Gray Tube Replication

[Ghst]

I'm going to try discharging nothing but the capacitor into the coils to see how much repulsion that produces.

When I did this I "swiped" a wire to my capacitors positive, across the high voltage supply, immediately touching off the discharge to the coils. If you setup properly it is accomplished in one motion. But, I found that, you need figure how to time the discharge "touch". The longer the "touch" the more the capacitor discharges. If you empty the capacitor then it wants to spark when you "swipe" the high voltage supply, on recharge.

[Electrotek]

Still Working

Martin: That's good. That's really good. It turns out, though, that the battery is alright. I let it set for awhile and it came back. It drives my 87V. treadmill motor at around 60 to 80 RPM. And it's sparking again. So I did a little more with it.

I changed the circuit so that the CSET is tied directly to the cap, without an interrupter. This gives the CSET a constant spark, but the cap still charges. This is probably due to the choke effect of the coil around the Tube, in series with the arc. The battery is in series with the transformer, on the non rectified side. I fired the circuit, after several seconds of charging time, by taking the battery's other wire to the LV end of the CSET. (Along with the unbroken HV wire.) With this circuit, there isn't any residual charge in the cap, as long as I pull the plug while the Puff Spark is present. It drops the battery potential as much as .2V after around 10 firings. When I turn the battery around, the potential picks back up. And it went up another .1V after setting for a few hours.

Ghst: You're probably right. I don't see any evidence of the battery increasing the cap's charge. Still, there may be a little extra power with the repulsion coils, when I try "splitting the positive" like that. I'm not expecting much. But once the battery's power is split between the cap and the transformer, combining these two positive sparks may be the magic "secret". IOW, it might be nothing more than the plasma spark effect itself. I'm going to try discharging nothing but the capacitor into the coils to see how much repulsion that produces.

[Ghst]

Splittin The Positive?

I think Grey was referring to spliting the positive as a way of describing, What he was doing with the supply battery. He was taking the battery positive and stepping up the voltage into half-wave rectified high voltage DC potiential. Using that high voltage potiential to charge caps, run the motor and returning any excess to the charge battery. Thus he had a low voltage and a high voltage from the same battery, splitting the positive.

[martin]

I've been checking my "splitting the positive" effect and it seems I may have jumped the gun with my report. It turns out the charge in the cap, after discharging the circuit, is related to how long it takes to turn the power off. I'm going to go back to using the cap as 38, rather than 16. And I may have killed my battery. It still shows a voltage, but I can't get any sparks out of it. (I still have four more.)

It's still an interesting theory so I'm going to persue it a little further. But I don't recommend anyone else try it with heavy current HV discharges.

Sounds like you figured out how to positively split the battery.

[Electrotek]

Retraction

I've been checking my "splitting the positive" effect and it seems I may have jumped the gun with my report. It turns out the charge in the cap, after discharging the circuit, is related to how long it takes to turn the power off. I'm going to go back to using the cap as 38, rather than 16. And I may have killed my battery. It still shows a voltage, but I can't get any sparks out of it. (I still have four more.)

It's still an interesting theory so I'm going to persue it a little further. But I don't recommend anyone else try it with heavy current HV discharges.

[martin]

In order to cancel out the magnetism, don't you have to have two identical setups producing waves in opposite directions? Or waves at 180 from the same direction.

Yes, and he had 2 seperate supplies (coils) for the motor power supply. He could have timed them accordingly maybe, which could be another possiblility on the importance of Mallory getting the circuit timing correct. This would also explain why he stated that the motor couldnt operate within another magnetic field from say another motor.

Do you or anyone know what core material his electromagnets consisted of and/or the motor housing (in the early motors)?

[Electrotek]

In order to cancel out the magnetism, don't you have to have two identical setups producing waves in opposite directions? Or waves at 180 from the same direction.

[martin]

Martin: Thanks for the circuit. I wonder how the loop is orriented relative to the coils.

That loop in Gray's picture will produce a rotating magnetic field if it's frequency mismatched.

Im not %100 percent for sure. Right now Im winding miniature actual Magnifying Tesla coil set (transmitter/receiver) to experiment a little with longitudinal/scalar waves. Im posative that this is the begining of the powersupply. I need a better understanding of this before I can come up with any kind of reasonable ideas. So far this thing puts out unbelievable power, but still warm electric.

I know that the scalar waves that Dollard makes with his circuit will light incandescent bulbs as well as fl. tubes. However, it still heats the bulb. Dollards scalar wave actually combines magnetisim and current in the same direction. What is confusing is how to cancel out the magnetism. Ive read some other documents on longitudinal waves and they have similar circular antennas that favor the combinitation FFF and wire loop in Gray's pic. The theory is to get identical waves 180 deg out of phase to cancel out the magnetic field, but what youre left with is so weak, it's hardly usable/detectable.

[Electrotek]

Martin: Thanks for the circuit. I wonder how the loop is orriented relative to the coils.

That loop in Gray's picture will produce a rotating magnetic field if it's frequency mismatched.

[martin]

OK, I see the blue arrow's wire now. It does look like the loop is connected to the coil. I wonder what the loop is? It would have a really high frequency if it was a standing wave antenna. Being in parallel with the main coils would make the loop some kind of choke. But it seems such an effect would be very small.

Any ideas?

I found this. Look a little familiar? I see 2 FFF's magnetically coupled and a LOOP!

Interesting theory on the battery and cap.

[Electrotek]

Splitting The Positive With Battery And Capacitor

It's obvious that you can't split the positive with two batteries, since the potential of each battery cancels the other's, leaving no potential difference between the two positive terminals. Also, three batteries, with two in series and the third battery's negative connected to the negative of the other two, doesn't split the positive, since there's only one positive terminal with this circuit, due to the voltage drop across the single battery. However, a different situation exists when a battery and a capacitor are used. With the capacitor at a higher potential, the battery's positive terminal acts as the capacitor's negative pole - but only until the capacitor discharges. Then, the battery's positive terminal returns to the LV potential, with the battery discharging a pulse through the capacitor and the rest of the circuit.

Another factor to consider is the capacitor's ring back effect. Atfer it discharges, the momentary electrostatic field still present in the dielectric pulls charge back into the capacitor, in the opposite direction of the discharge. It's occurred to me that this "inductive pull" might allow for a heavier surge of current from the battery than would occur when the battery is discharged into a non charged cap. So I set up an experiment to test for this effect.

I switched the cap around so that it's constantly wired to the diode 24, using my hot stick jumper wire for the switch 26. Then I fired the circuit after several seconds, to allow the cap to fully charge. After that, I turned the power off and shorted the capacitor with the jumper wire. This produced a snap, indicating there was still some charge in the capacitor. Then I did the same thing, with a car battery in series with the capacitor, positive to positive. This time, after turning the power off, I got a much louder snap when I shorted the capacitor.

I repeated both tests several times with similar results. I could never get as loud a discharge from the capacitor without the battery in the circuit. These tests were too primitive to be considered conclusive, but I have a direction to pursue. Later, I'll check the approximate power levels using my repulsion coils.

[boguslaw]

It's interesting that nobody touched interesting point : this photo clearly show that somebody was using tape recorder and presumably someone who owns those photos may also own audio tape ! It's only a problem with synchronizing both.

[Electrotek]

That diagonal line behind the transformer is a wire which goes up and plugs onto the top of one of the caps. Also, there's a plug on the end of the red wires. When this is unplugged, the white cover can lie flat. Maybe it's plugged into the relay?

[martin]

Martin: Here's the best photo I could come up with, by adjusting the highlights. It looks about the same as yours. I see a diagonal line behind the transformer. Behind that is what looks like a round tube with a black spot in the middle. I've got to get a better picture.

That pic is just a little clearer I think. What in the world could that be?? I see the diagonal line, actually I see 2 diagonal lines that intersect to form an "X" and what ever those circleular things are, are are sitting in the v's of the X. Very strange.

[Electrotek]

Aaron: OK, as long as you're satisfied with your understanding.

But here's one last thing I'll throw in. When doing electrical work, if two phases are shorted out, it produces a fire ball. AC power, phase to phase, with no ground. Or diodes.