The Extraluminal Transmission Systems of Tesla and Alexanderson by Eric Dollard

The Secret of Tesla's Power Magnification

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 04-01-2011, 09:31 AM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Originally Posted by TeslaTech View Post
Hello Jim!
Great work, well done! your gen looks very professionall machined!
Did you pulse the rectangular coil and getting over 300% out of the same coil?
Did you use the same spiral coil design like they use in the plans? Because your red coil look like just one wire?
I've tried something similiar but instead pulsing the coil i've used a lindemann rotary atraction motor to spin 2 circular neos(4cm diameter,80KG), with circular spiral coil. But didn't get much out of the spiral coils. I think only with rectangular neos it is possible to get this power out of it.
I belief in this technology, because it sound logical if you don't have an iron core that produce a resistance to the motion, you must getting more out than a normal constellation. But in fact there is a drag, i have recognized, when you load the spiral coil with resistive load for instance. Maybe the best would be to time the load, f.e. getting the power with a 555 timer out of it.
Greets
TeslaTech

Hello TeslaTech,
Im not getting 300% back from the coil. I tested the coil using a 9v battery. It came back roughly to 90v, just like what was said in the youtube video of the Fuelless Engine, about 10 times the input voltage. I was happy to see that, and feel it, Zap, haha. Its a short duration spike so I dont know how much power/amperage, is coming back out.
I didnt use the spiral coil wind, but used a faster and less efficient wind. All the winds in the plans are one wire. Im curious how well the spiral would work on the return energy, maybe more amperage with the 10x voltage spike. Ill have to try it after this project.
Im not familiar with the Lindeman motor, ill have to look that up and see how it works.
Yes I beleived in this too, learning about the prinicipal of collapsing magnetic field in basic electronics. I finally bought the plans for a winter project.
Ive had thoughts about that too,,,, using a 555 timer to match the charge up time with the discharge time to see how much percentage of energy is coming back out of the coil. It seems like that would work the best for a motor running at slower rpms, when the ON time is longer than the discharge time. I want to try that sometime with this motor.
So far Im happy I bought the plans and did this. Looks like its running at 150 watts full load and producing 1hp of torque. If 1hp can generate 746 watts, this thing will go way over unity and make some nice juice.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 04-01-2011, 05:29 PM
Sinatra Fan Sinatra Fan is offline
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Q for Jim Bromley

Jim...

Correct me if I'm wrong but I was kind of under the impression that you already had a jump on the sp500. When I look at your picture, to me it looks like the large coil with rotor that has magnets on it fit the description of the generator. and the motor is the part outside the white plastic box??? Please enlighten me as this fits non of the plans I've seen to date. Thanks



PS, how do you post a pic here... I tried by keep getting the X

To see the pic, just copy the link and paste it in your browser. Thanks

Last edited by Sinatra Fan : 04-01-2011 at 05:31 PM.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 04-02-2011, 10:06 AM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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SP500 generator

Sinatra,
You are right. The fuellless engine I built is the same as the SP500 generator, with a few differences. What I built can be used as a motor or generator. They now have 3 different designs for the generator. The SP500 design Im going to use is the disc type. That will be outside of the plastic box built onto the shaft.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 04-02-2011, 10:26 AM
bugler bugler is offline
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PS, how do you post a pic here...
What you are posting is not an image but a html page: ImageBam - Fast, Free Image Hosting and Photo Sharing

Use this server for images and they'll give you the direct url: ImageShack® - Online Photo and Video Hosting

Last edited by bugler : 04-02-2011 at 10:28 AM. Reason: d
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 04-02-2011, 12:11 PM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Sinatra,
I had a problem too with pics. Found out only JPEG will work for me.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 04-02-2011, 01:43 PM
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thedude thedude is offline
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Sinatra,
I had a problem too with pics. Found out only JPEG will work for me.
Feel free to upload to Energetictube.com and they will give you a image url you can plug in that will display here no problemo.

Would love to see a schematic that might help clarify. Correct me if i'm wrong but it does appear that we need to order these plans to have a copy? Is that the case?

I was looking forward to building a tin foil pyramid too.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 04-02-2011, 11:31 PM
WeThePeople WeThePeople is offline
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Correct me if i'm wrong but it does appear that we need to order these plans to have a copy? Is that the case?
Scroll back to my post for a link for it.



EDIT:
I poked around and found one of many discs,
it has 109 files you can go through yourselves.

Get a copy while you can,
share with all you know,
sort them yourself ...

"Creative Science & Research.RAR"

Single-File Win-RAR Archive:
116-MB (122,360,340-bytes)

Unpacked Archive = 109-Files:
171-MB (179,841,527-bytes)

Get It Here:
Download Creative_Science___Research.RAR

Or here:
Creative_Science___Research.RAR]Mozillashare - Easy way to share and deposit your files - 116.7 Mb

Note:
They takes all the spaces and special characters out and replace them with underscore's...

Last edited by WeThePeople : 04-03-2011 at 12:38 AM.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2011, 09:50 AM
TeslaTech TeslaTech is offline
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Hello Jim,


How did you measured the torque? With an arm on the shaft and a scale? Or you are using a spring scale, with a soft strip leather?
Did you wound the one wire like on a normal spool, starting from left(or from the top) to the right an from the right back to the left again? It looks that you sealed the wire in epoxy?
Did you have used what was ist i think in the plans it was mentioned to use 10 pound of copper wire.

How fast is this motor going? RPM?
In the one video on youtube, they're said something about 267 RPM?
So, this could be combined with windpower generator for slower rpms.


Greetings

TeslaTech

Last edited by TeslaTech : 04-03-2011 at 02:22 PM.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2011, 03:03 PM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Hello Tesla,

I measured the torque with a 12 inch plywood wheel precut from the hardware store. I put that on the shaft and then put a 5 lb weight on the side of the wheel. Then positioned the 5lbs at 90 degrees on a stand. It lifted it well when I applied 600v. So I figured at 6 inches out, 5lbs. So at 12 inches out it could lift 2.5, and more. Theres a motor manufacturer that makes DC motors called IronHorse. The specs for their 1hp dc motor says 2.92 lb.ft for torque. And constant torque from 90rpm-1800rpm. So I figure the fuelless engine is close to that at low rpm.
As far as the coil is wound, there are some things I cant reveal. Im sworn to secrecy. I used an 11 pound spool and used epoxy while winding it, then eventually to Elmers glue becaue it was cheaper and did just fine. Then I coated the whole thing in clear epoxy. This motor runs free about 1200 rpm, then can load down to about 500 rpm at about 150 watts. The IronHorse motor is using 936 watts at full load. So its looking very efficient and promising. Im targeting 500rpms for the generator design I want to make. I know in the video his is going about half that. Thats a lower rpm design that hes using, and he shows how he built that one in the plans. The 3 different designs in the plans would all be great for wind power.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2011, 11:55 PM
TeslaTech TeslaTech is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Bromely View Post
Hello Tesla,

I measured the torque with a 12 inch plywood wheel precut from the hardware store. I put that on the shaft and then put a 5 lb weight on the side of the wheel. Then positioned the 5lbs at 90 degrees on a stand. It lifted it well when I applied 600v. So I figured at 6 inches out, 5lbs. So at 12 inches out it could lift 2.5, and more. Theres a motor manufacturer that makes DC motors called IronHorse. The specs for their 1hp dc motor says 2.92 lb.ft for torque. And constant torque from 90rpm-1800rpm. So I figure the fuelless engine is close to that at low rpm.
As far as the coil is wound, there are some things I cant reveal. Im sworn to secrecy. I used an 11 pound spool and used epoxy while winding it, then eventually to Elmers glue becaue it was cheaper and did just fine. Then I coated the whole thing in clear epoxy. This motor runs free about 1200 rpm, then can load down to about 500 rpm at about 150 watts. The IronHorse motor is using 936 watts at full load. So its looking very efficient and promising. Im targeting 500rpms for the generator design I want to make. I know in the video his is going about half that. Thats a lower rpm design that hes using, and he shows how he built that one in the plans. The 3 different designs in the plans would all be great for wind power.
Hello Jim,

so that means that somebody tell you something secret and you are not allowed to speak about it? Or your are looking for investors?
Or as John Bedini said: "Why taking the secret to the grave?"

There are not so many possibilties. I guess that it is the bifilar design from the earlier tesla patent. Coils for electromagnets. I've done many experiments with that design and i can say that you have at least double the power with less than half the input, because the potential between each turn is very high.
This is what i can't understand, creative science mentioned everywhere in the plans that they want to patent this design. But this is nothing new! Tesla patent it near 100 years ago! He panted it both the single spiral design and the bifiler, too.

I thought that, we are here to share knowledge and also/maybe improve the world!

Greets
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2011, 03:06 AM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Tesla,
As I understand it, id have to look at the plans again, this is a patented invention. Its an honor system to keep information confidential, and I agreed to it. There are legal warnings attached to the plans. Im not looking for investors. Just a normal guy like everyone else trying out this invention. If this device works then David Wagoner and his crew deserve alot more money for their plans than what they are charging. I can give the inputs and outputs so that any one here can have the information they need to buy the plans or not. Over unity is what im looking for, and lots of it.
I know from the plans that it says its unlawful to make this device for profit, and its also unlawful to make this device and give it away for free. Its lawful to make a device for my own use, not someone elses use, and also can help someone else in the construction of their own device. Like you said there are patents already on this device or parts of it. Makes me think there are powers out there that dont want us to make our own electricity. If this device is so protected I would think it works very well.
Thats good to hear from your own studies the numbers are looking good for this motor. Im very hopeful at this point. Cant wait to get it done. Ill post the results here.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2011, 03:15 PM
AlaskanWolfWarrior AlaskanWolfWarrior is offline
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Thanks Jim for the info, i have been trying to scratch together resources to build this motor for a wile. do you have any tips on finding the parts on a limited budget? also the wiring for collecting the back emf has me a little confused. any help you could offer would be greatly appreciated.

thx Wolf
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 04-05-2011, 09:12 PM
TeslaTech TeslaTech is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Bromely View Post
Tesla,
As I understand it, id have to look at the plans again, this is a patented invention. Its an honor system to keep information confidential, and I agreed to it. There are legal warnings attached to the plans. Im not looking for investors. Just a normal guy like everyone else trying out this invention. If this device works then David Wagoner and his crew deserve alot more money for their plans than what they are charging. I can give the inputs and outputs so that any one here can have the information they need to buy the plans or not. Over unity is what im looking for, and lots of it.
I know from the plans that it says its unlawful to make this device for profit, and its also unlawful to make this device and give it away for free. Its lawful to make a device for my own use, not someone elses use, and also can help someone else in the construction of their own device. Like you said there are patents already on this device or parts of it. Makes me think there are powers out there that dont want us to make our own electricity. If this device is so protected I would think it works very well.
Thats good to hear from your own studies the numbers are looking good for this motor. Im very hopeful at this point. Cant wait to get it done. Ill post the results here.
Hello Jim Bromely,

Ok, i understand that. I'm planning now to build the high hp fulless engine with the number 362RC. If understood it right you plan to build the same engine? The construction is that way - that you have electromagnets on rotor and on the stator.

With this engine you could drive your car! I've smelled that they're have used some knowledge from the Ed Gray Patent. In fact they acknowledge this in their plans! The trick is to have a lot of ampere-turns. f.e. if you have one turn at 1V @ 10 amps, you could make the same strength of mag-field with 10 turns and 1 amp. So you cut your bill ten times!
The next steps would be to take a wire that is greater then 1 kilometer and very thin.
The current travels at the speed of light. So the voltage needs for 300 meter 1 micro second to flood the wire and then start the current to flow. If your pulse-length is in that range you can do work without paying for the current like Gray did it.
The more turns you have the greater the inductance will be - for normal engineers a problem, because the spike will kill their electronics! But it's not a problem for us - we have a greater Back EMF!

Greetings

TeslaTech
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2011, 04:05 AM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Tesla very interesting. I bought the small engine plans, so I learned how the engine works and then tried to go with a longer coil and shaft design that they show but didnt give any specs for. The plans said they decided to name it "fuelless engine" and not "motor" to convey the idea it can be used in a vehicle.
Ive been wondering something, maybe you can help. Thinking of trying a lower ohm coil, like for 12 volts instead of 1200v. A coil made with much thicker wire and less turns, say maybe 2 ohms, so 6 amps with a 12v battery. Would the back EMF contain a smaller voltage spike but more amperage? Seems to make sense but as you said the more turns the higher the inductance. I would like to wind a coil like that for experiment but am not sure.
And you are right, this motor I made I used a mile and a half of wire. Lots of turns. Also makes me wonder about going for more turns than that for more back EMF? Althought the ohms would be higher too and need more voltage for same current. Somewhat of a trade off but if the back EMF increases, the efficiency would increase. Any thoughts?
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2011, 09:03 PM
TeslaTech TeslaTech is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Bromely View Post
Tesla very interesting. I bought the small engine plans, so I learned how the engine works and then tried to go with a longer coil and shaft design that they show but didnt give any specs for. The plans said they decided to name it "fuelless engine" and not "motor" to convey the idea it can be used in a vehicle.
Ive been wondering something, maybe you can help. Thinking of trying a lower ohm coil, like for 12 volts instead of 1200v. A coil made with much thicker wire and less turns, say maybe 2 ohms, so 6 amps with a 12v battery. Would the back EMF contain a smaller voltage spike but more amperage? Seems to make sense but as you said the more turns the higher the inductance. I would like to wind a coil like that for experiment but am not sure.
And you are right, this motor I made I used a mile and a half of wire. Lots of turns. Also makes me wonder about going for more turns than that for more back EMF? Althought the ohms would be higher too and need more voltage for same current. Somewhat of a trade off but if the back EMF increases, the efficiency would increase. Any thoughts?
Jim,

I've made experiments with low resistance windings like those in small ac motors.
The resistance was in the range of 2-5 Ohms. I've got BEMF Spikes around 400 Volts.
The Input was around 20-30 Volts at 0.3 amps. The amperage from the spike depends on what Do you want to drive. If i took a cap for the bemf and connected a 220V bulb, the voltage was converted into amps in the cap. The amperage is always lower what you have putted into it, but the voltage is 20 times higher. It is always transformation.
With low ohms and less winding coils i observed that you getting always around 50% from the BEMF back that what your Input was.So you get always the half of the input amperage back.
F.e. But if you take two coils, like in the plans, or like Gray, and pulse to northpoles again each other, you'll get more gain. If you use bifiliar wound coils a scalar current will flow.
It's the amperage what kills the battery, not the voltage. The voltage is for free.

The aim here is to have very lot windings to do work with less Input. Newman did the same, but his coils were very large and weight tons and by the way Bedinis Window motor looks very similar.

Also, Another effect will take place only with very high voltage. If the frequency is right you'll get energy from the ambient. Electrostatic fields will build up between the turns.
It is well known that high voltage have a very high affinity to electrostatic phenomena.
That's why Tesla was always doing research in high voltage area, he was looking for that phenomena, to copy the nature. The higher the voltage, the higher the electrostatic phenomena is in your system, thats the way i want to go. Everybody is talking about free energy, its the electrostatics! The high voltage can be a trigger for this so called free energy.

Another example is that the very long transit power lines carry always high voltage because the efficency is always higher with high voltage.

Consider this the voltage is not coming from your battery! only the current is building up in the conductor because of the pressure voltage.
I think it was 30 years ago it was a researcher with the name Lee, he found out that the voltage in your battery comes not from the battery. It is creating a dipole between the poles and only the current is what is discharging the battery.

How many horse power did you get from the small engine?

Greetings

TeslaTech
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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2011, 02:37 AM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Tesla,
Very interesting stuff. Sounds like you've done alot of reaearch in this area.
I see high voltage is the way to go, makes sense.
On the HP I figured about 1 from the torque test. I think I could get about 4hp or more if I put another coil on top, then double the voltage.
I had a thought yesterday on possible making a coil that would double the output power from the bemf. Lets say we want a 100 ohm coil for a motor. Instead of winding one coil, wind 2 coils at 200 ohms each and wire them in parallel, but shaped as one coil for the motor. The input power from the power supply would be the same, into 100 ohms, the magnetic field should be the same. The bemf from each coil would be twice the voltage, half the current, but in parallel. So the current would add together, to equal 1, and the voltage in parallel would be double from each coil but in parallel so not add together so equal 2. Compared to the coil wound at 100 ohms the bemf now has twice the return voltage because of twice the windings. What do you think? Is that a patented coil design in the making?? Haha. Let me know if you think that is worth testing.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2011, 02:55 AM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Originally Posted by AlaskanWolfWarrior View Post
Thanks Jim for the info, i have been trying to scratch together resources to build this motor for a wile. do you have any tips on finding the parts on a limited budget? also the wiring for collecting the back emf has me a little confused. any help you could offer would be greatly appreciated.

thx Wolf
Hello Wolf,
I got my magnets at magnets4less, and I think the wire also. I didnt really find any deals out there. I think this project may cost me about $700. I couldve saved money on some things but didnt. Like using plywood instead of poly for the frame. As far as capturing bemf, think diode.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2011, 04:32 PM
AlaskanWolfWarrior AlaskanWolfWarrior is offline
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Hello Wolf,
I got my magnets at magnets4less, and I think the wire also. I didnt really find any deals out there. I think this project may cost me about $700. I couldve saved money on some things but didnt. Like using plywood instead of poly for the frame. As far as capturing bemf, think diode.
il check that site out, it sounds good i have heard of it before, do they have good prices? outch thats more than i have for this, im using used parts and making my own. thanks for the help, have you tried building the engine with 2 electro magnets on the shaft inside 8 stationary electro magnets? with spark plugs as high voltage switches? i would love to see how much power that would make.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2011, 07:46 PM
TeslaTech TeslaTech is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Bromely View Post
Tesla,
Very interesting stuff. Sounds like you've done alot of reaearch in this area.
I see high voltage is the way to go, makes sense.
On the HP I figured about 1 from the torque test. I think I could get about 4hp or more if I put another coil on top, then double the voltage.
I had a thought yesterday on possible making a coil that would double the output power from the bemf. Lets say we want a 100 ohm coil for a motor. Instead of winding one coil, wind 2 coils at 200 ohms each and wire them in parallel, but shaped as one coil for the motor. The input power from the power supply would be the same, into 100 ohms, the magnetic field should be the same. The bemf from each coil would be twice the voltage, half the current, but in parallel. So the current would add together, to equal 1, and the voltage in parallel would be double from each coil but in parallel so not add together so equal 2. Compared to the coil wound at 100 ohms the bemf now has twice the return voltage because of twice the windings. What do you think? Is that a patented coil design in the making?? Haha. Let me know if you think that is worth testing.
Jim,

no, that's not a patented coil design, hehe. Anyway it is rediculous to try to patenting a coil design..... The patent must be for the whole system instead.

the idea is interesting. But instead making two new coils i would try to make the second coil the same like the first one and then wired them up in series.


How many watts of input you need for the 1 hp ?
There was something mentioned like 1000V at 10mA?

Furthermore, i think that there is a limitation, if you go to high with the coil resistance,
you could have a weaker magnetic field. I don't have tested this yet. That's my theory only. The other thing is you need some electrons(current) left in the wire. This can be a balance act.

I've thinking about to make a coil but bifiliar wound and this two twisted strands wired them up in series. I've tried this method with my 10 Coiler but only with one spool(2KG), i have recognized a drop in the input amperage by the half. So you can make the same work with half the input, because the differrents in voltage between the windings is very high.
I've thinking about to make this high hp fuelless engine with normal coil like in the plans and then to try it with bifiliar wound coils.

By the way, what are you doing with the BEMF? Charging batterys? Maybe it could be possible to use batterys as buffer and loop the whole thing for having a selfrunner.

Could you post a pic from your hp engine?

Greetings

Tesla
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 04-12-2011, 03:50 PM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Originally Posted by TeslaTech View Post
Jim,

no, that's not a patented coil design, hehe. Anyway it is rediculous to try to patenting a coil design..... The patent must be for the whole system instead.

the idea is interesting. But instead making two new coils i would try to make the second coil the same like the first one and then wired them up in series.


How many watts of input you need for the 1 hp ?
There was something mentioned like 1000V at 10mA?

Furthermore, i think that there is a limitation, if you go to high with the coil resistance,
you could have a weaker magnetic field. I don't have tested this yet. That's my theory only. The other thing is you need some electrons(current) left in the wire. This can be a balance act.

I've thinking about to make a coil but bifiliar wound and this two twisted strands wired them up in series. I've tried this method with my 10 Coiler but only with one spool(2KG), i have recognized a drop in the input amperage by the half. So you can make the same work with half the input, because the differrents in voltage between the windings is very high.
I've thinking about to make this high hp fuelless engine with normal coil like in the plans and then to try it with bifiliar wound coils.

By the way, what are you doing with the BEMF? Charging batterys? Maybe it could be possible to use batterys as buffer and loop the whole thing for having a selfrunner.

Could you post a pic from your hp engine?

Greetings

Tesla


Tesla,
Its running about 150-200 watts full load. The Bemf is being used back into the motor to increase efficiency. I wont say how. There were a few ways to do it in the plans, I beleive one of them is the way you described it. And also there were some pics of them using 2 strand wire for winding a coil in their own experiments but they didnt say to do that in the plans. Sounds like you might have something there to increase efficiency. I put up some pics of the motor on page 1. Im working on the generator now. I got one coil done and half the magnets installed and just tested it at 41 volts no load. I have to get some more resistors to get a power test for the one coil. Want to match the output impedance of the coil with ceramic resistors for accurate power measurement. Looks like it will work very well. Ill put in the rest of the magnets this week and give it a full power test with resistors for load. Hopefully by this weekend I can load it down enough to see how much wattage is being produced compared to how much the motor increases wattage consumption from no load to full generator load.
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 04-13-2011, 09:39 AM
TeslaTech TeslaTech is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bromely View Post
Tesla,
Its running about 150-200 watts full load. The Bemf is being used back into the motor to increase efficiency. I wont say how. There were a few ways to do it in the plans, I beleive one of them is the way you described it. And also there were some pics of them using 2 strand wire for winding a coil in their own experiments but they didnt say to do that in the plans. Sounds like you might have something there to increase efficiency. I put up some pics of the motor on page 1. Im working on the generator now. I got one coil done and half the magnets installed and just tested it at 41 volts no load. I have to get some more resistors to get a power test for the one coil. Want to match the output impedance of the coil with ceramic resistors for accurate power measurement. Looks like it will work very well. Ill put in the rest of the magnets this week and give it a full power test with resistors for load. Hopefully by this weekend I can load it down enough to see how much wattage is being produced compared to how much the motor increases wattage consumption from no load to full generator load.
Hi Jim,

do you have two different machines? One with the air-core, that you already postet and second one with an iron core(the motor with the high horse power).
I have wound around 1 Kilometer wire on a laminated iron core. It is only 0,5mm in dia not the thinner one that they have mentioned.
Together i have 2 Kilogramms of wire on the core.
Now i will build a hv power supply and will try it with 1000 Volts. i have no rotor finished this is just one coil. i will try to put a magnet on the top an look how high this goes.

When does you bought the plans? I think they're updated some stuff in the newer plans. I have bought my plans in 2006.

Greetings

Teslaelectromagnet-teslatech.jpg
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 04-13-2011, 02:36 PM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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Hello Tesla,
Thats a nice looking coil you made. No I have the one air coil motor. I think the other one you refer to was one I mentioned I saw online and had the specs for it. I bought the plans I think last November.
I think your coil will lift that magnet very high with 1000v. I wonder how much Bemf you will get with the iron core compared to air core.
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 04-13-2011, 09:25 PM
kenny_PPM kenny_PPM is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeslaTech View Post
Jim,

Furthermore, i think that there is a limitation, if you go to high with the coil resistance,
you could have a weaker magnetic field. I don't have tested this yet. That's my theory only. Tesla


You will find this is NOT the case , the more turns the stronger the magnetic field. That is why Newman used so many turns. The higher resistance the less current. This is one of the hidden ways this technology works. The more the better but you have to work with the higher voltages to get the the massive torque. Test it yourself with a magnetometer or two coils and you will see the torque.

Be safe at the higher voltages, it can kill or give you a really bad day if you dont respect. That is also why solid state versions dont work well with this technology. Bedini uses lower voltages as to not fry transistors. If you can make a commutator you can really ramp up the voltages and the back emf collection and use a high powered magnet to 'quench' any sparks at the commutator, no solid state to fry, but the commutator needs precision for timing, get a oscilloscope to tune signals.

Also, of extreme imortance, make sure you have hi-volatge diodes in place between your power supply and your coils, if you dont the bemf can blow up your capacitors in your power supply.

Ken


consider this: the torque of opposing magnetic fields drops by a factor of 4 if you double the distance, likewise if you move them closer together by half you get 4x the strength from the source (middle of electromagnet) . you could dramatically increase the force of your motor.
Tolerance is another key in motor/generator efficiency.

Last edited by kenny_PPM : 11-08-2012 at 05:07 PM. Reason: tip
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 04-14-2011, 06:23 AM
Bhargav Bhargav is offline
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Brilliant Post

@Ken,
Thanks , One of the best summaries i have seen in some time . Having worked on pulse motors for 6 months , i can see you have put so many learnings in your last post( i had to spend quite a bit of money to learn them ) .

Invaluable tips these :
1) More the turns in coil , stronger the field.
2)More the turns in coil , higher the resistance of coil.
3)Higher the resistance , lower is the current consumed.
4)Bedini uses low voltage not to fry the transistors on window motor.Apparently Rick has tried going to about 150 Volts using different transistors. By my experience as well: Higher the input voltage used , torque increases almost exponentially. Higher voltage and low current consumption seems to be the key to figure out high torque motors. Also at the free energy conference held last november , the pulsed motor displayed had a lot of turns of about #24 wire (not sure) with about 20 or so wires in parallel . The key it seemed again was the large number of turns.

Questions to Ken and anybody else interested:

1)Creative science again suggests usage of high voltage and capturing BEMF through the well known commutator arc method as can be seen in their video.I would maybe ask Peter Lindeman if he thinks the commutator arc method really is able to harness the radiant leading to higher output voltage than input.Next question would be do carbon brush commutator behave the same as copper arc commutator.

2) How do we use high powered magnets to quench the arc at commutator . Isnt the arc that is supposed to provide the high back emf when stored in a capacitor ?

3)What is the point of placing high voltage diodes in between power supply and coils to stop BEMF? Again , arent we trying to capture all the BEMF possible than simply wasting it ?

4) Bedini's pulsed Window motor doesnt seem to stress too much on the gap between coils and magnet . I will do some experiments to see if i can measure the difference but just wanted to know your thoughts . Do you think the gap does play a factor in window motor design ?

I hope to understand more about the pulsed motors with this discussion and iam sure we can use the principles of different designs to our advantage.

Have fun,
Bhargav
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 04-14-2011, 07:41 AM
kenny_PPM kenny_PPM is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhargav View Post
@Ken,

1)Creative science again suggests usage of high voltage and capturing BEMF through the well known commutator arc method as can be seen in their video.I would maybe ask Peter Lindeman if he thinks the commutator arc method really is able to harness the radiant leading to higher output voltage than input.Next question would be do carbon brush commutator behave the same as copper arc commutator.

2) How do we use high powered magnets to quench the arc at commutator . Isnt the arc that is supposed to provide the high back emf when stored in a capacitor ?

3)What is the point of placing high voltage diodes in between power supply and coils to stop BEMF? Again , arent we trying to capture all the BEMF possible than simply wasting it ?

4) Bedini's pulsed Window motor doesnt seem to stress too much on the gap between coils and magnet . I will do some experiments to see if i can measure the difference but just wanted to know your thoughts . Do you think the gap does play a factor in window motor design ?

Keep testing, much learning comes from simple tests.

1. Yes it does, you can test it and see with a commutator and capacitor. Carbon would last longer than copper for brushes. Same as typical motors.

2. Magnet will keep high voltage commutator from arcing and dirtying up thru use, you can test without also. There are some who design motors with a spark gap on purpose so the hi voltage arc collects more from the environment, that is a whole other discussion beyond this design. Adams motor used it I belie
3. Think of it this way, you are stopping the Flyback Voltage from going in one direction and collecting it going in a different path. The Flyback Voltage is what you want to capture in a battery or capacitor and dump to a load that is not a common ground, that is not part of the closed circuit. At least not connected to the closed circuit during the recovery pulse. If you didnt capture the Flyback Voltage this way, it would take a different path (the closed circuit path still connected to the power supply), and without a hi-voltage blocking diode in between your power supply then that path it would take would be to your power supply and overload all the specs on the components due to the spike being 10x higher than source voltage and then said voltage would overload and breakdown the rated voltage of the dielectric capacitors and boom. That is the main reason for the commutator, to pulse on AND when off to collect Flyback Voltage out of phase from the source or drive pulse. Hence a open circuit condition. That is why precision timing is critical. Scopes better for this reason.

4. Bedini's smaller motors are a different concept. Bedini does NOT rely on torque at the shaft as much as he wants to get a pulse through his circuit first to tune a signal to a recovery.
The high voltage high wound coil is just the opposite, you want as much torque as possible (very high voltage at very low current) at the shaft with collecting recovery pulses secondary. Hence gap is critical with this different designed motor. If you pulse two hi wound coils or solenoids with very hi voltage, the force generated is phonomenal. Air coils better for this reason.

Good luck with your experiments

Last edited by kenny_PPM : 11-08-2012 at 07:38 PM. Reason: tip
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2011, 05:30 PM
Sinatra Fan Sinatra Fan is offline
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Jim

How close are you on the generator? I can't wait to see the progress.
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Old 04-21-2011, 09:14 PM
cjw3579 cjw3579 is offline
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Has anyone looked at the Magniwork generator plans or have any experience with them? Can rare earth magnets be used instead of ferrite ones?
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Old 04-22-2011, 03:29 AM
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SkyWatcher SkyWatcher is offline
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Hi cjw3579, From the pictures I've seen, on the rotating generator device, he uses long stacks of neo magnets off the back of the pulse motor/generator coil.

Some kind of ping pong oscillation effect is supposed to account for the higher frequency output in the coil.
peace love light
tyson
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Old 04-22-2011, 12:30 PM
Jim Bromely Jim Bromely is offline
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SP500 Generator

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinatra Fan View Post
How close are you on the generator? I can't wait to see the progress.
Hello Sinatra. I just got the 2nd of 8 coils in and did some testing. With the motor running at 600v the maximum efficiency im getting is 39.8%. With 2 coils in series it will light up a 40w light bulb at 105 volts. Im thinking now the way to go over unity is to configure the generator to run at low rpms with high output. That can be done with more coils and magnets if necessary. Ill have to make the generator as a seperate unit and connect the motor to it with pulleys and a belt. That way I can increase the torque on the generator by 3x and get close to 120% output. If the motor is running best at 600 rpm it will turn the generator at 200 rpm with 3 times the torque. Then I can connect more and more light bulbs to the output to see if I get 3 times the power. Looks like torque is the name of the game. So I have some building to do. Should be fun.
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Old 04-22-2011, 07:09 PM
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SkyWatcher SkyWatcher is offline
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Hi jim, yes I think torque is the thing to optimize.
On my dual neo magnet rotor sandwiching air core coils pulse motor, I found that as I added each additional air coil in series while raising the input voltage to maintain the same rpm under shaft load while maintaining the same input watts.
I found the torque to increase with each added coil in series.
What this seems to say to me, is that if one was to keep adding coils in series with more neo magnet rotors and increasing the voltage to maintain the same rpm, that the motor should continue to increase in shaft torque for the same input watts.
With my dual air coil pulse motor using 6 sandwiched air coils at 72 volts, it was very difficult to stop the shaft with my hand, for something like 20 watts input.

Though when only using say one coil to start with, a child could stop the motor with their hand for the same input watts.
I think at some point, that with enough rotors and coils that it could exceed 100% production efficiency or COP>1.0.
Joseph Newman is correct on many things. Keep adding copper and raising voltage yields increasing shaft torque and input current steadily decreases, yet while using the same input watts, we progressively yield larger and larger levels of shaft torque. This graph from Newmans book says it all.


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peace love light
tyson
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