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Water Fuel This forum is for discussion on any water fuel topic dealing with electrolysis, Stanley Meyer, hho, Brown's Gas, Puharich, etc...

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  #91  
Old 09-26-2010, 09:29 PM
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crystal tolerance

Looking at some 120MHz and 20MHz crystals available:

Frequency Tolerance: Ī 50ppm (this is for both 20MHz and 120MHz crystals)

So the 20MHz crystal could be off by 1000hz and the 120MHz one could
be off by as much as 6000hz (either + or - of course). Is my interpretation
of Ī 50ppm accurate?

A 20MHz crystal would have the range of 19.999MHz to 20.001MHz.

So a 120MHz crystal would have a range of 119.994MHz to 120.006MHz.
The entire range is still within the general frequency range we want.

Seeing that the 20MHz still has some deviation overall, even if not as
much as a 120MHz crystal, it still has deviation meaning according to
Mike's diagram, the water still splits from this and the water would appear
not to care about the 20MHz crystal deviation.

-------------

edit: And, this depends on what deviation means. If the tolerance indicates
how much off from the rated MHz it is and if it is off, the frequency stats
consistent but could be off from 20MHz or 120MHz permanently.

Or does the crystal's frequency roam around while running deviating from
the rated spec as it is being used as a trigger signal.
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Last edited by Aaron; 09-26-2010 at 09:32 PM.
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  #92  
Old 09-27-2010, 03:18 AM
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Pll

Mike mentioned something to keep it tuned.
That means some kind of PLL phase locked loop
circuit - does this take out all the deviation
in the crystal itself?

This PLL isn't in the diagram but Mike did mention
it. I'm only guessing he is referring to a PLL.
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  #93  
Old 09-27-2010, 03:32 AM
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Good Thread

Here is something of interest.
My uncle is a WW2 veteran and has a wealth of info stored in his head. Which is easily accessed via a catalyst of ethanol and coke. LOL
Anyway...After a few catalyst he confided that soldiers in need of a hot drink with lack of combustibles would use 2 army issue spoons and the antenna of a army issue field radio to boil a cup of water in seconds.
The spoons were opposed to each other like a couple of parabolic sound reflection dishes that are commonplace at technology museums.
A whisper can be heard 50 yards away in the opposing dish etc...
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  #94  
Old 09-27-2010, 06:15 AM
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Excess energy

I'd like to add the following argument to this discussion: If you want excess energy in your system, IMHO you will have to use at least full wave antenna's. The more standing waves that fit in you antenna's, the more excess energy you will get, because you only have to drive one half wave yourself, the rest is powered by the electric field for free. That is one of the secrets the scientific community won't tell you. They say that resonance does not deliver energy and that it's just a matter of "impedance matching" to explain why antenna's have a gain. Well, Tesla nocked out a complete power plant using resonance, so don't buy that B.S. that it's just "impedance matching".
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  #95  
Old 09-27-2010, 08:37 AM
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Iím trying to think along the lines of something thatís common and readily adaptable to our project without getting too bogged down in the mire of UHF engineering
So perhaps cannibalizing a UHF walkie talky would be a reasonable starting point. Most of the work is done already. We could simply change the Xtal for 20 MHz and peak the tuning; of course a linear amp would have to be stuck onto the end of it. A connection made from the oscillator would let us deal with the x6 120Mhz side of things,
Computer clocking circuit is perhaps adaptable also? I was a little off track with the ďovertonesĒ I had forgotten that only odd harmonics apply sorry I didnít mean to lead anyone astray. I have worked at UHF but a long time ago. And that was ďthe state of the artĒ used at that time I was repairing these things NEN Gallery : 1970s radio I guess things have altered and advanced since then thank you Dr for a well directed nudge in the right direction.
Other things I am considering that could be altered are Beta 87A on PGX Handheld Transmitter Iíve Just searched UHF on eBay and think maybe such as this could be converted UHF Modulator RF 900 Channel 21-69 on eBay (end time 04-Oct-10 21:37:31 BST) to our cause. It would certainly be stable and it is up on the top frequency band we want to use. Just trying to get creative, and float a few ideas after all Iím sure lots of folks reading this would like to try this principle and the more the merrier as far as I concerned.
A few thousand cars popping about on water all at the same time would rattle a cage or two! Remember what Imhotep did with the fan? He adapted something thatís as common as mud. Itís what Iím trying to consider here if you get my gist.
After all thereís millions of TVs for instance all in the UHF band what about the old VHS tape machine in you garage for instance Its up there In the band we want and tunable if only to avoid cross channel interference usable??
Letís bounce it about a bit. I donít mind looking stupid... In fact I havenít got much choice
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  #96  
Old 09-27-2010, 08:52 AM
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crystal oscillators

A crystal oscillator is under $5 and the circuit for the oscillator part
is like 10 parts... probably takes less time to build one than the time it
takes to cannibalize something else... possibly.

In either case, for under $10, there are "crystal oscillator modules"
available in a little package not much bigger than a crystal itself.
It has the entire circuitry built in for the oscillator part of the circuit.

"crystal oscillator module" - Google Search

And another simple circuit that 'might' work:
Make your own oscillator modules!
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  #97  
Old 09-27-2010, 10:13 AM
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Hi Aaron thanks for that! The problem I anticipate is matching, it is nice and easy to imagine a 20 MHz or even a 120 Mhz oscillator doubling and tripling and us getting our lovely 720 MHz sine wave at the end. The trouble is Itís a block diagram, To give us a basic Idea.
In practice the construction is going to be difficult, effectively each stage has to be tuned to the next stage, (just like the ATU tunes to the magnetic loop effectively) impedance matching and of course stray capacitance can throw every thing to hell,
Amplifiers and /or attenuation between the stages, and as the good Dr has pointed out circuitry with high rejection of unwanted frequencies and admittance of our sine wave need to be employed, distortion of any sort destroys what we are attempting. A pure sine wave locked at 720 MHz heterodyning with 120 MHz
Distortion = mismatch and spurious signals all over the place (remember Stanís TVI) also any spurious content will not fracture water.
Of course things may have changed since I worked in this field and these multiplier chips (which I have never had anything to do with) might just make everything easy (I hope so) but Iím not holding my breath. And If I can spot something that I think may adapt and someone else has done the design work and matching and solved all the stability aggravations, frequency drift, and distortion well Iíll ask on this forum there seems to be plenty of very skilled people here in every discipline.
And Iím sure they all want to see it done. As I read somewhere itís been a long time Ö far to long!
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  #98  
Old 09-27-2010, 11:02 AM
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Hi Lamar yes youíll notice that I brought up the subject of ďgainĒ a little earlier with relation to the Yagi and lightly posed the proposition that the tubes Stan demonstrates in his WFC may actually be a parasitic array in disguise.
With those slots you see cut in the tops of the tubes actually tuning the forward and reflective elements if you get my drift.
The reason why there is this phenomenal gain available from a Yagi? Like you, Iím not sure I buy the resonance theory but it holds up to a point.
I was going to link here to a part of a lecture by Eric Dollard in which he demonstrates and explains that when tuning longitudinal wave the VSWR Is Indeed exactly the inverse of that which we tune an EM wave to. All in all the bits of this jigsaw seem to be falling into place.
Here lies your free energy if I read you right. In fact if I understand correctly somewhat more than Ĺ the energy will be free as this longitudinal wave is moving much faster than light speed.
If I find this link again Lamare Iíll post it for you
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  #99  
Old 09-27-2010, 01:03 PM
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Sorry Aaron I didnít see your question for a while. Yes In my opinion loading and matching are all important we start with a nice clean Sine wave and we have to keep it like that or else we end up with a random uncontrollable ďMushĒ for want of a better description.
You see where the Dr is asking about F1 and F2, F1+F2 and F1 Ė F2 this is a truncated form of fouries theorem and really itís about as far as I got. But itís basically saying if you add sine waveforms these algebraic sums are what you end up with. The Dr like me is curious to know if this is going to be fed into the magnetic loops. And get blasted at the water as is.
All these frequencies and the mathís is of course are worked out in aĒ perfect worldĒ every time you mismatch or load your sine wave it tends to distort after its distorted you end up with an F1 and F2 and the harmonics which again become F1 and F2, F1+F2 and F1 Ė F2 you amplify this and try to feed it to the next stage very quickly you can end up with a meaningless mess of signal. Iím not of the caliber of Mike or the good Doc and my explanation is perhaps not pukka, but Iím sure you can see how things can get out of control very quickly. And why the Doc stressed the high Q rejection and admittance circuitry.
Its UHF radio engineering and itís a very different beast to the digital world.
When your oscillator is running Iím not quite sure if this makes sense but you need to touch it very lightly. Preferably a harmonic (which takes a lot less power to deliver than the fundamental) into a high matched impedance so the load effectively remains constant with little or no reflected power and so no distortion and so no spurious signals. Right or wrong thatís more or less how I see it.
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  #100  
Old 09-27-2010, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamare View Post
I'd like to add the following argument to this discussion: If you want excess energy in your system, IMHO you will have to use at least full wave antenna's. The more standing waves that fit in you antenna's, the more excess energy you will get, because you only have to drive one half wave yourself, the rest is powered by the electric field for free. That is one of the secrets the scientific community won't tell you. They say that resonance does not deliver energy and that it's just a matter of "impedance matching" to explain why antenna's have a gain. Well, Tesla nocked out a complete power plant using resonance, so don't buy that B.S. that it's just "impedance matching".
@lamare

Quote:
If you want excess energy in your system, IMHO you will have to use at least full wave antenna's.
Maybe I am misunderstanding what you said here? If you are referring to Mike's injection system, its not an issue of excess energy, it a molecular vibrational issue. This will cause a vibration of the bonds as Mike explained with his stick analogy. If you need to reference it back to 'The Great Tesla' then think of what he supposedly did with his little vibration generators. A very small oscillation would randomly set into a sustained and feedback loop which would lead to the disruption of mass.... Unless I have missed what Mike is doing and saying the excess energy is gained via the gas liberation in excess of the input energy from the RF system?

Quote:
resonance does not deliver energy and that it's just a matter of "impedance matching" to explain why antenna's have a gain.
I would very much appreciate you directing me to any work that states that antenna's are gainful? The obtain the gain if you will by reducing the field over which the energy is directed. If this has been shown otherwise I would be more than willing to relearn this part about antenna design.

Quote:
nocked out a complete power plant using resonance, so don't buy that B.S. that it's just "impedance matching"
This is pretty general indeed. I would think that you should rather say that is certain circuits 'Impedance Matching is not necessary for maximal power transfer'. Of course if you pulse a circuit with a square wave in the proper way you can set it into a decaying (ringing) oscillation at its resonance point, regardless of the driving impedance so long as the drive does not load and so drag down the Q of the driven so that full ringing is not possible.

Further I don't think Tesla what Tesla did was all that significant when one considers the generation technology for the electrical grid at that time. It common office knowledge that the early office photocopiers would bump the service so much that it would disrupt office computers and often throw breakers. My view of some of his work is not all that significant when viewed today, granted he was a great experimenter and contributed heavily to what we have today, yet what about all the rest of the great men of that period??
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  #101  
Old 09-27-2010, 02:54 PM
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Mike! an additional question

Mike, I was wondering how you viewed the media, what I mean is do you consider it to be non-linear or linear?

In the SEC Theory the Lattice is a linear medium and return for my purpose is via Superposition rather than a mixing in a non-linear fashion. This only applies when looking at my last question of whether the to separate 120 and 720 are doing the work or if it is a synthesis of the two primaries.
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  #102  
Old 09-27-2010, 03:54 PM
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I'm back

Well I am back from my trip which was quite eventfull to say the least. First I will explain the frequencies.

The frequencies I chose could have been other frequencies, but, the difference between them is important.

If you look at the first frequency of 120mhz, the secound is 6X to 720mhz. We now look at the heterodyning frequencies:-

Without filtering out we will get many orders of exact frequencies with a finite space between them. If we were to start with only 3X difference between these two frequencies we would get a different result.

Example:-

100mhz and 300mhz

200 400
200 600
400 800
400 1200

100mhz and 600mhz


500 700
200 1200
1000 1400
400 2400
2000 2800

Now you can see the difference with a 6X spacing rather than a 3X spacing. Each new frequency will interreact in a heterodyning mode as well and you need to run this through a computor program to see the full frequency spectrum.

Mike
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  #103  
Old 09-27-2010, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrStiffler View Post
Mike, I was wondering how you viewed the media, what I mean is do you consider it to be non-linear or linear?

In the SEC Theory the Lattice is a linear medium and return for my purpose is via Superposition rather than a mixing in a non-linear fashion. This only applies when looking at my last question of whether the to separate 120 and 720 are doing the work or if it is a synthesis of the two primaries.
I think the last post answers your question, I view it as linear.

I view the finite space between the frequencies is like a fulcrum point and that point is the breaking point.

I have not had time to go through all the questions yet, but I will do now and try to answer over then next few hours.

Mike
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  #104  
Old 09-27-2010, 04:15 PM
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Thank you, very interesting

Mike
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Old 09-27-2010, 04:35 PM
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20mhz cristal

@All

I chose this because it is quite stable at that frequency without using an oven to maintain the cristal temperature.

At higher frequencies the cristals are very thin and move frequency depending on temperature.

As Dr. Stiffler has said, you can use other means to obtain these frequencies, all you need at the end of the day is a good clean signal, the trick is not in the electronics, it is in the cell where these signals interreact. I do not think that the exact frequencies of 120mhz and 720mhz is important, what is important is the spacing "6X"

Mike
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  #106  
Old 09-27-2010, 06:29 PM
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How elegant!
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Old 09-27-2010, 07:30 PM
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basic crystal oscillator

Mike,

If you have a chance to answer some of the other questions, that
would be much appreciated! If you're too busy, no big deal.

@ Mike & All,

This seems to be about the most popular 20MHz crystal
http://www.rxdtech.com/pdf/mp49.pdf
If this is sufficient for the job, I'm ordering a few today.
With shipping about $3.50 USD each and shipping can be
reduced per item for multiple pieces.

This is the circuit I'm going to build, simplest I can come up with
so far:



Is there any concern about needing it to be square wave or sin wave
or can this signal from this oscillator simply be plugged into the doubler?
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  #108  
Old 09-27-2010, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
Mike,

If you have a chance to answer some of the other questions, that
would be much appreciated! If you're too busy, no big deal.

@ Mike & All,

This seems to be about the most popular 20MHz crystal
http://www.rxdtech.com/pdf/mp49.pdf
If this is sufficient for the job, I'm ordering a few today.
With shipping about $3.50 USD each and shipping can be
reduced per item for multiple pieces.

This is the circuit I'm going to build, simplest I can come up with
so far:



Is there any concern about needing it to be square wave or sin wave
or can this signal from this oscillator simply be plugged into the doubler?
@Aaron

Aaron you are asking some questions that do not have text book answers, only text book rules of thumb. To answer if this will go into a doubler the answer is most likely yes with a lot caveats, you will need to know the output impedance of this oscillator and the input impedance of the doubler, like will the doubler be a IC or a FET or a bipolar. You need to know the output peak to peak so you can determine how to bias the doubler. Then you need to know how clean the output is so that you can determine how much and if you need and bandpass filters. You may even need an amp after the double and then an impedance match to the power amp either active or static depending on the final power available from the last stage.

Simply put it would take the better part of a day to but the info into Spice and get a clean working circuit. I'm not sure who is going to really build this, but one needs to be familiar with Spice or some other design program or spend a lot of cut and solder time and some slide rule manipulation.

I hope you don't take my response wrong, its not a simple task to do it and feel you have what is specified and give one that warm feeling when looking for results.

We are totally bogged down here until after the first of the year. After that I just might do a circuit design unless Mike presents something before.

Sorry if I wasted the text.... and did not provide what you wanted.
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  #109  
Old 09-27-2010, 08:55 PM
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audio source from laptop

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrStiffler View Post
Sorry if I wasted the text.... and did not provide what you wanted.
That does answer more of what I need to know. I don't know what I don't know but now I know a little more. lol

I have a free spice version but never bothered to use it. I'll try to play
around with that.

In any case, I need to get a few of those crystals anyway if I go this
route.

I didn't fully get your method of doing the same without the crystal
and doublers/triplers.

I have cool edit pro and can generate a 120MHz signal on left for
example and 720MHz signal on the right channel. Then I could
cable out the left and right separately into their own 10watt linear
amp then put the amp outputs to the plates.

Would this not be appropriate for this purpose - something like that
have too much interference?

It's the only thing I already have that could do it. I can cut a headphone
cable and scope the two channels to see the waveform. The audio
program can generate square, sine or triangle.
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Old 09-27-2010, 09:26 PM
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Very Interested

A lot of us are very interested in this water splitter of Mike's. When he said that such a water splitter could get up to 10X more hydrogen and oxygen than an electrolyzer, he got our attention. Many of my friends and I have been building cells such as but not limited to the Boyce 101 plate cell, different configurations of Meyer, and many others for about 8 years now. Anyway, Mike, DrStiffler, & Aaron, you have quite a large following here. You have sparked a lot of interest indeed.
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Old 09-27-2010, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrStiffler View Post
@All

I don't want to change Mike's direction at all, but will throw out some additional info about obtaining the frequencies you want.

If you use doubler's, tripler's etc., you can design them so that they are for the most part immune fro non-desired input frequencies by using a combination of input filters (bandpass) and a high Q tank for the output stage. Therefore its a matter of good engineering and the art of RF to reject what might be present that you do not want.

What we do at my lab is use one of my exciters into a SGATE which gives a pretty level output across hundreds of megahertz.

*Side note for that 'PestWicked' fellow that made the remark that I could not substantiate UWB from my Exciters in the Diode Electrolysis Videos, LOOK CLOSELY.

Okay to explain what a SEC Exciter and SGATE can do, here are a few picture from an SA to show what not many of you have seen do to not having the needed equipment.

What I do is adjust the exciter for the spread I desire and bridge off the specific frequency I desire.

I would think this would be much easier than all the oscillator, doubler and triplers, just bandpass and amplify what you want, pic the candy from the selection so to speak.
Dr. Stiffler is making a good point, at the end of the day you only need those two frequencies. I personally do not have the circuit diagrams of 20 years ago and they were designed by one of my associates whom was a brilliant EE, he was also one of the people from my town in Shropshire who worked to bring about SSB.

Tomorrow I hope I will have more time and look for an easier solution for making these frequencies, but the Doc's idea is a sound one and might take some beating.

Mike
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  #112  
Old 09-27-2010, 09:50 PM
DrStiffler DrStiffler is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
That does answer more of what I need to know. I don't know what I don't know but now I know a little more. lol

I have a free spice version but never bothered to use it. I'll try to play
around with that.

In any case, I need to get a few of those crystals anyway if I go this
route.

I didn't fully get your method of doing the same without the crystal
and doublers/triplers.

I have cool edit pro and can generate a 120MHz signal on left for
example and 720MHz signal on the right channel. Then I could
cable out the left and right separately into their own 10watt linear
amp then put the amp outputs to the plates.

Would this not be appropriate for this purpose - something like that
have too much interference?

It's the only thing I already have that could do it. I can cut a headphone
cable and scope the two channels to see the waveform. The audio
program can generate square, sine or triangle.
@Aaron
I will rough out a circuit and post it tonight or tomorrow, but it will not have values. The bias points, supply voltage and filter values all need to be calculated. Most of the information can be obtained from the transistor spec sheets (if) the include transfer curves etc. Any way I'll post a rule of thumbs circuit which can be a starting point.
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Old 09-27-2010, 10:18 PM
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thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrStiffler View Post
@Aaron
I will rough out a circuit and post it tonight or tomorrow, but it will not have values. The bias points, supply voltage and filter values all need to be calculated. Most of the information can be obtained from the transistor spec sheets (if) the include transfer curves etc. Any way I'll post a rule of thumbs circuit which can be a starting point.
That would be great!

Myself and most other members are not experienced in these circuits and
it would be very helpful.

@ Slovenia - when the document you're putting together has a bit more
for the average experimenter to start getting their feet wet, like Dr.
Stiffler's basic concept schematic or anything else to get experimenters
off and running, that doc will get to a lot of people. Send a copy to Ash
too to get out and if you or anyone is pretty good at Wiki systems, then
starting a new page on Peswiki on this concept would be a good place
to have this stuff posted as well.
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  #114  
Old 09-27-2010, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slovenia View Post
A lot of us are very interested in this water splitter of Mike's. When he said that such a water splitter could get up to 10X more hydrogen and oxygen than an electrolyzer, he got our attention. Many of my friends and I have been building cells such as but not limited to the Boyce 101 plate cell, different configurations of Meyer, and many others for about 8 years now. Anyway, Mike, DrStiffler, & Aaron, you have quite a large following here. You have sparked a lot of interest indeed.
This work that was done back in the late 80's was never fully completed, we had a working model and it was demonstrated to get further working capital. Two weeks after it was stopped, and that is as far that I will go in public on that story.

What potencial it has can be demonstrated by the results that we had, about 1kw was used and we had 5kw out via an invertor being fed from an alternator which was driven by a turbo jet engine.

Now you can do what you want with the hydrogen and oxygen but for me running a piston engine is not a good idea for reasons I have stressed in other threads, it has to be used with a nitrogen carrier. I have gone off topic a bit here, but it was just to address the X10.

Mike
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Old 09-27-2010, 11:16 PM
DrStiffler DrStiffler is offline
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Thumb Rule Diagram

@All
Okay here is a circuit that would work, but one needs to give it values and that depends on the xtal, the transistors, etc.

I will wave my normal design fee here.....

Edit:
I just ran a simulation and R7 for the power we want will be an inductor and not a resistor, so keep this in mind when doing the follower.
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Last edited by DrStiffler; 09-27-2010 at 11:52 PM.
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  #116  
Old 09-27-2010, 11:21 PM
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Aaron Aaron is offline
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Location: Washington State
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"replication" attempt

Hey Everyone,

I'll claim the first attempt at 120mhz and 720mhz signals generated on different
channels posted in this thread for the purposes of splitting water.
I didn't say it worked, just the signals in the frequency were produced
and I haven't applied it to anything.

http://www.feelthevibe.com/free_ener...mhz720mhzR.zip

That zip is an audio file I made in very high resolution of 120MHz on the
left channel and 720MHz on the right channel. Through stereo headphone
jacks, I measured it on the scope. I did NOT measure those exactly on
the scope because with such a long cable, etc... I doubt those frequencies
can ever be clean coming from a laptop audio card. If anyone is bored,
check out that sound file.

Hmm, perhaps if I played it on a good quality
audio amplifier with fat cables maybe I can measure those frequencies.
Even the 120Hz and 720Hz didn't come out as pure clean square waves.

And IF I can get a good quality audio signal already amped up that maybe
I could send them directly to antenna plates inside of some water mist
from a humidifier?

I used cool edit pro and first did just 120hz and 720hz just to have a lower
frequency to actually see.





Then I did it with 120MHz and 720MHz:



Obviously at those high of frequencies and with the wiring I'm using, etc...
it'll never show up but that audio file should will those frequencies.
I just made it 10 seconds long and played it on loop. I have a slight
headache from both the higher MHz ones and the lower Hz ones even
though I couldn't even audibly hear the MHz ones, I could sense it
within my brain.

Brain wave entrainment is a form of heterodyning.

If you put 100Hz in the left ear and 107Hz in the right ear for example
with stereo headphones to keep the sound isolated to each ear, the
corpus collosum (traffic director between the hemispheres) will interpret
a "phantom beat" of the DIFFERENCE between the left and right for a
total of 7Hz or a low Theta brainwave state and the entire brain will
synchronize and balance the left and right hemispheres (and audio and
visual centers) (front and back) and in addition to synchronization, it
will also entrain the entire brainwave to that 7Hz (difference of frequencies).

I don't have the equipment to measure if the brain is actually ALSO
able to show a sum of the two for 207Hz for example. Never looked
for it. Unless I can rig up some electrodes to my head with the scope.
That voltage would have to be amplified quite a bit to see.
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Aaron Murakami

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  #117  
Old 09-27-2010, 11:26 PM
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Aaron Aaron is offline
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thanks Dr. Stiffler!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrStiffler View Post
@All
Okay here is a circuit that would work, but one needs to give it values and that depends on the xtal, the transistors, etc.

I will wave my normal design fee here.....
Thank you - Amazingly fast!

I'll have to redownload the free version of spice and see if I can
experiment with the values. Too many things to learn and not enough time.
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Aaron Murakami

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  #118  
Old 09-27-2010, 11:43 PM
DrStiffler DrStiffler is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
Thank you - Amazingly fast!

I'll have to redownload the free version of spice and see if I can
experiment with the values. Too many things to learn and not enough time.
@Aaron & All

Acouple of points on the circuit. The osc is a crystal stabilized, Colpitts in design. One might find one very similar in a ham manual for 2-meters. The coupling caps are variable and the tank coils should be selected to be resonant at the desired double and triple frequencies. Standard formula works here, want a high Q so wire if built should be like #24. The whole circuit should generate at least 2W at the emitter follower for a short end drive to a low power linear.

Bypass, bypass and bypass again to a good ground plain (metal) no wire to wire here or wire wrap. Coils should be positions so that they can have a metal shield between to stop feedback. Look at a few ham manuals or a radio engineers handbook to see some good layout methods.

Good luck and if its still going (the thread) after my load decreases I might build one up just for the heck of it.
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  #119  
Old 09-28-2010, 12:37 AM
DrStiffler DrStiffler is offline
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RF Bond Breaking in 2005

I can say I believe what Mike is showing you, why, well in 2005 I did it in a different way. It was not very efficient, yet it proved it could be done. Here is one of the pictures of one of the cells, look at the gas bubble size.
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Old 09-28-2010, 01:09 AM
Slovenia Slovenia is offline
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Posts: 1,668
Thanks

Hi Mike,

Thanks!! I do understand. I realize that there are many things you can not say and we all respect that. Thanks for what you have shared and what you are able to share. You have helped jump start some tired experimenters.

Best Regards,
Slovenia


Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael John Nunnerley View Post
This work that was done back in the late 80's was never fully completed, we had a working model and it was demonstrated to get further working capital. Two weeks after it was stopped, and that is as far that I will go in public on that story.

What potencial it has can be demonstrated by the results that we had, about 1kw was used and we had 5kw out via an invertor being fed from an alternator which was driven by a turbo jet engine.

Now you can do what you want with the hydrogen and oxygen but for me running a piston engine is not a good idea for reasons I have stressed in other threads, it has to be used with a nitrogen carrier. I have gone off topic a bit here, but it was just to address the X10.

Mike
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