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  #2431  
Old 03-19-2010, 11:43 PM
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Thanks for the info John, your right about the Energenx's website and yes i have seen the latest videos, very impresive. I build your version of the switch and still playing with different loads, coils and capacitors to get some sort of gain

wanted to see the video's again but they are gone?
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Last edited by scratchrobot; 03-20-2010 at 12:13 AM.
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  #2432  
Old 03-20-2010, 01:00 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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Energenx videos gone from YouTube

Scratchrobot,

Yes, it appears ALL of the Energenx (and rickfriedrich) videos have been taken off YouTube.

I was fortunate enough to use Keepvid to capture a few of the earlier ones that were released.

John K.


Quote:
Originally Posted by scratchrobot View Post
Thanks for the info John, your right about the Energenx's website and yes i have seen the latest videos, very impresive. I build your version of the switch and still playing with different loads, coils and capacitors to get some sort of gain

wanted to see the video's again but they are gone?
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  #2433  
Old 03-20-2010, 01:46 AM
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Quote:
Yes, it appears ALL of the Energenx (and rickfriedrich) videos have been taken off YouTube.
I guess people might have been super analyzing the videos for parts lists.

LOL

Matt
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  #2434  
Old 03-20-2010, 12:14 PM
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Why didn't i saved those vid's I would love to see them again.
I'm gonna save Bit's vid's right away, you never know

Found some vid's from cest73 very interesting..

Regards, scratchrobot
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Last edited by scratchrobot; 03-20-2010 at 12:36 PM.
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  #2435  
Old 03-20-2010, 02:25 PM
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Today I read some old JB posts again and thought I will post some of them to make us all think again.
I got a serous Cap pulsar going. Charging a bank of 90 000uf up to 20V and than trigger a relay with a 20v zener from the caps to discharge into my 4 X 7Ah batteries in parallel.
I charge the caps up with radiant reactive pulses from a Joule thief and my small hard drive SSG .They take 3 second to fill from 12V to 20V before discharging into the batteries.
The batteries are in the conditioning phase for the 2nd week.
In the beginning they could run a 11W cfl from a small inverter for 20 minutes.
Today I stopped the test after 4 hours and the batteries were still on 12.6V.
I use a relay to make it easy and to try and get it working without all the transistors. There are not a lot of sparking on the relay contacts as I parallel some of the contacts and while the caps discharge the radiant output off the ssg and joule thief are connected to a 30 000uf cap that prevent the voltage to go up to high in that 1 second.
Here are the JB posts that covers the Solar charger:


Solar Kick
You know a light bulb just turned on. What if we could use the Bi- Polar switch in the Tesla Switch then we would know when it was off. One switch for charging a cap the other for the dump.
JB
Here is the right drawing for the switch, it shows where the hall devices go.
JB
http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...lar-switch.jpg
Leave the 1K
also protect the hall positive voltage buy using a 470 resistor and a Zener diode to ground. That way you can never blow the hall out. Use this diagram only.
It's a fast little devil.
JB

Make a Solar oscillator out of that or make a new one it will work much better. Just make an oscillator out of the sg circuit by reversing the trigger wire, then it will charge in the moon light. I do it all the time when I can see the moon. My lights are always on with that oscillator. Hook it up like the joule thief but use the SG coil with the resistor in the base circuit.
JB

Originally Posted by John_Bedini
John K
I have a video of a solar charger I want you to see later using the Tesla Switch scare your pants off. I'm going to talk to Rick about you testing one. I have been very busy with this switch, ground current next. Then I will post.
JB

I cant say much as this is a company product, but when it finally dawns on what you just saw. you will know to keep working and you will get it. I do hope the best for the world.
But I will do everything one can do to get it out. its plain and simple no heat in the batteries at all. It's a Modified Tesla Switch Solar Charger, but can be used on the motors also.
53 watt in 148 out. here is the link. I won't answer the question you posted, but you guys are very close.
JB

I will say this much the caps are for the solar panel, like the solar kick, You will find a patent pending under my name on Google patents. what you can't see is drivers pnp, I did post the BI-Polar switch, it's part of it. The circuit is far different then what your working on so don't second guess this. Sixteen switching points. you need the basic circuit working with the Original Tesla Switch to understand this, no guessing, Peter also gave the hint in his second to last post about who invented the original. It's was not Ronald B.
JB
Device and method for pulse charging ... - Google Patent Search

No, it's patent number US 2008/0129250 A1.
Spoke to JB this morning, he told me to say that the caps are there for the solar panel. The batteries you saw in the video were frozen, Rick put them out the back because they were gone. JB pulled them inside and used them for the test, the load tester is rated at 500A. So it's also a great battery rejuvenator.

You can use either of these two devices to do the charging, as I said it's been in front of your eyes so long ,your burned out. These two patents were used with the solar kick. To use them you must change the impedance of the solar panels and use inverted circuits on the switching devices. The monopole group that Rick runs has built many of these chargers.
John B

Unfortunately the batteries work by moving Ions and the speed it not fast, it's a slow process.
The Tesla switch only uses two currents, and it is current between sides, one high and one low and this keeps switching.
The Patent is one half of the Tesla Switch, these two patents combine to make the Solar Kick. To make it work The impedance of the panel must be changed, by building up of charges to high potential.
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  #2436  
Old 03-20-2010, 03:56 PM
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"and use inverted circuits on the switching devices"
Can anybody explains what is meant by that. I think I got a idea but is not to sure about it.
Leroy..anybody?
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  #2437  
Old 03-20-2010, 05:25 PM
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Self Running "Cap Pulsinator"

Take a look team;

YouTube - Cap Pulsinator.MPG




Thanks

Bit's
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Last edited by Bit's-n-Bytes; 05-25-2010 at 02:53 AM.
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  #2438  
Old 03-20-2010, 08:39 PM
John_K John_K is offline
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Hi Bit's,

Nice work!

Can you please post your code?

This is a bit like Dr. Spark's setup which I was playing with yesterday. What sort of charging are you seeing on the battery?


John K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit's-n-Bytes View Post
Take a look team;

YouTube - Cap Pulsinator.MPG




Thanks

Bit's
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  #2439  
Old 03-20-2010, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_K View Post
Hi Bit's,

Nice work!

Can you please post your code?

This is a bit like Dr. Spark's setup which I was playing with yesterday. What sort of charging are you seeing on the battery?


John K.
Here you go John K.

Main:

do
high 5
pause 10
low 5

high 4
pause 10
low 4
pause 50
inc b1
loop while b1 <100

let b1 = 0
high 6
pause 50
low 6



goto Main

To early to tell on the charging. The batt voltage did raise about .2 in about 20Min.

Bit's
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  #2440  
Old 03-20-2010, 10:09 PM
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Thanks Bit's

I'm off to get a transformer and some other stuff. I should be able to knock this up today.


John K.

P.S. I didn't get too far with my dual SS SGs as a load for the TS. It worked, but the batteries ran down over time. I tried dumping the caps into the TS batteries a few different ways, but whatever I tried I couldn't make the batteries charge up. I did have success dumping the caps to other batteries and probably could have rotated the batteries around to get a nett gain, but not what I was looking for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit's-n-Bytes View Post
Here you go John K.

Main:

do
high 5
pause 10
low 5

high 4
pause 10
low 4
pause 50
inc b1
loop while b1 <100

let b1 = 0
high 6
pause 50
low 6



goto Main

To early to tell on the charging. The batt voltage did raise about .2 in about 20Min.

Bit's
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  #2441  
Old 03-20-2010, 11:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
"and use inverted circuits on the switching devices"
Can anybody explains what is meant by that. I think I got a idea but is not to sure about it.
Leroy..anybody?
Hi Vessie,

JB always uses inverted circuits where possible. In the TS, it is the inverted transistor to put the batteries in series....or the SCR...inverted to put the batteries in series. Other than that, you are on your own. He also used them in cap pulsers, so this is one other place you can see how to use them.

Leroy
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  #2442  
Old 03-21-2010, 06:57 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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Hi Bit's

I got it running. Tried a couple of different trafo's that I had laying around.

I can't get any charging on the battery, tried various timing settings.

I'm seeing about 9.2 - 9.3V over C1 when C2 is 13 - 17V. Is this what you see too? (I'm using 6,800uF 50V caps)

Also tried using a MJL21194 in place of the relay, still no dice.

Anyway, I'll play around some more when I have fitted a better trafo. I also splurged and got myself a nice 5A lab p/s, which will come in real handy.


John K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bit's-n-Bytes View Post
Here you go John K.

Main:

do
high 5
pause 10
low 5

high 4
pause 10
low 4
pause 50
inc b1
loop while b1 <100

let b1 = 0
high 6
pause 50
low 6



goto Main

To early to tell on the charging. The batt voltage did raise about .2 in about 20Min.

Bit's
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  #2443  
Old 03-21-2010, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
This is the circuit that I currently uses.
I changed the zener to a 16V last night to get the pulsing to once every second, pulsing 17V from the cap bank to the batteries.
This morning the relay contacts was stuck , but the battery banks voltage sat on 14.2V
So the batteries loved the pulsing but relays will not last as we were told before.
Now I need to get a panel ammeter to test what sort of current is passed with every pulse.
I want to do a easy experiment by discharging the parallel cap bank to the battery and measure the current .
Then I want to charge the caps up in parallel, connect them in series and measure the current pulse when discharging and vice versa to try and determine how Mr. Bedini does it.

Leroy
Is the inverted circuit on the cap pulsars that you talk about the opto , transistor, scr one's that switch the negative?
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  #2444  
Old 03-21-2010, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
So the batteries loved the pulsing but relays will not last as we were told before.
What Stuck inside? If the contact welded they are to small.
I haven't had to many problems with relays as long as they rate over what voltages I am using. But you get to heavy on them and they'll bight ya.

Matt
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  #2445  
Old 03-21-2010, 11:54 AM
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One of the contacts that burn close before with a different application got stuck again.
I can see a spark every time it switches so in the long run they will not last.
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  #2446  
Old 03-21-2010, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
I changed the zener to a 16V last night to get the pulsing to once every second, pulsing 17V from the cap bank to the batteries.
This morning the relay contacts was stuck , but the battery banks voltage sat on 14.2V
So the batteries loved the pulsing but relays will not last as we were told before.
Now I need to get a panel ammeter to test what sort of current is passed with every pulse.
I want to do a easy experiment by discharging the parallel cap bank to the battery and measure the current .
Then I want to charge the caps up in parallel, connect them in series and measure the current pulse when discharging and vice versa to try and determine how Mr. Bedini does it.

Leroy
Is the inverted circuit on the cap pulsars that you talk about the opto , transistor, scr one's that switch the negative?

Vissie,

I'm beginning to believe that the whole point is not to have the grounds connected at all...only for very brief moments in time.

To answer the question asked, YES, the SCR is the main switch on the negative and it is a potential switch in JB's circuits, but it works in conjunction with the opto and transistor in a darlington arrangement.

For what it is worth, if I were doing what you are doing, I'd switch the negative and not the positive.

Leroy
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  #2447  
Old 03-21-2010, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
If the 17V from the solar panel capacitor is fed directly to the cap banks without going through a radiant charger first to get the voltage up, we have to charge the caps in parallel to 17v each and then switch them in series and dump to the battery .About 60V
If we charge them in series first each of the 4 caps will only have a voltage of about 4V and we won’t be able to charge a 12v battery when switched to parallel.
I drew up a diagram using the bipolar switch to try and do this.
I’m not sure if the 3 series transistors will switch on like that.
Please have a look and tell me what you think.
I will test soon to see what the best way will be to discharge into the battery as soon as I have a panel ammeter. The discharge pulse is to fast to see on a dvm.

Vissie
I am not sure why you need to go through all the trouble on the back end near the battery.
This is a dumbed down version of pretty much the same thing. I am just trying to diagram the flow of things first before I choose components. Let me explain

In section 1 you have Tesla Switch set to oscillate at a given rate. The incoming power will supplement the CHARGING capacitors.

In section 2 you 2 loads. Both Radiant oscillators with COILS, one set to create a positive spike the other set to create a negative spike. These are both set to run at alternating times based on which way the Section 1's switch is running. We will only grab the radient spike for the caps just as in a monopole. Notice the Capacitor they run from.

In section 3 you have to capacitor bank initially set to serial while charging.
Based on a Monopole I built that works just like this you can charge 150 to 200 volt in a cap bank with ease. The cap bank in the end would be charges to given point then switched to parallel and make a Direct Dump to the charging battery.

I don't have it all worked out so I was curious about what your planning and why so many switch's on the end that dumps the battery.

Matt
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Last edited by Matthew Jones; 03-21-2010 at 02:39 PM.
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  #2448  
Old 03-21-2010, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_K View Post
Hi Bit's

I got it running. Tried a couple of different trafo's that I had laying around.

I can't get any charging on the battery, tried various timing settings.

I'm seeing about 9.2 - 9.3V over C1 when C2 is 13 - 17V. Is this what you see too? (I'm using 6,800uF 50V caps)C2 voltage is a product of how long you run the loop function before you trigger the relay to pulse the batt. I am still tweeking that time interval to see where I get the best results. IMO, if you are able to elevate the voltage on the center tap (without that voltage coming off of the batt itself) you'll see this guy really start to perform. My Caps are 10,000uf @ 35V, but I am not saying bigger is better, just noting a slight difference. I ran this to a seperate batt just for the charging leg for 2 hrs. Beggining volts was 12.16 and after the 2hrs, batt volts is 12.22. After letting it rest all night, the volts are still @12.22. Going back to what I explained on the center tap, I am working to feed that from the caps (higher voltage side) which I hope to create a "stair stepping" effect on the trafo's output / cycle. Additionaly I think I need to find some photoflash type caps which will charge quicker. Adjusting the delay downward on the 2 tranny's for the trafo's primary reduces the load on the batt and improves charging. Sorry for being long winded.

Also tried using a MJL21194 in place of the relay, still no dice.

Anyway, I'll play around some more when I have fitted a better trafo. I also splurged and got myself a nice 5A lab p/s, which will come in real handy.


John K.
@John K.

See comments in red above.

Thanks

Bit's
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  #2449  
Old 03-21-2010, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
Vissie
I am not sure why you need to go through all the trouble on the back end near the battery.
This is a [URL="http://www.matthewcjones.com/power/ISCC/Solar_Charger.jpg"]
I don't have it all worked out so I was curious about what your planning and why so many switch's on the end that dumps the battery.
Matt
I tried to do what JB said. It was to use the bipolar switch.
ie: "You know a light bulb just turned on. What if we could use the Bi- Polar switch in the Tesla Switch then we would know when it was off. One switch for charging a cap the other for the dump."

It completely isolates the source and the battery from the caps.
As I could not see a radiant generator in Jb's video I assumed that the 17v is going straight to the 4 caps and then you have to charge it in parallel.

I like your diagram
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  #2450  
Old 03-21-2010, 06:21 PM
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You understand what I am trying to convey right?

You can use a bipolar switch to create the same 2 wave forms on the diagram. I don't know how but I know thats how a bipolar works, so I have been told. It will do the same thing I outlined except across one coil. Giving you the same HIGH potential across the cap bank.

But you don't need to use a switch at all between the bank of caps and the battery.
Just disconnect the cap bank from the charger, switch to parrallel, while at the same time hook up to the battery and dump.

You could have 2 cap banks off the charger. One dumping one charging.
That will allow the top half of the circuit to run continuously.

Its just an idea but its the simplist thing I can think of to correspond with the action of the machine in the video.

Matt
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  #2451  
Old 03-21-2010, 06:36 PM
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Double Pole Double Throw relay,good idea. I feel it may work.!
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  #2452  
Old 03-21-2010, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
If the 17V from the solar panel capacitor is fed directly to the cap banks without going through a radiant charger first to get the voltage up, we have to charge the caps in parallel to 17v each and then switch them in series and dump to the battery .About 60V
If we charge them in series first each of the 4 caps will only have a voltage of about 4V and we won’t be able to charge a 12v battery when switched to parallel.
I drew up a diagram using the bipolar switch to try and do this.
I’m not sure if the 3 series transistors will switch on like that.
Please have a look and tell me what you think.
I will test soon to see what the best way will be to discharge into the battery as soon as I have a panel ammeter. The discharge pulse is to fast to see on a dvm.
Parallel charge and serial discharge.
Maybe this will work?

/Hob
Attached Images
File Type: jpg p-in-s-out.jpg (12.3 KB, 70 views)
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  #2453  
Old 03-21-2010, 08:22 PM
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Hi Hob
Follow the red lines . That looks like a dead short to me
Too long a stare makes you blind i guess

I think it only works the other way around,
flip the caps upside-down,
charge in series and discharge in parallel,
which was my initial intention way back.

/Hob
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  #2454  
Old 03-21-2010, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by nilrehob View Post
flip the caps upside-down,
charge in series and discharge in parallel
Hobs,

Is this statement a mistake "charge in series and discharge in parallel"; did you mean to say - charge the caps in parallel and discharge in series (12v >> 24v)?

- Schpankme
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Old 03-21-2010, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Hobs,
Is this statement a mistake "charge in series and discharge in parallel"; did you mean to say - charge the caps in parallel and discharge in series (12v >> 24v)?
- Schpankme

No you wanna charge in series and discharge in parallel. That takes the high voltage and turns into onto charge voltage (14 -15 volt) with a serge of amperage.

Matt
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Schpankme View Post
Hobs,

Is this statement a mistake "charge in series and discharge in parallel"; did you mean to say - charge the caps in parallel and discharge in series (12v >> 24v)?

- Schpankme
No mistake.
You will have less losses if you charge in series and discharge in parallel.
The reason is that the Q value for the caps gets higher when in series.

Charge two capacitors (nilrehob)
YouTube - Charge two capacitors

The opposite can be done to coils,
although i haven't tested it as i have with caps:
PS-coil SP-cap (nilrehob)

/Hob
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:29 AM
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Hi Hob
Where did you find this buck/boost Bedini circuit. Does It come from JB?
I think i can see how this circuit of yours work. I had the polarities wrong before
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  #2458  
Old 03-22-2010, 09:38 AM
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Hi Hob
Where did you find this buck/boost Bedini circuit. Does It come from JB?
I think i can see how this circuit of yours work. I had the polarities wrong before
This is the buck-boost converter (also found in the SSG):
Buck–boost converter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There are lots of other similar circuits (halfway down the page):
Switched-mode power supply - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In this article there is the cap serial in parallel out (pointed out for us by lamare way back)
http://www.linear.com/pc/downloadDoc...14,P1258,D4816

The sequential bipolar circuit is by JB really an H-bridge:
H-bridge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And here is an interesting article about H-bridge:
H-bridge secrets part 1

And here as well:
Power Smart H-Bridge - BEAM Robotics Wiki

/Hob
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Last edited by nilrehob; 03-22-2010 at 09:48 AM.
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Old 03-22-2010, 10:25 AM
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nvisser nvisser is offline
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Thank you
That will keep us busy for a while.
Have you tested the above diode ser. to par conversion and do you think it will work with bipolar switches on both sides?
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Old 03-22-2010, 10:43 AM
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nilrehob nilrehob is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
Thank you
That will keep us busy for a while.
Have you tested the above diode ser. to par conversion and do you think it will work with bipolar switches on both sides?
Not quite sure which one you mean,
but i have only had time to test this on caps as shown in my video,
and the coil+cap is currently only tested in the falstad simulator.

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