Here's my new video:


8,2 bulbs - YouTube


I apologise for the poor quality, but you get to see my setup. THE FINAL MEASUREMENT OF THE SINGLE BULB WITH THE 7 BULB CLUSTER WAS 6,600 Lu's. The data shows a 40% increase in efficiency between the single and eight bulb cluster.

@Billixx,

The instrument measurements indicate that the blub cluster behind the clouded glass would be brighter then the one bulb at five times the brightness by a factor of 40%!

@Peanutbutter -- you assumed incorrectly, but let me clarify:



I have said (and further it seems rather obvious) that the calibration factor depends on the number of bulbs and will change when more bulbs are used.


Thus, the 0.0793 factor applies only for ONE bulb in this light box. In the vid, I clearly say - and show inside the box - that FOUR bulbs are used! so the calibration factor is NOT .0793 as you assumed.

I could leave it there, but you sort of asked, so I will note here that for four bulbs, I of course did the calibration, and the calibration factor for 4 bulbs in the positions shown is 0.103, so we have:

5480 Lux x 0.103 = 564 Lumens
564 Lumens / 6.018w = 94 Lu/W

I said 95 Lu/W because on run I did before making the vid, I had 5530 lux --> 570 Lumens, and
570 Lumens / 6.018w = 95 Lu/W (rounding).

Note that this small variation (94 or 95) is within the uncertainty (quite small) from run to run -- things are repeatable! Again, that video is here:
95LmPerWatt.AVI - YouTube

Hope this helps!

@PhysicsProf
Ty for the clarification. I had thought / hoped you used another calibration, but did not note it anywhere; and thus the improper assumption.
I'm a bit surprised at the change from 1-4 in factor. I've only noted about a 1/4 of that for any combos I've run. Maybe box size is related there, dunno; but shouldn't matter.

I suppose too, it seems the ferrite rod is helping enough that possibly Lynxsteam may wish to include your mod in his suggested design? It has shown improvement in all cases, correct?

Also, if you don't mind. Since I have 3 of these same bulbs, but am still waiting on a 220v step up to arrive. How the heck do you come up with a lumens approximation on 120? I tried basing all of my calibration numbers from all bulbs and only get 45-55 Lumen @ 120v. I am hoping to be able to use the rated 252 lumens when run on 220v; but if not, I cannot see how to establish a lumen for calibration.

Last, since it was rather rude to not include before; Congrats on the higher lu/w!

Thanks
PB

Ty, PB. Yes, the ferrite rod has helped in all tests so far, with the air-core set-up.

You talk about the "rated 252 lumens when run on 220V" -- BUT why do you trust the Chinese advertisements? I've warned about this before. NONE of the bulbs I've bought from China reach the advertised ratings!

Furthermore on this particular bulb, one ad says 252 lumens, another -- EXACT SAME bulb - says 152 lumens! (nothing on the packaging for these bulbs -- I've purchased from both sources)

So, how are you going to calibrate with that? Are you going to use 252 lumens or 152 lumens, or what??? you tell me!

No, I used AMERICAN-rated bulbs for the calibration (as I have explained before!!)

Gotta run -- but this just posted on you-tube:

Exciting -- but having trouble posting at ou.com; see vid -- here's the text:
Using the Lynxsteam build of the Lasersaber 2.0 SJR again... Lynx asked me to tap the primary at winding 75 (instead of going to the end) AND to lower the voltage to 12.8 V, so that we would be able to run this with a standard 12V battery. I did so -- congratulations Lynxsteam -- this now surpasses 100 Lumens per watt!

The data recorded on this vid show: 385 mA @12.8V = 4.9W (input). The output is 493 x 10 = 4930 Lux.
The calibration factor (to lumens) is 0.103, so we have 4930 X 0.103 = 508 Lumens.
Thus, 508 Lm/4.9W = 104 Lm/W -- excellent progress!

Note: at 12.0 V, I found 102 Lm/W.


Note 2: at 12.8V, without the ferrite rod, I found 75 Lumens per watt -- 104 Lm/W with the ferrite rod. It makes a big difference!

vid: 104LmPerWatt.AVI - YouTube

_______________
I've got some work to do outside now; will be back in a few hours I expect.
Best,
Steve
PPS -- having trouble posting over at ou.com right now...

Hrmm, I think you ended up asking me the exact same question I asked you. I asked how what you got for lumens on A/C. I wasn't insinuating anyting; other than how to properly calibrate these.

I went ahead and found where you showed before. Is this correct? I can use this 90 Lu/w (which means 135 Lumens on 120v right?) that you found then; for calibration.

I'm using your recommended box
Your recommended bulb
So, Now I just need your estimated lumen output

I assume I'll use yours, which gives me a calibration factor of .476 with the three bulbs (135x3) / 850 Lux = .476

I suppose if we both use the same starting Lu/W and lumens on 120v; then I could probably test something to see.

Thanks
PB

Yay, I found the first report. Scratch above post then for calibration as it was noted to not be exact. This is your first mention of it and pretty exact. So I can use this, TY!

Okay so new calibration is
1 Bulb - 80 Lumens / 290 Lux = .275
2 Bulb - 160 Lumens / 580 Lux = .275
3 Bulb - 240 Lumens / 850 Lux = .282

I'll try the 3 bulbs then on a Radio shack, Using 80 Lumens and 1w off 120v A/C as the bulb reference. I guess this would be the same then, but different factors from boxes (of course).

I'll report back with the findings!
Let me know if I'm incorrect on the lumens you found Prof.
Thanks
PB

Tested radio shack. Seems the circuit has a driver chip for dimming though not probably the same. However Bridge Rectifier Cap mod still helps from utilitech vid.

Used PhysicsProf 80 Lumens @120vac for calibration
Super Joule Ringer 2.0 w/ Radio Shack & Foreign 1.5w LED x 3 - YouTube

Thanks

In "Energy From The Vacuum - Part 15", Walter Rosenthal (An associate and friend of Sparky Sweet) speaks about his experiences in Free Energy and the Sweet VTA. In the video, he speaks about a man Win Lambertson who invented an "energy machine" that produced more light that what you would get from using the power grid. According to Rosenthal, he was using sodium vapor & mercury vapor lamps. The most signficant thing he says in the video is that another man named Toby Groates discovered that Win's system produces more light per watt. He asserts that the light produced is a function of frequency and not power, since the voltage was apparently unchanged.
The same effect is obviously happening in the Joule Ringer. What is not clear however (to me anyhow, not sure who's measured what) is whether or not this is a just a light gain, or is there an increase in power as well?
My hats off to you Allen for your hypothesis. You might be right.
We just have to test it now.

A 60 watt 120 volt incandescent bulb produces 860 Lumens. A 120 would produce 1720. The single 2 watt at 120 watts of power .6 amps x 200 volts, produces over 3000 lumens.

"A 100 watt, 120 volt lamp will produce about 17.1 lumens per watt". The 2 watt LED is producing 25 Lu/w: As follows:

The 2 watt LED is producing over 3000 lumens for the same power a 120 volt incandescent produces 1760.

I thought maybe my last video efficiency factor was a result of wasted power the 2 watt couldn't handle at 200 volts, so I checked the comparison numbers and it looks pretty good for a bulb that cheap. How long the LED bulb will take to burn out is still to be determined.

@Herbie687,

Any with a full function signal generator can run a Khz frequency current through an LED, and see if he can swap increased frequency for lower amperage and sustain bulb brightness. I think this kind of demonstration video would act as a cornerstone of lighting science.

It will probably last longer at 120V, since LEDs have shorter lifespans at higher voltages than what they're recommended for at.

Sorry to confuse you if you saw my last post. I'm alittle tired and misread your analysis.

I agree. I'm not sure if the LED bulbs are wired so that both halfs of the waveform are sent throught the LEDs, so It would be best to test with an incandesence bulb if the LED bulb allows only half of the waveform.
This is what I want to do if I can do it soon.

At 120 volts, the Jr 2.0 lights the single bulb at 200 ma with 2450 Lux. The eight bulb cluster draws 300 ma with 450 lux. Divided, then multiplied times
eight equals a ratio of 12 Lux to ma. The single bulb a ratio of 10.25.

Voila, an increase in efficiency with the eight bulbs of around 20%. Half the 40% increase rate measured at twice the voltage!

I wonder how Lidmotor will react to these measurements?

@Herbie,

Can't wait to see your new video!

I like those numbers! I have several multi bulb light fixtures in my home including an eight bulb over the mirror in my master bathroom. However I will be using a ecosmart 8.6 watt light bulb so I am assuming I will need to change parts togett it to balance correctly & be as efficient as the circuit you have. Can anyone please explain the math behind balancing the circuit so that the parts won't get hot.

Thanks.

Well, already mentioned having done the 1 Ohm test and said "Or do you pick lowest amp draw for highest charge?" as done with the SSG.
The SS SSG seems to be different kind of an animal though.

Some say 60Hz is good, others say you need at least 10KHz.
Others again say 50-200Hz is good and that higher frequency sometimes is not better.
Looking at some normal SSGs, people use 16 magnets and have ~142rpm.
Then you have others who swear by 8 magnets only - guess the diameter also plays a role.

Then you have people using too much input current on their SS SSG which apparently reduces it to a normal charger - around 4A if I remember correctly.
Then you have people using 350mA input on their SS SSG, which charges really quickly, but the charge is only a fluffy charge.
Then you have people using 19V input source to charge 12V batteries.
My circuit already generates 650V. Do I really need more?

I have read so much in so many different threads, that - at the moment - I have no idea what is best.

PS. Have used a 19V power supply, and the charge is a lot better at 1A than with 12V input.

I did take the schematic for the SS SSG from this thread, but might not be the right one to discuss this in.
Will try and find the right one.
Thanks for all your help.

Hi folks, Hi harvester, lately I've been using a 555 timer and a mosfet with a 7 strand - 24 gauge coil with ferrite core.
This way I can vary the pulse width and frequency and duty cycle.
I have noticed with this 555 setup, that you can charge the same voltage battery off the diode flyback, though the frequency needs to be very low, like below 60hz, i used around 10 hertz and a decent size pulse width, then the charge battery receives a solid charge and not a fluffy one.
Of course, the amp draw then needs to be higher for each pulse, though the average is lower since it's a very low frequency.
In my experiments with solid state, I never had much luck charging the same voltage battery with high frequency.
I normally use my 13.8 volt-10 amp power supply to power these radiant pulse chargers and this charges 12 volts very well at higher frequencies.
peace love light
tyson

I attached 3W, 44LED lamp Schematic which has wide range of operating voltage:80-240V AC.
Hope it will be helpful for joule ringer developers.

Regards-
RATUL KHAN,
BANGLADESH.

Attached Images

	44ledsch.jpg (32.4 KB, 57 views)
	ViewPicture.aspx.jpg (77.5 KB, 28 views)

Thanks for the circuit
for off the shelf parts maybe we can use a busted cfl ckt removing the glass tubes and replaced with leds
still testing my sjr flahlight with min pot R out 59 v ac to a 220 v ac 5 w led lamp but with diode goes to 13 v dc going back to neg source battery 9 v dc square cell initial start 8 after 3 hours still 8v dc also one drained alkaline battery 6v went up to 7.2 v dc when place in series with pos source batt

totoalas

Dear PhysicsProf,
Could you please tell us where you purchased your "cheap 36 led bulbs"?
I searched both threads here and at ou.com for the name of the bulbs you achieved the 104 lm/W.
They are the little acorn style. I can't find them anywhere.
Congrats and thanks in advance.
Stephen

@Ratul - I very much appreciate that you posted this. Thanks.
Now we can all buy the stuff at digi-key for under $10 instead of buying more expensive bulbs. #CostEffectiveness

See attached -- best wishes
Steven J

Attached Images

36LEDbulbs.jpg (31.2 KB, 79 views)

These bulbs may not be as efficient, I don't know, but they are much cheaper, and provide 280 lm = (93 lm/w), from a 3 watt bulb, at $2,50 each. They also come in many different wattages. Maybe someone would like to try them out, also.

12V/110V-220V 3W MR16/ GU10 Warm/Cool White SMD/RGB/SpotLight Lamp Bulb Lighting | eBay

And these 5 to 7 watt 108 led bulbs, for $2. No I don't work for these guys...

B22/E14/E27 110V/220V Warm/Pure White 5/7W 108 /38 LED Corn Light Bulb Lamp | eBay

Hi.I have been doing a few experiments with Lasersabers jouleringer today and using peanut butters idea of using a mains transformer greatly simplifies construction and you can make one of these from scrap in minutes
I re-jigged it a bit and instead of connecting the load to the negative rail,I connected it to the positive rail.To be honest I can't see any difference.
I made a simple light meter consisting of a light dependant resistor,taped to the 1w 240v led bulb and took an ohms reading when the bulb was powered by 240v and then, if you get the same reading using the jouleringer circuit,you are at mains brightness.Also using the home made lightmeter allowed me to see if any changes I made to the circuit were benificial.
This is a great thread.Cheap renewable lighting is a much needed resource,judging by some of the posts here and I hope the sharing of ideas makes it happen.Jonny.
Here is a vid of my test today.
Lasersaber Jouleringer variant and simple light meter - YouTube

These bulbs are not cheap but it can give 390Lum for 3w(130Lum/w)!!!
Three for16.49$

3 E14 Warm White 60 LEDs Spot Light Bulb Lamp Spotlight 3W | eBay

It just keeps on getting better and better.
Thanks for the find. These are what we need.

Very interesting Designing a Solar-Powered, Rechargeable Lantern for Developing Nations Using NI Multisim and Ultiboard - Solutions - National Instruments.
I would like to participate but that will be rather next year. My goal is "selfrunning" led light system powered by a minute recharging capacitor at various chosen intervals and then running from this precharged capacitor for a long time with almost 100% recovery. Just to let you be informed Unfortunately it's not on top of my "importance list" but only because I cannot free myself from the "master project duties" anyway I think you may find it interesting and also use similar method. Why it's the best ?

Reasons:
- battery can be small in size and capacity
- large farad capacitors are also small
- inverters in tiny size are possible to step it up from say 1V 3V or 5V
- the biggest part will be transformer I suppose but not bigger then a matchbox
- I'm almost sure it will work perfectly

What is the life expectancy of power LED if continuously lit ?

"it can give 390Lum for 3w(130Lum/w)!!!" -- Buyer beware -- don't count on it! I have purchased about 20 LED bulbs from China, and NONE of them lived up to the lumens-output advertised on-line! Running on 120VAC mains, they were in the same range as what you can buy in the US (that I've found) -- around 55-to-70 Lumens/Watt.

Another example, a certain LED bulb from China was advertised at 262 lumens on one site-- but on another site, the SAME bulb (same # etc) was advertised at 162 lumens.

Conclusion -- you really cannot expect that the lumens advertised ON_LINE by Chinese companies (at this time) will be correct. If you find a bulb rated and sold at stores in the US or Europe, then I think you can better trust the Lumens listed on the packaging.

Hope this helps.

Hi physicaprof

Thank you for the explanation yes that explan every thing although it's not easy to find agood quality even here in Sweden , one of these led bulbs will cost more than 30$ here and you can imagine how much it will cost the USA one or the Japanese one and our markets filled with chinese staff .

Ehsan

The bulbs that I linked previously are cheap enough that even though they are not very accurately marked or evaluated lumens/watts wise, one can just add or use one or two bulbs more, as practically no more energy is consumed by their addition. At a couple bucks a bulb... the more the merrier.
It takes a certain amount of bulbs to get the needed draw. As the load drawn becomes part of the circuit.

Been playing a bit as I'm still waiting on one piece for the MC (5 weeks, argh!). Found some goodies though.

It was asked early if we could use strings of LED's with a circuit for these SJR's, well it seems you can. I've noticed a few companies doing pretty much that to save cost. I show then a highly modified Foreign bulb as further verification. I believe I cover the aspects of making a circuit. It's pretty simple, output electrolytic needs to be larger and input cap determines frequency, power and light. Anyhoo, I believe it was Jules that had first asked this; I can finally say with certainty, yes you can and here's how.
Super Joule Ringer w/ Modded Foreign bulb 1.6w & Yes you can! - YouTube

Second, running same bulb to see what the maximum possible lumens might be and to help with reverse calibration. I was curious here if the bulb could even produce the 250 odd lumens at all. Seems it can, but at a higher power, similarly noted when running utilitech at full output. Take your pick on lumens .
Foreign Bulb Max Output and reverse calibration validation - YouTube

Last, since some are wondering about measuring Power output rather than light; I believe that can be done easily. All of the circuits I've looked at so far output a filtered DC, and can be measured with instantaneous measures. I set up a simple experiment (with the stripped down minimum circuit) to see if that too was DC. Sure enough it is! For those wanting to estimate Power out to LED (after all circuits) this is the way to go. Be sure to use an RMS meter for A/C check.
Simple "How to" measuring power out with Super Joule ringer. (for any bulb) - YouTube

Thanks
PB