Energetic Forum  
Facebook Twitter Google+ Pinterest LinkedIn Delicious Digg Reddit WordPress StumbleUpon Tumblr Translate Addthis Aaron Murakami YouTube REGISTER NOW*** 2018 ENERGY CONFERENCE ***


Monero XMR


Go Back   Energetic Forum > >
   

Renewable Energy Discussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

* NEW * BEDINI RPX BOOK & DVD SET: BEDINI RPX

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 11-13-2011, 07:48 PM
Jetijs's Avatar
Jetijs Jetijs is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,134
The mechanysm of water structuring


Hello all.
I have realized recently how water can be structured and it is really simply in fact as all things in nature should be. Have you seen those joecell videos where Joe himself shows how he makes charged water burn? Have you seen those documentaries about Masaru Emoto's works where this one guy shows how he adds 20 percent structured water to 79 percent diesel fuel and 1 percent of emulsifying agent and then drives his truck with that? He also claims that the engine has a lot more power on that fuel mix. Have you seen a video where those two Russian professors show how a drop of diesel fuel in a glass of structured water makes the whole mix burnable? I mean this is a ratio of 1:1000 at least? Have you seen the video of Daveys water heater where he boils the water in a second or so and uses very much power to do so. I am sure you have seen the famous Kanzius video where he shows how the water burns with a red flame when put near some powerful electromagnetic waves in high frequency? Sounds impressive, because it is. Most of this can be easily explained with the concept I propose. Nobody ever tells how exactly do they make this magic structured water, they just show what can be done with it. But as I say, it is very simple. So lets get down to business.

At first we must understand two basic concepts - ionization and vibration. Lets start with water ionization.

Water can be ionized or charged negatively and positively. More on this you can read on this topic:
Living vs dead water. It is easy.

Using two electrodes immersed in water and an ion membrane between them this can be achieved quickly and easily. You just need to apply some 200-300V DC to the electrodes. Electrolysis will happen, you will see hydrogen production on the negative plate and oxygen production on the positive plate. But that is not all, the water molecules are also broken apart in liquid form turning into all kinds of water ions, which always have a charge, positive or negative. The water containing mostly negatively charged ions will stay around the negative electrode and the water containing mostly positive ions will stay around the positive electrode. The membrane between electrodes is used so that the two waters don't mix together and lose the charge.
Positively charged ions, for example H3O+ look like this:


Negatively charged ions, for example OH- look like this:


There is a great website where these and other anomalous properties of water are researched and papers published. Lots of great info there, including all this.
Water structure and science: Contents

It has already been proven that water ions tend to cluster together among themselves and ordinary water molecules. For example here is how a cluster of several H3O ions looks like:


And this is how one OH- ion clusters together with several H2O molecules:


Here are several ways of how water ions and molecules can cluster together in basic scale:


Even something like this may form:


Here is a quote form the same web page:
Quote:
Such a fluctuating self-replicating network of water molecules, with localized and overlapping icosahedral symmetry, was first proposed to exist in liquid water in 1998 and the structure subsequently independently found, by X-ray diffraction, in water nanodrops in 2001. The clusters formed can interconvert between lower and higher density forms by bending, but not breaking, some of the hydrogen bonds. Structuring may also flicker between statistically and topographically equivalent clusters but involving different molecules by shifting their cluster centers. As the temperature increases the average cluster size, the cluster integrity and the proportion in the low-density form all decrease.
Scientists have modeled various ways of how these clusters could form and grow, here is one for example:

And these in turn can form strands and so on:


So a structure can be established only if there is high enough ionized water molecule count in the water. No structures will form in pure water with only H2O molecules in it. Ionization is needed.

No lets go to the next fundamental concept, the concept of vibration and how these vibrations create standing waves because standing waves are important. So what is a standing wave? Here is a great video that explains the concept and fundamentals on standing waves:
Standing Waves Part I: Demonstration - YouTube
You can see that at the right frequencies the string has areas on it where the vibration amplitude is very high and some spots where there is almost no motion. But this happens only at right frequency that is matched with the string length. Here is how this same concept works on salt grains on a vibrating plate:
Cymatic experiment - YouTube

The plate sits on a solenoid that moves it up and down at high frequency. The plate is not rigid enough and is bend a little bit and these bends travel within the plate bending it constantly in a small amplitude and of course shaking all the salt grains on the surface. As in the previous video, there are areas on the plate where the amplitude is great and all the salt grains get thrown away from those places, also there are spots where both the incoming and the outgoing waves cancel each other out and there is almost no motion on those spots so the salt grains tend to pile up on these spots. Since the plate is in a square form, it forms different geometric patterns as the frequency is changed, this is because the wave speed is the same, but it must travel longer distance to the corners of the plate than to the sides. Also as the frequency increases, the pattern becomes finer and finer and more complex. So the frequency and the shape of the plate determines what structure you will have on the plate.
This happens in any medium, be it aether, air or water. Here is how it looks on large scale in a water reservoir:
Making standing waves - YouTube

if the waving frequency is adjusted to the reservoir length, you get a standing wave.
This is how it works on much smaller scale - on a drop of water:
silver heptagon secret - YouTube
Harmonic waves - YouTube
hexagon 19 flower of life standing wave.mp4 - YouTube

So those are the two basic fundamental concepts you need to know to understand how water can be structured. Now lets put them together.
Imagine that you have a sack of glass marbles. They are round and do not stick to each other. If you put that sack in a square box, it will take the shape of the box. But when you remove the box, the marbles will fall down and the shape can not be maintained. They just don't stick to each other. The same happens with water, if you have pure water H2O without ionization, you can put it on a speaker and play a sound tone to it, it will induce standing waves in the water and as the sound plays, the water will have a structure that depends on the container size and shape where the water is in and on the sound frequency. But as the sound stops, water just spots waving and the structure falls apart. So what can we do to "glue" those molecules together when the sound is played so that they maintain that structure or cluster even when the sound is off? We can ionize the water, because water ions are the "glue" that enables and maintains water clusters. So to make structured water we just need to combine those two components - ionization and vibration. Depending on the frequency of the vibration, you will get larger or smaller water clusters with different shapes. One frequency might make the cluster in a icosahedron form, another frequency might make a cube form cluster. It depends on the frequency and the container size and shape.

So where have we seen these two concepts work hand in hand? The same Kanzius video, see it here:
John Kanzius' Water Fuel Cell - YouTube

He uses electromagnetic waves to structure the water. An oscillating magnetic field will always induce a current in a conductor and what is water if not a conductor. An electric current in water will create electrolysis and thus water ionization, so we now have the building blocks that make up the structure and clusters. So where is the vibration? The vibration comes from the electromagnetic waves themselves. Kanzius just shoot two birds with one shot. He uses a frequency of 13.56MHz, that would be a wavelength of 22,109 meters. Only the wavelength is important, not the frequency, because the frequency varies depending on the medium. For example sound in water medium would need to be at 72.36Hz to achieve the same wavelength as radiowaves at 13.56MHz. So a proposed experiment would be a container full with ionized water (positive, negative or both) containing a source of sound vibrations, for example an insulated speaker that plays a tone at 72.36Hz. This in theory should assign the water the same structure that Kanzius uses to make the water burn.
Another example - Davey water heater:
Peter Davey's Sonic Resonance Boiler - 02.2008 - YouTube

He also has electrolysis occurring in his device and he also has vibration at mains frequency using specially tuned spheres to achieve resonance or should we say a standing wave between these spheres?

Another example. Do you remember Joseph Cater with his awesome ideas and suggestions? One of such was this one:


He proposes such a device will generate large amounts of electricity that exceeds the one you put in it. Also here we have the same fundamental concepts. The container has tow electrodes immersed in water through which a DC current flows. This, of course, creates electrolysis and ionization. He also has an ultrasonic transducer on the container that is the source of the vibration. So how can this work? Only if there is a particular structure of water that can be achiever on those ultrasonic frequencies that makes the water release the energy from where ever, maybe aether itself.

Lets go a bit further. We know that negatively charged water is beneficial to humans, more on this you can read here:
Alkaline Water and ORP Explained

One way to make such a water is electrolysis with a ion exchange membrane between electrodes. I made such a device that ionizes and separates the charged waters:
Charged water maker - YouTube
__________________
It's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links

Download SOLAR SECRETS by Peter Lindemann
Free - Get it now: Solar Secrets

  #2  
Old 11-13-2011, 07:49 PM
Jetijs's Avatar
Jetijs Jetijs is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,134
Another way of making such healing water in the way similar to the natures way is a magtrap in a vortex tube:


The water moves in a vortex fashion at high speeds. There are some magnets on that vertical piece of acrylic. The water moves past those magnets at high speeds and of course current is induced in it since water is a conductor. This creates electrolysis in small scale and ionization. Positive and negative ions do not have the same density or weight, so the centrifugal action separates them one from another. The positively charged water gets thrown out on the outer walls of the tube and the negatively charged water gets collected from the center of the tube. As you can see in my video, negatively charged water has high PH up to 11. High PH makes the dissolved minerals in the water to become solid again and makes the water misty, those minerals settle down after a while. Most people that uses such mag traps confirm this. So where does this happen in nature? Easy, the planet is a big magnet with its N and S pole, this is the source of magnetism. And if any water in nature is moving at all, some very small currents will be induced in it from this filed, since if a conductor moves past a magnetic field, current will be induced. This is the global source of water ionization - earths magnetic field and water movement. The faster the water moves, the more it ionizes. And the vibration can be anything from sounds to even light which is also nothing more than a vibration at a certain wave length. Why does earth move? Because of the same principle, we have earths magnetic field and we have earths electric field between the ionosphere and the earth itself. Ionosphere is constantly being charged up from the cosmic ray bombardment and the energy from the sun. It always discharges itself to the earth more or less steadily, faster in lightning storms because the dielectric of our big capacitor is more conductive at those times and places. But basically it discharges more or less steady. This means that there is a more or less steady charged particle flow from ionosphere to earth and this, combined with earths magnetic field, makes the earth rotate. It is the very same principle of how a DC motor works. If we have two magnets and a wire between them, then if the wire will be carrying charged particles, it will be thrown out of the magnetic field of the magnets:



But it is not the wire that gets thrown out, it is the charged particles that move in and around the wire and they just take the wire with them. It is not important what the medium is, as long as there will be a charged particle flow perpendicular to magnetic field, there will be motion. Here how it works in water and it is called the magnetohydrodynamic (MHD) effect:

Magnetohydrodynamic Pump Demonstration - YouTube

The same works in air. So the earth is but a giant electric motor with its magnetic field:

and its electric field:

And those two fields are more or less perpendicular at equator and almost vertical at the poles:

In these conditions the earth has no other option as to spin, like those small homopolar motors. Wasn't it Tesla, that said that the earth is nothing but a motor?
This also explains the main global wind directions and the ocean currents and many many more things.


It is certainly some food for thought.
So as for experiments, I will get an ultrasonic transducer and a driver for it, they come at about 50$ on ebay with powers of 30-60w. I will use my water ionizer and vibrate that water using that transducer and the see what the water does, if it burns, if it mixes with fuel and so on. Many fifferent frequencies will have to be tried. Also I will try to replicate the proposed experiment by Joseph Cater. Will see what this does. Anyway I think that the concept is solid and straight forward.
What do you think?
Thanks,
Jetijs
__________________
It's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-13-2011, 09:06 PM
sturgeon sturgeon is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 39
Fascinating! It will be very interesting to see how your Joseph Cater replication turns out.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-13-2011, 09:20 PM
MonsieurM's Avatar
MonsieurM MonsieurM is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 10,078
Send a message via MSN to MonsieurM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sturgeon View Post
Fascinating! It will be very interesting to see how your Joseph Cater replication turns out.

I could not agree more...Would it be alright if i transfer all the info on water i posted scattered in various thread ...

hint: quantum water also exist

Joseph Cater proposed design is quite interesting, lacking maybe one component that was previously proposed by Powerme, and that is Zno or Quartz....
__________________
Signs and symbols rule the world, not words nor laws. -Confucius.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-13-2011, 10:52 PM
malohnes malohnes is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 10
I agree, very fascinating and exciting.! Great work Jetijs!
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-14-2011, 03:33 PM
realmikel realmikel is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 45
Some of the experimenters have used heat and a catalytist to create carbon monoxide in fuel reformation to create carbon fuels with a mixture of water and some carbon compounds. If you were able to use the ionizer and membrane and manage to use the side where the oh was produced it might readily combine with carbon compounds with little to no current flow. If your original idea to generate hydrogen as fuel is not as successful as you hope this might be a way to salvage the project. Always enjoy your experiments so please keep up the great work.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Please consider supporting Energetic Forum with a voluntary monthly subscription.

For One-Time Donations, use admin@ this domain > energeticforum.com

Choose your voluntary subscription

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO v1.4.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Shoutbox provided by vBShout v6.2.8 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
2007-2015 Copyright - Energetic Forum - All Rights Reserved

Bedini RPX Sideband Generator

Tesla Chargers