pointing outward. This sound like an equilibrium, but it is not. Look in a bath tub vortex, it exists because matter is flowing out perpendicular to the area of the circle. In other words, a 2D vortex can only exist in a 3D space, because it needs an extra dimension.
                            OK? Now add 1 more dimension to this example. We get a vortex in 3D which may look like a ball sucking in surrounding matter. But this matter has to go somewhere to maintain the vortex, so we need 1 more dimension.
                            This was the reason why I tried to rewrite Meyl's work in 4D. Unfortunately that can not be done.

                            Which brings me to the scentence I have lifted out of your post, and your use of the words 'scalar', 'longitudinal' and 'transverse' in one sentence.
                            longitudinal and transverse are occilations (AC), scalar is more like expanding DC.
                            Try to get a copy of Turtur's work. This deals with that scalar part and also proofs its existance both in theory and a practical experiment.
                            If you have trouble finding it on the internet I can always send you a copy by email.

                            @ garrettm4,
                            Thank you so much! Your overview is very much appreciated! I have not read it yet, but I will some time today...



                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Farmhand View Post
                              Isn't the apparent over luminal velocity of resonant air core coils just the result
                              of the wave not actually having to travel the entire length of the wire but calculated
                              as if it does travel the entire distance of the wire giving the appearance of over
                              luminal velocity ? Layman's answer please.
                              Yes. I haven't done these tests on the flat spirals so I can't comment from that side, but the point is you need to know what the actual wavelength is and what is "100%" before you can say your result is higher or lower than it. He hasn't bothered to consider the distance travelled, he just found a resonant peak on the coil at 4.7 Mc, called that "the speed of light", and went on his merry way from there. So we have no idea whether his result is actually "faster" or "slower" than light. If 7 Mc is below the luminal frequency of the coil based on wire length then obviously there's no faster than light measurements at all, there's no way to tell because he forgot to mention it.

                              "Knowledge is cosmic. It does not evolve or unfold in man. Man unfolds to an awareness of it. He gradually discovers it." - Walter Russell

                              "Once men died for Truth, but now Truth dies at the hands of men." - Manly P. Hall